Official JVC RS40/X3 Owners Thread - Page 73 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #2161 of 10050 Old 12-28-2010, 11:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toe View Post

..........the message asking if "you want to turn off the projector?" is in all yellow and is pretty easy to see this mirroring of the letters when you are at the screen, especially on the "w" in want which looks like it is a "m" when you look at the trailed/mirrored letter above it.

I don't know much about projectors [yet ], but I haven't seen anyone else pick up on this aspect of the problem, so I'll risk displaying my ignorance....

I would not think that misconvergence would account for that kind of artifact. Convergence errors would conform closely to the contours of the objects (letters in this case), rather than extending out from them, correct? But the first thing that occurred to me on reading about the mirroring was that it sounded like some kind of internal reflection somewhere in the optics. Depending on what elements may be out of alignment, would that also account for the color shift of the trails (i.e. red and blue are reflecting but not green, so white text gets reflected as purple)?

Or is the idea completely off base? I guess I'll learn something either way.

I'd like to get a 40 or 50 myself soon (inventories willing), so I hope Sam and others confirm that this is isolated to the one bad unit.
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post #2162 of 10050 Old 12-28-2010, 11:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vidwiz View Post

Ordered my 40 from Projector people a week ago Monday because they said it would be arriving there around Christmas. Called for an update this week and they said they are now expecting it mid January. Did anyone else get a similar story from their dealer?

PP's price was competitive with free shipping but I'm pissed that they charged my card already, I know that's not how AVS does business...

Cancel your order. They done the bait and switch with you. Think what your service will be if you have an issue. Call Mark H or Jason here on the forum at AVS.
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post #2163 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 05:38 AM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

I remember reading about convergence in the JVC thread over and over regarding the 25 / 35. It sounds like hit or miss and none of them will be perfect. There is one fellow who returned his RS50 for one issue and now the 2nd has worse MC than the first.

MC = misconvergence? Or is it motion contouring?



I received my X3 and set it up last night. I'm a PJ newb, so take the following comments with that in mind.

Generally I'm very pleased with image the PJ is throwing.

I'm using quite a bit of vertical lens shift, as the PJ is mounted approx. 6" above screen top (no way around this, unfortunately). It appears that focus suffers a bit for this in the bottom 1/4 of the screen, however from seating distance this is not visible to my eyes, and the picture appears to be quite sharp. Convergence to my eyes appear to be fine, I'm having a hard time quantifying the divergence of each pixel, but generally if I shift R/G/B 1 pixel up/down/left/right it looks significantly worse (all over the screen) which leads me to believe that the convergence is OK. Maybe I'll try to take a couple of pictures tonight.

I cannot see any uniformity issues (on full white/full black) either. I'll throw on a B/W film tonight to confirm this.

One potential issue I've noticed is the digital noise. On the grey ramp on the AVS HD disc, when I walk up to the screen, I can see the digital noise from approx. 20-80%, with about 50% grey being the worst. As I said, this is when I'm up close looking at the screen, and it looks very much "alive" with dots crowling all over the place. From my normal seating position (about 12.5 feet from a 106" diagonal 16:9 screen) it is not visible. I would say, though, that it is visible to a smaller degree and if I'm looking for it, up to about 5-7 feet from the screen, worst case scenario (about 50% grey). I will examine this issue closer tonight, including on real material.

To those who have received their new JVC's: Do you see the digital noise, and how far away from the screen can it be seen? Does it decrease with time like Jon from the UK is reporting on his X7?
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post #2164 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 05:40 AM
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Ok, I haven't visited the forum since I purchased my RS40. Totally intentional, as I always like to avoid coming here after making a big purchase so I dont read all the nit-picky comments that lead to me questioning my purchase! So this may have been addressed already..

That being said, I would like to ask other owners if they see as much crosstalk in 3D as I do? I mean, the crosstalking is so bad it just totally ruins the 3D experience for me. All types of 3D has exhorbitant amounts of it: games, animated blu-ray's, real-life blu-rays, etc. They all have crosstalk to the extreme. Same thing on my Samsung Plasma 3D panel.

