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Old 09-13-2011, 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by johnsmith808 View Post

I'm glad Sony is not making the headphones so good that the cost goes way up. We already know what good sound is and can get it with a device we probably already own. It's the visuals that we are willing to pay for. I'm sure we will figure out a way, if desired, to use external sound equipment of some sort. However, I think the built in headphones may end up being used most of the time due to convenience since most of us a lazy.

Do the HMD's headphones allow an input from a 3rd party headphone amplifier? I have a Toshiba Dolby Headphone amp which takes an optical input and outputs 5.1 to a set of headphones. The effect is pretty realistic.

How does the HMD receive audio input? Via HDMI into that coupled brick unit?
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Old 09-13-2011, 07:11 PM
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David, is the picture equally sharp left-to-right and top-to-bottom?

They are equally sharp but there is slight bowing on the bottom left and right when watching 16:9 signal. The bowing was a lot worse at CES but not distracting although noticable. They may or may not fix the final production, I don't know.

Regardless, Sony have promised to ship a final unit for review when it becomes available, most probably mid November. Furthermore, I'll definitely be buying one for absolutely sure.

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Old 09-13-2011, 07:22 PM
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David. I didn't notice it on thepair I watched. The panels are flat I think but maybe thay are curved like eye glass lenses. I don't know. I would be dissapointed if a bow, if there, needed to be fixed by scalling. If a bow was there, what would cause it? Was it caused by the position of one's eyes in relation to a panel, a curve in the panels, or something else. What do you think?

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Old 09-13-2011, 07:32 PM
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^You are not look directly at the panel. There are intermediate optics which allow your eye to focus that close, analogous to using a jeweler's loupe. Optics, regardless of price, are never perfect and can have some degree of bowing/pincushion distortion, chromatic aberrations, blurry corners, vignetting, coma distortion, etc.


[The fact that these seem to have a greenish tint in the photo above is good. It doesn't mean they color the image green! It means at least some of the optical surfaces are AR (anti-reflection) coated, probably with magnesium fluoride or a metal oxide, which improves light throughput and helps reduce, but not eliminate, reflections off these surfaces. These reflections tend to reduce contrast and causes distracting ghost like reflections in the image. Seeing these ghosts, if they exist, would be most easy with bright credits at the end of a movie against a black background.]

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass, etc., any more than we pick the ending of a play. High fidelity means an unmodified, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original artist's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..
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Old 09-13-2011, 07:55 PM
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Other than the bottom corner bowing due to the optics, there is zero chromatic abberation (something I'm super sensitive about), zero blurriness, zero chroma distortion, zero vignetting.

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Old 09-13-2011, 09:27 PM
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I always wondered what we would do if we got a display that had perfect contrast and absolute black level. Ever since the inception of digital displays, that has always been the elusive goal. With this device, we may just about obtain just that.......then what? I know, I know. More resolution, more fov, etc. But this may be one of the largest jumps in picture quality any of us has ever seen (for a "large" image). For a projector to reach this level of picture quality, we may have to wait many years. To think that we can have something like this very soon is very exciting!

Projector will never reach this level as too many factor into play. As long as you have a bulb to generate light, there is no way to cut it down to total blackness. Also room reflection is another issue unless all your wall is matte black paint. With HMD all these problems are eliminated as it is self contained.
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Old 09-13-2011, 10:07 PM
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Thanks guys. Of course there are optical elements in front of the panels. And here we go again, the optics are built to a price point. It would be likely that more expensive optics might be able to eliminate the pincushioning or slight revisions to the optics in use on the demo pairs. None of us had a chance to view a grid pattern or a geometry pattern. But even if minor pincushioning is visible on the bottom of a grid pattern, it would be unlikily that it would be noticeable when watching normal content.

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Old 09-14-2011, 01:31 AM
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and the topic title start to make sense. xD
i will skip projector for sure.
what single user will buy a 1000 projector with 'crap' image if can buy something cheap that is portable , have much much better IQ in 2D with only 15W power consumption and still have not only 3D but the best 3D available???
call me crazy, but for single use, projector after sony hmz-t1 dont make any sense.

now only need to confirm how confortable this gadget is with 2-3h hours of continuous use and the lifetime of OLED screen
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Old 09-14-2011, 02:16 AM
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Yes this device is the most efficient display on the planet. Efficient use of energy, light, and room environment.

Conversely, you could say that a 3d projector is the most inefficient display. 75% of light is lost. The bulb being used (on most projectors) creates more heat than light. The image suffers washout through the optics, greatly reducing ansi contrast. A great percentage of the light is either reflected or absorbed in the viewing environment. A tremendous amount of room customizations are required to experience optimum viewing conditions.

Of course we still love and have come to accept these limitations/requirements of owning a projector. It was the only way to experience the large screen effect at home.....until now.
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Old 09-14-2011, 02:25 AM
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Originally Posted by David Susilo View Post

oh, and to answer your question, compared to the PT-AE3000U and PT-AE4000U... my projectors look like garbage, especially in the fast motion department and black level (my projectors... what black level? they're more like dark-grey level)

I think right now many of us are thinking that this hmd will be a great compliment to our home theater. I am worried that many of us may have a hard time sitting through a movie on our projectors and not be bothered by the reduced contrast, etc.

