Official Sony VPL-VW95ES Owners Thread - Page 102 - AVS Forum
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post #3031 of 3582 Old 04-12-2012, 07:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bathes2051 View Post

I've been experimenting with the VW95ES and the Spears&Munsils BD on an Oppo BDP-95 player, and here's what I've found:
  • YCbCr 4:2:2 fails all chroma tests, as well as the clipping test
  • RGB video level passes the chroma tests, but fails the clipping test: the smallest square cannot be seen, regardless of brightness/contrast settings (I didn't try calibrating for RGB PC levels, and didn't test this mode)
  • YCbCr 4:4:4 passes these tests, and therefore seems to be the best color space for this projector
  • I couldn't see any difference between the Deep Color modes on this disc, I need to try Ratatouille.

Interesting findings. I feed my VW95 from my Radiance. According to Lumagen, they recommend outputting 4:2:2 because internally that is what the Lumagen processes things as. I do not recall if 4:4:4 out of the Radiance is even an option. If so, I don't see how it makes a difference whether the Radiance converts to 4:4:4 or the VW95 converts it.

Its even possible I suppose that the VW95 internally down converts from 4:4:4 to something else. In which case I would be up converting from 4:2:2 to 4:4:4 for no reason out of the Radiance, just to have the VW95 then down convert it from 4:4:4 to something else.

The bigger question on my mind is how any of this matters with real world material. For instance you mention that the VW95 fails those test patterns when fed 4:2:2. What type of real world materials / situation do those test patterns simulate? What would be the expected negative impact on a real picture? I've had the VW95 for 6 months now feeding it 4:2:2 with all types of sources (PS3, XBOX, Comcast, Blu-ray) and never have noticed any issues with the color space or otherwise...?

Can someone explain why this is relevant? Maybe it only will be with special sources which I am not using yet.
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post #3032 of 3582 Old 04-12-2012, 08:18 AM
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I send the 95 4:4:4 from the Radiance. I have reported this earlier. I believe the only reason Lumagen recommends 4:4:2, is because it is more universally accepted than 4:4:4.
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post #3033 of 3582 Old 04-12-2012, 10:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdrew View Post

I send the 95 4:4:4 from the Radiance. I have reported this earlier. I believe the only reason Lumagen recommends 4:4:2, is because it is more universally accepted than 4:4:4.

Lumagen recommend to send everything in 4:2:2 (or 4:4:4 if not possible) because bluray content is encoded at 4:2:0 and they convert everything internally to 4:2:2 anyway. So when using a Radiance, 4:2:2 (input and output) is the mode which creates the least amount of unnecessary conversions and makes the best use if their internal processing power.

When it reaches the projector, the 4:2:2 signal is then converted into RGB, but if you send RGB directly it's often first converted back to 4:2:2 (if you have a color decoder controls, I understand it has to) then into RGB again, so you get one more conversion.

Same thing with an HTPC as a source, it's usually better to set the drivers to output YCbCr 4:2:2 to the Radiance rather than sending RGB. You might think it's RGB because it's a PC, but as the bluray signal is YCbCr 4:2:0, a 4:2:2 output gives you a slight chance to minimize conversions (although I'm almost sure they go 4:2:0 -> RGB -> 4:2:2 in many cases).

The only reason to send anything else than 4:2:2 to a Radiance is if you believe your source (like a media player or an HTPC) is messing with the conversion and the output format would be better converted to 4:2:2 by the Radiance than by the source itself.

So for bluray, sending YCbCr 4:2:2 8 bits to the radiance is the best setting in most situations, as this is the closest to the original signal and their internal processing format anyway.

If you have anime content or home movies actually encoded with deep color, then you might want to send it to the projector directly as the Radiance doesn't support deep color, but this is not an issue with 99.9999% of actual HD content.
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post #3034 of 3582 Old 04-12-2012, 02:30 PM
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Thanks Manni. I have asked for an explaination of that a few times so far.

Isn't 4:4:4 esentially uncompressed RGB that has been converted to digital and 4:2:2 and 4:2:0 are compressed?
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post #3035 of 3582 Old 04-12-2012, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mdrew View Post

Thanks Manni. I have asked for an explaination of that a few times so far.

Isn't 4:4:4 esentially uncompressed RGB that has been converted to digital and 4:2:2 and 4:2:0 are compressed?


As I understand it, RGB 4:4:4 is always uncompressed (re chroma) and can use either video or PC levels, while YCbCr can be either uncompressed (4:4:4) or compressed (4:2:2 and 4:2:0 being only two of many variations, see the wiki here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chroma_subsampling). Levels are not applicable in YCbCr as it's always video levels (16-235).

