OWNERS thread for Mitsubishi HC7800 - Page 5 - AVS Forum
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post #121 of 363 Old 01-05-2012, 12:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HiFiFun View Post

Kraine,
Here is the JVC DLA-X30 crosstalk picture from your review:


This excellent result does not agree with the AVS forum review by Jason. What is going on here? Further there is a special thread dedicated to the ghosting of the new JVC's here. A lot of owners have voiced there displeasure...

Fellow scientists independently verify each others results. Is your crosstalk pattern available? Or can you use the Grand Canyon picture?
The goal here should be to identify the root cause(s) which leads to designing better projectors. As it is now different sites have almost opposite findings.

Just to throw something out there, the IR emitter/glasses have tight timing tolerances, so any IR interference could cause ghosting.

You can adjust the ghosting on the X30 (operation that I have done during my review) and not on the mitsubishi, i'm using 3D Test patterns and also Movies.

The ghosting is discrete on the Mitsubishi, but it is still there. And if you make a comparaison with over DLP LINK Models, they are free from this issue and with cheaper Glasses. My point is why do you have to choose the Mitsubishi 3D Glasses if you have to give more money and in the same time getting Ghosting ? In the meanwhile you can get an HD33, HD83, H9500BD free of ghosting, with more Brightness in 3D and with Glasses that are easy too find Universal and cost half the price of the Mitsubishi.
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post #122 of 363 Old 01-05-2012, 04:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kraine View Post

In the meanwhile you can get an HD33, HD83, H9500BD free of ghosting, with more Brightness in 3D and with Glasses that are easy too find Universal and cost half the price of the Mitsubishi.

Maybe because the 2d quality of Mitsubishi is better than these projectors and however ghosting is limited and doesn't disturb while watching movies?
Before buying HC7800 I've watched 3d movies on X30, HW30, TW9000, and even if I haven't seen much ghosting in those machines, I found the vision very tiring (I don't know if this is the right way to say).
Good quality on optoma HD83, but I preferred 2d image on Mitsubishi.
As soon as I get back my projector I'll try to test that noise issue.
Another problem I have found in my machine is the slowness of some menu settings, for wich you had to wait 3 or 4 seconds before the command is executed.
I think that in order to make available the machines for Christmas time, Mitsubishi has released them with firmware problems.
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post #123 of 363 Old 01-06-2012, 06:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HiFiFun View Post

Kraine,
Do you have Mark's Grand Canyon disc? The closeup tree proves and excellent easily understood test of ghosting:
Here is the JVC RS45 with JVC glasses (severe amount of ghosting)


Here are the official three AVS crosstalk discs (which are also great movies):
Dispicable Me - 5:27
Sammy's - 30:05


Grand Canyon - 12:08

http://www.amazon.fr/Grand-Canyon-Ad...5716344&sr=8-1

Hello i did a test for you with the scenes you ask for: and no ghosting here on the hc7800

And also the lamp in low mode here.



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post #124 of 363 Old 01-06-2012, 06:20 AM
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Sorry, does anyone known how to check the firmware version of the HC7800 ?

Also, are there other cheaper 3D glasses that can work with the Mits ?
It seems to be infrared based and I notice that there are a few such similar 3D glasses on sale in Amazon.

Please share your experience if any.
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post #125 of 363 Old 01-06-2012, 06:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kraine View Post

And it seems that a german owner of the HC7800 have seen the same level on ghosting on his projector :


I share his conclusion that the HC7800 is the first DLP that produce this level of ghosting.

I was keeping this to myself as I didn't want to be a debbie downer and be the first to report. I am home sick today and in a rather fowl mood, so my allegiance lies with no manufacturer and only to my home theater. There certainly is ghosting on the projector. Sorry Mits, you need to fix this. I would like to find out if it is somehow glasses related. I for one have spent about $15,000+ now over the years on 3D and have not yet experienced ghost free in the home. This pj was the first time I have seen a DLP in 3D. I bought it site unseen because of DLP's track record for ghosting (and I always longed for a Mits DLP RPTV). I will hopefully do the scenes talked about here as a test today. The ghosting is almost always through the right lense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wnielsenbb View Post

That is such slight ghosting I really can't imagine it being noticable in real life. Show that same shot from the movie and I really doubt you would notice it.

My girlfriend notices it. My friends notice it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kraine View Post

Yes I'm thinking that the glasses are causing this ghosting. With DLP-Link glasses or RF Glasses I have no ghosting on the ACER 9500BD, OPTOMA HD33, OPTOMA HD83, etc....

