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post #2431 of 10735 Old 05-09-2012, 05:22 PM
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Should have mine tomorrow
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post #2432 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 02:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericsson View Post

AVForums review and comparison to JVC X70. http://www.avforums.com/reviews/Sony...95/Review.html

Black levels JVC X70 looks blacker than Sonys finally an unbias fully calibrated comparison....why am i not surprised....

Just imagine how the X90 would have looked
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post #2433 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 04:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin 3000 View Post

Black levels JVC X70 looks blacker than Sonys finally an unbias fully calibrated comparison....why am i not surprised....

Just imagine how the X90 would have looked

And you just couldn't wait to post it here!

Who wants to trade in their 1000ES for a RS55? Raise your hand...

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post #2434 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 05:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin 3000 View Post

Black levels JVC X70 looks blacker than Sonys finally an unbias fully calibrated comparison....why am i not surprised....

Because you've been trying for months to apparently justify your JVC purchase to yourself?

Quote:
Just imagine how the X90 would have looked

Exactly the same as the X70 from all accounts.
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post #2435 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 07:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin 3000 View Post

Black levels JVC X70 looks blacker than Sonys finally an unbias fully calibrated comparison....why am i not surprised....

Just imagine how the X90 would have looked

This review is very pro JVC just like you, but most people who have seen them side by side in the same room holds the VW1000 to be quite alot better including me. I would never trade my expencive VW1000 with the JVC X70/X90...

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post #2436 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 08:07 AM
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I'm sure the JVC does have slightly better blacks, but does that surprise anyone? thats what they are known for!

Meanwhile, the Sony has 2000 lumens, much better motion, much better 3D, and way less lag for gaming. Oh, and it can do native 4K, which the JVC cannot.

I could see getting the JVC if movies were all i care about, and i had a batcave, but i don't want to spend that much money on 3D filled with crosstalk and unplayable game lag.
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post #2437 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 08:29 AM
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Is anybody else using the 1000ES with a very large screen and significant vertical shift (I'm also at almost minimum throw if that matters)? After looking at other Sony PJ threads, I've found reference on older models to my core geometry issue, which is slight trapezoid on the left and right sides (increases as you get closer to the bottom) and horizontal bowing in the bottom middle. I've had two projectors act the same way. I think maybe that is just the way the light path works with a lot of vertical shift (I'm not anywhere near the limits though, I'm less than 2 feet above the top of the screen).

I know it is not the screen because we ran a string test near the bottom of the screen with a perfectly level tight screen and could verify the bowing image with the test patterns built into the projector.

I believe now that my geometry issue at the top of the screen may be an issue with the screen boundary not being perfectly straight/level. That was throwing me off during initial testing with my original projector.

I think some of this may actually be able to be corrected by intentionally shimming the screen out of plane, but it may not be worth it. Not sure how big of a deal it is going to be long term since I don't have my HTPC hooked up yet and I haven't used gaming systems that much yet.

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post #2438 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 08:30 AM
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Originally Posted by whitetrash66 View Post

I could see getting the JVC if movies were all i care about, and i had a batcave, but i don't want to spend that much money on 3D filled with crosstalk and unplayable game lag.

I completely agree about gaming on the Sony. On my previous projector (JVC X7/RS50), lag on fast moving games made the experience so unpleasant that I gave up and played them on the plasma downstairs instead.

The Sony in game mode is fantastic however - feels just as responsive as the plasma, lovely and bright, but with the advantage of it covering the wall! I completed Mass Effect 3 on it, and by the end I was convinced I *was* Commander Shephard
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post #2439 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 09:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

And you just couldn't wait to post it here!

Who wants to trade in their 1000ES for a RS55? Raise your hand...

The same can be asked about a Sim2 3 chipper for a 1000! Even though the black level on the 1000 is better, a couple 3 chip owners who demoed the 1000 admitted how great it looked , but still preferred the higher black level dlp.
Obviously, black level is important, but screen size, gain, perf or not, type of material viewed, e.g dark movies vs sports, gaming, all come into play when they decide what looks best to them.