What has your experience been David?
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Old 09-14-2011, 04:48 AM
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Originally Posted by johnsmith808 View Post

I think right now many of us are thinking that this hmd will be a great compliment to our home theater. I am worried that many of us may have a hard time sitting through a movie on our projectors and not be bothered by the reduced contrast, etc.

What has your experience been David?

you are absolutely correct. This device is a perfect (warts and all) complement of front projection and NOT a complete replacement of front projection

not because front projection is better or worse, but the reflective image of front projection looks (obviously) more filmlike than any flat panel display technology (I consider the HMZ-T1 as FPD tech)

for ultra serious movie watching like Casablanca, Sound of Music, I'd stick with my projector but for animation stuff and movies with lots of CG (where the movies were designed more for FPD viewing than projection), the HMZ-T1 will be the better companion.

The above of course is purely subjective opinion and not based on any objective view.

And for the person who insinuates that I'm a Sony fanboy, I open my house door to you to find Sony equipment in my electronics collection. You'd think I'm a Pioneer fanboy afterwards and yet you'll still be wrong.

I'm a fanboy of good electronics with great value for the money.

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Old 09-14-2011, 06:04 AM
 
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Originally Posted by p_sousa View Post

and the topic title start to make sense. xD
i will skip projector for sure.
what single user will buy a 1000€ projector with 'crap' image if can buy something cheap that is portable , have much much better IQ in 2D with only 15W power consumption and still have not only 3D but the best 3D available???
call me crazy, but for single use, projector after sony hmz-t1 dont make any sense.

now only need to confirm how confortable this gadget is with 2-3h hours of continuous use and the lifetime of OLED screen

There you go, the perfect way to rationalize this purchase to the wife.

" But honey it will save us money. Instead of turning on the projector and all those amps that use so much energy, I just have to turn on these glasses and a BD player."

AVS disclaimer: AVS not held responsible for use of above statement to significant other.
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Old 09-14-2011, 09:13 AM
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There you go, the perfect way to rationalize this purchase to the wife.

" But honey it will save us money. Instead of turning on the projector and all those amps that use so much energy, I just have to turn on these glasses and a BD player."

Let's not forget the biggest killjoy of them all: bulb hours. ::shudder::

I haven't been this excited over a new development in a long time. It's no replacement for a PJ, but I suspect it'll have better PQ than anything I've ever had, and the same goes for many people. I live in an area where $750K gets you 2000 sq ft, so turning a room into a bat cave is not really an option. And really, I'm the only geek in the family who cares much about the big screen experience or PQ anyway (everybody else is happy to watch the LCD TVl and doesn't notice any problem unless the movie actually stops playing, usually because I want to fix something).

Mark, David: what was the longest continuous time you were able to use it? It's highly individualized of course, but I wonder about negative physiological reaction -- eye strain, headache, tiredness, etc. An emissive display in a small enclosed space kinda worries me.
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Old 09-14-2011, 09:18 AM
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About 50 minutes straight, watching Incredibles blu-ray, yesterday.

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Old 09-14-2011, 10:12 AM
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Let's not forget the biggest killjoy of them all: bulb hours. ::shudder::

It's funny how this serves two segments simultaneously. I was looking at 3D projectors this year before ultimately settling on the Vango. This seems to fill that niche for me and I doubt I will use it except for travel for much besides 3D.

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Old 09-14-2011, 10:41 AM
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Yeah. I'll still use my RS35 for 2D movie watching but I'll use this for 3D and gaming. I'm really excited about this unit. Might get two so the wifey can join the 3D fun.

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Old 09-14-2011, 11:25 AM
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What's the thought on using this with an existing surround sound setup? I could see someone who lives by themselves (such as myself) changing around their theater room so that the seating is right in the middle of the room. Sit down, put these on, flip up the headphones, and have at it.

I guess the main problem, as someone mentioned earlier in the thread, would be lag between the video and audio, caused by the conversion box. It will be interesting to see how that plays out once people start receiving review units.
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Old 09-14-2011, 12:28 PM
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What's the thought on using this with an existing surround sound setup? I could see someone who lives by themselves (such as myself) changing around their theater room so that the seating is right in the middle of the room. Sit down, put these on, flip up the headphones, and have at it.

I guess the main problem, as someone mentioned earlier in the thread, would be lag between the video and audio, caused by the conversion box. It will be interesting to see how that plays out once people start receiving review units.

That has yet to be confirmed. Check the thread history. It's purely speculation as to whether there will be a delay.

I don't see Sony allowing an HMDI pass-through considering any audio delay would make wearing the HMD (while other people watch via an HDTV) very annoying. If Sony thought to have a pass-through, surely they thought of the end result. But then, that's my optimistic speculation vs. the pessimistic speculation.
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Old 09-14-2011, 12:53 PM
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I could care less about a passthrough .. I'd use a splitter if really necessary anyway, which would probably be rare .. I mean, why would you be using the HMD and displaying the same thing on the TV .. ??

