JVC RS 45 / Sony HW30 / BenQ W7000 / Epson 5010 mini-shootout - Page 80 - AVS Forum
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post #2371 of 3270 Old 03-13-2012, 05:51 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blipszyc View Post

zombie - how did you measure the lumens for each one? Did you take a measurement through the glasses for 3D or just put the pj in 3D mode?

the measurements were just in 3D mode without the glasses. I can take a few measurements through the glasses and post them in the thread.
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post #2372 of 3270 Old 03-13-2012, 12:25 PM
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Hello zombie did you read my topic about the epson update?

It seems to be a good update for 3d(more fluid 3d)

And some other changes..
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post #2373 of 3270 Old 03-13-2012, 12:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john2910 View Post

Hello zombie did you read my topic about the epson update?

It seems to be a good update for 3d(more fluid 3d)

And some other changes..

I just read it. How do we get the update?
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post #2374 of 3270 Old 03-13-2012, 12:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

I just read it. How do we get the update?

I think its only possible by some official epson dealers(they need to do it)

I i wish we had the file and could do it our selfs....
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post #2375 of 3270 Old 03-13-2012, 12:37 PM
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Hold the phone!!!!

There is an update for 6010?
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post #2376 of 3270 Old 03-13-2012, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ozer19 View Post

Hold the phone!!!!

There is an update for 6010?

Does it fix the lag?

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post #2377 of 3270 Old 03-13-2012, 12:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LowellG View Post

Does it fix the lag?

I didnt here anything about fixing the lag only this:

The update brings an improved programming of the IRIS membrane.

In addition, the "super resolution" now better aligned with the 5 institutions and our main criticism was that choppy 3D view now revised and corrected.

Unfortunately, the "inter-frame" is still only available for 2D display
(This was not possible because off some memory limitation).
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post #2378 of 3270 Old 03-13-2012, 03:39 PM
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so how do we get the epson 5010/6010 update? do we just go back to the dealer where we got them from? do you know what is the latest firmware version?

thanks.
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post #2379 of 3270 Old 03-15-2012, 01:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john2910 View Post

I didnt here anything about fixing the lag only this:

The update brings an improved programming of the IRIS membrane.

In addition, the "super resolution" now better aligned with the 5 institutions and our main criticism was that choppy 3D view now revised and corrected.

Unfortunately, the "inter-frame" is still only available for 2D display
(This was not possible because off some memory limitation).

According to an unofficial quote from Epson, it doesn't sound like the lag will ever be fixed on these units:

A fix would require more than just a firmware for the lag on with video games. There would have to be a hardware change as well. These first 3 units were designed to work with 3D movies more than any other media. It will be addressed for future models.
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post #2380 of 3270 Old 03-16-2012, 10:38 AM
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My guess is that the lag produced is a result of the video processing chip that cannot be bypassed. No matter what they do, there is probably no way to speed it up and there is probably no way to obypass the chip either.
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post #2381 of 3270 Old 03-16-2012, 09:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

the measurements were just in 3D mode without the glasses. I can take a few measurements through the glasses and post them in the thread.

If you could, that would be great. Debating between the Epson 6010 or the Sony. The Epson seems like it would be a brighter PJ for 3D, but the Sony sounds like it would be better in 2D. I'm also a bit concerned about the gaming lag and fan noise of the Epson. While I don't game that much, when I do, it's mostly games like Need for Speed or Uncharted on the PS3.

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post #2382 of 3270 Old 03-19-2012, 04:10 AM
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Guys,
I just had my Epson TW9000 (6010 in the US) for a couple of days and let me say I'm amazed

It's so bright and much better than my local cinemas.
It's my first 3D projector so I'm just starting to read/fight with all this at the HTPC front and I have a question:
Is it true that NVIDIA cards support HD 3D 1080p24 (frame packing) only on the primary monitor?
I use my PC both as HTPC and a workstation and I have my LCD monitor as primary and the projector as secondary in extended desktop mode. I'd like to keep this configuration even when watching 3D Blurays but I can't make TMT 5 to activate the 3D mode. It only works if the PJ is primary.
Am I doing something wrong? Is it the same with ATI/AMD?
Sorry to bother you with this question I know it's a little off topic but I searched the web and didn't find anything and I know you all have the greatest knowledge in 3D so I'm hoping you can help.
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post #2383 of 3270 Old 03-19-2012, 01:37 PM
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I just ordered the Omaga Filter kit and 2 Optoma 3D-XL boxes. I'll be feeding the dual stream 3D from both HDMI outs of my Oppo 93 to the Optoma boxes. The left stream from one 3D-XL to the 9500 and the right stream from the other to the 7500. I am very interested to see how this system compares to my 6010. I'll be able to retain the DI and FI for 3D and have the power of two lamps instead of one. Supposedly this should be bright, ghost-free 3D -- we'll see. This is a passive setup that let's me keep my 120" HP screen in use and that's the reason I've decided to give it a try. It also let's me get my 7500 back into the loop. I haven't been using it much lately.
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post #2384 of 3270 Old 03-19-2012, 07:09 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by happybob View Post

so how do we get the epson 5010/6010 update? do we just go back to the dealer where we got them from? do you know what is the latest firmware version?

thanks.

