Panasonic PTAE7000/ AT5000 - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 08:24 AM
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Any word if panasonic offer a bundled package with this? I would like the 3d version of Avatar with a couple pairs of glasses to get started.

Can 3d movies be rented anywhere? I have netflix but never thought to look before.

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post #92 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 09:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Jones View Post

There were prices announced last year when they had planned to release their LCoS projectors and before then ran into issues with actually manufacturing the LCoS chips (see the existing thread - HERE). However, as the market has changed over the past year I suspect the prices will be lower, especially for 2D only models. Epson has not yet announced their plans for 3D projectors, but it is expected this info will be released, and perhaps demos provided, at the IFA (Germany) and CEDIA (USA) trade shows in early Sept. There have been some hints that Epson would bring out a LCD 3D projector and given that Panasonic is usng D9 Epson LCD chips, there will probably be an Epson LCD 3D model(s) based on these same D9 chips. If Epson follows their normal pattern there will probably be at least 2 models offered. It's still unknown what plans Epson has for a LCoS based 3D model.

As I vaguely remember, the tentative prices floated last year for the Epson lcos pj's were in between their lcd pj's and the JVC's. If they are indeed still only 2d as expected--which would be my preference--I hope you are right that they will be a bit lower. If Epson actually produces a product with the performance of the prototype that cine4home reviewed last year, I think it will be my next pj--unless JVC's new product shows some very significant advances!
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post #93 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 09:21 AM
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the panels they use are .74 higher aperature.

the D7 was .70" panels. So yes new panels should have better native contrast also.
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post #94 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 09:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by conan48 View Post

the panels they use are .74 higher aperature.

the D7 was .70" panels. So yes new panels should have better native contrast also.

I hope you buy the Panasonic and then let us know what you think. Give it a bit of time though - let's say a month to get over that crucial honeymoon period. I believe you own the Acer 720p 3D projector and have had both the Sony VW90 and JVC RS-50 so your comments should be well informed.
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post #95 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viche View Post

I have a 240hz samsung lcd and I can still see the lcd motion blur. The 240 helps the frame creation techology, but I don't know that it overcomes the blurriness that you see in lcd motion. Not sure if its the same with projectors.

I'm very sensitive to LCD panel motion blur and as I walk around Best Buy I wonder how people can put up with it, as I see it in so many of their flat panel LCD TVs.

Plasmas, CRTs, and small panel projector LCD s [ such as the Epson D7 (I think) LCD panel based Panasonic PTAE4000 I've had for a year, or so] don't seem to have this same problem and I'm viewing in a much better setting than a department store, and on a 98" screen, so I think I'd notice it if it were a problem. I guess .7" LCDs don't have this same problem as their big brothers.

LCOS/SXRD projectors on the other hand I believe do have this problem. At least they did when I investigated them some 5 years ago or so. I'm not sure about single chip DLP, but their rainbow distortion, which I am also sensitive to, makes them a deal breaker in my book.

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..

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post #96 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 10:11 AM
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no thx i'll keep my 4k....3D is okay, but i can't see buying 8 pairs of glasses to fill my HT.

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post #97 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 10:26 AM
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Quick question: Will HDMI 1.3a support 3D or will I need to upgrade my receiver to support the new Panny?
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post #98 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 10:42 AM
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^

check: hdmi.org

I think you need 1.4 for 3D, IIRC.

specifically:
http://www.hdmi.org/manufacturer/hdmi_1_4/3d.aspx

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass any more than we get to pick the ending of a play. High fidelity is an unbiased, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original source's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..

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post #99 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 10:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

As I vaguely remember, the tentative prices floated last year for the Epson lcos pj's were in between their lcd pj's and the JVC's. If they are indeed still only 2d as expected--which would be my preference--I hope you are right that they will be a bit lower. If Epson actually produces a product with the performance of the prototype that cine4home reviewed last year, I think it will be my next pj--unless JVC's new product shows some very significant advances!

I'm a pretty big fan of 3D. Hopefully the new Epson 4000 will support 3D. If the pj doesn't do 3D but is amazing in just about every other way, and if JVC doesn't get their act together, then I would strongly consider it even without 3D.
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post #100 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

...If Epson actually produces a product with the performance of the prototype that cine4home reviewed last year, I think it will be my next pj--unless JVC's new product shows some very significant advances!