I'd be curious though if the 3 chip dlp would still be the preferred choice if you had a moderate size screen , sat at common distances from screen, in total light control room and watched mostly dark movies, no sports or gaming compared to the 1000 or the 55/65.
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post #2440 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 09:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlanzy View Post

The same can be asked about a Sim2 3 chipper for a 1000! Even though the black level on the 1000 is better, a couple 3 chip owners who demoed the 1000 admitted how great it looked , but still preferred the higher black level dlp.
Obviously, black level is important, but screen size, gain, perf or not, type of material viewed, e.g dark movies vs sports, gaming, all come into play when they decide what looks best to them.

I'd be curious though if the 3 chip dlp would still be the preferred choice if you had a moderate size screen , sat at common distances from screen, in total light control room and watched mostly dark movies, no sports or gaming compared to the 1000 or the 55/65.

Pretty much in agreement with your comments. Every now and then I do miss the higher o/f CR of the JVC, but like the 1000 much better overall. Sitting close (~1.0 SW) to a large screen, one really appreciates the superb 1080p => 4K upconversion; and the brightness (>/~ 30 ftL off a 144x72 HP screen) is addictive!
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post #2441 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

Pretty much in agreement with your comments. Every now and then I do miss the higher o/f CR of the JVC, but like the 1000 much better overall. Sitting close (~1.0 SW) to a large screen, one really appreciates the superb 1080p => 4K upconversion; and the brightness (>/~ 30 ftL off a 144x72 HP screen) is addictive!

Are you speaking of your RS20 JVC you used to own? If so i am surprised you miss on/off CR compared to this VW1000?
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post #2442 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

Pretty much in agreement with your comments. Every now and then I do miss the higher o/f CR of the JVC, but like the 1000 much better overall. Sitting close (~1.0 SW) to a large screen, one really appreciates the superb 1080p => 4K upconversion; and the brightness (>/~ 30 ftL off a 144x72 HP screen) is addictive!

It appears that the 1000 has presented a bridge both pricewise and performance between lcos and dlp, with black levels comparable to lcos and brightness closing in on the 3 chip pjs. Add to that the sharpness/detail that 4K adds and it makes the 3 chip advantages less compelling, and thier costs even more halting, unless you have humongous screens and watch a lot of sports.
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post #2443 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 10:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joerod View Post

And you just couldn't wait to post it here!

Who wants to trade in their 1000ES for a RS55? Raise your hand...

My 1000 replaced a JVC X9 and it's no comparison.
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post #2444 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 10:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rfield19 View Post

I completely agree about gaming on the Sony. On my previous projector (JVC X7/RS50), lag on fast moving games made the experience so unpleasant that I gave up and played them on the plasma downstairs instead.

The Sony in game mode is fantastic however - feels just as responsive as the plasma, lovely and bright, but with the advantage of it covering the wall! I completed Mass Effect 3 on it, and by the end I was convinced I *was* Commander Shephard

You may need a new bulb after completing a game that long on a projector! I finished that one too..except on my 30" monitor. Some didnt like the ending... I did... kind of a BSG style ending.


Speaking of game mode, what does it change in the settings? Is there any use to movies in switching game mode on?
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post #2445 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by hifiaudio2 View Post

You may need a new bulb after completing a game that long on a projector!

Speaking of game mode, what does it change in the settings? Is there any use to movies in switching game mode on?

I'm not 100% sure what game mode alters!
It definitely alters the gamma and pushes the colour up a bit, but that's adjustable in the 'game' preset afterward anyway.

All the user manual says is
'well-modulated colours and fast response'.


which I'd concur with - as it seems to switch off any postprocessing of the image as far as I can tell (although you can still use RC) - and lag is definitely reduced with game mode on vs off. Even with game mode off though, lag time is still pretty good vs my old setup!

I've not tried it, but I don't think it'd do much for video tbh - could perhaps try it on really low quality cable signals maybe, but I can't really see it getting much use for anything but gaming.

