Official JVC RS40/X3 Owners Thread - Page 157 - AVS Forum
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post #4681 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 01:19 PM
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Another thought...do you another projector by chance or can you feed the same video cable into a nearby flat screen ( drag one over if you can ) to make sure the video chain if fine.
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post #4682 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 01:20 PM
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MANNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN that is for the most part what i was afraid of. I bought from a local vendor who had one in stock so i could get it by superbowl. ive already given him a call. guess we'll see what comes about from this. I love the PJ even with this small issue. it really started to crop up once I hit about 100h on the bulb. beforehand it was perfect

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post #4683 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 01:22 PM
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ive thought about this, but i dont have anything readily available. judging that the pixel loss is on test patterns and the bootscreen, im not going to go through the trouble of pulling my sammy down off its fireplace mount.

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post #4684 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 01:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

I have a hard time following reviews, I reserve my judgement until I see it in person. I had the RS40 for about a month before I picked up the RS50. I wanted the CMS and didn't want to start with an external VP. My one issue with the RS40 was the locked Gamma modes in 3D. Gamma A crushed blacks, and Gamma B was a bit too much since I have an HP screen, I wanted something in between. With the 50, I can adjust the gamma to any way I like it.

What i find very interesting is that this particular RS50 doesn't ghost anywhere near as much as my RS40 did. There is nothing in the specs that should suggest this to be the case, so the only answer is sample variance. All other components were identical and I had them side by side for a week. This is why when I read some people notice the ghosting more than others, I imagine it has something to do with variances between individual copies of the projectors.

I have the Acer 5360 DLP so I know what ghost free 3D looks like, the 40 I had was noticeable, but this particular 50 is closer to the Acer image and you really have to go out your way to find the slightest ghosting. I guess that is what we get for diving into a new technology - some luck is involved.

Zombie:

Thank you so much for the reponse. I have to admit I have only watched ~ 1.5 hours of 3D on my 40, but I have yet to see what ghosting is and I am looking for it. I only have one 3D title however, Legend of the Guardians, and I understand this particular title does not exhibit much in the way of ghosting for one reason or another. So, if I understand you correctly the only difference you noticed in side-by-side comparison of the two, was the difference in 3D performance? Just out of curiosity, was ghosting the only area in 3D you noticed a significant performance increase in the 50?

J
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post #4685 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 01:37 PM
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Re: the Trusted Reviews piece.

So many interesting bits in there, things I've struggled to put into words but they do so effortlessly.

Quote:


And so it proves. Using the excellent THX preset or, if you like more punch to your pictures, a tweaked version of the Cinema1 mode, dark scenes instantly look more dynamic than they do on the X3 thanks to noticeably deeper, richer blacks. In fact, the X7's abilities in this respect go comfortably beyond our expectations, without crushing out shadow detail.

This isn't about RS-40 vs. 50 for me at all, but I have to concur that some of the preset modes on my 50 are simply perfect for the type of viewing they claim to be for. By far the most impressive demo I use is the Anime preset for Ratatouille. Despite this preset using low-lamp mode the contrast ratio is out of this world. It's a fantastic picture, so good that I can't imagine how it could be better--again, in low lamp mode (I think this mode also upps the sharpness a bit too).

I also love this part:

Quote:


That's not to say the CMD is pointless. For while some people, understandably, wouldn't touch it with a barge pole, its Mode 1' setting arguably introduces an interesting subtle flickering effect that feels oddly evocative of a celluloid cinema experience, without making motion look distractingly processed.

I remember this effect (or something similar) from a demo of an RS-20 some time ago, but didn't know how it was being introduced into the image--I just chalked it up to something D-ILA tech does.

When I got the 50 I was a touch disappointed that the same effect was not present. Now I know how to enable it again I know this effect isn't for everyone, but anything that gets me closer to that film look makes me a happy camper.
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post #4686 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nohjy View Post

Zombie:

Thank you so much for the reponse. I have to admit I have only watched ~ 1.5 hours of 3D on my 40, but I have yet to see what ghosting is and I am looking for it. I only have one 3D title however, Legend of the Guardians, and I understand this particular title does not exhibit much in the way of ghosting for one reason or another. So, if I understand you correctly the only difference you noticed in side-by-side comparison of the two, was the difference in 3D performance? Just out of curiosity, was ghosting the only area in 3D you noticed a significant performance increase in the 50?

