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post #91 of 292 Old 04-04-2011, 08:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

You also need to know how the projector has been set for reference white level. This is which HDMI Input mode (i.e., Standard, Enhanced or Super White) is being used and also the setting for the contrast control. For a standard reference these could be set to "Standard" HDMI input mode and the constrast set to zero (0). This will get you close to the having the projector using a digitial input value of 235 as the reference white level. When the HDMI input mode is set to Super White or Enhanced then the contrast control will need to be set to something around +10 to get the reference white level to near 235. If you calibrate your projector to allow the whiter-than-white levels (i.e., level 236 thru 255) to be displayed without clipping then when you measure the projector's lumens output using a 100% reference white screen you will get a lower reading than if calibrated for reference white level for a input of 235.

You also need to know how the Lux or Lumens were measured. I have found that measurements using the wrong tool (e.g., Eye-one) can produce meaningless results for lumens. The best tool seems to be a lux meter placed directly in front of the screen with the light sensor aimed toward the projector. Also remember that many of these lux meters are specified to have accuracy only within a few percent, so two meters even of the same make and model may produce readings that differ by more then 5%, so small differences in results (e.g., 850 vs. 900 lumens) may not have any real meaning.

UPDATE: Finally we need to know if they did a single point masurement at the screen center or did the 9-point measurements and are reporting the average (ANSI Lumens technique).

Hi Ron,

Thanks for your, as usual, very informative posting.

I like to adjust my contrast to have a little whiter-than-white in normal viewing, so since this projector clips blacks and whites in the Standard HDMI white level setting I would have to use the Enhanced setting. However, for the purpose of this measurement exercise do you think it would be less confusing and more consistent if everyone used the Standard setting and kept the Contrast set to 0?

What about the Brightness setting? Should that also be set to the zero setting to get reasonable lumen measurements?

So far ohotos measurements look spectacular.

Larry



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post #92 of 292 Old 04-04-2011, 08:11 AM
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I only did a single point measurement, but will do 9-points when I get a chance. From memory my brightness setting is at 4.


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post #93 of 292 Old 04-04-2011, 09:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryChanin View Post

Hi Ron,

Thanks for your, as usual, very informative posting.

I like to adjust my contrast to have a little whiter-than-white in normal viewing, so since this projector clips blacks and whites in the Standard HDMI white level setting I would have to use the Enhanced setting. However, for the purpose of this measurement exercise do you think it would be less confusing and more consistent if everyone used the Standard setting and kept the Contrast set to 0?

What about the Brightness setting? Should that also be set to the zero setting to get reasonable lumen measurements?
So far ohotos measurements look spectacular.

Larry

I also like to calibrate so that video levels up to around 245 are displayed before clipping occurs. This provides a little dynamic headroom to accommodate those video sources that sometimes (incorrectly) do output whiter-than-white video levels. However, setting to display only up thru video level 235 is consistent with the official video standards (e.g., HDMI spec.) and not displaying levels above 235 does not mean there is "white crush" since "white" officially corresponds to video value 235. Rather it would be more correct to say that whiter-than-white levels (236 thru 255) are not displayed. Also it should be noted that some Blu-ray players do not output whiter-than-white and/or blacker-than-black levels and also some displays will not display these levels (essentially only offering the equivalent of the RS40's HDMI "standard" input mode).

In theory modest differences in the brightness setting should have very little impact since it sets black level. However for a common baseline for comparing different user's RS40 projector light output: HDMI input mode could be set to "standard" and both contrast and brightness set to zero.

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post #94 of 292 Old 04-04-2011, 09:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

What is the color profile on the RS40 that is equivalent to the color profile = off mode on the RS50?

This 1100+ reading still sounds like a torch mode setting. How could 1 projector be over 30% higher than anyone else has measured?

Hi Jason,

As you probably know the RS40s do not have color profiles, but as I mentioned earlier in order to get those "torch" lumen output you have to set the color temperature to High Brightness. On page 40 of the manual you can see the menu setting for High Brightness occurring after the 9500K setting. Ohotos specifically mentioned that he used a setting of 6500K.