Just to confirm, I don't believe we can test with any other glasses but the proprietary Mits. glasses. Can anyone chime in if this is true?

On a positive note, I don't hear the weird sounds that some talk about. I still really like the 2D picture.
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post #126 of 363 Old 01-06-2012, 07:18 AM
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[quote=kraine;21443946]You can adjust the ghosting on the X30 (operation that I have done during my review) and not on the mitsubishi, i'm using 3D Test patterns and also Movies. /QUOTE]

My understanding is that if you adjust the JVCs to reduce ghosting (using the JVC anti-ghosting controls) for a particular scene then your changes may eliminate ghosting for the scene you're viewing, but the changes just add ghosting to other scenes! It simply does not solve the ghosting problem! Reviewers need to test this because lots of JVC owners have and complain about it.
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post #127 of 363 Old 01-06-2012, 07:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmyj2 View Post

I was keeping this to myself as I didn't want to be a debbie downer and be the first to report. I am home sick today and in a rather fowl mood, so my allegiance lies with no manufacturer and only to my home theater. There certainly is ghosting on the projector. Sorry Mits, you need to fix this. I would like to find out if it is somehow glasses related.

My girlfriend notices it. My friends notice it.


Hi, can you let us know what movies / scenes you see the ghosting?
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post #128 of 363 Old 01-06-2012, 08:42 AM
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The 3D glass of 7800 is much easier to show ghost than the others if loss sync to the projector. I think you might check the angle /distance of the 3D sync signal path (the IR emitter or something ...etc.).
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post #129 of 363 Old 01-06-2012, 09:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

Hi, can you let us know what movies / scenes you see the ghosting?

Funny enough, to confuse things a little more, I reviewed a number of my favourite 3d scenes this morning. Ghosting seems to have gotten better somehow, but it is still there. The last time a I watched 3D was at 40 hours. I am now at the 100 hour mark, maybe the lamp is settling a little bit....Full 3D movies I have only watched Polar Express and Tahiti Wave. Have watched a number of scenes from despicable me, sammy, owls etc. The ghosting shows up often enough, but most times is faint enough to not really notice badly (I am fortunate enough to not see any rainbows, but my eyes are drawn to ghosting instantly). Below are some pics. The supposed torture scenes in Sammy and Despicable, the 7800 breezes through them quite easily. There are a couple shots from Polar express just to prove it is there, and I have noticed in enough other scenes as well. Also, the closer your eye is to the edge of the glasses, the worse it gets. All pics taken through right lens and cropped. Going to watch a 3D movie this afternoon and will report back.





Left edge of face:


White on Red Suit:



Quote:
Originally Posted by ETK View Post

The 3D glass of 7800 is much easier to show ghost than the others if loss sync to the projector. I think you might check the angle /distance of the 3D sync signal path (the IR emitter or something ...etc.).

Do you own this projector ETK? The IR is so strong I might not lose sync at the end of the block on my street lol.
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post #130 of 363 Old 01-06-2012, 09:54 AM
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Snapped some pics of 2D also. Mostly just cropped, basic settings applied converting from raw to jpg. Handheld as I didn't have enought space behind for tripod with 18mm lense.



















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post #131 of 363 Old 01-11-2012, 06:48 AM
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Watched Megamind, and some other favourite clips again. Ghosting is very minor, but it is there in scenes. I think I might hate ghosts more than anyone on the planet but I still find the 3D very enjoyable. Was hoping for perfection in 3D, really close but not quite there. I must say with the lamp broken in a bit more, the blacks have become even better, and I've come to enjoy the iris more now too. While not perfect overall, I am hard to please and am still happy with the purchase and will be keeping it for the long term
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post #132 of 363 Old 01-11-2012, 06:48 AM
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post #133 of 363 Old 01-21-2012, 02:44 PM
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Unfortunately, also the second sample I have received has the same geometry problem as the first one: the right lower corner is 1 inch lower than the left one.



I noticed also the same issue found by Kraine in the review!!
In light scenes starts a noisy buzz that stops in dark scenes!
I find this issue really annoying!
So, even if the 2d quality was good for me, I have decided of giving it back to the seller and buying another kind of projector.
Sorry Mitsubishi.
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post #134 of 363 Old 01-23-2012, 05:09 AM
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Hi guys
just got mine today
wondering if there is a way to activate the dlp glasses?
I have the true depth one.
do I HAVE TO BUY IR,RF ONES?
THANKS
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post #135 of 363 Old 01-26-2012, 07:37 PM
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I have sold Mitsubishi projectors for about 6 years and I sold the crap out of the HC6800 - it was awesome. For me, the 7800 was a BIG disappointment as they removed some good qualities of the 6800 to cram in the 3-D. Ex. It lost its motorized lens shift which was a great feature at the price point. The case feels of lower quality and they raised the price significantly. I have since switched to the Epson 6010 which with everything they include and the 3-D brightness is a no-brainer.

