Projector Mini-Shootout Thread 2013-2014 - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 07:30 AM
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Reality creation even on it's minimal setting looks too digital for my tastes and is actually off from reality IMO. The Darbee works beautifully by improving detail while still making the picture natural looking.
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post #32 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 07:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Geof View Post

I was thinking the same thing.

Yeah, too much sharpening for me as well. The RC at default is like the Darbee at max 120.
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post #33 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 08:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ranger View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Geof View Post

I was thinking the same thing.

Yeah, too much sharpening for me as well. The RC at default is like the Darbee at max 120.

You are wrong. I have seen both and this is just not true.

It is personal taste but for me, the RC at minimum, make the picture look very detail but not too digital.

Please guy, dont fill this thread with false info like that.

Let Zombie give is impression. He have both in is room...
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post #34 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 08:18 AM
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thanks Jason,

Maybe you can give us a bottom line on RC and Darbee:

1. Which do you prefer RC or darbee or do you think they can happily conexist with the right settings?

2. Do I still need the darbee with the RC?

Sorry I don't really look at screenshots, unless it's for showing 3D ghosting wink.gif
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post #35 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 08:18 AM
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A few things putting me off shelling out the extra dosh for the HW50 now lol! Namely, I really don't need the extra lumens, I liked the idea of a built in emitter but buzz syndrome (ain't no way I'm shelling out extra for an emitter) and RC doesn't seem that great and I'm one of the few that didn't really take to the Darbee (I personally found the picture more natural without it and less forced).
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post #36 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 08:21 AM
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Actually, he already did post a first impression on the RC
Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

Some initial impressions on the RC vs. Darbee on Post #2. It's getting late, but have to check out some 3D first. cool.gif

edit: back to the RC for a few minutes. I turned the RESOLUTION setting all the way to minimum. MUCH better now.. it adds just enough sharpness to appreciate the difference but not overdoing it in the background or making it look overly sharp.

Overall, out of the box PQ looks very good (provided the RC resolution is turned down a bit). Based on first impressions, I would prefer the HW50 with the RC over the HW30 with the Darbee.
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post #37 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 08:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raine0 View Post

A few things putting me off shelling out the extra dosh for the HW50 now lol! Namely, I really don't need the extra lumens, I liked the idea of a built in emitter but buzz syndrome (ain't no way I'm shelling out extra for an emitter) and RC doesn't seem that great and I'm one of the few that didn't really take to the Darbee (I personally found the picture more natural without it and less forced).

If you use the darbee at 40% strength or less there is no negative side effects whatsoever. Just a better more 3 demensional image. Or course we are gonna get those that say ANY PROCESSING is bad and not as the director intended, blah blah blah wink.gif

It's almost like saying that I'd rather watch DVD then Bluray because Bluray looks to real. biggrin.gif I actually had someone say that to me when I worked at an electronics store once, and they only bought DVDs and had a big screen HDTV.
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post #38 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 08:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickAVManiac View Post

You are wrong. I have seen both and this is just not true.

It is personal taste but for me, the RC at minimum, make the picture look very detail but not too digital.

Please guy, dont fill this thread with false info like that.

Let Zombie give is impression. He have both in is room...

guys - remember this is a running review, I wanted to see how it looked 'out of the box' and give some closeups of the RC vs. Darbee, etc. IMO, the setting is too high out of the box, but the PQ becomes quite pleasant once I turned down the resolution setting.

The RC is very different than the Darbee processing. The RC is an obvious sharpening process whereas the Darbee is enhancing certain areas of contrast and a bit more subtle in comparison.

I didn't get a chance to update the other thread with this information, but here it now:

of all the projectors from last year (RS45, Epson 5010, RS55, HW30, BQW700) - IMO, the Darbee had the LEAST effect on the HW30 compared to the others. I am not sure if it's due to the pixel structure technique they use, but cranking the Darbee to 50% on the HW30 didn't have the same net effect that it did on the others. In other words, the more naturally sharp the projector, the better the Darbee works.

Having said that, the RC is definitely a nice sharpening technique to offset the somewhat softer image (with RC turned off). I watched a number of 2D clips I am familiar with and they looked very good with the RC resolution @ minimum and the Darbee @ 30%.

