Marantz VP 15S1 Replacement - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 45 Old 08-10-2012, 05:51 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
jdlynch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Floyds Knobs, Indiana
Posts: 652
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 23
I've got the itch to upgrade. Is there a projector out there that better my Marantz, in 2D, with an MSRP of less than $13,000?

David Lynch Current Equipment: Marantz AV8801, Proceed HPA3, Parasound HCA-1206, Aerial Acoustics LR5's (LCR), Aerial Acoustics LR3's (sides), RBH in-walls (rears), Seaton Submersive, Marantz VP15s1, 106" Carada BW screen, Oppo BDP-103.
jdlynch is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 45 Old 08-10-2012, 05:54 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 7,586
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 292 Post(s)
Liked: 405
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdlynch View Post

I've got the itch to upgrade. Is there a projector out there that better my Marantz, in 2D, with an MSRP of less than $13,000?

For 2D movies, I prefer the JVC's

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Brands we sell: 
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 
Call for B-stock projectors
Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI, Falcon & many more.
RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Technology, MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech.
AV Science Sales 5 is offline  
post #3 of 45 Old 08-10-2012, 06:06 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
jdlynch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Floyds Knobs, Indiana
Posts: 652
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 23
Unless LCos has progressed significantly I prefer the look of DLP.

David Lynch Current Equipment: Marantz AV8801, Proceed HPA3, Parasound HCA-1206, Aerial Acoustics LR5's (LCR), Aerial Acoustics LR3's (sides), RBH in-walls (rears), Seaton Submersive, Marantz VP15s1, 106" Carada BW screen, Oppo BDP-103.
jdlynch is offline  
post #4 of 45 Old 08-10-2012, 06:14 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 7,586
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 292 Post(s)
Liked: 405
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdlynch View Post

Unless LCos has progressed significantly I prefer the look of DLP.

I own a Marantz and a JVC. Just giving my preference.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Brands we sell: 
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 
Call for B-stock projectors
Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI, Falcon & many more.
RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Technology, MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech.
AV Science Sales 5 is offline  
post #5 of 45 Old 08-10-2012, 06:26 PM
AVS Special Member
 
ultra 150 pilot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Western mass
Posts: 1,079
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 18
I think jvc has come a long way but I still think dlp is king but you need to step up to the 3 chippers, look for a used one and don't look back;)
ultra 150 pilot is online now  
post #6 of 45 Old 08-10-2012, 06:32 PM
AVS Special Member
 
coderguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,983
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Liked: 147
A JVC RS-55 would be worth a look. I don't think either DLP or LCOS wins in all movies, I think it depends on the specific movie or what you are watching.

If you are trying to find a projector that beats another in all different viewing content, I doubt you will find it. The DLP's that even halfway approach JVC contrast are just so expensive. Even on the low-end, the JVC RS-45 can do 25,000:1 to even 50,000:1 Native on/off at 900 lumens best mode, no such luck with a DLP that I know of. The B-stock JVC's are dirt cheap and come with a warranty, it is virtually impossible to beat this deal.

I for one would have a VERY VERY hard time spending that kind of money on a used DLP projector.



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

**Current Projector Calculator** --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

coderguy is offline  
post #7 of 45 Old 08-10-2012, 07:01 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
jdlynch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Floyds Knobs, Indiana
Posts: 652
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

I own a Marantz and a JVC. Just giving my preference.

Thanks Mike;

Which JVC are you referring to, and, what is its MSRP?

David Lynch Current Equipment: Marantz AV8801, Proceed HPA3, Parasound HCA-1206, Aerial Acoustics LR5's (LCR), Aerial Acoustics LR3's (sides), RBH in-walls (rears), Seaton Submersive, Marantz VP15s1, 106" Carada BW screen, Oppo BDP-103.
jdlynch is offline  
post #8 of 45 Old 08-10-2012, 08:16 PM
AVS Special Member
 
coderguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,983
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Liked: 147
Since you may not get an answer for a while, I can help...

All three JVC's are similar and when he says "JVC" he just means RS-45/55/65, but the JVC RS-55 is the popular one for the enthusiast if you have the extra cash, and you can even get a further small boost in contrast with the RS-65. The RS-55 is the best "stopping point" for the serious enthusiast though, whereas the RS-65 is really for people that have a lot of extra money to burn on this stuff. The newer model JVC's will be shipping around the end of this year towards the very beginning of next year. The RS-45 (the one I own) still does a very admirable job if you are on a budget but it lacks some features of the two more expensive models, and it doesn't sound like you are on that tight of a budget, so then look at the RS-55.