If you want to know if a product is "good", please tell us your definition of "bad" for an understood point of reference. Do you want subjective opinions or objective facts?
- FunHouse Media
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post #136 of 363 Old 02-04-2012, 02:08 PM
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Here's projector review's take on the HC7800 http://www.projectorreviews.com/mits...800D/index.php. From the not so gushing review it doesn't seem like this unit sets itself apart in anyway from the pack. Seems a bit overpriced and outgunned in this range.
If Mits priced it at $1800..it would sell like hotcakes!
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post #137 of 363 Old 02-04-2012, 02:34 PM
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I just got mine set up and I haven't heard any strange buzzing or had any geometry issues.

I think it's important to know what your getting into, in order to set your expectations appropriately.

My new theater room is a bit smaller than the last, so I went with a 106" screen with a 1.3 gain. With dark carpet walls and ceiling, out of the box I saw exactly what I expected. Great dark detail, skin tones, best 3D I've ever seen, and not the best absolute blacks. But with good shadow detail, the image is still quite pleasant despite the less than inky blacks. You just have to know this going in.

I replaced an old Sony VPL-VW50 and I think it was a pretty good upgrade.

I do have one complaint tho. I think the Iris is crap. I've tried all 3 modes and it seems that the Iris is very aggressive and "pops" during any major seen change. I just turned it off and it seems to have remedied the issue. Any suggestions on this issue would be appreciated. The iris on the Sony was much better and far more subtle.

Now the 3D. Wow. I'm not seeing ghosting so far and because I have a dungeon it looks quite bright. I compare this to any number of local Cinema DLP screens. It is simply superior. A friend of mine has one of the new JVC models (can't remember which one) and I watched 3D on it. And while the JVC has better absolute blacks, the Mitsu just blows the 3D out of the water hands down. Well I was originally going to go with a JVC, but now having compared the two, I can live with some lighter blacks on the Mitsu. This is of course assuming you really want great 3D. JVC is certainly the better 2D unit as is expected.

If I try hard enough, I can make a rainbow show up, but in normal viewing, it is not an issue.

The clarity is thing thing in 3D I can't get over. I use the polarized glasses at the theater, and although they are comfortable, I see a lot of ghosting. Some may complain about the Mitsu glasses, but the quality of the 3D they give amazes me.

I would like to know how to access a hidden diagnostics menu or something to dial back the FRC in 3D mode a bit as it can not always keep up and it's a bit distracting.

-James
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post #138 of 363 Old 02-04-2012, 02:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmacdonald801 View Post

I do have one complaint tho. I think the Iris is crap. I've tried all 3 modes and it seems that the Iris is very aggressive and "pops" during any major seen change. I just turned it off and it seems to have remedied the issue. Any suggestions on this issue would be appreciated. The iris on the Sony was much better and far more subtle.


-James

Yeah..coming from the Sony, you'll be hard pressed to find a better or more subtle Iris. Runco is probably the closes in that regards to not seeing Iris action.
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post #139 of 363 Old 02-05-2012, 07:33 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joesyah View Post

Here's projector review's take on the HC7800 http://www.projectorreviews.com/mits...800D/index.php. From the not so gushing review it doesn't seem like this unit sets itself apart in anyway from the pack. Seems a bit overpriced and outgunned in this range.
If Mits priced it at $1800..it would sell like hotcakes!

You paint with to broad a brush.
Projector Central and Projector Reviews and I agree that the 2D color and natural sharpness is superior to any of the competing projectors. That single panel and ED glass lens.
Both say the black level isn't too good, partially because the dynamic iris doesn't work correctly. Only the Acer 9500BD actually works at this time.

Notice Art largely ignores 3D. That is because it is very flawed and he either must not understand it or is pulling punches. So ignore it.

Kraine came closest in reporting ghosting and the 3D IR transmitter interfering with the projectors own remote control. The motion interpolation and switching between 2D and 3D are also unfinished works.

