Official JVC X30 / RS45 owner's thread! - Page 16 - AVS Forum
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post #451 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 09:17 AM
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I just installed another RS-45 for a client and used Cinema mode as the default for 2D. Colors are accurate out of the box. No adjustments were needed. Convergence - near perfect. I had to reduce sharpness from 20 to 6 and Detail Enhancement from 10 to 0. Watched 'Avatar' (2D) for few minutes. Stunning picture.


I am surprised at the variation between two units from the same batch in their out of the box performance.


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post #452 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 09:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raghu13 View Post

I just installed another RS-45 for a client and used Cinema mode as the default for 2D. Colors are accurate out of the box. No adjustments were needed. Convergence - near perfect. I had to reduce sharpness from 20 to 6 and Detail Enhancement from 10 to 0. Watched 'Avatar' (2D) for few minutes. Stunning picture.


I am surprised at the variation between two units from the same batch in their out of the box performance.


Raghu

My first RS40 had bad convergence (completely uncorrectable). The second one is near perfect.

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post #453 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 09:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raghu13 View Post

I just installed another RS-45 for a client and used Cinema mode as the default for 2D. Colors are accurate out of the box. No adjustments were needed. Convergence - near perfect. I had to reduce sharpness from 20 to 6 and Detail Enhancement from 10 to 0. Watched 'Avatar' (2D) for few minutes. Stunning picture.


I am surprised at the variation between two units from the same batch in their out of the box performance.


Raghu

have you seen the sony hw30 the jvc 45 rival? If so how would you compare the two.
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post #454 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 09:45 AM
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Originally Posted by kutlow View Post

have you seen the sony hw30 the jvc 45 rival? If so how would you compare the two.

The Sony is less bright especially in 3D. In 2D both are close with the RS45 a bit brighter.

The Sony has the better frameinterpolation and less digital noise in the picture. The fannoise is a little lower.

But the RS45 has better contrast and no need for dynamic iris. Also lens is fully motorized.

It's more a matter of taste. Both are good value for the money.

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post #455 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 10:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fatshaft View Post

Are there any Canadians here that got at least a call from any Canadian dealer advising them that their RS45 has arrived and/or shipped?

Just curious...it seems only our neighbors in the US have gotten their calls notifying them that their unit is shipping.
I'm telling ya, it's not easy being Canadian

Man I can't wait to get mine!

Sorry for the little rant

We are just over the border, many make the trip to the US for electronic goods.
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post #456 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 10:13 AM
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Originally Posted by ravenous View Post

Same way as with the RS40: Up - Down - Left - Right - Enter
Works for me

Thanks for verifying that.

Ron Jones said: up,down,right,left,enter.

Is yours really left,right? Or was that a typo?

And the service menu on the RS45 does have a 100 IRE screen it can display, right?
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post #457 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 10:44 AM
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Typo

Sorry.

Ron is right.

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post #458 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 10:44 AM
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Hello all,

It's been many years since my last HT upgrade but I'm ready to take the plunge having ordered a new 137" 2.35 Firehawk screen and new Oppo BD93. I've been doing a bunch of research and was ready to pull the trigger on an AE7000 but Mark at AVS recommended I look into the RS45. So for the last 2 days I've been reading reviews and threads on this projector. It is fairly obvious that the RS45's contrast and black levels are superior to the LCD's so 2D content is going to be superior but I get the sense that the AE7000 may have a better 3D picture. Initially, my 3D viewing may only be about 5% but over the next couple of years, who knows? I also have a very large room with vaulted ceilings and, although I can get it very dark in there at night, any daytime viewing will have some ambient light. My throw distance is 18'. I'm a little worried if this projector will be bright enough for daytime viewing and wide-screen movies. Lastly, I think I read somewhere that the RS45 will not do 3D on a widescreen, only 16:9. I may be wrong about that. I realize there will be some trade offs and no projector in this price range will be all things to everyone but, I'd appreciate any input you all can provide as I'm ready to make a decision soon.
Thank you in advance for your help.

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post #459 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 10:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ravenous View Post

The Sony is less bright especially in 3D. In 2D both are close with the RS45 a bit brighter.

Hi, do you have lumen measurements through the glasses, or was this a subjective side by side test?

thx!
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post #460 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 10:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ravenous View Post

I vote for 2)

Mine was off by 300-400K with the Defaults. Also Gamma wasn't perfect.

With my equipment i was able to get a Delta E lower than 1,5 all over the IRE band from 20-90. Below 20 IRE the i1Pro is inaccurate so i do not care for the <20IRE readings.

I would not pay more than 100$ for a standard calibration. You can get Calman and a i1Display Pro meter for less than 400$. With HCFR and Spyder3 you are spending only 150$.

