The Ultimate 3D projection system: A Practical Discussion Thread - Page 76 - AVS Forum
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post #2251 of 2269 Old 11-05-2013, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wnielsenbb View Post

"As for performance hits it depends how the 3d is rendered some solutions only require around 4% more power. "
What 3D solution only requires 4% more power? And what 3D solution are you using to game at 1080p?

Cryengine uses a "reprojection" method for creating the 3d image that has around a 4% hit in performance for crysis 2 and 3, other similar solutions where used for deus ex human revolution and gears of war 3 on console. I'm sure their are more examples but those are the ones that come straight to mind. Personally I don't think this looks as good as the more intensive option but at the same time it is a very nice option that is getting better and better (try comparing crysis 2 and 3 on pc for evidence of how far it has come).
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post #2252 of 2269 Old 11-06-2013, 03:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wnielsenbb View Post

"As for performance hits it depends how the 3d is rendered some solutions only require around 4% more power. "
What 3D solution only requires 4% more power? And what 3D solution are you using to game at 1080p?
Screen-space reprojection 3D, also known as single camera Z-buffer based 3D, many gamers call it "fake" 3D.
It's a very simple solution and elegant from a programmer's point of view.

The problem : it produces occlusion artefacts, so the developers need to keep the separation at a minimum and it makes games look very flat. Crysis 2 and 3 use this technique.
Some people like the compromise, but I can't stand it.
I bought Crysis 2 and was deeply disappointed by the results. When Crysis 3 came out, I just looked at a 3D screenshot made by someone else and immediately noticed the exact same problems, so I didn't buy it.

The Tridef drivers also have an option to use this mode instead of doing a full dual-camera rendering, I never use it because I can't stand the artefacts.
It's possible to reduce the effects and be able to use this technique propely, but it requires deep integration in the game. Until now, the only time i've seen this done right was in a console demo of Batman Arkam City at a trade show (TrioviZ booth) but the PC game didn't use this technique, it used the normal Nvidia 3D Vision instead, so I was never able to study it propely.

Passive 3D, forever !
My Full-HD dual-projector passive polarised 3D setup. (really out of date ! I need to update it some day...)

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post #2253 of 2269 Old 11-21-2013, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by BlackShark View Post

I compared the light output between Omega and polarised dual projectors.
I don't have any measuring instruments so I compared them visually by putting them side by side.

On my Epson LCD projectors (color primaries cross-polarised), the Omega filters provide similar light output as standard linear polarised filters at 45° (supposed to be about ~45% light output per projector).
I also have specialised polarised filters designed to leverage the cross polarisation of my LCD projectors made by Advisol (SPAR filters), they are significantly brighter.

So how much did the cross-polarized projectors + SPAR setup cost you?
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post #2254 of 2269 Old 11-21-2013, 02:48 PM
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The info about the projectors is in the (old) thread in my signature.
I got the SPAR filters later, they used to be worth over 1200$ back in 2010 which is why I chose regular linear filters instead, I then got the SPAR filters second hand for much less.
I don't know how much they are worth today, I haven't checked advisol's website recently.

Note : newer Epson projectors have a different type of polarisation, make sure you check exactly what kind of polarisation your projectors have before buying the polarisation filters.
If your projectors have all colours polarised the same way, you'll be able to use different types of filters to achieve the same lumen efficiency gains for much cheaper.

Passive 3D, forever !
My Full-HD dual-projector passive polarised 3D setup. (really out of date ! I need to update it some day...)

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post #2255 of 2269 Old 12-15-2013, 12:49 PM
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VNS Inc. has added to the Geobox functionality for passive 3D.
Geobox G-104, G-303, G-501, and G-502 with 12/1/2013 or later firmware will support:
Nvidia 3D Vision 1080p/120Hz 3D.
AMD HD3D 1080p/120Hz 3D.

An LCD shutter Nvidia 3D setup is what I am use now so it is the method I personally will adapt to and can comment on with minimal knowledge. None of this is direct experience with a Geobox. It is from reading the VNS doc (linked below) and direct experience with 3D Vision shutter glasses since the CRT days to now on an HD TV (rear projection DLP).

This is from a PC gaming point of view. 3D Blu-ray from an Oppo player at 1080p/24Hz doesn’t need all this extra hoop jumping.
The PC method needs a monitor EDID override so the Nvidia drivers think the Geobox is a supported monitor. It needs the Nvidia IR emitter connected via USB or an emulator so the Nvidia divers will output the video in the 1080p/120Hz S3D format. Note: Nvidia 3DTV Play is not an option here as that is only the HDMI 1.4a compatible video out signal. That is why the need for the IR emitter (or maybe emulated).