@ Conan - I hear you on the screen shots, they are most valuable with the 3D screenshots. On post #2, I did a closeup of the changes of the RC on/off, + Darbee, etc. I do think these are valuable since we are looking at what's happening at the pixel level, then working our way back from there.

I think my relatively large 142" @ a close seating distance is a perfect venue for the RC vs. E-shift vs. Darbee comparisons. Some of this could be less obvious on a small screen @ 1.6 - 2.0SW, etc. which is why we saw such a wide range of opinions last year when discussing e-shift.

I also watched a number of 3D clips last night and the RC looks great in with 3D mode - especially with 3D animations. I watched Despicable Me and this looked great on the HW50. With the glasses brightness turned down to 3 from Max, there is minimal ghosting. I know exactly where it is, but overall, most folks are going to like the 3D on the HW50, it's quite an improvement over the HW30. It's noticeably bright (I'll get some measurements in 3D tonight) and the RC does a great job of bringing up the sharpness on this sized screen.

I am hearing the buzzing in 3D mode the other HW50 owners are talking about. I have the projector 3 feet behind my head for Max gain on the HP. It does vary when lowering the screen brightness, but it's always there. I'll have to see if I can get the external transmitter to see if it happens as suggested in the HW50 thread. When I put my ear near the built in transmitter, the sound does seem to come from that general area. I have to spend more time with this later tonight.
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post #39 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 09:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SED <--- Rules View Post

Reality creation even on it's minimal setting looks too digital for my tastes and is actually off from reality IMO. The Darbee works beautifully by improving detail while still making the picture natural looking.

Edit - not relative comment now with the new pics
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post #40 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 09:53 AM
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Here is the HW 50 Buzzing Sound while in 3D mode:

http://soundcloud.com/tj-demonte/hw50-buzzing
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post #41 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 09:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SOWK View Post

Zombie10K
This is unacceptable... You've had 10 hours to get a full 3 page report out, and 1 post with 5 pictures is all we get...

What, did you think you we're allowed to sleep?

J/King... smile.gif

I feel asleep at 4:30am (with the 3D glasses still on).

are you getting one of these to check out? The lumen output is impressive out the box, it's blasting my 2.8HP - overly bright.. just how I like it.

I have to rig up my table mount so I can stack the HW50 & RS55 for 2D comparisons and the HW50 / W7000 for 3D. I have an HDMI splitter than can pass a 3D signal, so that should allow me to go back and forth with some A/B testing.

overall, it's a nice improvement over the HW30 (better black floor and brighter and sharper in 3D with the RC). Colors look great out of the box. If this is relatively consistent between copies, it should be a very good 'out of the box' experience for new owners.
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post #42 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 10:05 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

Some initial observations of the RC.
1. With the RC turned off, the HW50 appears very similar in PQ to the HW30.
2. Pixel structure clarity is about the same as it was with the HW30.
Did you take any similar pictures from the last shootout thread of the HW30 pixel structure to compare objectively?
In my examination of several 30ES last year the pixel structure was less evident. Actually it was difficult to see at all.

In fact cine4Home measured a 30% increase in native contrast of the 50ES over the 30ES. We should give credit to the substantial improvements and hard work Sony made to the optical block.

Panasonic also greatly improved the contrast (less light scatter) in their new 6000/8000.
Mitsubishi also improved the contrast in their new model 8000 which AVS will stock when it becomes available.

JVC only made any improvements to contrast/optical block in the their two most expensive models $7K-$12K
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post #43 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

I feel asleep at 4:30am (with the 3D glasses still on).
are you getting one of these to check out? The lumen output is impressive out the box, it's blasting my 2.8HP - overly bright.. just how I like it.
I have to rig up my table mount so I can stack the HW50 & RS55 for 2D comparisons and the HW50 / W7000 for 3D. I have an HDMI splitter than can pass a 3D signal, so that should allow me to go back and forth with some A/B testing.
overall, it's a nice improvement over the HW30 (better black floor and brighter and sharper in 3D with the RC). Colors look great out of the box. If this is relatively consistent between copies, it should be a very good 'out of the box' experience for new owners.

Looking forward to this. Raine said the same thing about out of the box presets being very good.