J

Legend of the Guaradian is a great 3D title and ghosting wasn't apparent on either projector. If you pick up a title like Monsters Vs. Aliens or Despicable me, there are scenes where it's quite noticeable. Mainly on high contrast backgrounds, orange seems to be a target for ghosting on these models.

In regard to a 2D comparison - I would say in my environment, it was nearly identical. I have a 142" HP 2.8 and a 16ft throw. I am a brightness fanatic and will sacrifice contrast for brightness. I would have to start clamping down the RS50 dual iris to take advantage of the extra contrast.

The one benefit is the CMS and I was able to adjust my settings to better match a REC709 color space. Based on the calibration thread, there seems to be some variance between 40's in how close they are to 709, likely due to variances in the lamp. By pure chance, my 40 lamp was excellent and my 50 lamp is down on red by 18% which I've had to adjust in a calibration.

The lamp variances is a whole other discussion, enough to the point where I'm certain this is my last lamp based projector. I will resist upgrading until the LED's become more popular. In the meantime, my Chroma 5 pro meter is going to get one heck of a workout keeping my white balance @ 100%.
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post #4687 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 03:46 PM
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Jason do you run in normal lamp for 2D? If so and you prefer more brightness even to the point of sacrificing a little contrast, what are your thoughts or have you tried going to high lamp, maybe losing some total hours, but gaining more red back and allowing much more brightness due to both the lamp and being able to maybe put more blue/green back? And then just dialing it down with the apparently excellent low ansi loss dual iris? Or did I miss it and you're on high all the time?
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post #4688 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 03:57 PM
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Ran into a trouble setting up my Harmony 900 to control the RS-40. Power On does not work via the IR blaster. At all. Other commands (Menu, Power off) work via the blaster just fine. However power on works ok via IR directly from the remote. Weird. Any ideas? I tried learning the command RAW and non-RAW, in both cases it works fine via IR but never via blaster.

EDIT: RAW works. But the trick is to learn a longer sequence, i.e. hold the power on button on the original remote longer while learning.
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post #4689 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 06:08 PM
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Hi all,

My and wife are just now jumping into the amazing world of home projection (saw a demo of Runco 750i and was completely blown away).
After much research we've finally settled on JVC X3 and Da-Lite High Power Cinema Contour screen.

Now I've heard many varying opinions on the narrow viewing cone, and the consistency in brightness across the screen. We don't watch a lot of TV, and a very narrow room (only 14" throwing space, not including the width of the to-be-shelf-mounted projector). We're planning on shooting the biggest image possible, at 133" (needs 13" 2" based on online calculators).

With the X3, is anyone else have the same setup, and would I be safe with the X3 + DL HP combination?

We're pretty excited about the setup, and am just hoping the local dealer has them in stock or is not fibbing about a 10-day delivery period.

Thanks everyone!
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post #4690 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 06:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by agasarang View Post

Hi all,

My and wife are just now jumping into the amazing world of home projection (saw a demo of Runco 750i and was completely blown away).
After much research we've finally settled on JVC X3 and Da-Lite High Power Cinema Contour screen.

Now I've heard many varying opinions on the narrow viewing cone, and the consistency in brightness across the screen. We don't watch a lot of TV, and a very narrow room (only 14" throwing space, not including the width of the to-be-shelf-mounted projector). We're planning on shooting the biggest image possible, at 133" (needs 13" 2" based on online calculators).

With the X3, is anyone else have the same setup, and would I be safe with the X3 + DL HP combination?

We're pretty excited about the setup, and am just hoping the local dealer has them in stock or is not fibbing about a 10-day delivery period.

Thanks everyone!

Sounds like a great combo to me. (I have a 126" HP with a RS20.)
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post #4691 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 06:22 PM
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Thanks millerwill!

In your setup, do you have to turn the iris down or add a filter to cut down on the light? Also, is it bothersome to have the supposed drop-off in brightness within relatively short distance from the "ideal" sweet spot?
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post #4692 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 07:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by agasarang View Post

Hi all,

My and wife are just now jumping into the amazing world of home projection (saw a demo of Runco 750i and was completely blown away).
After much research we've finally settled on JVC X3 and Da-Lite High Power Cinema Contour screen.