If you were looking for a mode that doesn't alter the incoming video very much, reference is probably a better choice.
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post #2446 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 10:49 AM
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My 1000 replaced a 3 chip DLP (not a newer SIM although I've seen and tested a couple in my room). I'm very happy with the 1000. The truth is if I don't have the other PJ set up side by side or quickly do A/B comparisons it's sometimes (and sometimes really) difficult to see what all the differences are.

I know the 3 chip I had was brighter but it's not noticeable to me but would be to a light meter. I know the 1000 is a much better picture, has zero pixels visible at any distance compared to the 3 chipper as well as host of other things. For myself I wouldn't go back to a 3 chip DLP unless I could see something it was doing the Sony wasn't that I really wanted and I can't see that happening in the near future. The Sony has all the "pop" of my old DLP and a host of benefits it didn't have. I'm using a AT 140" 16:9 SMX gain around 1.0 and its fine for everything. Plenty bright for 3D (better than I've ever seen 3D really including the Epson which I've seen in a dedicated room - the Epson was brighter but the picture wasn't as good IMO so I'm ok with that trade off). For gaming, movies, pretty much everything I've thrown at it and I have about 150 hours on the unit already and for me it's an amazing PJ well worth the upgrade from my 3 chip DLP.

At the end of the day I guess as long as you're happy with the purchase and the picture that is all that ultimately matters!

Cheers
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post #2447 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 10:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hifiaudio2 View Post

You may need a new bulb after completing a game that long on a projector! I finished that one too..except on my 30" monitor. Some didnt like the ending... I did... kind of a BSG style ending.

Playing FFXIII-2 on it currently btw - which is apparently around the 40 hour mark in total, so you could be right about needing a new bulb soon!

Oh, and I didn't mind the ending on ME3 either - thought it was quite cinematic!
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post #2448 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 11:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin 3000 View Post

Are you speaking of your RS20 JVC you used to own? If so i am surprised you miss on/off CR compared to this VW1000?

Yes, the RS20 (that my daughter and son-in-law now have!), but this is just from my memory, which is certainly not wholly reliable. Keep in mind that the 1000 is very much brighter than the RS20, so that it's black level would be higher even with the same o/f CR; and I believe the o/f CR of the RS20 is somewhat greater than that of the 1000 (without its iris). And as noted, I only (think) I notice this on rare occasions.

Ideally, it would be nice to have the inkier blacks of the JVC's with something like the 1000. Maybe this will happen within the next 5 yrs or so when laser-based pj's become available (and 'affordable').
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post #2449 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitetrash66 View Post

I'm sure the JVC does have slightly better blacks, but does that surprise anyone? thats what they are known for!.

It should be pointed out that AVForum does not use the DI in their reviews which puts the Sony and all other DI projectors at a large disadvantage when comparing dark scenes.

To me this is the same as a Car mag turning off the twin turbos on the new BMW M5 and then running 0 to 60 comparisons.
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post #2450 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 01:01 PM
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Did they say that they turned off the DI in this review? I frankly find that truly stupid for exactly the reason you stated: the projector is designed to use this DI, and that's how it should be reviewed.

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post #2451 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 01:18 PM
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Seems from reading the review that the iris was used, but in manual mode (at minimum), not dynamic. Lamp was in low brightness mode.

As it was a light controlled room with a not particularly big screen, that sounded reasonable enough to me, especially if they were trying to measure colour accuracy via calman, etc?
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post #2452 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 03:32 PM
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108" wide 2:35 .. a tiny screen...

I have said it before, but using this projector on a small screen is not what it was made for. If its what you like, then fine.. but dont put it on a small screen to compare it to other projectors that can light up that screen and dont show their pixel structure on that small of an image.

The 1000 is made for very large screens, both in terms of light output and in what the extra pixels bring you. I know my RS20, even if it were bright enough, showed so much pixel structure at 150" wide that it would be unnaceptable.
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post #2453 of 10735 Old 05-10-2012, 03:58 PM
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Another new review that I don't think has been posted: http://www.trustedreviews.com/sony-v...ojector_review

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post #2454 of 10735 Old 05-11-2012, 05:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

Yes, the RS20 (that my daughter and son-in-law now have!), but this is just from my memory, which is certainly not wholly reliable. Keep in mind that the 1000 is very much brighter than the RS20, so that it's black level would be higher even with the same o/f CR; and I believe the o/f CR of the RS20 is somewhat greater than that of the 1000 (without its iris). And as noted, I only (think) I notice this on rare occasions.