What have your experiences been? My 3D device is a PS3, but I just purchased an Oppo 93 to see if that helps (not getting my hopes up, as Im beginning to thin crosstalk comes down to each individual viewer.)
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post #2165 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 06:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kvestergaard View Post

One potential issue I've noticed is the digital noise.

If I remember correctly, the sharpness controls are turned up pretty high by default. Not sure if this is contributing to the noise.

I didn't like how it looked so I dialed it down to 0.
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post #2166 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 06:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HD_Bebop View Post

I don't know much about projectors [yet ], but I haven't seen anyone else pick up on this aspect of the problem, so I'll risk displaying my ignorance....

I would not think that misconvergence would account for that kind of artifact. Convergence errors would conform closely to the contours of the objects (letters in this case), rather than extending out from them, correct? But the first thing that occurred to me on reading about the mirroring was that it sounded like some kind of internal reflection somewhere in the optics. Depending on what elements may be out of alignment, would that also account for the color shift of the trails (i.e. red and blue are reflecting but not green, so white text gets reflected as purple)?

Or is the idea completely off base? I guess I'll learn something either way.

I'd like to get a 40 or 50 myself soon (inventories willing), so I hope Sam and others confirm that this is isolated to the one bad unit.

I dont know much either and your theory sounds as good as any. The thing is, I can knock the convergence out in the menu all the way the other way and the mirroring is just as bad.......I would think if what I was seeing was due to convergence it should get better when I do this?

Curious to hear what Sam found (probably/hopefully nothing) last night if he happened to check.

JVC 3D: Been there, done that, bought a DLP
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post #2167 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 06:25 AM
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Quote:


I just read over at 3D Central that Samsung plans to release a 3D Blu-ray player (to be shown at CES) that will do 2D to 3D conversion.

My guess is that this will be the next 'common' feature in most AVR video chipsets (much like HD upconversion is now standard) within a year or two so all connected sources can take advantage of it with 3D tv sets/projectors that do not have 2D to 3D conversion ability.

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post #2168 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 06:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Woof Woof View Post

If I remember correctly, the sharpness controls are turned up pretty high by default. Not sure if this is contributing to the noise.

I didn't like how it looked so I dialed it down to 0.

Good idea. I'll try to work on this tonight as well, both in regards to the noise and also detail in the image (I assume the AVS HD detail patterns would be good for this).
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post #2169 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 06:37 AM
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Originally Posted by kutlow View Post

3 Times now I went to turn on my rs 40 and the lens cover opens and you see a little tiny pin hole light coming out then it just does not come on all the way. Then the red light start flashing and the pj freezes up. The remote will not turn it on or off. You have to unplug the pj and wait a miniute andturn it on and it works fine. Its annoying especially when you have people over and this starts.

I think I rerad earlier in this thread of it happening t someone else.

This happened with the rs10 I previously had. Eventually it just stopped working completely. You should contact your dealer asap to report the defect.
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post #2170 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 06:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Toe View Post

Curious to hear what Sam found (probably/hopefully nothing) last night if he happened to check.

I have an X3, and checked it last night on the Oppo logo (stationary logo, with no disc) and didn't see the "purple shadows" you describe. I will check more closely tonight.
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post #2171 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 06:52 AM
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Anyone notice ghosting beyond 20 minutes of warming up?
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post #2172 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 07:22 AM
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Following up on an earlier post by Cine4home. I know this is an RS40 thread, but I want to close the loop on the gamma issue.

On my RS50/X7, I can confirm that in user preset the gamma DOES change and is not locked to 3D (A) or 3D (B). I went through regular Gamma A,B,C,D and saw obvious changes.

Additionally the lightness/darkness tweaks available on the RS50 work as well which should allow me to shift out any black crush.

This seems to differ from what Cine4home was stating...but I validated this just today and I am not seeing the same behaviour.
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post #2173 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blee0120 View Post

Anyone notice ghosting beyond 20 minutes of warming up?