Now I've heard many varying opinions on the narrow viewing cone, and the consistency in brightness across the screen. We don't watch a lot of TV, and a very narrow room (only 14" throwing space, not including the width of the to-be-shelf-mounted projector). We're planning on shooting the biggest image possible, at 133" (needs 13" 2" based on online calculators).

With the X3, is anyone else have the same setup, and would I be safe with the X3 + DL HP combination?

We're pretty excited about the setup, and am just hoping the local dealer has them in stock or is not fibbing about a 10-day delivery period.

Thanks everyone!

I have a 142" Dalite HP with the RS40 and now the RS50. The projector is about 16" from the screen. I like a bright image, so I run high lamp in 2D. I could have turned it down in the beginning, but after 100 hours the lamp has already dimmed from when it was new.

The HP screen is great for 3D movies. At that size of screen you need all the light you can get since the glasses rob a good deal of the light.

The Cinema contour screen has a well built frame. They cover it in a special velvet material and overall the craftsmanship of the entire screen is impressive. I bought 15 feet extra feet of the velvet material from Dalite. It has an adhesive backing and I'm using it to make 2:35:1 masks for the screen. At 142" 16x9, my 2:35:1 size is ~133" diagonal.

enjoy your new setup when it arrives.
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post #4693 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 07:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RonF View Post

Jason do you run in normal lamp for 2D? If so and you prefer more brightness even to the point of sacrificing a little contrast, what are your thoughts or have you tried going to high lamp, maybe losing some total hours, but gaining more red back and allowing much more brightness due to both the lamp and being able to maybe put more blue/green back? And then just dialing it down with the apparently excellent low ansi loss dual iris? Or did I miss it and you're on high all the time?

I run the projector in high all the all the time. This lamp is already low on red in high mode, it's worse in low lamp mode. I have to pull out blue and green gain to compensate and get an accurate grey scale. Reducing the color gain will also result in a loss of light, but I can still run a -5 iris with the HP screen. I have about 120 hours, hopefully it levels out.
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post #4694 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 09:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by agasarang View Post

Thanks millerwill!

In your setup, do you have to turn the iris down or add a filter to cut down on the light? Also, is it bothersome to have the supposed drop-off in brightness within relatively short distance from the "ideal" sweet spot?

Note again that I have a RS20 (now 2 yrs old), though the aspect of using a HP screen is about the same as for the new RS40/50. I use low lamp and have the iris at 0; it's been noted that having the iris fully open gives the best ANSI CR (at least for the RS20), and I do like a bright pic, 20 ftL or more (the 'giant plasma' type pic).

I'm not sure I understand your last sentence about the 'ideal sweet spot'. ? My pj is right near the min throw distance, which leads to max brightness but less than the max O/F CR. But this is my choice, and I find the pic outstanding.
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post #4695 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 10:36 PM
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I just had another lock up. Was playing some Xbox and decided to switch over to the Oppo and was waiting for a picture and the RS40 locked up. Have to manually remove the power cable.

This can't be good on the bulb. Correct?
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post #4696 of 10035 Old 02-19-2011, 11:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpc View Post

From AVForums.com:
I've heard that the REC.709 setting isn't perfect, but I still don't get AVForums.coms review. When I visit the JVC website, REC.709 is spelled out in plain language. Does AVForums.coms review mean the X3 has different presets than the RS40 and/or AVForums.com simply didn't like the colour when they used the setting that was supposed to provide a REC.709 gamut? I cannot recall what the supposed REC.709 setting is labeled as in the X3, or RS40 for that matter.

What they are saying is that although the Standard colour profile is supposed to be Rec.709 as the JVC website says, when it is measured it is not and is still wide. They have the graphs in the review showing this. I believe his comment is that he wants JVC to be more accurate with the X3 preset or add a CMS next year.
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post #4697 of 10035 Old 02-20-2011, 12:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

I run the projector in high all the all the time. This lamp is already low on red in high mode, it's worse in low lamp mode. I have to pull out blue and green gain to compensate and get an accurate grey scale. Reducing the color gain will also result in a loss of light, but I can still run a -5 iris with the HP screen. I have about 120 hours, hopefully it levels out.