However this is wildly beyond my level of competence, so more knowledgeable posters might jump in.
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post #3036 of 3582 Old 04-14-2012, 12:23 AM
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I just want to lay some dissapointment on the Sony Europe Service Center. Sony Prime Support and the service center (in Holland?) recieved my projector two weeks ago and they won't reply to any of my emails anymore. SPS used to reply to all emails within a day before I sent the projector. Asked for the status of the repairs three times I don't get anything
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post #3037 of 3582 Old 04-14-2012, 07:39 AM
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Anybody using the lens memory for 2.35 and 16:9 on CIH scenario. I'm considering a 140 wide Seymour XD 2.35 and was wondering if this feature worked well, if the PJ was bright enough, and lastly where I would need to mount the projector (ceiling mount) for it to work correctly.
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post #3038 of 3582 Old 04-14-2012, 08:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Drem View Post

I just want to lay some dissapointment on the Sony Europe Service Center. Sony Prime Support and the service center (in Holland?) recieved my projector two weeks ago and they won't reply to any of my emails anymore. SPS used to reply to all emails within a day before I sent the projector. Asked for the status of the repairs three times I don't get anything

Hi,
As i understand in Europe if they don't repair your projector in 10 working days,it will be replaced with a new one...right?
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post #3039 of 3582 Old 04-14-2012, 09:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maximus74 View Post

Hi,
As i understand in Europe if they don't repair your projector in 10 working days,it will be replaced with a new one...right?

No, at least in the UK, if they estimate the repair will take more than 10 days they lend you an equivalent model.

Not even close to the U.S support unfortunately.
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post #3040 of 3582 Old 04-14-2012, 09:53 AM
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I don't know exactly what the specifics are regarding a loan unit. I tried everything to get a new projector. Upgrading the Prime Support agreement etc, but it was impossible to get a new unit. You Americans are lucky

I am just so dissapointed since they just suddenly quit answering my emails. I don't want to be the annoying customer, I just want a straight answer what is the status of the repairs. Maybe the unit is just standing in a corner somewhere. I don't even know if they have recieved it, but according to the track-ID they have, two weeks ago. I am missing my projector damnit ! 46" telly is not quite the same.
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post #3041 of 3582 Old 04-14-2012, 11:34 AM
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Hey FatDave your mailbox is full.

I was going to ask what comport setting people were using for Imagedirector3.

Walter
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post #3042 of 3582 Old 04-14-2012, 12:45 PM
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Hi,
It is a shame that here in Europe we don't have the same policy as the Americans,even if in many occasions we have to pay more.Maybe in the future Sony will reconsider their policy.
Drem....i understand your frustration.
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post #3043 of 3582 Old 04-15-2012, 02:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maximus74 View Post

Hi,
It is a shame that here in Europe we don't have the same policy as the Americans,even if in many occasions we have to pay more.Maybe in the future Sony will reconsider their policy.
Drem....i understand your frustration.

Thanks. I hope there is some form of information forwarded this week.
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post #3044 of 3582 Old 04-16-2012, 07:11 AM
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Finally got an update. They have ordered a part for the projector with an ETA of a minimum of two weeks. Surely hope they find a loan unit for me. He said he was going to check with managers and supply chain.
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post #3045 of 3582 Old 04-17-2012, 12:37 AM
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Yay, they will send a loan unit to me today ! Unfortunately they only have a VW-90ES. Pretty much the same as the 95ES if I'm told correctly? The 2D aspect that is?
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post #3046 of 3582 Old 04-17-2012, 03:39 PM
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Which better SONY Sunglasses or Monster vision 3D?
Thanks.
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post #3047 of 3582 Old 04-17-2012, 03:52 PM
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I misstake.not "sun"glasses...
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post #3048 of 3582 Old 04-17-2012, 03:59 PM
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Most everyone like the monsters over the Sonys...

"We can complain because rose bushes have thorns or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses". - Abraham Lincoln
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post #3049 of 3582 Old 04-17-2012, 04:26 PM
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Really.I want it.But I don't konw how to connect to VW95ES... VW95ES has only LAN connect.
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post #3050 of 3582 Old 04-17-2012, 05:16 PM
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Get this http://www.amazon.com/MonsterVision-...4707966&sr=8-1
Then what I did with my 90ES is took one of my phone chargers which uses USB and then just plugged into electrical outlet where pj is plugged in.

"We can complain because rose bushes have thorns or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses". - Abraham Lincoln
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post #3051 of 3582 Old 04-17-2012, 05:33 PM
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Thank you for the reply.I'm Japanese.My english is not good enough.I hopefully you can understand my english...I put on only glasses? don't need connect to VW95ES? I understood how charge.
Thank you
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post #3052 of 3582 Old 04-17-2012, 05:40 PM
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Nothing plugs into pj. Glasses charge by plugging into computer USB port

"We can complain because rose bushes have thorns or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses". - Abraham Lincoln
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post #3053 of 3582 Old 04-17-2012, 07:22 PM
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I got it.I will buy it ! Thank you very much.
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post #3054 of 3582 Old 04-17-2012, 07:26 PM
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You are welcome. Enjoy, that setup works excellent

"We can complain because rose bushes have thorns or rejoice because thorn bushes have roses". - Abraham Lincoln
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post #3055 of 3582 Old 04-17-2012, 08:09 PM
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Just wanted to post some brief thoughts on my recent upgrade from a VPL-VW50 AKA "Pearl":

This is my fourth Sony: 10HT for 3 years, then a major upgrade in contrast to the HS51, another 3 years, and a major upgrade in resolution (720 to 1080) to the VW50. I was very satisfied with the VW50 for a long time. But five years later, after reading all the positives about the 95, I decided to take the plunge. I'm very glad I did.