Larry



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post #95 of 292 Old 04-04-2011, 09:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryChanin View Post

Hi Jason,

As you probably know the RS40s do not have color profiles, but as I mentioned earlier in order to get those "torch" lumen output you have to set the color temperature to High Brightness. On page 40 of the manual you can see the menu setting for High Brightness occurring after the 9500K setting. Ohotos specifically mentioned that he used a setting of 6500K.

Larry

Thanks for the reminder You would think i didn't own one for a month, but I just don't recall. I believe Ron and Cinem4home had ~800 in a D65 mode. I wonder if the reading is accurate, what is unique about this particular projector to be cranking out that kind of light, it's first we've heard so far.

My local dealer is offering an RS40 at near pre-sales price + free shipping so I'll likely make up my mind tonight if I decide to pick it up for a direct comparison to the RS50 with the brand new lamp I have. My only hesitation is am I going to get a clean one, or start this mess all over again with having to sent it back.

My RS50 is exceptional for focus and convergence so i'll have to think about it. I also want my lumens back at the same time.


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post #96 of 292 Old 04-04-2011, 10:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

As I recall it was Gary from JVC UK that first told us that the "Standard" color space setting on the X3/RS40 was intended to be close to Rec. 709. The manual describes this setting as "equivalent to the HDTV color space" which is in fact defined to be Rec. 709. The actual color points you get with a RS40 vary by the combination of the setting for "color space" and the setting for "Picture Mode." While genearally no combination of these two settings will produce perfect Rec. 709 color points, it appears that a setting of "Natural" picture mode plus "standard" color space can produce fairly accurate color points, and with some units this will produce the closest to accurate Rec. 709 color points. However with other units units "film" picture mode plus "standard" color space might be a little better result (or preferred by given viewer).

Thanks Ron. I'm not familiar with the 40 but I knew there was a torch mode and a Rec709 mode......

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post #97 of 292 Old 04-06-2011, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

Thanks for the reminder You would think i didn't own one for a month, but I just don't recall. I believe Ron and Cinem4home had ~800 in a D65 mode. I wonder if the reading is accurate, what is unique about this particular projector to be cranking out that kind of light, it's first we've heard so far.

I believe ohotos said their's was non-calibrated, correct? I've seen other people report non-calibrated lumens around 1100 for an RS40. It typically drops down to ~800 once it's been ISF calibrated.
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post #98 of 292 Old 04-06-2011, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shagg View Post


I believe ohotos said their's was non-calibrated, correct? I've seen other people report non-calibrated lumens around 1100 for an RS40. It typically drops down to ~800 once it's been ISF calibrated.

Yes, mine is not calibrated professionally, just a rough "by eye" and color filter calibration using the Disney WOW disc. Still debating about spending money on a colorimeter or doing with a picture that I really like already and saving money for a new bulb in case I need it later.


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post #99 of 292 Old 04-08-2011, 02:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shagg View Post

I believe ohotos said their's was non-calibrated, correct? I've seen other people report non-calibrated lumens around 1100 for an RS40. It typically drops down to ~800 once it's been ISF calibrated.

Hi,

The point is that it is possible, even without a professional calibration, to use settings that provide a reasonably accurate picture that roughly approximates a calibration. Ron Jones did that and obtained measurements in the mid 800s at 50 hours usage without a full calibration.

In addition Ron reported that he could come close to the maximum claimed lumens if he used the High Brightness color temperature setting. Needless to say this would be unwatchable for most normal viewing.

Ohotos did not use settings that artificially boosted the lumen output at the expense of accuracy. He seems to have used settings similar to what Ron used when Ron recorded his mid 800 lumen readings.

Larry



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post #100 of 292 Old 04-08-2011, 06:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryChanin View Post

Hi,

The point is that it is possible, even without a professional calibration, to use settings that provide a reasonably accurate picture that roughly approximates a calibration. Ron Jones did that and obtained measurements in the mid 800s at 50 hours usage without a full calibration.

In addition Ron reported that he could come close to the maximum claimed lumens if he used the High Brightness color temperature setting. Needless to say this would be unwatchable for most normal viewing.