What % of brightness do yu lose in the bulb after the first 100 hours with the rs 40 and rs 50?
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post #4698 of 10035 Old 02-20-2011, 05:13 AM
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I have been using my RS40 for over 30 days, and have been very happy with the picture quality (hudge improvement over my Z2000).

On the first week I had it, on one night we were getting started in a movie it powered itself down completely after 15mins of viewing. The unit stayed completely dead (no LEDs on) and would not respond to any remote control command.

I got very concerned as after removing the power cable and turning the projector back on, it would not turn on the fans and the LEDs would flash indicating the units temperature was too high inside (as per the manual).

This never happened again until last night when the exact same thing happened (watching a 2D movie). After waiting some minutes I went and upgraded the firmware to V1.2 just to make sure this was not related with that. On the following morning, I had hopes that the firmware change may have fixed the problem and we got ready to watch a 3D movie. Guess what...after 15mins same thing happened again...

Do I have a defective unit ? Has somebody experienced the same ?

Thank's in advance for anybody's feedback.
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post #4699 of 10035 Old 02-20-2011, 07:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by afss View Post

I have been using my RS40 for over 30 days, and have been very happy with the picture quality (hudge improvement over my Z2000).

On the first week I had it, on one night we were getting started in a movie it powered itself down completely after 15mins of viewing. The unit stayed completely dead (no LEDs on) and would not respond to any remote control command.

I got very concerned as after removing the power cable and turning the projector back on, it would not turn on the fans and the LEDs would flash indicating the units temperature was too high inside (as per the manual).

This never happened again until last night when the exact same thing happened (watching a 2D movie). After waiting some minutes I went and upgraded the firmware to V1.2 just to make sure this was not related with that. On the following morning, I had hopes that the firmware change may have fixed the problem and we got ready to watch a 3D movie. Guess what...after 15mins same thing happened again...

Do I have a defective unit ? Has somebody experienced the same ?

Thank's in advance for anybody's feedback.

Sounds to me like the unit thinks it is overheating, either because it really is, or a bad overtemp sensor.

Check that you have airflow through the unit and that there is no other heat source that could be causing the PJ to actually get hot for real.

I suspect you have a bad unit, though.

IMHO, AFAIK,

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post #4700 of 10035 Old 02-20-2011, 07:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kaotikr1 View Post

I just had another lock up. Was playing some Xbox and decided to switch over to the Oppo and was waiting for a picture and the RS40 locked up. Have to manually remove the power cable.

This can't be good on the bulb. Correct?

Actually, removing power the hard way is not that bad on the bulb, as long as it gets a chance to cool down without a fan before powering back up. It would be preferable to let the fan cool it down, but really the fan cool-down is mostly to allow a power-up within a shorter time frame.

The hardest thing on a bulb is firing it up, even from cold. Unfortunately, that's just part of how they work.

AFAIK,

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post #4701 of 10035 Old 02-20-2011, 07:48 AM
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So far I probably only have 20 hours on mine - I just watch movies in my theater and only on weekends.

This weekend - Piranha 3D, a truly hideous film that a friend gave me a copy of, but I was able to project it 12 feet wide and got a pretty bright picture in 3D. The 3D itself was mediocre in my opinion (converted I believe).

Last night, took a 3D break and watched a favorite classic film, NORTH BY NORTHWEST.
Really a beautiful Blu ray transfer of a Vista Vision film. I was really happy with the 2D picture! Super smooth and sharp, I'm using a tweaked pre-set with high lamp mode, this one 10 feet wide.

So far I'm really happy with this projector, no convergence issues (I can notice), hopefully I got a good unit.

If the bulb doesn't crap out too bad at 100 hours or so, I'll be a very satisfied customer.

S A M 33
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post #4702 of 10035 Old 02-20-2011, 08:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S A M 33 View Post

If the bulb doesn't crap out too bad at 100 hours or so, I'll be a very satisfied customer.
S A M 33

Closing in on 500 hours and the bulb is still fine. I get the feeling that those experiencing bulb dimming are mostly the folks doing calibrations. I don't remember reading a J6P complaining about brightness other than the few that got a bad unit.