I would like to see wireless .. but I'll take this in it's current configuration, regardless ..

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Old 09-14-2011, 02:01 PM
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more than 20.000 views on this topic...people are start to get some interest in this. xD
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Old 09-14-2011, 02:18 PM
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For a projector to reach this level of picture quality, we may have to wait many years. To think that we can have something like this very soon is very exciting!

Indeed, it is. I've been waiting patiently for years for an affordable HD LED projector while waiting for a laser projector, but now it looks like I'll only be waiting for OLED HMDs.
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Old 09-14-2011, 02:31 PM
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I only saw it at the show and the longest continuous viewing was about 7 minutes.

Our Sony rep said this product will ship in October but that Sony had not yet set dealer pricing. MSRP of $799 confirmed.

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Old 09-14-2011, 02:55 PM
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I only saw it at the show and the longest continuous viewing was about 7 minutes.

Our Sony rep said this product will ship in October
but that Sony had not yet sett dealer pricing. MSRP of $799 confirmed.

so since im on the pre order list through you , would that mean would get them in october??
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Old 09-14-2011, 04:19 PM
 
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so since im on the pre order list through you , would that mean would get them in october??

You will get them right after we receive them. Of course we might have to run a quality check, for a few days on each pair before shipping out.


JUST KIDDING.
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Old 09-14-2011, 04:36 PM
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I could care less about a passthrough .. I'd use a splitter if really necessary anyway, which would probably be rare .. I mean, why would you be using the HMD and displaying the same thing on the TV .. ??

I would like to see wireless .. but I'll take this in it's current configuration, regardless ..

Here is the solution. But too bad you still need the power cable.

http://www.guru3d.com/article/kfa2-g...eam-hd-review/

For 360 degree gaming, we just need a portable battery pack and a backpack with wireless video streaming.

Is the power input using a DC adapter into the video controller or direct 110v/240v? If it is using either 5v or 12v DC adapter than it's easier to mod for battery pack.
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Old 09-14-2011, 04:36 PM
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you will get them right after we receive them. Of course we might have to run a quality check, for a few days on each pair before shipping out.:d


just kidding.

awesome ty
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Old 09-14-2011, 06:16 PM
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Is the power input using a DC adapter into the video controller or direct 110v/240v?

Direct AC. It draws 15 watts.

In A/V reproduction accuracy, there is no concept of "accounting for taste". We don't "pick" the level of bass, etc., any more than we pick the ending of a play. High fidelity means an unmodified, neutral, exact copy (or "reproduction") of the original artist's tonal balance, timing, dynamics, etc..
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Old 09-14-2011, 06:51 PM
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Direct AC. It draws 15 watts.

So even 2 18650 3,000 mAh Lithium batteries can power this for an hour.

But this can't be powered off of a USB port

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Old 09-14-2011, 08:04 PM
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We should be shipping them sometime in October. And I will loan him the unit ordered for me if he promises not to check each incoming pair by using them for two days.

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Old 09-14-2011, 08:13 PM
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It makes me sick to read some of the posts here. The Sony people are not lazy and neither was JVC in not including a 4K input. They are good people who care about their products.

The Sony demos, put it on and look for a few minutes and then next in line, on and off and adjust them for each viewer's head and eyes, just don't permit on and off with the bottom flaps attached. They probably wouldnt stand up to the wear for 8 or 9 hours of on and off. 9 hours of such on and off would be about the equivalent I am guessing to a few years of really heavy use. The rough handling I suspect could damage the flaps. If you buy them, you will adjust them for your head and will quickly learn how to use them and take them on and off without damaging them.

The show is for dealers and press. The show is not designed for consumer demos by which a potential buyer can decide. That's a job for dealers and stores. To allow you a full demo. If you buy without a demo for yourself, do it based on what people you trust, that have had a proper demo, conclude. Banter here by people who have not had a chance to use them, is just that, banter. WTF cares what you think? After you try them, tell us what you think. We all care about such observations. They are then useful to us in making a buying decision.

If you think a product is too expensive for you, that's fine but it has no bearing on whether someone else thinks its worthwhile or not. Everyone's economic situation is different and what they buy is their decision. All I care about is whether I want or need them, and whether I think they are worth the money for that want and need, and the whether I can afford them at the cost of not getting something else I might want.

I made mine, I wish Sony could sell them for $14.95, I would save a lot of money and have the big balance to spend on something else. I wish they could run on rechargeable batteries and I could wear them on a plane. It would increase my want and use. But it is what it is. For me it is worth it, but that's based on my values and wants and not yours.

The only comments by me that are of any value are those sharing product knowledge, reporting on how they feel to wear, and the PQ they provide.

If you were Sony's product manager and it was your responsibility to demo the product to thousands of visitors to the Sony booth who wanted to briefly experience the product, you would have done it the same way they did. A spot was assigned. Better booth design and planning could have taken care of the bright light overhead but its a show and something the designers of the booth just overlooked. They aren't perfect but you are. Right.

Sorry for the rant. And I am not talking here as an AVS representative, just as a forum member and consumer.

This should be a sticky! lol Excellent points.
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