Ohotos did not use settings that artificially boosted the lumen output at the expense of accuracy. He seems to have used settings similar to what Ron used when Ron recorded his mid 800 lumen readings.

Larry

I don't think we know what settings ohotos is using, do we?
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post #101 of 292 Old 04-08-2011, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by ohotos View Post


So I just did another measurement with the following settings:

Picture mode: Natural
Color space: Standard
Color temperature: 6500K
Gamma: A (somehow I couldn't change this option to Normal this morning, option was greyed out. Had to get ready for work so not enough time to look into it.
Iris: 0 Fully open
Lamp power mode: High

48 hours on lamp
throw 13'2"

Since my last measurements the only things that changed are that I did a rough calibration using the WOW disc. Also this time I used a full white screen for the measurement, last time I had used the white one with the nine black circles.

I got a reading of 292 lux at the center this time.
My screen is 58.6"h x 104.7"w

So after my calculation I got 1153 lumen.

^


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post #102 of 292 Old 04-08-2011, 06:56 PM
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Sorry, I meant about the "color filter calibration" you were talking about. Do you mean greyscale and the "pseudo" CMS gain/offset settings for colors in the service menu, or were you talking about the standard menu brightness/contrast/color/tint slider bar settings?
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post #103 of 292 Old 04-08-2011, 07:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shagg View Post

Sorry, I meant about the "color filter calibration" you were talking about. Do you mean greyscale and the "pseudo" CMS gain/offset settings for colors in the service menu, or were you talking about the standard menu brightness/contrast/color/tint slider bar settings?

Didn't touch greyscale yet, just slightly adjusted color, tint, brightness and contrast.


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post #104 of 292 Old 04-08-2011, 07:13 PM
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Originally Posted by ohotos View Post

Didn't touch greyscale yet, just slightly adjusted color, tint, brightness and contrast.

Thanks. That makes sense, I think. From what little I know, it's the other stuff (gain/offset and pseudo CMS) that takes it down from ~1100 to ~800, not the basic color/tint/brightness/contrast sliders, at least not as much.

What others are effectively doing with the gain/offset controls is taking their lowest common denominator, and dropping the other colors to match it. That's where the majority of lumen loss of the "professional" type calibration (1100 - 800) comes from.

Is that right?
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post #105 of 292 Old 04-08-2011, 08:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shagg View Post

Thanks. That makes sense, I think. From what little I know, it's the other stuff (gain/offset and pseudo CMS) that takes it down from ~1100 to ~800, not the basic color/tint/brightness/contrast sliders, at least not as much.

What others are effectively doing with the gain/offset controls is taking their lowest common denominator, and dropping the other colors to match it. That's where the majority of lumen loss of the "professional" type calibration (1100 - 800) comes from.

Is that right?

Hi,

Maybe Ron can help clarify this issue further, but here's a description of how he measured an ANSI average of 869 lumens after 50 hours on the lamp.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

I just did some measurements on my RS40 with about 50 hours on the lamp. With the projector set to Natural mode, Standard color space, 6500K Color Temp, Normal gamma and High lamp mode. I used the AVS HD calibration disc to set the black level and white level with the projector set HDMI input mode for Super White. For White level I set it to display above video standard level 235 but not all the way to 255 (bars on test pattern visible up to about level 245). This results in the setting for brightness (black level) of +2 and the setting for contrast (white level) of +10.

I used the ANSI method by taking measurements for lux at 9 points (3 X 3 grid) and averaged the lux measurements to calculate the lumens. The result was 869 lumens. The max. measured lux was at directly in front of the screen center and the drop near the screen corners was about 12%. Since I am waiting until I have 100 hours to do a full calibration, it will be a little longer before I do a set of measurements for the calibrated lumens. However, my above measurement will provide a reference point that I can use to track lamp dimming over time.