Does anyone have a link to the cine4home review of the prototype mentioned above? I tried the cine4home site but didn't see it. Thanks.
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post #101 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 11:06 AM
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thanks, I'll probably get a Blu-ray 3D disc player that has both 1.3 and 1.4 outputs and use the 1.3 output for the audio to my receiver. I'm nowhere near ready to replace my Denon 3808CI just because it doesn't support 1.4.
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post #102 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 11:29 AM
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Panasonic DMP-BDT310 has dual HDMI outs for around $200 street.
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post #103 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovingdvd View Post

Does anyone have a link to the cine4home review of the prototype mentioned above? I tried the cine4home site but didn't see it. Thanks.

Sorry; try this.

http://www.cine4home.de/tests/projek...00_Preview.htm
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post #104 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JamesN View Post

On the 4000 it matters. If your lens isn't centered, and you use the manual horizontal shift to center a zoomed 2.35:1 image, then the "unzoomed" 16:9 image is slightly off center. It's an even bigger deal if you have masking.

I was really hoping they would add power lens shift to the lens memory on this model. I didn't see anyone commenting either way, but I guess it's not there otherwise Panasonic would have made a point of mentioning it.

The manual lens shift controls are no longer on top of the case though, so where did they go?
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post #105 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 12:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m. zillch View Post

I'm very sensitive to LCD panel motion blur and as I walk around Best Buy I wonder how people can put up with it, as I see it in so many of their flat panel LCD TVs.

Plasmas, CRTs, and small panel projector LCD s [ such as the Epson D7 (I think) LCD panel based Panasonic PTAE4000 I've had for a year, or so] don't seem to have this same problem and I'm viewing in a much better setting than a department store, and on a 98" screen, so I think I'd notice it if it were a problem. I guess .7" LCDs don't have this same problem as their big brothers.

LCOS/SXRD projectors on the other hand I believe do have this problem. At least they did when I investigated them some 5 years ago or so. I'm not sure about single chip DLP, but their rainbow distortion, which I am also sensitive to, makes them a deal breaker in my book.


Great info! That's good news. So where can I find a list of LCD projectors using the .7" chip?


There was an interesting line from the projectorpoint review:
"Viewing the AE7000U side by side against the previous AE4000U clearly shows the smokier, gray look to the black areas of the AE4000U. By comparisson the AE7000U produced blacks that were inkier."

I'd really like someone to compare shadow detail. I've found that an image that is overall more black looking sometimes means that shadows are being crushed. When you have good shadow detail, there should be a slightly more grey overall look to the entire image.
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post #106 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 12:14 PM
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The manual lens shift controls are in the front hidden behind a door see the image

Quote:
Originally Posted by kriktsemaj99 View Post

I was really hoping they would add power lens shift to the lens memory on this model. I didn't see anyone commenting either way, but I guess it's not there otherwise Panasonic would have made a point of mentioning it.

The manual lens shift controls are no longer on top of the case though, so where did they go?


LL
LL
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post #107 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 12:26 PM
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Pity they didn't add powered shift, that would have made the lens memory work for a lot more people who have limited mounting options.
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post #108 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 01:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ckenisell View Post

I just received my 65" VT30 plasma (the 3D glasses will work with this 3D projector), but I just decided to move to a new city and, with the move, comes a new house. This house has an optional media room, which, of course, will become my home theater.

Floor plan here. Click Interactive Floor Plan tab > Second Floor > Media Room

The room is 15'-9" by 15'-8" and I will have the slope to 9' ceilings.

Since I am new to the projector scene, I could use a little advice:
  • What are the length limits for high speed HDMI cables? [Edit]I think I answered this one by looking at Monoprice and I see 100 ft. high speed HDMI cables. I don't need anything near that long, but would that work?
  • I would like to put the equipment rack in the closet. Since I have a Logitech Harmony H1, how do I point the remote at the screen, but have the signal reach all of the equipment that's in the closet? Is that was an IR repeater does? How does this work? [Edit]I just looked on Logitech's web site. It looks like I need the Harmony 900 with IR blaster.
  • What type of screen do I need to get for the best results with this projector?
  • Why not have a large 16x9 screen and just have the black bars during 2.35:1 movies? What does all of this "lens memory" stuff actually accomplish? I really don't want to have to get some kind of shifting screen cropping mechanism.
  • Am I correct in assuming that this projector mounts to a pole or platform that hangs from the ceiling?
  • What are some of the best room acoustical treatments available that also reduce light reflection such as the light reflecting from a projector screen?

Anybody?