Yes...but so far it has not bothered me in any film. It reduces to a level that you have to really be looking for it. There are a couple of titles which show it more obviously (IMAX Giant Dinosaurs (German release) and The Child's eye (Taiwanese made film rather surprisingly set in Thailand)), but interestingly none of the major movies so far.
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post #2174 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 07:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JonStatt View Post

Following up on an earlier post by Cine4home. I know this is an RS40 thread, but I want to close the loop on the gamma issue.

On my RS50/X7, I can confirm that in user preset the gamma DOES change and is not locked to 3D (A) or 3D (B). I went through regular Gamma A,B,C,D and saw obvious changes.

Additionally the lightness/darkness tweaks available on the RS50 work as well which should allow me to shift out any black crush.

This seems to differ from what Cine4home was stating...but I validated this just today and I am not seeing the same behaviour.

wow, that is impressive and certainly a feature I am missing in the RS40. I didn't actually try this myself, I was assuming Cine4home knows for certain this is the case for the RS40. It's not likely this would have changed from his pre-prod X3 to the production models.

I'll try it tonight just to see what happens. That is a bummer if JVC left out that feature on the RS40 - forcing between two set gamma modes (both having their own issues) in 3D.

if it bugs me enough, I'll wait until the market settles down and either find an external VP or swap up to the RS50.
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post #2175 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 08:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JonStatt View Post

Following up on an earlier post by Cine4home. I know this is an RS40 thread, but I want to close the loop on the gamma issue.

On my RS50/X7, I can confirm that in user preset the gamma DOES change and is not locked to 3D (A) or 3D (B). I went through regular Gamma A,B,C,D and saw obvious changes.

Additionally the lightness/darkness tweaks available on the RS50 work as well which should allow me to shift out any black crush.

This seems to differ from what Cine4home was stating...but I validated this just today and I am not seeing the same behaviour.


Yes my RS-50 is able to do the same thing, even though it says it shouldn't be able to do that in the manual if I remember correctly. I find that this has been most helpful for the picture quality and have used it for some tweaking.


.
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post #2176 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 08:33 AM
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I don't know if anyone watched the Kennedy Center Honors last night on CBS in HD, but I found that the "stage" settting was absolutely perfect for this type of programming so awards shows, ect should be great. My RS-50 looked better in that mode than any of the others for the stage show. JVC certainly knew what they were doing with the settings on this mode! I then tried my Image Entertainment Blu-ray "Victor Victoria live on stage" and it was just stunning in stage mode.

Funny thing, I tried this mode on film on Blu-ray and it really makes a movie look videotaped. I wouldn't watch a movie that way but it's interesting to see that look just for fun.
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post #2177 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 08:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by curtishd View Post

Can someone else let me know what 3d channels they are getting on directv. I bought a new receiver and I only get channel 103. Channel 104 says incompatible signal saying the projector can't take a 1080p/24 signal ( I know it can) and channel 106 says that it can't take a 720p signal. Everyone else have this issue?

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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

it looks like some other folks are discussing this in the other thread

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...5#post19723605

Gary/Chris, and all JVC employees reading this:

Can we please make sure JVC Japan is 100% aware of this issue with 720P and 1080/24 3D playback via broadcast TV? This is a $3500-$10,000 projector investment for hundreds of people, if not thousands around the world, we need to be able to play ALL, not some, 3D content whether it's Side by Side, Frame Packed, Top and Bottom, 720P, 1080/24...etc.

Bottom line, all of the new JVC 3D projectors should play all of the commonly used 3D content via Network, Cable, or Satillite broadcasts. This is NOT a one-off type of 3D, this is what ESPN 3D uses, 720P 3D, so this is a HUGE issue that needs to be resolved ASAP.
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post #2178 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 08:44 AM
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Originally Posted by mntwister View Post

I

Funny thing, I tried this mode on film on Blu-ray and it really makes a movie look videotaped. I wouldn't watch a movie that way but it's interesting to see that look just for fun.

I'm guessing this is because frame interpolation is on in stage mode.
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post #2179 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 08:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Toe View Post

I dont know much either and your theory sounds as good as any. The thing is, I can knock the convergence out in the menu all the way the other way and the mirroring is just as bad.......I would think if what I was seeing was due to convergence it should get better when I do this?