If you have a dual output receiver you could even run both projectors side by side on your massive screen at the same time and shoot that - would be cool! Or even a youtube video - just for fun...Not that I'm asking you to do that or anything I'm sure you have enough on your plate but would be cool to do sometime cool.gif
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post #44 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 11:06 AM
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Just wanted to say great work so far Jason. I agree with all of your observations so far as I have the HW30 and the HW50 with the darbee in the mix. You really do need to be careful when using the RC on he HW50 like you stated and I felt when I added in the darbee it enhanced the contrast more in parts of the image. I think E shift2 is going to give a completely different effect and look forward to your thoughts on it. These two features are going to cause a lot of opinions from everyone that likes one over the other.
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post #45 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

guys - remember this is a running review, I wanted to see how it looked 'out of the box' and give some closeups of the RC vs. Darbee, etc. IMO, the setting is too high out of the box, but the PQ becomes quite pleasant once I turned down the resolution setting.
The RC is very different than the Darbee processing. The RC is an obvious sharpening process whereas the Darbee is enhancing certain areas of contrast and a bit more subtle in comparison.
I didn't get a chance to update the other thread with this information, but here it now:
of all the projectors from last year (RS45, Epson 5010, RS55, HW30, BQW700) - IMO, the Darbee had the LEAST effect on the HW30 compared to the others. I am not sure if it's due to the pixel structure technique they use, but cranking the Darbee to 50% on the HW30 didn't have the same net effect that it did on the others. In other words, the more naturally sharp the projector, the better the Darbee works.
Having said that, the RC is definitely a nice sharpening technique to offset the somewhat softer image (with RC turned off). I watched a number of 2D clips I am familiar with and they looked very good with the RC resolution @ minimum and the Darbee @ 30%.
@ Conan - I hear you on the screen shots, they are most valuable with the 3D screenshots. On post #2, I did a closeup of the changes of the RC on/off, + Darbee, etc. I do think these are valuable since we are looking at what's happening at the pixel level, then working our way back from there.
I think my relatively large 142" @ a close seating distance is a perfect venue for the RC vs. E-shift vs. Darbee comparisons. Some of this could be less obvious on a small screen @ 1.6 - 2.0SW, etc. which is why we saw such a wide range of opinions last year when discussing e-shift.
I also watched a number of 3D clips last night and the RC looks great in with 3D mode - especially with 3D animations. I watched Despicable Me and this looked great on the HW50. With the glasses brightness turned down to 3 from Max, there is minimal ghosting. I know exactly where it is, but overall, most folks are going to like the 3D on the HW50, it's quite an improvement over the HW30. It's noticeably bright (I'll get some measurements in 3D tonight) and the RC does a great job of bringing up the sharpness on this sized screen.
I am hearing the buzzing in 3D mode the other HW50 owners are talking about. I have the projector 3 feet behind my head for Max gain on the HP. It does vary when lowering the screen brightness, but it's always there. I'll have to see if I can get the external transmitter to see if it happens as suggested in the HW50 thread. When I put my ear near the built in transmitter, the sound does seem to come from that general area. I have to spend more time with this later tonight.

Thanks Jason,

I'm happy that RC and darbee compliment each other. Should give me a very nice picture. I suggest people hold off on returning the projector because of the buzz. Sony has an express RMA within 3 months, so I think it's better to wait to see if they get it sorted before instantly returning the projector and getting another one with the exact same problem. Maybe they will just ship everyone an external transmitter. biggrin.gif

Jason, I know your running on fumes right now, but did u get a chance to test the monster vision glasses with the Sony?

As for the screen shots. You'r right, they do help show pixel level sharpness. Screens that other reviews post for black level, or contrast or colour ARE COMPLETELY USELESS. U can make a 1000.00 projector look better then a 25 000 projector with a screenshot.
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post #46 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

overall, it's a nice improvement over the HW30 (better black floor and brighter and sharper in 3D with the RC). Colors look great out of the box. If this is relatively consistent between copies, it should be a very good 'out of the box' experience for new owners.

Interesting info. We'll see what you think once you see some of the other units. Sounds like the Sony is like the Epson 5010 version of an LCOS (good contrast, very bright overall).


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post #47 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 12:31 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by conan48 View Post

Thanks Jason,
I suggest people hold off on returning the projector because of the buzz. Sony has an express RMA within 3 months, so I think it's better to wait to see if they get it sorted before instantly returning the projector and getting another one with the exact same problem. Maybe they will just ship everyone an external transmitter. biggrin.gif
Are you aware of the typically severe return policy constraints of the vendors?
Do you really think Sony will ship out transmitters?
Do customers receive another new projector or a refurbished one?