Chet
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post #109 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 01:28 PM
 
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I saw the Panasonic yesterday along with Brad at the Panasonic Labs. I agree with Brads comments about the new AE7000. I think there is a good difference in brightness and detail quality between the AE7000 and the AE4000 in 2D. Nothing to compare in 3D of course

Still has the memory lens everyone seems to love. Great for scope screens. Panasonic glasses from their flatscreen tvs will work with the projector. The projector has a built in emitter that works within 6 meters. They do sell an external emitter for those who need a longer range. It connects to the 12 volt trigger

Let me first say that I dont really like 3D and I havent changed my mind after watching the Panasonic. However, i did think the 3D was done very well and I saw no ghosting. Just like any other projector, there is a big difference in brightness between wearing the glasses and not wearing them. They used a 1.0 white screen in both demos and to be honest, i have no idea how well those screens deal with polarization. I do know that Stewart has a type of material that deals really well with it and probably makes the 3D look a lot brighter. Panasonic likes to includes a lot of bells and whistles in their projector and has added those for 3D. They have a wave monitor that allows you to adjust the colors by displaying what the right eye and left eye sees and you can adjust both so they match. I would like to add that i was impressed by the 2-3D conversion. You know it wasnt filmed in 3D, but it does a great job in faking it. Its not exactly 3D, but not exactly 2D either.

As a fan of 2D, i think Panasonic did a really nice job with the AE7000. If you like the 4000, you are really going to like the 7000.

As for Panasonic coming out with a new projector., don't get excited. While they didnt exactly say so, its more likely going to be a less expensive projector, probably not 3D although that's my guess. Panasonic usually has an expensive model and a cheaper model
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post #110 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 02:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Hutnicki View Post

As for Panasonic coming out with a new projector., don't get excited. While they didnt exactly say so, its more likely going to be a less expensive projector, probably not 3D although that's my guess. Panasonic usually has an expensive model and a cheaper model

They usually do, but if Epson gets things worked out with their reflective-LCD chips (like LCOS) I could see Panasonic having a more expensive projector using those chips. While I don't recall them doing this before, they could even have 3 projectors by the end of the year or early next year, with this AE7000/AT5000 in the middle (R-LCD being the highest end and maybe a 2D model being the lowest end).

Just speculating though.

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post #111 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 07:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Whitefield View Post

You're correct if the lens throw is exactly perpendicular to the screen. And yes, you don't want to use horizontal shift.

But if the projector is angled just a tad horizontally, you won't notice the tiny amount of horizontal keystoning and overscan caused by a 6" offset, if you split the difference between 16:9 and 2.35. Even with 16:9 masking.

At least I don't, and I'm pretty picky. You may be pickier...

"Picky" is the polite term for what I am. More like anal-retentive.

Happily I am using a Chief RPA mount, and after a bit a research I found this:
Lateral Shift Bracket

It provides a 3" right/left lateral shift and adds only about 7/8" to the overall mount height. Seems like just the ticket.

Now I just need to find out if I also need a new mounting plate. It would be nice if the plate for the 4000 fit the 7000 as well.
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post #112 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 07:47 PM
 
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While I don't recall them doing this before, they could even have 3 projectors by the end of the year or early next year, with this AE7000/AT5000 in the middle (R-LCD being the highest end and maybe a 2D model being the lowest end).

I am not expert on Panasonic, but i have been following their projector now since the AE500. While they do fast in terms of releasing a new projector every year, I dont think they would all of sudden come out with a new projector just because a new chip comes out. I think they already have the 2012 model already in the design stage and while It could very easily be change before a 9/12 release, i cant see them creating a new projector and releasing in early 2012 just because there is a new chip
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post #113 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 09:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Hutnicki View Post

I saw the Panasonic yesterday along with Brad at the Panasonic Labs. I agree with Brads comments about the new AE7000. I think there is a good difference in brightness and detail quality between the AE7000 and the AE4000 in 2D. Nothing to compare in 3D of course

Still has the memory lens everyone seems to love. Great for scope screens. Panasonic glasses from their flatscreen tvs will work with the projector. The projector has a built in emitter that works within 6 meters. They do sell an external emitter for those who need a longer range. It connects to the 12 volt trigger

Let me first say that I dont really like 3D and I havent changed my mind after watching the Panasonic. However, i did think the 3D was done very well and I saw no ghosting. Just like any other projector, there is a big difference in brightness between wearing the glasses and not wearing them. They used a 1.0 white screen in both demos and to be honest, i have no idea how well those screens deal with polarization. I do know that Stewart has a type of material that deals really well with it and probably makes the 3D look a lot brighter. Panasonic likes to includes a lot of bells and whistles in their projector and has added those for 3D. They have a wave monitor that allows you to adjust the colors by displaying what the right eye and left eye sees and you can adjust both so they match. I would like to add that i was impressed by the 2-3D conversion. You know it wasnt filmed in 3D, but it does a great job in faking it. Its not exactly 3D, but not exactly 2D either.