A product with great potential but one in need of more development time. Move over BenQ!
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post #140 of 363 Old 02-09-2012, 09:15 AM
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I had a chance to see the Sony-HW30, JVC-RS45, Epson-6010 and the Mits-HC7800 yesterday and I have to say for me the Mits was the clear winner!

I was really disappointed with the Sony 2D\\3D, the picture was just so-so for me and really washed out. Plus the motion blur was really driving me crazy. As for the LCD's the Epson was the clear winner and the 3D was really sharp.

But as I mentioned before...the Mits was the has down winner. It had the plasmas "pop" I was used to and try as I may....no "double-rainbows" for me

I was also able to see the 2:35 mod\ rick in action on a 128 cinemascope screen! Awesome! I'm not one to follow the pack and I believe in a lot of research and review. I can't tell you how disappointed I would have been if I had just gone with the Sony based its popularity here. Ultimately, I believe you have to go with what looks best to you....Needless to say I'm sold!!!
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post #141 of 363 Old 02-09-2012, 09:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kraine View Post

In the meanwhile you can get an HD33, HD83, H9500BD free of ghosting, with more Brightness in 3D and with Glasses that are easy too find Universal and cost half the price of the Mitsubishi.

The Projector Central review of the Acer H9500BD is totally contrary to your review of the Acer - it claims that ghosting on the Acer is a problem.

Here's the link. This is the worst review of a projector I have seen. The reviewer also hated the 2D to 3D conversion.


http://www.projectorcentral.com/acer...ing-Experience

Update: Due to complaints by AVS members PC has pulled its review and is taking a second look. I wish I had printed out the review. It was close to brutal.
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post #142 of 363 Old 03-12-2012, 09:02 AM
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Does anyone know about these 3D glasses model number EY3DGS78U?

http://www.amazon.com/Mitsubishi-EY3.../dp/B00689HPJG

I see them on-sale in a bunch of places but no real information as to any improved performance etc. They certainly look better.

-James
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post #143 of 363 Old 03-12-2012, 02:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmacdonald801 View Post

Does anyone know about these 3D glasses model number EY3DGS78U?

http://www.amazon.com/Mitsubishi-EY3.../dp/B00689HPJG

I see them on-sale in a bunch of places but no real information as to any improved performance etc. They certainly look better.

-James


I think the seller just has the wrong picture. Those look like the HC9000 glasses - EY-3DGS-1U

http://www.mitsubishi-presentations.com/hc9000d/ Then click on documents/accessories
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post #144 of 363 Old 03-12-2012, 02:52 PM
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Thought I heard somewhere that Mitsu was come out with some better glasses for the 7800D at some point.

There were a couple other sites that had that picture that amazon did.

-James
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post #145 of 363 Old 03-15-2012, 01:29 PM
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Has anyone tried the Xpand glasses with this projector? I would like to try something other than the Mitsu glasses.
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post #146 of 363 Old 03-15-2012, 03:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmacdonald801 View Post

Thought I heard somewhere that Mitsu was come out with some better glasses for the 7800D at some point.

There were a couple other sites that had that picture that amazon did.

-James

Quote:
Originally Posted by though View Post

Has anyone tried the Xpand glasses with this projector? I would like to try something other than the Mitsu glasses.

Funny you should ask that as I was just about to post the disappointing news. I couldn't handle not knowing anymore so I ordered both the mitsubishi programmable, and the dlp-link Ultraclear glasses. They are now back in the box as neither worked. I was in touch with xpand, and they would not send me the 104's, saying I needed the dlp-link. I highly doubt the 104's would work since the ultraclears did not. I hope somebody can prove me wrong or xpand can figure out a way to get the 104's programmed. There is a company in France I believe that is working on glasses that will work with the 7800. I will post here again if I hear anything further.
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post #147 of 363 Old 03-17-2012, 02:15 PM
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does anyone know if the HC9000 glasses (EY-3DGS-1U) will work with the HC7800?
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post #148 of 363 Old 03-21-2012, 07:40 AM
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Translated links for the glasses I mentioned above....no news on how they work yet.

http://translate.googleusercontent.c...iz8w6Owa6_7xA#

http://translate.googleusercontent.c...dyQ#p176853077
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post #149 of 363 Old 04-28-2012, 04:20 AM
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i wander who is the best in sharpness/clarity and black levels.
mitsubishi or benq w7000. ????
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post #150 of 363 Old 04-28-2012, 07:22 AM
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Both are very sharp projectors. Black level favors the HC7800. shoot us an email and we can discuss more in depth.

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