MSRP
RS45 $3,499
RS55 $7,999
RS65 $11,999

Don't get me wrong, you cannot completely beat a high-end DLP with a JVC, but it certainly does win in some situations. For the ultimate setup, a two projector setup is the best (DLP + LCOS).



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

**Current Projector Calculator** --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

coderguy is offline  
post #9 of 45 Old 08-10-2012, 10:42 PM
Advanced Member
 
danieledmunds's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Bermuda
Posts: 986
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by ultra 150 pilot View Post

I think jvc has come a long way but I still think dlp is king but you need to step up to the 3 chippers, look for a used one and don't look back;)

I would agree, for the money you are looking at you can find used or, more preferably, ex-demo 3 chippers. After getting used to 0.95" DC3/4, I couldn't do LCOS again, although thats my preference. If you can live with 600 or so lumens there are some decently priced used/ex-demo high end DLP LEDs around at the moment.

danieledmunds is offline  
post #10 of 45 Old 08-10-2012, 10:51 PM
AVS Special Member
 
coderguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,983
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Liked: 147
You spend thousands of dollars on a used projector and end up with a giant broken decoration, it's not hugely uncommon for that to happen. You need a warranty if buying used on these high dollar machines, unless you are so rich you just do not care, or you have a gambling addiction.

Part of how good an LCOS looks is luck of the draw, but the JVC's have come a long ways in sharpness. IMHO, it is VERY hard to see these small differences of sharpness in movies.

Since he already owns a high-end DLP, I am not sure how he is going to beat it, but I didn't see what MARANTZ he owned (he didn't say). Still, an LCOS + DLP sounds better than trying to buy a new DLP to beat an existing DLP (if his DLP is already 1080p, etc...). The biggest advantage to the DLP (IMHO) will be cleaner motion and the ability to handle poorer NON-Bluray sources much better than a JVC can, but the JVC will out-shine a DLP in several Bluray movies.



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

**Current Projector Calculator** --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

coderguy is offline  
post #11 of 45 Old 08-10-2012, 11:20 PM
Advanced Member
 
danieledmunds's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Bermuda
Posts: 986
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 15
I obviously have a gambling addiction.

I guess I can use all the money I saved on therapy

danieledmunds is offline  
post #12 of 45 Old 08-10-2012, 11:24 PM
AVS Special Member
 
coderguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,983
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Liked: 147
I think the Runco QLED's only do 400-500ish lumens after calibration.

Has anyone done the Native On/Off readings on the higher end LED DLP's?
So far every LED projector I've seen has had poor contrast.

I am just trying to figure this out, like what Marantz does he own, and what projector are you guys suggesting to beat it?
Seems like we are talking $8,000+ for a used DLP to significantly beat an existing high-end DLP (unless it is a 720p Marantz), and that seems like an insane amount of money for a used projector. Are we really suggesting one high-end DLP is going to significantly beat another high-end DLP, you do know that the DLP tech has been in a frozen world for a long time.

The contrast has been stagnant, the JVC RS-55 can do 80,000:1 Native on/off with no IRIS at all, the RS-65 near 100,000:1+. The Rs-55 and RS-65 have e-shift to make the pixel fill completely invisible and to create a very nice analog effect to movies. These DLP's with any significant lumens are lucky to get to 3000:1, sure they can do 5000:1+ at sub-500 lumens, but beyond that they are using an IRIS. So not saying one is better than the other, just that rather have two different types of dogs then buying the same dog twice. For me anyhow, it has been more exciting owning different machines with different strengths than trying to replicate a pre-existing experience. That said some people may always love their DLP's more and never want an LCOS, but I don't think it is the norm anymore.



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

**Current Projector Calculator** --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

coderguy is offline  
post #13 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 05:05 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 7,586
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 292 Post(s)
Liked: 405
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdlynch View Post

Thanks Mike;
Which JVC are you referring to, and, what is its MSRP?