Curious to hear what Sam found (probably/hopefully nothing) last night if he happened to check.

Todd, I wasn't able to do anything when I got home last night, I got in really late, and my wife had to run some late errands so I had to watch my 4 month old daughter and by the time my wife came home, I couldn't keep my eyes open, it was a very long day, but I will go straight down to the theater when I get home tonight at 6pm, that's a promise!
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post #2180 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 08:49 AM
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Originally Posted by adidino View Post

I'm guessing this is because frame interpolation is on in stage mode.

Just a bit of a gotcha to watch out for that I have reported to JVC.

If you reset a picture mode it "should" go back to how it was out of the box. It doesn't at least on the RS50 (except for THX and 3D presets). CMD mode 4 gets enabled! Everything else resets correctly.
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post #2181 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by JonStatt View Post

If you reset a picture mode it "should" go back to how it was out of the box. It doesn't at least on the RS50 (except for THX and 3D presets). CMD mode 4 gets enabled! Everything else resets correctly.

If you update your software, you should find CMD defaults to off.
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post #2182 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 09:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by TheTonik View Post

Ok, I haven't visited the forum since I purchased my RS40. Totally intentional, as I always like to avoid coming here after making a big purchase so I dont read all the nit-picky comments that lead to me questioning my purchase! So this may have been addressed already..

That being said, I would like to ask other owners if they see as much crosstalk in 3D as I do? I mean, the crosstalking is so bad it just totally ruins the 3D experience for me. All types of 3D has exhorbitant amounts of it: games, animated blu-ray's, real-life blu-rays, etc. They all have crosstalk to the extreme. Same thing on my Samsung Plasma 3D panel.

What have your experiences been? My 3D device is a PS3, but I just purchased an Oppo 93 to see if that helps (not getting my hopes up, as Im beginning to thin crosstalk comes down to each individual viewer.)


Tonik,
Most of our 3D experiences with the RS40 have been nothing short of PHENOMENAL!!! So something is peculiarly odd with your 3D set up. First of all, a couple of dumb questions. Make sure your 3D glasses are synched, if you are using the Xpand glasses. If you are using the JVCs they should auto synch provided that you have the JVC 3D emitter plugged into the back (and within total synch range, under 30 feet total distanct from emitter to screen, plus from screen to 3D glasses). Also, most of us seem to be using either the $500 Oppo 93, or the $140 Sony BDP-S570, and none of s have reported the excessive level of ghosting you're experiencing, once we're past the 20 mins warm up. so I am not sure how the PS3 fares in comparison with a true HDMI 1.4 capable 3D playback device such as the Oppo., or if there are certain 3D playback settings on the PS3 that needs to be adjusted, not to mention possible firmware updates. Also if you are using an AVR, be sure to disable all the default video scaling and upconverting to the source where you have your 3D bluray player plugged in.


With that being said, I will start by saying that unlike Flicker, which seems to bother some more than the others (almost nonexistent on the JVCs though), Ghosting is more prone to be noticed by everyone, especially excessive ghosting, so I don't think your eyes in particular will be THAT much more sensitive to ghosting where the same image that 90% of see as acceptable and virtually ghost-free, is Not acceptable to you and filled with ghosting. That just doesn't make sense, which is the GOOD news for you, since this seems like a configuration issue more than a perceived-sensitivity-to-ghosting on your part.

Second, all of us reported some issues with ghosting with gaming, such as Call of Duty Black Ops (SBS 720p), GranTurismo 5 (FP 720p), and other DLC games such as Stardust 3D. With Gran Turismo in particular, you can go through the Display and 3D settings to change certain image properties such as Brightness, convergence, parallex, and all of which can almost eliminate ghosting but it will take a bit of trial and error. I cannot say the same things about Black Ops as it does not offer any special 3D display settings within the game like GT5. but games in particular will show more noticeable ghosting in 3D than 3D blurays which amost show no ghosting.