And here's how he did a quick calibration.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

My throw is near the short end of the allowable range for my 120" (16 x9) screen at just over of 13 ft. The measurements were done with the iris fully open. This Mode (i.e., Natural with Std. color space) is basically what Chris (JVC USA) reported they are suggesting (except I'm using the high lamp mode while, as I recall, Chris suggested low lamp for 2D). As least for some of the RS40 units the Natural mode combined with Standard color space provides the color points nearest to Rec. 709, so that's an additional reason for selecting this mode for my measurement.

The RS40 has no setting for 'color profile' since (I assume) this is related to CMS which the RS40 does not have. I did go ahead and do a quick measurement for just the screen center location with the color temp bumped up to 8500K (with all other settings the same as I reported above) and the lumens went up to just over 1050. I had also done a quick calibration at just the 10 hour mark on the lamp in Film Mode (std. color space, 6500K, high lamp, custom gamma to get it between 2.2 and 2.3) where I got the color temp to track close to 6500K and low DeltaE at above 30 IRE. I went back and did a quick check for lumens in that mode, again just a quick check at screen center) and it came in at approx. 10% less than what I had reported above for Natural mode (or close to 800 lumens but if I would have used the ANSI 9 measurement points that would have reduced that to perhaps around 750 lumens).



In the first set measurements it doesn't appear that he did any thing to adjust the gain/offset controls. I would guess that his peak center screen lumens would have been about 920 lumens. Those settings were not identical to ohotos', but they are similar.

In the second measurement Ron did a quick calibration and the peak lumens at screen center dropped to about 800 lumens.

Larry



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post #106 of 292 Old 04-08-2011, 09:30 PM
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Hi,

To recap Ron's responses to my questions in posting #87:

For folks who have not had a professional calibration, but who are interested in measuring lumens using meaningful settings for comparision purposes, the following settings are recommended:

Picture mode: Natural
Color space: Standard
Color temperature: 6500K
Gamma: Normal
Iris: 0 Fully open
Lamp power mode: High
HDMI Input mode: Standard
Contrast: 0
Brightness: 0

State hours on lamp
State % of maximum throw based on screen size
State measurement method, peak at screen center, or 9-point ANSI average.


If Ron's observations of around a 10% reduction in lumen output due to calibration are representative, we might be able to get rough idea of what to expect after calibration while collecting precalibration measurements taken with consistent, and usable settings. Of course this 10% number really depends on the color balance of the lamp and at this point we really don't know how consistent they are between individual lamps without continuing to take precalibration and post calibration measurements as Ron has done.

Larry



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post #107 of 292 Old 04-09-2011, 06:00 AM
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Anyone make any measurements in 3d mode?

With all of the comments/data here and in other threads I am having a hard time understanding whether I might get enough brightness for 3D on my HP 2.8 106" screen with a throw distance of ~15 ft.

Right now I am testing an optoma hd66 which apparently gets ~600 lumens in 3D mode (from projectorcentral). I find it bright enough for 3d with my setup. Would the rs40 come close?
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post #108 of 292 Old 04-09-2011, 07:14 AM
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Originally Posted by mike infinity View Post

Anyone make any measurements in 3d mode?

With all of the comments/data here and in other threads I am having a hard time understanding whether I might get enough brightness for 3D on my HP 2.8 106" screen with a throw distance of ~15 ft.

Right now I am testing an optoma hd66 which apparently gets ~600 lumens in 3D mode (from projectorcentral). I find it bright enough for 3d with my setup. Would the rs40 come close?

Hi Mike,

Here's another posting from Ron.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

I did check my RS40 last week for lumens in 3D mode but didn't post the results. I only measured 3D mode at the screen center. This was where I had just measured about 920 lumens in 2D mode (Natural - Std. Color Space - 6500K - high lamp -iris open -short throw) with 869 ANSI lumens using the 9-point measurements. I set my Blu-ray player to output in 1080i mode and played the AVS calibration disc for the 100 IRE white field then set the projector to force 3D side-by-side mode. I didn't record my exact result but I remember it was close to 600 lumens. I'll measure it again within the next day or two and report the specific result.

Larry



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post #109 of 292 Old 04-09-2011, 07:35 AM
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^^^

So should one set the blu ray player to output 1080i with using the AVS HD 709 test disc (using DVD as writable media)?