I use a JVC RS45, Lumagen and a Darbee. I am also running an A-lens. My Marantz is the older VP-12S4. The Marantz has a great lens and was my go to projector for HDTV. Now my JVC setup stomps all over it, to the point that my wife even notices the difference and she does not care about this stuff at all. She watches TV on an old 36" 4:3 CRT TV, not even HD. As an example, we watched the Olympics on the JVC. The next night we watched on the Marantz. She kept complaining, why we were not using the JVC because the picture was so much better. Also the JVC is handicapped when watching 16:9 content because my lens is a fixed in place lens with the Lumagen doing the processing to put the image back to 16:9. Even with that, the JVC was the clear winner. The Lumagen and the Darbee makes a big difference.

An RS55 and a Darbee would also be a tough combination to beat. The Darbee improves the sharpness enough that I doubt that he would miss the Marantz.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Brands we sell: 
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 
Call for B-stock projectors
Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI, Falcon & many more.
RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Technology, MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech.
AV Science Sales 5 is offline  
post #14 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 05:47 AM
AVS Special Member
 
ultra 150 pilot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Western mass
Posts: 1,079
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 18
I came from an infocus 7210 to a jvc x70 and although a very nice picture, I could not get used to the motion. In addition the jvc lacked that dlp look. I sold the x70 and realized that none of the sub 10k Dlps won't cut it, I'm looking for a higher end used 3 chipper.

Don't get me wrong the blacks and contrast are wonderful but the Dlps have better shadow detail, motion and 3 chippers are considerably brighter. I wish I could combine both.

I recently went to a high end shop and saw the x70 compared to an older runco vx8 3 chip and the quantum 750i, with the exception of the color palate on the 750i the vx8 just had the edge with image depth it just sucked you in, when the sales guy told me it was only 720 p I was shocked, granted you can't sit too close or you will notice but at the right distance they look similar.

It's not an option for me to spend 20 or 30 k on a pj with that I'm willing to give up a little newer advancements to have that superior image of a previously priced 30k pj.

Just my 2 cent
ultra 150 pilot is online now  
post #15 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 05:48 AM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
jdlynch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Floyds Knobs, Indiana
Posts: 652
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 23
Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post

You spend thousands of dollars on a used projector and end up with a giant broken decoration, it's not hugely uncommon for that to happen. You need a warranty if buying used on these high dollar machines, unless you are so rich you just do not care, or you have a gambling addiction.
Part of how good an LCOS looks is luck of the draw, but the JVC's have come a long ways in sharpness. IMHO, it is VERY hard to see these small differences of sharpness in movies.
Since he already owns a high-end DLP, I am not sure how he is going to beat it, but I didn't see what MARANTZ he owned (he didn't say). Still, an LCOS + DLP sounds better than trying to buy a new DLP to beat an existing DLP (if his DLP is already 1080p, etc...). The biggest advantage to the DLP (IMHO) will be cleaner motion and the ability to handle poorer NON-Bluray sources much better than a JVC can, but the JVC will out-shine a DLP in several Bluray movies.

I stated my projector model in the thread title; it is a VP15S1.

Sounds like any move at this point may just be a lateral shift. A three chipper would definitely be an improvement, but, at a significant cost as well.

David Lynch Current Equipment: Marantz AV8801, Proceed HPA3, Parasound HCA-1206, Aerial Acoustics LR5's (LCR), Aerial Acoustics LR3's (sides), RBH in-walls (rears), Seaton Submersive, Marantz VP15s1, 106" Carada BW screen, Oppo BDP-103.
jdlynch is offline  
post #16 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 06:17 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Ron Jones's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Florida and West Virginia, USA
Posts: 5,854
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 135 Post(s)
Liked: 177
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdlynch View Post

I stated my projector model in the thread title; it is a VP15S1.
Sounds like any move at this point may just be a lateral shift. A three chipper would definitely be an improvement, but, at a significant cost as well.

If any serious consideration were to be given to getting a new 3-chip DLP, then I would consider instead (in the same $20K price range) the Sony VW1000 (native 4K, LCoS). Actually in the price range you started off this discussion, you could get a JVC RS55 plus a single chip DLP, such as the new Sharp XV-Z30000. Use the JVC for watching 2D movies and the DLP for 3D, sports, video games, etc. This should be better overall than any single projector in the $10K - $12K price range can deliver. If you are not in a hurry the CEDIA Expo is only 3 1/2 weeks away and the new JVC, Sony, Mits (rumored to be introducing a native 4K LCoS projector, based on Sony SXRD 4K display chips, in the $12K range), SIM2, Runco, etc. projectors will be announced/demo'ed with most of the new models shipping later in 2012.