It is a huge upgrade in black level, contrast, and overall picture quality. There is simply no comparison. I viewed them side by side for maybe five minutes. Side by side comparisons are unnecessary, and rather embarrassing to the Pearl.

Both my Pearl and the 95 have been professionally calibrated. The Pearl calibrated settings were a major improvement over OOB; but the 95 out of the box settings (and picture) are very close to to perfect calibration. At least with my unit, Sony seems to have improved the OOB settings tremendously. Another area of major improvement is color uniformity (shading). I'm a cinephile who watches a lot of black and white. Color shading issues are very annoying with black and white material. I was quite content with my Pearl, but the 95 makes the Pearl B&W picture seem like a rainbow. At least with my unit, the 95 rivals DLP for color uniformity.

I'm not a huge 3D fan, but I find the 3D on the 95 at least as satisfying as any 3D I've seen in a theater. I've tried the Sony glasses and the Xpand 104s. For me they both work great - with no severe ghosting issues.

As you can tell, I'm not a big believer in incremental upgrades, but for anyone contemplating an upgrade from the VPL50 - there is nothing incremental about it. Go for it.

And lastly, my thanks to Jason at AVS. I buy everything I can from these guys. They are the best.

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post #3056 of 3582 Old 04-18-2012, 09:59 AM
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Lol, I am a guy like you! Not upgrade to upgrade. My lamp was a bit dim, because around 1500 hours, but honestly i was thinking about getting another lamp.

I always like the ruby, but was not blind for its shortcomings. it always lacked a bit of "punch" and sharpness could be better. I heard a lot of good of the New Epson (here in Europe W 9000). I read a lot of good reviews, but it was difficult to see here in Southern France. I have nothing against JVC, but I not know, they never did it for me, although the blacks were really good.

But anyway the epson should be good for the price, I did not intend to spend so much on a projector any more. My concern was that I like very sharp images, and I heard the Epson was rather good, not perfect, but uniformity was not perfect.

Now one of my good friends bought him self a VW 95, he was so kind to show it in my living -room and on MY screen! I was ready to say, that it was an improvement, but was it worth to replace his black pearl?

First the brightness against my poor Ruby, with his older lamp was huge!Ok, lamp is old, but then we saw some bd's and honestly I never saw this quality! Motion very good, solid blacks, detail that I never noticed that was there depth that was emerging. I saw the Black knight on a recent jvc! Very nice, deep solid blacks but something was not right. It lacked detail in some scenes, and shadow details was not always perfect. The dark buildings in the beginning of the movie were impressive, but the windows were not so visible as what I saw on the VW 95! F&F 5, marvellous, but my biggest thrill was star wars, episode 5. I not see that movie like this for ages! Everything looked bright, the spaceships against the black background were, the helmet of Dark Vador shiny, the armour of C-3PO dusty, the make up on Princes Leila too visible! A brand new copy!

Ok, done, i fell in love! And although the Euro crisis was not good to me, I lost a lawsuit, I could not loose this week, I said well this is for me!
I had a good offer and it is on his way! I never thought I would buy such an expensive projector again, but I did!

And I not think I am going to regret it!

I like my HT, wine and pretty girls. But...am I the only one
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post #3057 of 3582 Old 04-21-2012, 12:30 AM
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So I have the VW-90ES loan unit up and running and the first thing I noticed was the lens was not as sharp as my 95ES. Have been struggling to get close but it's just not possible. Also, somehow the blacks don't seem as black as the 95ES. Could this be right? Aren't the two supposed to be identical in 2D?
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post #3058 of 3582 Old 04-21-2012, 01:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bathes2051 View Post

I've been experimenting with the VW95ES and the Spears&Munsils BD on an Oppo BDP-95 player, and here's what I've found:
  • YCbCr 4:2:2 fails all chroma tests, as well as the clipping test
  • RGB video level passes the chroma tests, but fails the clipping test: the smallest square cannot be seen, regardless of brightness/contrast settings (I didn't try calibrating for RGB PC levels, and didn't test this mode)
  • YCbCr 4:4:4 passes these tests, and therefore seems to be the best color space for this projector
  • I couldn't see any difference between the Deep Color modes on this disc, I need to try Ratatouille.

I took a shot at Ratatouille 31:04, and like on my previous RS1, and on Bob Pariseau's display, Off/Dithered is clearly the best setting, pretty much perfect (all other settings have some kind of banding going on).
Many thanks to Bob for his idea to check a setting that doesn't effect calibration disks.
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post #3059 of 3582 Old 04-24-2012, 10:46 AM
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Would anyone happen to have the measurement of how deep/recessed the lens is within the bezel?

Edit: Answered my own question - seems to be about 1.25" from front bezel to center of lens.
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post #3060 of 3582 Old 04-28-2012, 05:51 PM
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Thinking about getting this unit or the RS55. But I have a Draper Onyx HiDef Grey screen. How compatible is the VW95 with a HiDef Grey screen? I would like to get a new PJ without the screen upgrade.
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