You may not be aware that projectors can be unreliable and need special consideration.
This is why experienced owners typically wait to ensure meeting reliability and quality standards.
BTW I've enjoyed reading your posts and following your spot-on observations.
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Well lets try again:
I'd be interested to hear if the Sony 50ES is "good enough" so that two projectors are no longer recommended for the vast majority of potential owners.

That is, unlike with the last shootout, can ONE PROJECTOR do both excellent 2D and 3D?

Thanks in advance!smile.gifsmile.gif
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post #49 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 12:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HiFiFun View Post

Well lets try again:
I'd be interested to hear if the Sony 50ES is "good enough" so that two projectors are no longer recommended for the vast majority of potential owners.
That is, unlike with the last shootout, can ONE PROJECTOR do both excellent 2D and 3D?
Thanks in advance!smile.gifsmile.gif

I thought the Sony 30ES was the best one projector combo last year
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post #50 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 12:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadow39 View Post

Just wanted to say great work so far Jason. I agree with all of your observations so far as I have the HW30 and the HW50 with the darbee in the mix. You really do need to be careful when using the RC on he HW50 like you stated and I felt when I added in the darbee it enhanced the contrast more in parts of the image. I think E shift2 is going to give a completely different effect and look forward to your thoughts on it. These two features are going to cause a lot of opinions from everyone that likes one over the other.

thanks for your feedback on the HW50 so far. The RC, E-shift and Darbee device PQ enhancements are no doubt deviations from from the regular conversations about 2D PQ that existed just a few years ago. They all have their benefits to varying degrees. Just like the Darbee settings, I can see there will wide variances on settings for each particular setup and personal preferences. My goal is to take a close look at what's happening at the pixel lexel and work our way back from there.
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post #51 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 01:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by conan48 View Post

Thanks Jason,
I'm happy that RC and darbee compliment each other. Should give me a very nice picture. I suggest people hold off on returning the projector because of the buzz. Sony has an express RMA within 3 months, so I think it's better to wait to see if they get it sorted before instantly returning the projector and getting another one with the exact same problem. Maybe they will just ship everyone an external transmitter. biggrin.gif

Jason, I know your running on fumes right now, but did u get a chance to test the monster vision glasses with the Sony?

As for the screen shots. You'r right, they do help show pixel level sharpness. Screens that other reviews post for black level, or contrast or colour ARE COMPLETELY USELESS. U can make a 1000.00 projector look better then a 25 000 projector with a screenshot.

We'll have to ask Sony if they are aware of the buzz. I just realized they didn't include the external transmitter in the packing since it's technically not necessary. I'll have to try and locate one and try it out.

I haven't used my MV3D's in ages so I had to charge them last night. I was going back and forth between the Sony glasses and the Xpand 104's. I like the 104's fit, nice and comfortable, but the tint is a bit more noticeable than the Sony glasses. I'll have to try and calibrate both behind glasses since the Xpand's are lightweight and good for prescription glasses.

I'll check out the MV3D's tonight. I have a number of 3D titles I have seen yet. Abraham Lincoln Vampire Hunter was one of my favorites recently. cool.gif
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post #52 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

I have to rig up my table mount so I can stack the HW50 & RS55 for 2D comparisons

Thanks for everything you are doing Jason. I'm most interested to hear your impressions of your RS55 vs the HW50 in 2D.

Thanks again,
Mike

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post #53 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tehotaone View Post

Here is the HW 50 Buzzing Sound while in 3D mode:
http://soundcloud.com/tj-demonte/hw50-buzzing

How far away was the recording device from the projector?
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post #54 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 01:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HiFiFun View Post

Well lets try again:
I'd be interested to hear if the Sony 50ES is "good enough" so that two projectors are no longer recommended for the vast majority of potential owners.
That is, unlike with the last shootout, can ONE PROJECTOR do both excellent 2D and 3D?
Thanks in advance!smile.gifsmile.gif
This is what i am hoping for. The es50 i have coming is replacing my acer h9500 and sony vw85. If it as good in 2d and 3d i will be satisfied. I know it will be brighter. I am anxious to try it with the darbee i recently bought.