The latest for the 6010 is software 104. It is dealer installable.
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post #2385 of 3270 Old 03-19-2012, 10:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deja Vu View Post

I just ordered the Omaga Filter kit and 2 Optoma 3D-XL boxes. I'll be feeding the dual stream 3D from both HDMI outs of my Oppo 93 to the Optoma boxes. The left stream from one 3D-XL to the 9500 and the right stream from the other to the 7500. I am very interested to see how this system compares to my 6010. I'll be able to retain the DI and FI for 3D and have the power of two lamps instead of one. Supposedly this should be bright, ghost-free 3D -- we'll see. This is a passive setup that let's me keep my 120" HP screen in use and that's the reason I've decided to give it a try. It also let's me get my 7500 back into the loop. I haven't been using it much lately.

One question i have is will the different projectors' latency with respect to their video lag have any effect?
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post #2386 of 3270 Old 03-20-2012, 08:51 AM
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Sorry for going a little off topic but I hope someone in this thread has an answer to my question:

I m from Europe (Netherlands) and bought the 2 Optoma RF glasses for my Sony projector (because they suppose to give much better results, more brighness and less ghosting, then the original Sony glasses).

But I need to know some things about the Optoma emitter:

Since I ve heard that the Optoma BC-100 is the exact same emitter as the MV3D emitter I downloaded the MonsterVision utility for my PC. I tried to update the firmware of the BC-100. Everything goes as described in the update manual of MonsterVision and it looks like firmware version 1.05.010 is loaded to the emitter. But after reconnecting the BC-100 emitter to my and load the MonsterVision utility again the software still says 1.05.004...... So either firmware 1.05.010 is actually NOT applied to the emitter (and the Optoma BC-100 is not compatible with the MV3D software) OR the Monster Vision software reports incorrect information.

Can anyone tell me anything about this?
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post #2387 of 3270 Old 03-20-2012, 09:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ondaedg View Post

One question i have is will the different projectors' latency with respect to their video lag have any effect?

No! They'll have the same video lag and how does this effect 3D movies? Maybe 3D gaming, but I'm not using them for this.
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post #2388 of 3270 Old 03-21-2012, 01:09 AM
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The Epson 6010 has a processor that looks for ghosting and @ a frame rate 7times the viewing rate. It works affectively to minimize crosstalk by shutting both left and right sides off.

Color wheels are a disposable item and I looked at this again for someone and just think it has to be included with the price of ownership. The 4x wheel on the benq I thought based on the mechanical parts used were going to be an issue first with noise, then complete failure. It's dependent on use but something to consider. You can replace it tho.
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post #2389 of 3270 Old 03-21-2012, 01:39 AM
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I was finally able to make the custom cable needed for the MV3D emitter myself (with some help of John). My emitter is now connected to the Sony and I m ready to use my MV3D (Optoma RF) glasses.

1.
How do I pair the glasses with the emitter?

2.
I can set the polarity to TWO red leds or THREE red leds. What is the recommended setting of polarity for the VW95?

3.
I can set the DELAY TUNING and LENS DUTY CYCLE TUNING with the arrows in the submenu of the emitter. What are the best settings for the VW95/what is a good starting-point?

thanks!
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post #2390 of 3270 Old 03-22-2012, 04:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mandarax View Post

Color wheels are a disposable item and I looked at this again for someone and just think it has to be included with the price of ownership.

What is that based on?
Color wheels last a lot longer than they used to.
They can still fail just like any moving part, but it's much rarer now.
They are built around hard drive motors, the newer motors are much more reliable.

Color wheels could go longer than the life of the projector. LCD's can get a dust blob and this is more common than the CW of a DLP failing.
I personally think DLP is more reliable than LCD or LCOS, since LCD and LCOS can lose contrast over time and the panels wear out quicker. DLP's also require fewer parts in them, that's why they are so much smaller (and fewer parts means fewer things to break).

The above still isn't a reason to buy one tech over the others for 99% of people, I'm just saying...


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post #2391 of 3270 Old 03-22-2012, 06:34 AM
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Based on getting one opening it up and looking at it. Run it in cycles that is typical and extending that tenure out in time frames and if the temperature and the pitch of the sound change beyond what I am comfortable with I drop it. Asking other dealers who go in and replace the color wheel is another source of information I use.

I have people that use 200 hours a year to 5000 hours in a year. So yeah the number of revolutions the wheel makes will be relevant for sure as is the volume of the audible sound of a 4x color wheel. That audible part of the equation having different tolerances to different people.

It is a great review btw. I just added something people may or may not wish to be aware of at one point I was getting failures at just 800 hrs, and way too many prior to 2000 hrs. Even Digital Projection uses inferior mechanical parts in some of there dlp projectors. Some are virtually silent.