Ron Jones
Blog + Reviews + Articles: projectorreviews.com
Ron Jones is offline  
post #17 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 07:20 AM
AVS Special Member
 
ultra 150 pilot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Western mass
Posts: 1,079
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 18
The Sony is a definite option, I would give mike Garrett from avs a call, great guy to work with and check with if they have any open box or b stocks worth a shot.
ultra 150 pilot is online now  
post #18 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 08:23 AM
AVS Special Member
 
coderguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,983
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Liked: 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by ultra 150 pilot View Post

I came from an infocus 7210 to a jvc x70 and although a very nice picture, I could not get used to the motion. In addition the jvc lacked that dlp look. I sold the x70 and realized that none of the sub 10k Dlps won't cut it, I'm looking for a higher end used 3 chipper.
Don't get me wrong the blacks and contrast are wonderful but the Dlps have better shadow detail

You've made some informative posts, but I disagree about shadow detail. Shadow detail is based on Native On/Off contrast and GAMMA calibration and the black floor, so the higher Native On/Off a projector can do the more intrascene contrast it shows in dark scenes and therefore the higher shadow detail. LCOS projectors beat DLP's in shadow detail, and every calibrator will tell you that. A Plasma TV is the absolute winner in shadow detail.

Sometimes the higher intrascene contrast in dark scenes will make it appear that in some poorly shot scenes the shadow detail looks better on a DLP, but it's not shadow detail you are seeing, it is because some of the pixels in the darker range are being displayed brighter. The JVC can do the same thing, you just change the gamma curve at the low end and raise the black floor with the brightness control. However, the JVC can more easily show intrascene contrast gradiations from darker areas on the image where the gradients are close and tight, whereas a DLP cannot. In highly detailed and well shot dark scenes, the JVC easily runs away from DLP's at shadow detail. By default JVC's require an intense gamma calibration as their gamma curves are often backwards and this is one reason someone should not judge shadow detail by eye without a professional calibration. That said, if you are watching at 5,000:1+ native on/off with a DLP, then the shadow detail won't be that much difference from a JVC except that the IRIS on projectors will crush shadow detail to some extent, and the JVC has no IRIS which is another reason that a properly calibrated JVC is # 1 at shadow detail above all other projectors.



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

**Current Projector Calculator** --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

coderguy is offline  
post #19 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 08:54 AM
Advanced Member
 
danieledmunds's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Bermuda
Posts: 986
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Agreed, the JVCs have higher native contrast and if you have a dedicated, light controlled theater room then you will be able to see then benefits. Personally I don't and find DLP works better for me. If you prefer the sharpness and general look of DLP then yes, most replacement models would be a lateral move unless its 3 chip. Really the best advice would be to demo some models and take the measurements into account, with CEDIA right around the corner you are probably better off holding on to what you have and seeing whats announced. It will be a chance for me to take a look at the latest models, I haven't seen a JVC demo since the RS25/35 they may have improved signficantly since then.

danieledmunds is offline  
post #20 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 08:57 AM
AVS Special Member
 
ultra 150 pilot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Western mass
Posts: 1,079
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by coderguy View Post


That said, if you are watching at 5,000:1+ native on/off with a DLP, then the shadow detail won't be that much difference from a JVC except that the IRIS on projectors will crush shadow detail to some extent, and the JVC has no IRIS which is another reason that a properly calibrated JVC is # 1 at shadow detail above all other projectors.


You seem to really be caught up in specs, that's only part of the equation.

Have you seen a 3 chip dlp?
ultra 150 pilot is online now  
post #21 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 09:05 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Seegs108's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Schenectady, New York
Posts: 4,104
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 306 Post(s)
Liked: 226
Quote:
Originally Posted by danieledmunds View Post

Agreed, the JVCs have higher native contrast and if you have a dedicated, light controlled theater room then you will be able to see then benefits. Personally I don't and find DLP works better for me. If you prefer the sharpness and general look of DLP then yes, most replacement models would be a lateral move unless its 3 chip. Really the best advice would be to demo some models and take the measurements into account, with CEDIA right around the corner you are probably better off holding on to what you have and seeing whats announced. It will be a chance for me to take a look at the latest models, I haven't seen a JVC demo since the RS25/35 they may have improved signficantly since then.