Even for using the single pixel convergence test? In other words, should the whole disc no matter what be output in 1080i instead of 1080p?

Sorry, I just want everything in check when I recieve my RS40.
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post #110 of 292 Old 04-09-2011, 09:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryChanin View Post

Hi,

Maybe Ron can help clarify this issue further, but here's a description of how he measured an ANSI average of 869 lumens after 50 hours on the lamp.

..............................

And here's how he did a quick calibration.

..............................

In the first set measurements it doesn't appear that he did any thing to adjust the gain/offset controls. I would guess that his peak center screen lumens would have been about 920 lumens. Those settings were not identical to ohotos', but they are similar.

In the second measurement Ron did a quick calibration and the peak lumens at screen center dropped to about 800 lumens.

Larry

Larry -

My 'quick' calibration wasn't really all that quick. I did set the RGB gains and offsets to achieve very close to 6500K using my Eye-one. I also did a custom gamma setup so that it stayed between 2.2 and 2.3. This calibration was done starting with the Film mode and Standard colorspace. This custom setting did have the contrast set to display some above the reference white level (235) which would mean the the peak lumens output when sending a reference 100% white image (from the AVS calibration disc) would be a little lower than if I had it set to not display whiter-than-white video levels (i.e., start clipping just above level 235, as I had done with the other measurement for the preset Natural mode). So the bottom line was I was getting just under 800 lumens in the calibrated mode, but it would probably have gone up to a little over 800 lumens if I had set the white level to the 235 reference. Also recall this was using the 9-point ANSI lumens measurement approach which will produce a lower number than just doing a single center of screen measurement that some other forum members have reported.

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post #111 of 292 Old 04-09-2011, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by monstosity12 View Post

^^^

So should one set the blu ray player to output 1080i with using the AVS HD 709 test disc (using DVD as writable media)?

Even for using the single pixel convergence test? In other words, should the whole disc no matter what be output in 1080i instead of 1080p?

Sorry, I just want everything in check when I recieve my RS40.

No - the BD player should normally be set to output in 1080p/24 for using the AVS test disc. I used the 1080i output mode just for doing the measurement of the projector's lumens output in 3D mode. I did this because the JVC projectors can be forced into 3D side-by-side mode when a 1080i signal is input and for a full screen reference white screen test pattern this can be used for measuring the projector's 3D mode lumens output. For all 2D tests the BD player needs to be set to 1080p/24 output mode ('auto' mode shouild also work with most BD players).

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post #112 of 292 Old 04-09-2011, 10:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

Larry -

My 'quick' calibration wasn't really all that quick. I did set the RGB gains and offsets to achieve very close to 6500K using my Eye-one. I also did a custom gamma setup so that it stayed between 2.2 and 2.3. This calibration was done starting with the Film mode and Standard colorspace. This custom setting did have the contrast set to display some above the reference white level (235) which would mean the the peak lumens output when sending a reference 100% white image (from the AVS calibration disc) would be a little lower than if I had it set to start clipping just above level 235 (as I had done with the other measurement for the preset Natural mode). So the bottom line was I was getting just under 800 lumens in the calibrated mode, but it would probably have gone up to a little over 800 lumens if I had set the white level to the 235 reference. Also recall this was using the 9-point ANSI lumens measurement approach which will produce a lower number than just doing a single center of screen measurement that some other forum members have reported.

Hi Ron,

Thanks again.

There seems to be some understandable doubt from others concerning ohotos' fabulous measurements. However, if we compare your precalibration peak center screen measurement to his we are comparing about 920 lumens to about 1153 lumens. So that roughly 20% difference could be simply due to variations in lamps and meters. If both of those lumen outputs were to hold up over several hundred hours there would probably be no need for this thread to monitor lumens for this projector.

Larry



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post #113 of 292 Old 04-09-2011, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by LarryChanin View Post

Hi Ron,

Thanks again.