Holy crap does that look fantastic!! Thanks for posting.

What did your gamma chart show (can you post that too)?


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Originally Posted by kutlow View Post

waiting for someone who owns both the JVC 45 and the Sony HW30 before I order! Im finially being smart instead of listening to the JVC GODS.

Just got back from church and GOD said... GO for It!

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post #461 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 10:53 AM
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@DoRight
I assume it's down to the Panny 7000 vs. RS-45 because you need lens memory for your 2.35 screen?

I think in 2 years you'll see $900 to $1200 DLP's with really good 3D and 1080p that you can buy to supplement the RS-45.

Also, if it were me (and this is just me), I'd buy the RS-45 for the superior 2D picture, I am sure about that. Taking a major hit in black levels and contrast just for 3D, hmm...

If I were going to take a hit in black levels and contrast, I'd be going to a DLP instead like the Benq w7000 (or maybe an Epson 5010), but I know you need lens memory. Although I wonder if the 5010 added a capability kind of like the Mits hc4000 for CIH, not sure.


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post #462 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doright View Post

Hello all,

It's been many years since my last HT upgrade but I'm ready to take the plunge having ordered a new 137" 2.35 Firehawk screen and new Oppo BD93. I've been doing a bunch of research and was ready to pull the trigger on an AE7000 but Mark at AVS recommended I look into the RS45. So for the last 2 days I've been reading reviews and threads on this projector. It is fairly obvious that the RS45's contrast and black levels are superior to the LCD's so 2D content is going to be superior but I get the sense that the AE7000 may have a better 3D picture. Initially, my 3D viewing may only be about 5% but over the next couple of years, who knows? I also have a very large room with vaulted ceilings and, although I can get it very dark in there at night, any daytime viewing will have some ambient light. My throw distance is 18'. I'm a little worried if this projector will be bright enough for daytime viewing and wide-screen movies. Lastly, I think I read somewhere that the RS45 will not do 3D on a widescreen, only 16:9. I may be wrong about that. I realize there will be some trade offs and no projector in this price range will be all things to everyone but, I'd appreciate any input you all can provide as I'm ready to make a decision soon.
Thank you in advance for your help.

I haven't seen the 7000, but I have the Panny 4000. I can tell you that for 2D, the JVC spanks the 4000 and sends it home crying. The high native contrast that makes 2D look so very, very good on the JVC also makes 3D look amazing. Based on that, I suspect 3D on the JVC looks comparatively better than it does on the Panny. And since 2D is still going to be what you watch the most, I would go with a JVC over a Panasonic any day of the week. Again, this isn't based on direct comparisons of the two projectors, so take it for what it's worth.

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post #463 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by krichter1 View Post

Holy crap does that look fantastic!! Thanks for posting.

What did your gamma chart show (can you post that too)?




Just got back from church and GOD said... GO for It!

That's funny. I live in the Bible Belt in the South. I once went into a car lot and when he ran my credit (830) he came back and said "It's as good as GODS WORD" lol
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post #464 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 11:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ravenous View Post

The Sony is less bright especially in 3D. In 2D both are close with the RS45 a bit brighter.

The Sony has the better frameinterpolation and less digital noise in the picture. The fannoise is a little lower.

But the RS45 has better contrast and no need for dynamic iris. Also lens is fully motorized.

It's more a matter of taste. Both are good value for the money.

yeah if that is true thats cool however the bigger picture is How will the JVC Bulb measure after it has 300 hours on it? It was just reported a gentleman just tested his 300 hour SONY 30 and it hasnt dropped any. In another words the JVC will the new jvc blow its load before 300 hours and return with 50% less light? Only time will tell and I dont have much patience right now.
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post #465 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post

Hey Guys,

For another Panny review, go read the Epson 5010 vs. Panny 7000 review by Projector Central.

Next thing you know he's going to review a JVC RS-65 vs. the Panny and declare the Panny has darker blacks in a pure black frame, but it's otherwise tied

LOL.

He seems to be a big Panny fan. Projector Reviews states the Sony HW30 has better blacks than the Panny. There's so many different opinions out there it's hard to tell whose to trust. Projector Reviews (Art?) does seem to be more of a black level fanatic than other reviewers though which I appreciate.
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post #466 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 11:43 AM
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Originally Posted by krichter1 View Post

Holy crap does that look fantastic!! Thanks for posting.

What did your gamma chart show (can you post that too)?

Sure.