From the RS35 they haven't made any drastic improvements. You may notice pixel sharpness to be a tad better but it still can't match .65" DLP with a decent lens, let alone a .95" DMD which still decimates LCOS in overall depth and sharpness to the image.

I'm sure being used to the larger DMD and and custom konica minolta lens used in the Marantz he's going to have a hard time transitioning to a JVC.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Seegs108 is offline  
post #22 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 09:13 AM
AVS Special Member
 
coderguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,983
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Liked: 147
DLP's are generally better for TV (only TV at 30fps, stuff like Game of Thrones is better on the JVC), Sports, Gaming, and handling poorer sources, although there are always going to be exceptions. The JVC is better at movies with any dark scenes, and very nearly equal in most movies with bright scenes, but DLP's do tend to beat the JVC in movies that have noise in them. Many films do not even have enough sharpness to see any difference between a DLP and a JVC, filming methods will sometimes matter more than the projector even matters.

Where the JVC can really run away from some DLP's is in the reference level films.



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

**Current Projector Calculator** --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

coderguy is offline  
post #23 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 09:26 AM
AVS Special Member
 
coderguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,983
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Liked: 147
Quote:
Originally Posted by ultra 150 pilot View Post

You seem to really be caught up in specs, that's only part of the equation.
Have you seen a 3 chip dlp?

Yes, and the shadow detail is not as good as a JVC. Shadow detail is specs and calibration. There is processing, but modern projectors no longer have processing issues in gradiations of dark scenes unless there is a bunch of noise in the source, so it generally is all calibration and native on/off. I am not saying that the JVC beats the DLP's overall, but they are two different images for sure and it will be personal preference. The reason most of push JVC's for movie viewing is because in a sub $5000 budget it is REALLY hard to beat a JVC at movies, in the higher budgets it's harder to say but it depends on what you value in the image I suppose.

The Sony VW1000 should be better than the JVC's in many respects (never seen one) going by others that have judged it, but in the seemingly less BIAS'd comparisons I've seen between the RS-55 and the vw1000, I think people said the JVC still wins at black levels, whereas the Sony wins at everything else.



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

**Current Projector Calculator** --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

coderguy is offline  
post #24 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 10:40 AM
AVS Special Member
 
ultra 150 pilot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Western mass
Posts: 1,079
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 18
Coderguy,

I need all the feedback I can get on 3 chip Dlps since Ive only seen the 720 runco, which one did you see?


Thx
ultra 150 pilot is online now  
post #25 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 11:20 AM
AVS Special Member
 
coderguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 9,983
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 16 Post(s)
Liked: 147
I've seen several different ones both commercially and in a couple private showrooms (Christi's, Sim2's), there is no way to tell that much about it unless I spent time with it myself in my own room, but I do know on some of those they were so bright that the contrast was nullified somewhat (hence with DLP's the brighter ones lose contrast due to a limitation of the technology). I've seen a bunch of various high-end PJ's all over Dallas in some showrooms and various places, as well as some in Colorado. However, I didn't do much if any critical viewing other than a couple time, as I wasn't looking to buy one myself. I actually thought the Sony4k looked better in a way (more film like at least), which I saw in a movie theater in Colorado (in Colo Springs). I watched Super8 on the Sony4k, and even though the movie wasn't great, I went to see it on a commercial DLP to try to compare the same day (I had time to kill and nothing to do). Super8 was probably a bad movie to compare because parts of the movie were heavily filtered or whatever to give a more film ("Super8") look, at first I actually thought the Sony4k projector was broken until the movie played some cleaner scenes smile.gif

It's hard to compare in a movie theater because the projectors have too many lumens and not enough contrast, but even outside the theater I've never seen a DLP that I thought just blew away my JVC in movies, and that includes Runcos and others. Perhaps if I had a super high-end DLP in my own room I would change my mind, but I kind of doubt it. Keep in mind that anyone can find a Sony4k and a Christi just by going to the local theater, a lot of theaters are really bad, but there are a few good ones with better setups and to where the lighting on the side isn't reflecting as much (which is really annoying).

In these viewings, sharpness was a non-issue between these high-end DLP's and modern LCOS projectors (at least to me), the movies were not sharp enough to make a difference, that's why I would need it in my own room to tell and A/B. Tree of life is a good movie to compare projectors on (it has super dark high contrast scenes, scenes filmed with neutral D65 lighting, and it has some scenes that show off sharpness, like billowing clouds of smoke). If I had to just take one movie to use as a comparison, it probably would be Tree of Life, but having a Harry Potter movie handy is good for further dark scene comparisons as well. There might be a better movie to use other than TOL (there is also Art of Flight which some like), but for now I use TOL.