If you look at the comparisons you made for failure of the different technologies there is also remedies I can get with some of the failures you describe and no remedies with others. Many in this bracket of projector will consider it a commodity item that either throw away, replace every year with an upgrade or other short tenure of use. For those that made the investment for a longer tenure the lifespan of the expected failure is something I believe to be relevant information.

If I am reviewing choices I always ask what the purpose and use is going to be.

I am not criticizing your thread. I haven't been here in ages and had a tenure with some crutches. Of the threads I read this go round this was the best so thanks for that.. It was better than what I could have read in a magazine.
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post #2392 of 3270 Old 03-22-2012, 08:51 AM
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This is Zombie's thread, not mine.
Based on the Mits hc3800 and hc4000 thread, I have seen almost no color wheel failures. I've been in those threads for years, there have been a couple out of hundreds, if not thousands of users. Sure some don't post if it fails, but in general it's rare. I can find dust blob issues posted almost a hundred times in some threads.

I stand by the fact that color wheel failures are fairly uncommon on modern projectors that early on (but anything can happen), they may be more common on a Benq, I do not know. I have put well over 5000 hours spread across multiple DLP's including the one my friend owned (I owned the hd1000u, hc3800, hc4000, and now the Pro8200), never had a color wheel problem. I have however had contrast panel burn-outs on LCD projectors, as well as dust blobs. Current DLP has 1200 hours, no issues either. Another guy I helped out had 7,000 hours on his projector without a color wheel failure.


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
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post #2393 of 3270 Old 03-22-2012, 10:27 AM
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I consider it Zombie10K originator thread and everyone that has been posting in it and contributing. Its a great "thread". Very refreshing to see. From all the sections I read its a good blueprint for making threads.
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post #2394 of 3270 Old 03-22-2012, 11:29 AM - Thread Starter
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I created the thread and did the shootout since 3D became such a hot topic last year. Many of the owner threads were overrun with discussions of 3D and folks who were only interested in 2D were getting frustrated.

The idea is to discuss and compare each model's pros/cons so AVS members who don't have the opportunity to see the projectors in person, can get a good idea of what they are about to purchase.

I appreciate everyone's input and contributions to the thread. we're not done yet.
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post #2395 of 3270 Old 03-22-2012, 12:54 PM
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For those interested in the Monster Vision glasses, Amazon has these for sale through a 3rd party vendor for $81.96 shipped. This is the kit that includes the RF emitter.
MonsterVision Eyewear

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post #2396 of 3270 Old 03-22-2012, 01:21 PM
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Speaking of the Monstervision glasses I was wondering what kind of connector is needed (what is the name of that cord) to make the custom chord Zombie describes in order to use the JVC and Monster glasses together as the link he provides states the store is closed until the end of the month. I realize you need 3 of them to make it work.
Thanks
Joe
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post #2397 of 3270 Old 03-22-2012, 01:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JOE-C View Post

Speaking of the Monstervision glasses I was wondering what kind of connector is needed (what is the name of that cord) to make the custom chord Zombie describes in order to use the JVC and Monster glasses together as the link he provides states the store is closed until the end of the month. I realize you need 3 of them to make it work.
Thanks
Joe

I think it's some kind of 3-pin DIN cable.

I've been waiting since the beginning of the month for that stockcable store to open up again myself.

I need a male-female 3-pin DIN cable to extend the llength of the attached cable on my JVC IR emitter, not necessarily to make a splitter (although I may look into that option as well). I want to position the emitter a little farther away than the included cable will allow.

rwestley responded to an earlier inquiry of mine with another site that seems to sell the cables, but they seem to be pretty expensive:

http://www.kvconnection.com/3-Pin-Mi...les-s/7576.htm

I'm going to wait until the stockcable.com store opens up again at the end of the month to see if their prices are any better.

Otherwise, I've tried calling around and can't seem to find this type of cable/connector anywhere else (monoprice, bluejeans, radioshack, JVC, . . . ).

I don't know why JVC used a cable/connection that seems to be so hard to find.
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post #2398 of 3270 Old 03-22-2012, 01:50 PM
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OK, for some reason the link I copied and pasted into my above post doesn't seem to work.

You can go directly to the site at: http://www.kvconnection.com/

Look on the menu on the left under Cables-->DIN Cables --> 3-pin.

Although, at the moment, it seems like they only have the male-male cables.
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post #2399 of 3270 Old 03-23-2012, 02:43 AM
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Hi,

I have a RS45 and a Lumagen Radiance XS.

Lumagen sell the CRT-Sync-box that allows send 3D frame-sequential and synchronize with active glasses, in use with Radiance series (the Radiance controls the 3D-glasses polarity and phase).

I've been thinking that maybe using the Sync-box could improve the 3D ghosting in the RS45.

What do you think? Would be good if someone could try this.

I've put this comment also in the thread X30/RS45 Owners.

Best regards
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post #2400 of 3270 Old 03-23-2012, 12:32 PM
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Really nice review! Although I've not gone through all 81 pages in this thread, what about fan noise?
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