There is still room for improvement, but i was happy with the first result in the short time i had. The i1pro is not good for the below 20IRE and i need to use another setting to get closer or above 2,2
LL

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post #467 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kutlow View Post

That's funny. I live in the Bible Belt in the South. I once went into a car lot and when he ran my credit (830) he came back and said "It's as good as GODS WORD" lol


Kevin

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post #468 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 11:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ravenous View Post

Sure.

There is still room for improvement, but i was happy with the first result in the short time i had. The i1pro is not good for the below 20IRE and i need to use another setting to get closer or above 2,2

Thanks... looks fantastic!!

It was widely thought last years best gamma was 2.2 but we could never get there (easy enough), because gamma's interaction with grayscale was very poor. This however gives me real hope they have made some corrections here but I guess only time will tell (still waiting Jon! )

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post #469 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 12:14 PM
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davestan

Quote:
Originally Posted by raghu13
Ceiling Mounting: This was really tough since my Peerless Universal mount turned out to be 1" short in reaching all the four mounting holes.
Raghu

So are the mounting holes wider apart than the X3? Because the Peerless PRG-UNV fits perfectly without having to rotate those end pieces. Just needed to buy longer mounting screws. endquote

According to Peerless

*Mounting holes on projector must be within a
16.55 in diameter in order to use this product.

So according to the instruction guide for my X30(RS45) you need 17.5 inchs.
It sucks because I tought I finally find a mount that would be easy to ajust the pitch and tilt.
Maybe mount the projector on a sheet of MDF and secure it the bottom part of the mount.

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post #470 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 01:28 PM
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Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 4 View Post

Hi Noah. Sorry I missed your post but Kelvin has pretty much answered it.

Yes, but thanks

I was starting to waver a bit, but then I remembered that to use its capabilities I need measuring equipment and skills I don't have, or hire a pro, either of which adds hundred$ more.

But I'm happy with the colors of my RS10 (calibrated at purchase by Jason).

Is instrumentation needed to use the gamma curve adjustment reasonably effectively?

Noah
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post #471 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 01:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kutlow View Post

yeah if that is true thats cool however the bigger picture is How will the JVC Bulb measure after it has 300 hours on it? It was just reported a gentleman just tested his 300 hour SONY 30 and it hasnt dropped any. In another words the JVC will the new jvc blow its load before 300 hours and return with 50% less light? Only time will tell and I dont have much patience right now.

I've taken something like 100 measurements across 10 different projectors in lumen readings (which pales to how many a pro calibrator has taken, so maybe a pro can weigh in here), and I've never seen a bulb not drop at 300 hours. I'm not saying it's impossible, but I've never seen this.

I have a sneaking suspicion some of these light meters have linearity problems, or people changed a setting on their projectors and forgot about it (or even measured a different mode). Either that or some people are not being 100% honest about it (and I'm not accusing anyone of being dishonest, but come on), so I am not believing some of these absurd readings. I've seen some post a 2% loss at 800 hours, that's malarkey. Most likely they were not taking the reading exactly the same way each time, or standing in the wrong position, or in varying ambient light conditions.

This doesn't mean you'll get a super inaccurate reading, but it could cause readings to drop at points and not be even. Hence, it might not detect the difference between say 400 lumens and 375 lumens properly, it might still just say 400 lumens, but then when it hits 350 lumens, it might say 355 lumens.

You just never know, but some of these lumen measurements by some do not make sense to me.


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post #472 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 01:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kutlow View Post

yes and Im about to order both the sony and the jvc and then list the one thats not as good. I wonder how much I would loose?

Is it the JVC RS45 and Sony VW30 that you're going to buy and compare, or the 'step up' RS55 vs Sony VW95?
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post #473 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 01:45 PM
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Probably not too much, I'd guess $200 to $400, just a guess.


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post #474 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 01:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noah katz View Post

Yes, but thanks

I was starting to waver a bit, but then I remembered that to use its capabilities I need measuring equipment and skills I don't have, or hire a pro, either of which adds hundred$ more.

But I'm happy with the colors of my RS10 (calibrated at purchase by Jason).

Is instrumentation needed to use the gamma curve adjustment reasonably effectively?

You will need to have some kind of sensor and software to adjust the gamma. Although I've found that my old i1LT (D2) still does a great job with gamma (compared to a rented i1Pro) even though it's drifted now in terms of greyscale measurements.

However, if you are happy with an RS10 (I have the UK version a HD350) without any external CMS correction, then maybe you would find an accurate colour gamut a bit undersaturated: The RS10 is very oversaturated on it's own, even after calibration. Bear in mind that if calibrated when it was new, it would have drifted markedly by the time it hit 100 hours, let alone after a few years.

I'm not deliberately trying to be rude, but just noting that you may not be as bothered about an accurate picture from your comments...it could save you money. You may well b e more than happy with just an RS45 and I wouldn't be surprised if you prefer to put it into a wider gamut mode if that's what you're used to as the more accurate modes will tend to seem a bit dull until you get used to them.