I might be wrong. It's not as if I remember all the posts!

GO HABS GO!
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post #4703 of 10035 Old 02-20-2011, 08:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericsson View Post

What they are saying is that although the Standard colour profile is supposed to be Rec.709 as the JVC website says, when it is measured it is not and is still wide. They have the graphs in the review showing this. I believe his comment is that he wants JVC to be more accurate with the X3 preset or add a CMS next year.

As stated in the AVForums.com article, their reviewer used the Cinema Picture Mode with Standard Colorspace settings. There is some unit-to-unit variations, but several of us have found using Standard Colorspace in combination with Cinema Picture Mode results in less accurate color points (e.g., over saturation) than either using Film Picture Mode or perhaps better still Natural Picture Mode in combination with the Standard Colorspace setting. It is the combination of the setting for Picture Mode plus Colorspace that determines the color points on the RS40/X3.

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post #4704 of 10035 Old 02-20-2011, 09:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zbroke View Post

Closing in on 500 hours and the bulb is still fine. I get the feeling that those experiencing bulb dimming are mostly the folks doing calibrations. I don't remember reading a J6P complaining about brightness other than the few that got a bad unit.

I might be wrong. It's not as if I remember all the posts!

Calibrating doesn't cause dimming, it just means that you have an objective method of measuring it as the eye is easily fooled. I used to think my projector was bright and when I measured it there was only 5fL on the screen...I opened up the iris a good few clicks to get to 12fL. The picture has a lot more punch at this setting.

I've had a lamp dim quickly recently on my HD350 so I'm watching out for measurements by RS40 owners to see if this is common with the RS40.

Zooming: Been there, done that, bought the lens...
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post #4705 of 10035 Old 02-20-2011, 09:42 AM
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You're probably right. I don't know anything about calibration but it's just that I always read "after calibration lumens were bla bla bla". I always assumed calibration had an effect on lumens.

GO HABS GO!
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post #4706 of 10035 Old 02-20-2011, 09:51 AM
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Well yes, after calibration there will probably be less output as typically you have to reduce the green and blue gains to match the lower red output of most UHP lamps. This will reduce light output compared to having a higher colour temperature (ie more blue) with the blue and green gains up higher. If the colour temp out of the box is quite close then you may not lose much light when calibrating.

I read your previous comment as 'calibrating causes the dimming', which I guess isn't what you meant, sorry.

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post #4707 of 10035 Old 02-20-2011, 01:42 PM
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Just had a thought. For those of you who have read into my problem on the previous page, does anyone think that removing the bulb and putting it back in might fix my situation or is it more likely coming from the panels?

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post #4708 of 10035 Old 02-20-2011, 04:36 PM
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Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Just had a thought. For those of you who have read into my problem on the previous page, does anyone think that removing the bulb and putting it back in might fix my situation or is it more likely coming from the panels?

IMHO, there is no way a bad bulb can cause individual pixels (or lines of pixels) to behave so erratically.

And since it occurs on the DILA boot-up screen, it has nothing to do with your source IMHO.

You have a bad processor chip, LCD panel, or something similar somewhere in the PJ, and it is wreaking havoc on your displayed image.

Again, IMHO, AFAIK,

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post #4709 of 10035 Old 02-20-2011, 04:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shinksma View Post

IMHO, there is no way a bad bulb can cause individual pixels (or lines of pixels) to behave so erratically.

And since it occurs on the DILA boot-up screen, it has nothing to do with your source IMHO.

You have a bad processor chip, LCD panel, or something similar somewhere in the PJ, and it is wreaking havoc on your displayed image.

Again, IMHO, AFAIK,

shinksma

I don't remember whether he tried reloading the firmware. Could corrupt firmware possibly cause something like this?
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post #4710 of 10035 Old 02-20-2011, 05:23 PM
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Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

Just had a thought. For those of you who have read into my problem on the previous page, does anyone think that removing the bulb and putting it back in might fix my situation or is it more likely coming from the panels?

It could also be a bad HDMI connector/cable. Try the other HDMI input and outputs and/or another cable.

However, if like someone mentioned, if this happens on the startup screen - then it can only be some internal component thing - call your dealer.
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