As a fan of 2D, i think Panasonic did a really nice job with the AE7000. If you like the 4000, you are really going to like the 7000.

As for Panasonic coming out with a new projector., don't get excited. While they didnt exactly say so, its more likely going to be a less expensive projector, probably not 3D although that's my guess. Panasonic usually has an expensive model and a cheaper model

How would you compare the AE7000 with the RS50?
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post #114 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 10:43 PM
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my worry is still with the non-centre-mounted lens and dust-blob problem.

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post #115 of 1396 Old 07-30-2011, 10:58 PM
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Originally Posted by lovingdvd View Post

If one does get a dust blob, can it be cleaned at home - or do you have it send it in for service? If that later, I don't think I could consider such a machine.

In theory you can clean it at home, but it's not for the faint of heart. It's not as simple as opening the lid, blow some air, close the lid. It's tricky and requires (relatively) a lot of work.

They should've addressed this issue even on the 4000 but they didn't. I hope they REALLY address the issue on the 7000 or at the very least have a lid with only one screw (with rubber surround seal) to make the cleaning process much easier at home.

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post #116 of 1396 Old 07-31-2011, 12:01 AM
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Originally Posted by David Susilo View Post


In theory you can clean it at home, but it's not for the faint of heart. It's not as simple as opening the lid, blow some air, close the lid. It's tricky and requires (relatively) a lot of work.

They should've addressed this issue even on the 4000 but they didn't. I hope they REALLY address the issue on the 7000 or at the very least have a lid with only one screw (with rubber surround seal) to make the cleaning process much easier at home.

I hated cleaning mines
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post #117 of 1396 Old 07-31-2011, 02:01 AM
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Panasonic should just add the Sanyo cleaning design to their projectors, especially since they own Sanyo now. I don't think even the Sanyo design got rid of them 100%, but close enough as it blows them into such fine pieces you can't see them anymore.

My biggest concern with the Panasonic 7000 will be if it still produces a slightly softer image like the 4000 did, I wonder if this Panny is finally in the class as one of the sharper and punchier projectors for bright scenes, or if its still a bit soft like the old Panny's were (at least to me they appeared softer). A lot of people will not care either way, but sharper is especially better when you want to use it for HTPC.

Also, about time they added a stronger lamp, as some of the numbers these LCD's pump out in best mode is too DIM for those of us that like bigger screens. I guess it took 3D to make them finally increase the lumens. I guess heat/reliability issues keeps these LCD manufacturers trying to keep the lamp wattage at the minimums they think are suitable for their market.


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post #118 of 1396 Old 07-31-2011, 02:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Hutnicki View Post

I am not expert on Panasonic, but i have been following their projector now since the AE500. While they do fast in terms of releasing a new projector every year, I dont think they would all of sudden come out with a new projector just because a new chip comes out. I think they already have the 2012 model already in the design stage and while It could very easily be change before a 9/12 release, i cant see them creating a new projector and releasing in early 2012 just because there is a new chip

In this case the new chips from Epson have been public knowledge for almost a year (they were demoed at CEDIA last year), so I would be surprised if Panasonic hasn't been working on a model to use those chips. To be clear, I'm talking about the chips Epson announced for the 2000 and 4000 models last year, but have been delayed. I don't know if Epson will insist on an exclusivity period for the chips (if they ever work all the issues out) given the long delay.

--Darin

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post #119 of 1396 Old 07-31-2011, 03:14 AM
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Hi,

product sheet (in english) is available here :

http://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum/v...180#p174916180
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post #120 of 1396 Old 07-31-2011, 04:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darinp2 View Post

In this case the new chips from Epson have been public knowledge for almost a year (they were demoed at CEDIA last year), so I would be surprised if Panasonic hasn't been working on a model to use those chips. To be clear, I'm talking about the chips Epson announced for the 2000 and 4000 models last year, but have been delayed. I don't know if Epson will insist on an exclusivity period for the chips (if they ever work all the issues out) given the long delay.

A year ago, rumor had it that Epson had one year's exclusivity for their "reflective LCD" panels. Even if that were true, it might be one year from product announcement or from the actual launch. Which would make a big difference in this case.

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