Link to a PDF from VNS on the ‘how to’.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B0FNJgjyvsYvU2ZTMlZjMjJsTTg/edit?usp=sharing

When I have the funds saved, I’ll be doing this. Probably after my Q1 2014 bonus in May 2014.
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post #2256 of 2269 Old 12-15-2013, 08:31 PM
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So those of us with the G-501 can do a firmware update to get the function for Nvidia? Can this be done by us or will it require the unit to be sent back to VNS?
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post #2257 of 2269 Old 12-16-2013, 09:05 AM
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Supports both NVidia 3D vision and AMD HD3D at uncompromised 1080p60 ? This is getting interesting. I might order one for christmas.
I'll have a look at the different VNS products with this feature, I've been waiting for an affordable demultiplexer with this feature for quite a while.

Passive 3D, forever !
My Full-HD dual-projector passive polarised 3D setup. (really out of date ! I need to update it some day...)

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post #2258 of 2269 Old 12-16-2013, 09:42 AM
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That is great news. Now for someone to take the jump, and to figure out what 3D system I want.
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post #2259 of 2269 Old 12-16-2013, 04:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trgraphics View Post

So those of us with the G-501 can do a firmware update to get the function for Nvidia? Can this be done by us or will it require the unit to be sent back to VNS?

"Firmware" was my interpretation. I don't know it is just a firmware update. I'd ask VNS if you can upgrade an older G-501. I hope so as I was planning on getting one from Motorman45.

This is the exact notice I got from VNS Sales along witht he PDF I linked in the previous post.
"Due to many customers are requesting to support active 3D signal 1080p/120hz in passive 3D system, we had update our design to support this special function. Here is the application note to display Nvidia 3D Vision 1080p/120Hz 3D format in passive 3D system through G-104, G-303, G-501 or G-502. It will also support AMD HD3D 1080p/120Hz 3D format. We had implemented this new function from the products shipped from Dec-1-2013."
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post #2260 of 2269 Old 12-16-2013, 05:10 PM
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i will see if the 501's and 201's i have and have sold can be flashed. i do have a flash utility and procesure from vns for an update i got several months ago for another issue and the 501 i have was easily flashed to change some features.
it would be great if this was the case.

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post #2261 of 2269 Old 12-17-2013, 04:48 PM
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I certainly hope a piece of electronics as expensive as the 501 can be updated. I would hope they made improvements to the firmware but I have never heard of any type of update. In this day and age, that is almost unheard of.
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post #2262 of 2269 Old 12-17-2013, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trgraphics View Post

I certainly hope a piece of electronics as expensive as the 501 can be updated. I would hope they made improvements to the firmware but I have never heard of any type of update. In this day and age, that is almost unheard of.


i do have a flash utility and procesure from vns for an update i got several months ago for another issue and the 501 i have was easily flashed to change some features. i could email anyone who has a 501 the utility but i have to see if the new firmwear is available to flash. one can also email vns for the info and if anyone gets an answer before i do please post it here.

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post #2263 of 2269 Old 12-18-2013, 07:54 AM
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so the older Geobox 501's ARE capable of being flashed to support Nvidia 3D vision and AMD cards and 120hz with the new firmware. i should be getting the utility and files soon. VNS also will offer these files and the procedure of how to.

good news !

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post #2264 of 2269 Old 12-18-2013, 09:26 AM
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Good news. I would like to get this when it becomes available. I have the G-501. Thanks for looking into this Motorman.
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post #2265 of 2269 Old 12-18-2013, 11:10 AM
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It's available.
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post #2266 of 2269 Old 12-19-2013, 11:22 PM
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I am hesitating between the 303 and 501.
The 303 does all I need, the only little extra feature of the 501 that interests me is the optional DP input.
I can't find the retail price for the 501, I did find one for the 303 at alibaba (never bought anything from this platform) at around 1000$.
I suspect the 501 would cost significantly more than the 303, probably too much just to justify the DP input alone.

Are there any other retailers for the geobox products ?

Passive 3D, forever !
My Full-HD dual-projector passive polarised 3D setup. (really out of date ! I need to update it some day...)

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post #2267 of 2269 Old 12-20-2013, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackShark View Post

I am hesitating between the 303 and 501.
The 303 does all I need, the only little extra feature of the 501 that interests me is the optional DP input.
I can't find the retail price for the 501, I did find one for the 303 at alibaba (never bought anything from this platform) at around 1000$.
I suspect the 501 would cost significantly more than the 303, probably too much just to justify the DP input alone.

Are there any other retailers for the geobox products ?
Go to the source

Geobox warp is supricingly sharp, much better than normal keystone.
Loving my curved screen...i only wish i would have not sold my projector before bying a new one...:-D
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post #2268 of 2269 Old 12-20-2013, 06:30 PM
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the only retial outlet for geobox i know of is elite screens or elite screens. they call the models something else so you have to look at the specs to see whats what . they just cut their prices but i dont see the 501 box on there anymore. i have several 201 box's and 2 501's left i can sell. new in box

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post #2269 of 2269 Old 06-02-2014, 08:01 AM
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I have a couple of new geobox 501's in if anyone is interested. pm me

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