There seems to be some understandable doubt from others concerning ohotos' fabulous measurements. However, if we compare your precalibration peak center screen measurement to his we are comparing about 920 lumens to about 1153 lumens. So that roughly 20% difference could be simply due to variations in lamps and meters. If both of those lumen outputs were to hold up over several hundred hours there would probably be no need for this thread to monitor lumens for this projector.

Larry

The difference may very well be just a matter of the light meter ohotos is using.

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post #114 of 292 Old 04-09-2011, 12:06 PM
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I received my May 2011 issue of Home Theater magazine today and it includes reviews of both the X7 (RS50) the X3 (RS40). The X3 review is by AVS Forum member Kris Deering and the X7 review is by Shane Buetter. They had a chance to do some side-by-side comparisons. I suggest you pick up a copy (or wait for it to show up online). I did note that while there were observations about the light output of the projectors there were no direct lumens measurements reported. Also it was interesting to see that their measurements for full on/off contrast ratio was essentially the same for both the X3 (i.e., 22,000:1) and X7 (i.e., 23,725:1). In both cases these CR numbers were with the projectors calibrated (i.e., dialed-in) in the configuration used for the evaluation of each projector. For the X7 this was with the aperature (dual iris) was set to -5, the lamp set to high and the setting of the zoom is not reported. For the X3 the aperature (single iris) was set to -6, the lamp to high and "near maximum zoom" was used. For the X7 it is reported that in testing for max. available CR the zoom was set to max. and the aperature was set to -15 and with the lamp still in high mode they measured a full on/off CR of 52,500:1. The max. CR possible with the X3 was not reported.

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post #115 of 292 Old 04-09-2011, 12:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryChanin View Post

Hi,

To recap Ron's responses to my questions in posting #87:

For folks who have not had a professional calibration, but who are interested in measuring lumens using meaningful settings for comparision purposes, the following settings are recommended:

Picture mode: Natural
Color space: Standard
Color temperature: 6500K
Gamma: Normal
Iris: 0 Fully open
Lamp power mode: High
HDMI Input mode: Standard
Contrast: 0
Brightness: 0

State hours on lamp
State % of maximum throw based on screen size
State measurement method, peak at screen center, or 9-point ANSI average.


If Ron's observations of around a 10% reduction in lumen output due to calibration are representative, we might be able to get rough idea of what to expect after calibration while collecting precalibration measurements taken with consistent, and usable settings. Of course this 10% number really depends on the color balance of the lamp and at this point we really don't know how consistent they are between individual lamps without continuing to take precalibration and post calibration measurements as Ron has done.

Larry

To help everybody out I just got my RS40 projector and took a measurement. Hope this helps.

Picture mode: Natural
Color space: Standard
Color temperature: 6500K
Gamma: Normal
Iris: 0 Fully open
Lamp power mode: High
HDMI Input mode: Standard
Contrast: 0
Brightness: 0
Hours on Bulb: 9
Screen Size: 126" 16x9 HP 2.4 Gain
Throw Distance: 16.5 Feet
Peak LUX: 204 LUX using peak mode on a CA813 meter. Center measurement only
Lumens: 892 Center measurement only
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post #116 of 292 Old 04-09-2011, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by LexiGuy View Post

To help everybody out I just got my RS40 projector and took a measurement. Hope this helps.

Picture mode: Natural
Color space: Standard
Color temperature: 6500K
Gamma: Normal
Iris: 0 Fully open
Lamp power mode: High
HDMI Input mode: Standard
Contrast: 0
Brightness: 0
Hours on Bulb: 9
Screen Size: 126" 16x9 HP 2.4 Gain
Throw Distance: 16.5 Feet
Peak LUX: 204 LUX using peak mode on a CA813 meter. Center measurement only
Lumens: 892 Center measurement only

Very close to my results. I measured slightly higher lumens (for center of screen measurement location) but you are using a little more zoom for you longer throw distance (thus a little more light loss thru the lens).

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post #117 of 292 Old 04-09-2011, 01:01 PM
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you guys are killing me with these reports. I'll trade either of you a perfectly converged / perfect focus RS50 for your RS40. It only has 1 problem. It can't put out more than 550 lumens in any usuable mode with a brand new lamp.

that's not a big deal, is it? JVC did a number this year on those willing to spend on the mid and high end models - making the RS40 the obvious choice in their 2011 lineup if lumen output is even remotely a concern.