Ideally, it would be nice to have the inkier blacks of the JVC's with something like the 1000. Maybe this will happen within the next 5 yrs or so when laser-based pj's become available (and 'affordable').

Hi,

There is a comparison between VPL-VW95ES and RS20 on the 95Es thread.This test is made in the same room,same setup,side by side and the black level perceived form 95 was at least as good if not a little better in the major part of the dark scenes.
I expect 1000ES to be at least as good if not a little bit better than 95ES in black level comparison.Anyway in any other aspects of the picture there is no comparison between
1000ES and RS20.
Regarding Auto Iris is a shame not to use it on 1000Es,because is so well implemented and you will have many advantages,even some so called purists are against it.
Also my previous projector was RS20.
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post #2455 of 10735 Old 05-11-2012, 06:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by turls View Post

Another new review that I don't think has been posted: http://www.trustedreviews.com/sony-v...ojector_review

Not sure if anyone else noticed but there was an eBay link on an ad on that review page to a sale for a Sony 1000 for 16k brand new. Someone in LA.
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post #2456 of 10735 Old 05-11-2012, 06:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hifiaudio2 View Post

108" wide 2:35 .. a tiny screen...

I have said it before, but using this projector on a small screen is not what it was made for. If its what you like, then fine.. but dont put it on a small screen to compare it to other projectors that can light up that screen and dont show their pixel structure on that small of an image.

The 1000 is made for very large screens, both in terms of light output and in what the extra pixels bring you. I know my RS20, even if it were bright enough, showed so much pixel structure at 150" wide that it would be unnaceptable.

Spot on buddy.

This projector should be compared to the Lumis or DPI. Not the JVC. That would make for a more interesting comparison. Or if someone feels the need to compare the Sony to the JVC then do it with a 120 wide or larger screen. You would find different results IMO.

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post #2457 of 10735 Old 05-11-2012, 06:44 AM
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Originally Posted by adidino View Post

Spot on buddy.

This projector should be compared to the Lumis or DPI. Not the JVC. That would make for a more interesting comparison. Or if someone feels the need to compare the Sony to the JVC then do it with a 120 wide or larger screen. You would find different results IMO.

Which is exactly what I did. And before anyone pulls the Sony fanboy card let me remind you that I chose JVCs the two past years as my projector of choice.

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post #2458 of 10735 Old 05-11-2012, 07:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin 3000 View Post

Are you speaking of your RS20 JVC you used to own? If so i am surprised you miss on/off CR compared to this VW1000?

That might have something to do with the 30FL that he is currently getting with his new setup. His old setup did not have those kind of numbers.

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post #2459 of 10735 Old 05-11-2012, 07:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlanzy View Post

It appears that the 1000 has presented a bridge both pricewise and performance between lcos and dlp, with black levels comparable to lcos and brightness closing in on the 3 chip pjs. Add to that the sharpness/detail that 4K adds and it makes the 3 chip advantages less compelling, and thier costs even more halting, unless you have humongous screens and watch a lot of sports.

I agree with that and have often times said the same thing.

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post #2460 of 10735 Old 05-11-2012, 08:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maximus74 View Post

..... Anyway in any other aspects of the picture there is no comparison between
1000ES and RS20.
Regarding Auto Iris is a shame not to use it on 1000Es,because is so well implemented and you will have many advantages,even some so called purists are against it.
Also my previous projector was RS20.

You have no argument from me here! I strongly agree that the 1000 is a major step up from my previous RS20: much, much brighter, sharper, more vibrant and accurate colors, quieter, shorter throw ratio, better features (esp lens memory), just about everything. Still, of course, we would always be happy to have higher o/f CR.
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