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post #55 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 01:56 PM
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zombie do you think i would benefit from e-shift 2?
my seating distance is 9' and 12'.
i really would like to buy the jvc 4810 but now im reading about motion judder in 3d mode at home cinema fr.com
how much pq differnce will i add in 2d,coming from a acer 9500bd
btw 130'' 1.2 screen.the brightness from acer in 3d really sucks
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post #56 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 02:00 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blee0120 View Post

I thought the Sony 30ES was the best one projector combo last year
Unfortunately recommendations change quickly with the release of new models. Here are the 50ES reviews with the first being an abbreviated Sony model comparison courtesy of Cine4Home :

Cine4Home:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1432654/official-sony-vpl-hw50es-owners-thread/150#post_22495629
http://translate.google.com/translate?depth=1&hl=en&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http://www.cine4home.de/tests/projektoren/Sony_VPL_HW50/Sony_VPL-HW50_ES_Test.htm

Audio/Video France (Kraine):
http://www.microsofttranslator.com/bv.aspx?from=fr&to=en&a=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.audiovideohd.fr%2Ftests%2F341-Sony-VPL-HW50ES-0.html

Projector Reviews:
http://www.projectorreviews.com/sony/hw50es/index.php

Notice that the two French 95ES reviewers purchased the 50ES. I luv the 50ES and Zombie is reporting it to be a nice upgrade too.
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post #57 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 02:23 PM
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Zombie -- Is the 3D on the 50ES that much better than everything else, especially in the "pop out" arena? Here's what Kraine had to say:

"Effects of spurts: Rapunzel
Just launch the Rapunzel 3D disc in your player and wait for the generic launch with the disc menu and in the background the release of sky lanterns and you will understand the concept of gushing trying to catch the balls floating all around you! SONY HW50ES is a 3D projector and it excellent in this area, it will make you want to buy and test everything that exists in BR 3D on the market just for the Visual pleasure it provides."

Also, when you get a chance, would you give us your opinion of the 3D black level.

Thanks
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post #58 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 03:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Todd Schnell View Post

How far away was the recording device from the projector?

I recorded the buzzing sound on an iPhone 5 and held it less than inch away from the built in sensor. I tried it at different locations on the sensor side and found this spot to be the best spot for having a clear recording. Just so everyone knows the buzzing is audible from as far back as 12 feet.
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Here's some initial impressions I'll add to the first few pages.

HW30 vs HW50 - Image sharpness with RC=OFF

1. The HW30 and HW50 appear very similar when RC is turned off. The pixel structure is similar to last year. It's going to vary based on different samples, but very close nonetheless. Neither have the defined pixel structure as seen on the 5010, W7000 or current JVC's.

2. If folks were here with me looking at these side by side, I think most would agree on a 142" screen, that the Sony's would be the seen as optically softer (no software enhancements) than the other models from JVC, Epson and BQ. The RC helps reverse that perception. When used in moderation, it's a nice enhancement for this projector. With it set to the minimum in 2D, the positives out-weigh the negative since most folks eyes are going to be drawn to the perceived increase in sharpness.

However, we can't ignore though that it applies the effect across the entire image, so certain movies with strong film grain might be affected. I have to watch 'Road Warrior' later on BD which has strong grain, I'm curious to see how the RC performs here.

Optical Sharpness Sony vs JVC

1. The current RS45/RS55 (no-eshift) are optically sharper than the HW30 and HW50 (without the RC) if we are inspecting each system at the pixel level. Even the entry JVC has a very good lens which resolves a well defined pixel grid from edge to edge. My particular RS55 is exceptional in this regard, A+ lens copy.

HW30 vs. HW50 - 3D comparison

1. The HW50 is brighter. I should be able to get some 3D lumen measurements tonight while the lamp is still new.

2. Motion flow in 3D works as good as it did before in the HW30. Some will remember I was quite vocal in a positive way about the FI in 3D and the quality processing here continues to look good.

3. Crosstalk- Very similar, and possibly a hair better than the HW30. I have to get some 'through the glasses' screenshots later, I've been too busy playing around with 2D content. The majority of folks are going to be very happy with the overall 3D performance. The key ingredient is the RC in 3D. It's does a great job of sharpening up animations in 3D and combined with the FI, it's looks good. I wish the flicker was a bit more subdued (I can always detect it compared to the 3D DLP's) but it's not likely to bother unless you are conscious of flicker or have been tainted by 3D DLP's abilities to produce a rock solid image.