Third, all of us have confirmed and reported the necessary WARM UP period for these projectors in order for 3D to display without ghosting. So be sure to turn on your projector, possibly put in in 3D mode using the 3D preset, and let it run for no less than 15-20mins, and then play your 3D blurays. My guess is that the ghosting would be decreased by 90% of what you had originally seen when you first turned on the projector, depending on how cold your theater is, you may need to warm up the PJ for a few more or less minutes, but I cannot imagine the projector taking more than 30 mins max to warm up in the cold winter if you did not have the central heat on. so be sure to do this and report back to us

Fourth and last, sometimes ghosting just comes down to how well the studio mastered their 3D transfers, Sony and Warner brothers seem to be on the Pinnacle of this technology, while Disney (surprinsgly) has had a few hits and misses (i.e. ghosting on Disney 3D intro, overly dim/dark image throughout Christmas Carol), and then you have some of the cheaper, what I call budget, IMAX titles such as Wild Ocean and Dinosaurs which show more ghosting than the others, but the same studio released Grand Canyon: River at Risk in 3D and WOW, this IS what 3D is all about. Lastly, don't forget that most 3D content via DirecTV or Comcast or SkyTV is noticeably inferior to Frame Packed 3D content and will show noticeably, but not excessively, more ghosting in many cases since it's 720p or 1080i SBS, compared to 1080P framepacked blurays.

Hopefully this will clear things up for you, and be sure to check out the RS40 settings I had posted on Page 1 by clicking here


If you haven't already, buy the following 3D titles on blu-ray which should show the least amount of ghosting:
- Open Season 3D (Best in show for animated 3D!)
- Under the Sea 3D (Best in show for live action 3D - tied with Grand Cayon)
- Deep Sea 3D
- Legends of the Guardian 3D
- Alice in Wonderland 3D
- Grand Canyon: River at Risk 3D (Best in show for live action 3D - tied with Under the Sea)
- Step up 3D
- My Bloody Valentine 3D
- Avatar 3D (if you can "get" it)
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post #2183 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 09:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Gary,
Do you know if Japan is aware of the SBS 3D broadcast playback issues, such as the 720P 3D used by ESPN 3D in the US? This is a major issue to say the least, we're missing out on dozens of 3D sporting events because the RS40/50/60 cannot play back 720p 3D content from DirecTV or Comcast.

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Originally Posted by GaryB_UK View Post

If you update your software, you should find CMD defaults to off.


Quote:
Originally Posted by damnsam77 View Post

Gary/Chris, and all JVC employees reading this:

Can we please make sure JVC Japan is 100% aware of this issue with 720P and 1080/24 3D playback via broadcast TV? This is a $3500-$10,000 projector investment for hundreds of people, if not thousands around the world, we need to be able to play ALL, not some, 3D content whether it's Side by Side, Frame Packed, Top and Bottom, 720P, 1080/24...etc.

Bottom line, all of the new JVC 3D projectors should play all of the commonly used 3D content via Network, Cable, or Satillite broadcasts. This is NOT a one-off type of 3D, this is what ESPN 3D uses, 720P 3D, so this is a HUGE issue that needs to be resolved ASAP.

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post #2184 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 09:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by damnsam77 View Post

Gary,
Do you know if Japan is aware of the SBS 3D broadcast issues, such as the 720P 3D used by ESPN 3D in the US? This is a major issue to say the least, we're missing out on dozens of 3D sporting events because the RS40/50/60 cannot play back 720p 3D content from DirecTV or Comcast.

Yes, I confirmed in in my post on 11th December. If it is a problem with the projector, then I'm pretty sure they'll be able to sort it. It's highly unlikely they'll be able to add any additional 3D modes beyond those that are in the spec.

I doubt Japan will want to release individual updates for any bugs found over the next few weeks, so my guess is they'll roll anything that they find/fix into one update. I'm on holiday until 10th Jan, so I'll have only very limited contact with them until then.
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post #2185 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 09:28 AM - Thread Starter
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So I am starting to see WHY some people love their CMDs on the RS40/50/60 and their regular 120hz/240hz flat panel TVs.