Zooming: Been there, done that, bought the lens...
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post #475 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 01:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darthray View Post

davestan

Quote:

According to Peerless

*Mounting holes on projector must be within a
16.55 in diameter in order to use this product.

So according to the instruction guide for my X30(RS45) you need 17.5 inchs.
It sucks because I tought I finally find a mount that would be easy to ajust the pitch and tilt.
Maybe mount the projector on a sheet of MDF and secure it the bottom part of the mount.

Ray

If you turn the end pieces on each arm 90 degrees, it will reach all the four holes. That is how I could make Peerless Universal mount work.
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post #476 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 01:55 PM
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I have a Lumagen Mini3D if anyone is interested. I'm going to upgrade from my JVC GS-TD1 3D camcorder to a Panasonic Z10000 in the next few weeks, and I'd like to use the extra cash for that. PM me if interested.

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post #477 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 01:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelvin1965S View Post

You may well b e more than happy with just an RS45 and I wouldn't be surprised if you prefer to put it into a wider gamut mode if that's what you're used to as the more accurate modes will tend to seem a bit dull until you get used to them.

I was debating on getting another LT or buying a more expensive meter. Someone posted in another thread that the LT's were relatively off about the same between purchases, and there was an offset you could use that should be fairly reasonable within the tolerance, but I'm not sure if this was true. I can get an LT really really cheap right now (already have one though but it probably has drifted), or I can drop $500. I just don't see the point in me spending that kind of money yet until I get a VP anyways, because how much difference is a $500 meter going to make just for gray scale and gamma?.... I think someone said one color was off by like 5% to 10% or something for gray scale, but I'm not sure, I forgot now, will have to go back and look.

Also, have you ever taken a lumen measurement from a LIGHT METER and seen a projector not drop at least a little after 200-400 hours, like some posters are claiming. Just curious because I have never seen this happen on any projector yet.


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post #478 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 02:05 PM
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Yes I use a lux meter (can't remember the model off hand, but it was recommended by Gary Lightfoot and much more accurate results than my i1LT). I had my i1LT offsets done by the UK retailer of Chromapure, but I also rented the much better i1Pro from them. My i1LT was significantly off in terms of greyscale without the correction so I wouldn't trust an older one (they tend to absorb mosture which effects the accuracy, even though I keep mine in a sealed bag with silca gel pouches in).

If I'd used the i1LT to set greyscale then it had a dE of about 12 IIRC. The gamma would have been good though, but that's not much help without a good greyscale. I suppose you could just use it to set gamma as IMHO this made a huge difference to the image quality on my HD350.

I plan to get the newer D3 sensor soon as my setup needs it's winter tune up...I thought about upgrading to an X30 or even X70, but I think I'll wait until they are a known product and probably buy a used one.

Zooming: Been there, done that, bought the lens...
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post #479 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post


Also, have you ever taken a lumen measurement from a LIGHT METER and seen a projector not drop at least a little after 200-400 hours, like some posters are claiming. Just curious because I have never seen this happen on any projector yet.

I hear some around here doubting my light readings
Coder.
The numbers have changed but not by much. When I first got my Sony the lumen output was in the 700s on low and 900s on high. I can't remember the EXACT numbers. I did not measure again until yesterday.
Now. My meter may be off yes. But the numbers have not changed MUCH using the same meter. Got it from Amazon.
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post #480 of 4457 Old 12-04-2011, 02:15 PM
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Here are some numbers I have from other projectors (I have more but I won't post them all), but this is why I am suspicious of peoples lumens readings. I've taken some readings across multiple units of the same model, not just a single unit. Like I said, I have more than 100 readings.

Mitsubishi hc3800 (unit # 1)
At 200 hours = 12% loss
(unit # 1)
At 300 hours = 16% loss

Mitsubishi hc4000
At 200 hours = 8% loss
At 500 hours = 19% loss

Sanyo z5 @ 200 hrs = 18% loss, at 500 hrs = 26% loss (running in lamp low)

Sanyo z4000 @ 200 hrs = 21% loss, at 500 hrs = 32% loss (running in lamp high)

Epson 8500ub @ 10 hrs = 45% loss (yes I had a defective bulb)

Viewsonic Pro 8200
@ 200 hrs = 18% loss (only have 250 hours on it)

---------------------

Now all of a sudden Sony makes this magical lamp that can go 300-500 hours and lose no lumens?

The Sanyos drop off the fastest the first 500 hours, but the slowest the next 3000 hours, based on extrapolating the 1000 and 2000 hour data I had.


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