HW50 Contrast performance

1. Definitely an improvement over the HW30. Not night and day, but the 142" 2.8HP is very unforgiving for the black floor. 1st ten minutes of Underworld Evolution are a benchmark, there isn't a whole lot the iris can do here. I would say it's similar to the 5010 now, but will need to stack the HW50 and upcoming 5020 to be fair here on the comment.

2. Bright and mixed contrast scenes look great overall, no concerns here. The DI works well and was generally undetectable.

3. HW50 vs.the RS55 with Dark sci-fi / Native contrast - None of the current models are quite the same as the RS55 @ -13 if were looking for that top level of black floor performance. We can't take everything away from JVC and the native contrast of this projector is still phenomenal and is in a class of it's own. Having said that, the majority of new owners should be quite happy with the performance of the HW50.

RC vs. E-shift

1. The reality creative is a clever sharpening technique. I think they went too high with the default settings, but it's going to elicit big 'WOW's when it's first seen. It's quite dramatic. When turned down, it's a nice sharpening trick to fool the eye that the image is sharper than it really is. All the sharpening techniques have some artifacts, but to what degree? The RC can make rough-shot of any noise when used with the default settings, it has to be used in moderation to balance it's effect vs. bringing unwanted artifacts into the image

2. The RC and e-shift are very different, but attempting to achieve the same things. Make 1080P content look better than it really is on a large screen. The 142" is unforgiving. Sitting close makes an even tougher audience when comparing these processes.

If we are praising the RC based on the initial impressions, we have to give equal accolades to JVC's E-shift technique. My first impression is that the e-shift does it with more finesse than the RC. It's more subtle and natural due to the increase in pixel density. Both have their appeal which we'll look at more closely soon. The RC is a good addition to the all-ready solid HW30 platform. It was something that was quite necessary to stay competitive.

We will continue to explore the RC vs. E-shift 1 vs. E-shift 2.





Sony HW50 Overall - This is a nice projector for the price point. I liked my HW30 and this HW50 is a good upgrade. Better brightness, Sharpness (due to the RC) and very good 3D. I do wish it had the power lens and native optical sharpness of the VW95 lens, but that might not be possible at this price point. We do need to investigate the buzzing in 3D mode as I can definitely hear it during the movie.

Of course there are still a number of upcoming models which can't be ignored, so we'll look at those as well when they are released.



Since this is the AV(Science) forum - we're going to continue to pick and prod at the new models and continue to compare because that is what people who are obsessed with front projectors do. smile.gif

This is a running review discussion with no specific conclusions at the end of page 4 like the typical published reviews. I encourage anyone with actual firsthand experience of the old and new models to please join in on the conversation. This is what made the last shootout such a success, great input from the AVS enthusiasts.
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post #60 of 8971 Old 10-21-2012, 03:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deja Vu View Post

Zombie -- Is the 3D on the 50ES that much better than everything else, especially in the "pop out" arena? Here's what Kraine had to say:

"Effects of spurts: Rapunzel

Just launch the Rapunzel 3D disc in your player and wait for the generic launch with the disc menu and in the background the release of sky lanterns and you will understand the concept of gushing trying to catch the balls floating all around you! SONY HW50ES is a 3D projector and it excellent in this area, it will make you want to buy and test everything that exists in BR 3D on the market just for the Visual pleasure it provides."
Also, when you get a chance, would you give us your opinion of the 3D black level.

Thanks

I watched my favorite benchmark, 1st ten minutes of Underworld Evolution. Overall a progressive upgrade to the HW30, better and now more similar to the 5010, but still not quite the same as my RS55.

3D - I ended up preferring the 5010's 3D last year to the HW30, mainly due to the sharpness. I found the HW30 a bit dull in 3D that even the Darbee couldn't really make up for. I like the RC in 3D more than in 2D mode, it's looks good and is equally as sharp as the 5010 is now in 3D mode.

We should get the 5020 sometime soon and will try to give more feedback once I see both on the same screen with the same content.

The W7000 is still a force to be dealt with, the naturally razor sharp image + completely ghost free / flicker free 3D PQ quality needs some comparison to the HW50 when I get time. Overall though, the HW50 3D is very good. smile.gif
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