At first I could only see myself turning CMD on for Sports and Broadcast/Network/Cable TV. But now I am starting to appreciate how much sharper it makes the picture appear. I find myself enjoying the sharper smoother picture in Mode 1 (DFI) and the other extreme which is Mode 4 (FI), but there are scenes where they just seem to look too smooth where I get turned off by it, maybe because my brain is programmed to enjoy movies at the lower 24 fps rate. But I can sort of see myself turning on CMD at modes 1 or 4, depending on the bluray movie itself. Unlike what I remember seeing with the initial FI on the 2008 Epsons, I feel like the frame interpolation on the RS40 gives a better more naturally smooth and less "waxy/soap-opera-ish" image. I was a big opponent of FI in the first couple of years, but I think FI, at least on the JVCs has come a long way. It's nice as long as it's not OVERLY done I suppose.
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post #2186 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 09:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryB_UK View Post

Yes, I confirmed in in my post on 11th December. If it is a problem with the projector, then I'm pretty sure they'll be able to sort it. It's highly unlikely they'll be able to add any additional 3D modes beyond those that are in the spec.

I doubt Japan will want to release individual updates for any bugs found over the next few weeks, so my guess is they'll roll anything that they find/fix into one update. I'm on holiday until 10th Jan, so I'll have only very limited contact with them until then.

I sure hope that that ESPN 3D playback issue is FW-addressable because I can already tell that this would be a major issue considering all the 3D events we're all missing right now because of this shortsight.

Enjoy your time off, you deserve it sir
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post #2187 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 09:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryB_UK View Post

Yes, I confirmed in in my post on 11th December. If it is a problem with the projector, then I'm pretty sure they'll be able to sort it. It's highly unlikely they'll be able to add any additional 3D modes beyond those that are in the spec.

I doubt Japan will want to release individual updates for any bugs found over the next few weeks, so my guess is they'll roll anything that they find/fix into one update. I'm on holiday until 10th Jan, so I'll have only very limited contact with them until then.

Gary - any chance you can confirm a feature on the 40 vs the 50. Cine4home stated that the Gamma (A) and Gamma (B) are locked in for the RS40. So even if you create a user mode with a custom gamma, the gamma would lock to Gamma (A) no matter what the custom setting was set to.

RS50 owners have confirmed they have full control of the Gamma in 3D mode.

thanks!
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post #2188 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by damnsam77 View Post

Todd, I wasn't able to do anything when I got home last night, I got in really late, and my wife had to run some late errands so I had to watch my 4 month old daughter and by the time my wife came home, I couldn't keep my eyes open, it was a very long day, but I will go straight down to the theater when I get home tonight at 6pm, that's a promise!

Isn't that called "parenting?"

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post #2189 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 10:26 AM
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Originally Posted by GaryB_UK View Post

If you update your software, you should find CMD defaults to off.

Thanks Gary. Good to know the change is there. I wouldn't update just for that as it is a tiny little thing, but I wanted to make sure people are aware of it, otherwise it may confuse.
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post #2190 of 10050 Old 12-29-2010, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by TheTonik View Post

Ok, I haven't visited the forum since I purchased my RS40. Totally intentional, as I always like to avoid coming here after making a big purchase so I dont read all the nit-picky comments that lead to me questioning my purchase! So this may have been addressed already..

That being said, I would like to ask other owners if they see as much crosstalk in 3D as I do? I mean, the crosstalking is so bad it just totally ruins the 3D experience for me. All types of 3D has exhorbitant amounts of it: games, animated blu-ray's, real-life blu-rays, etc. They all have crosstalk to the extreme. Same thing on my Samsung Plasma 3D panel.

What have your experiences been? My 3D device is a PS3, but I just purchased an Oppo 93 to see if that helps (not getting my hopes up, as Im beginning to thin crosstalk comes down to each individual viewer.)

The suggestion about trying a different 3D BD player is a good place to start. I'm a bit surprised you think your Samsung plasma exhibits lots of crosstalk since plasma, supposedly, is much better than other technologies at handling "ghosting" well.

I'm beginning to suspect that some people can easily ignore "ghosting" while others find it really, really distracting. "Ringing" (excessive edge enhancement) drives some viewers crazy while others don't even know it's there. Maybe it's the same with "ghosting" - of course, once it's pointed out it's very tough not to see it.
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