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post #118 of 292 Old 04-09-2011, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

I received my May 2011 issue of Home Theater magazine today and it includes reviews of both the X7 (RS50) the X3 (RS40). The X3 review is by AVS Forum member Kris Deering and the X7 review is by Shane Buetter. They had a chance to do some side-by-side comparisons. I suggest you pick up a copy (or wait for it to show up online). I did note that while there were observations about the light output of the projectors there were no direct lumens measurements reported. Also it was interesting to see that their measurements for full on/off contrast ratio was essentially the same for both the X3 (i.e., 22,000:1) and X7 (i.e., 23,725:1). In both cases these CR numbers were with the projectors calibrated (i.e., dialed-in) in the configuration used for the evaluation of each projector. For the X7 this was with the aperature (dual iris) was set to -5, the lamp set to high and the setting of the zoom is not reported. For the X3 the aperature (single iris) was set to -6, the lamp to high and "near maximum zoom" was used. For the X7 it is reported that in testing for max. available CR the zoom was set to max. and the aperature was set to -15 and with the lamp still in high mode they measured a full on/off CR of 52,500:1. The max. CR possible with the X3 was not reported.

Hi All,

Yes, I agree folks should pick up a copy. Both projectors were Top Picks and as Ron points out whereas neither Shane nor Kris took lumen measurements, both did mention anomalies when comparing targeted brightness to previous models.

Here's a brief excerpt from Kris' review of the X3.

Quote:


I typically like my projector to display about 12 to 14 foot-lamberts on my 1.3-gain 120-inch-diagonal Stewart Filmscreen StudioTek 130 screen. With my previous projector, the JVC DLA-RS35 (the Reference Series version of the identical DLA-HD990), I didn't have to run the iris wide open to reach this goal. So I was surprised to find that I had to run the DLA-X3 in High lamp mode, with the iris almost fully open, to obtain the same peak brightness level. This despite the fact that the DLA-X3 has a higher wattage lamp. I was really hoping that the DLA-X3's new lamp would afford more lumens, allowing for a more aggressive Lens Aperture setting to take advantage of its contrast performance. Unfortunately, the new lamp just doesn't seem to add any clear benefit despite its claimed increase in light output.

It is unfortunate that they did not measure the lumens and in particular compare the lumen performance of the X3 to the X7 since they had access to both projectors.

Larry



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post #119 of 292 Old 04-09-2011, 02:15 PM
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(..)
It is unfortunate that they did not measure the lumens and in particular compare the lumen performance of the X3 to the X7 since they had access to both projectors.

Larry

Now that quote is quite interesting. If the X3 is putting out 800 lumens calibrated, then that would be a bit more then the RS25/35.
They should have done some lumen measurements, as that quote seams controversial to the measurements here.
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post #120 of 292 Old 04-09-2011, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

you guys are killing me with these reports. I'll trade either of you a perfectly converged / perfect focus RS50 for your RS40. It only has 1 problem. It can't put out more than 550 lumens in any usuable mode with a brand new lamp.

that's not a big deal, is it? JVC did a number this year on those willing to spend on the mid and high end models - making the RS40 the obvious choice in their 2011 lineup if lumen output is even remotely a concern.

Hey Jason, I have seen your other post where you have been struggling with going back to the RS40 but had concerns with convergence and focus. If it helps my convergence is perfect on the left side of the screen and very slightly off on the right. Maybe 1/4 pic off. It is so close I almost have to put my face on the screen to see it. I used the convergence patterns on the AVS disc and not the internal pattern.

As far as focus I have been using various txt boxes like the menu system for the projector and for my oppo 95 player and it seems very good from what I can tell. Can you recommend a good test to verify focus across the entire screen?

Maybe others can chime in and state how good there focus and convergence is and if they just got there projector or had it for awhile. Maybe the newer shipping projectors have tighter tolerances or maybe I just got lucky.
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