Perhaps at Cedia they are setup well and you can go there and compare.



To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
-
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

**Current Projector Calculator** --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

coderguy is offline  
post #26 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 01:09 PM
Senior Member
 
jbn008's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 303
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 20
I love the look of DLPs and on mid to bright scenes, they can't be beat. But in terms of native contrast ratio and black level, they don't even come close to the JVCs. That's why I keep coming back to JVC's DLA line.

Headless Petie
jbn008 is offline  
post #27 of 45 Old 08-11-2012, 01:17 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 7,586
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 292 Post(s)
Liked: 405
Just my 45 was pretty good. My 45 and the Lumagen was a good improvement, especially for anything not 1080P. My 45, Lumagen and Darbee makes for a very nice setup. For pure BD viewing the RS55 and Darbee would be a great match. If you are watching much content that is not 1080P, then I am not sure that I would go with the 45, Lumagen and Darbee. Of cousers the RS55, Lumagen and Darbee would be even better. smile.gif

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Brands we sell: 
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 
Call for B-stock projectors
Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI, Falcon & many more.
RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Technology, MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech.
AV Science Sales 5 is offline  
post #28 of 45 Old 08-12-2012, 05:14 AM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
jdlynch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Floyds Knobs, Indiana
Posts: 652
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 8 Post(s)
Liked: 23
Thanks again for all the recommendations. However, now that I have had my VP15s1 for a while I am afraid that DLP has become my personal reference standard.

Any comments on the Runco q750i ? The idea of never having to replace the lamp is appealing. My room is totally light controlled with a black ceiling so the decreased lumens "might" not be a problem. I am using a Carada BW 1.3 gain 106" diag screen.

Also, does Sim2 have any offerings within my price range that would better the PQ of the Marantz?

David Lynch Current Equipment: Marantz AV8801, Proceed HPA3, Parasound HCA-1206, Aerial Acoustics LR5's (LCR), Aerial Acoustics LR3's (sides), RBH in-walls (rears), Seaton Submersive, Marantz VP15s1, 106" Carada BW screen, Oppo BDP-103.
jdlynch is offline  
post #29 of 45 Old 08-12-2012, 06:31 AM
AVS Special Member
 
pottscb's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 1,276
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 13 Post(s)
Liked: 37
Hey man, just my opinion (I own a DLP;SP8602; but like LCOS as well), I agree with coderguy, hang on to your 15S1 for sports and get an RS55 for movies...its chump change compared to what you would pay for a 3-chipper. As for the Runco 750i, there are some reviews out there (I think Jason Turk did a glowing review on AVS somewhere). Another option is a used Marantz 11S2 which would give you better contrast at the expense of brightness (you can still sell your on V'gon and buy an 11S2 for a net loss of only a couple grand).

As for Sim2, the only thing they offer for less than $20K is the Crystal 35 and 45, both higher brightness and both probably pretty comparable contrast-wise to what you have.

Also, I might recommend you at least look at a Sony VW-95 as it has excellent contrast/blacks and its motion is reportedly better than the JVCs and it will be less distracting coming from DLP.

Good luck.
pottscb is offline  
post #30 of 45 Old 08-12-2012, 07:44 AM
AVS Special Member
 
ultra 150 pilot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Western mass
Posts: 1,079
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 18
Quote:
Originally Posted by jdlynch View Post

Thanks again for all the recommendations. However, now that I have had my VP15s1 for a while I am afraid that DLP has become my personal reference standard.
Any comments on the Runco q750i ? The idea of never having to replace the lamp is appealing. My room is totally light controlled with a black ceiling so the decreased lumens "might" not be a problem. I am using a Carada BW 1.3 gain 106" diag screen.
Also, does Sim2 have any offerings within my price range that would better the PQ of the Marantz?

Check your pm
ultra 150 pilot is online now  
Reply Digital Hi-End Projectors - $3,000+ USD MSRP

Tags
Jvc Dla Rs55 Bundle , Jvc Dla Rs45 Home Theater Projector 1080p Hdmi
Gear in this thread - 1080p by PriceGrabber.com

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off