Projector Mini-Shootout Thread - Page 487 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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Old 06-14-2016, 09:27 AM - Thread Starter
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I just pre-ordered the updated XBox One with the UHD / HDR support. I have no real need for the Panasonic and for less $$, this will potentially have more utility and a few games to play in between. Mainly the driving games - any FPS is on a PC with mouse / keyboard.

They are due on August 31st. Kudos to Microsoft for thinking smart and trying to take advantage of an emerging market. They will be banking on the folks who are stumbling at Sony and cannot figure out what do with their UHD capable devices. The number of different attempts so far is both comical and sad at the same time.

They recently announced yet another UHD streaming service which is only for the TV's. And completely abandoned the 2 UHD streaming devices that were pushed with the 4K projectors. That is a bit infuriating in itself considering the cost of the units upon release. And $30 watered down UHD movies without HD audio.

It's like they have islands of companies working under the same name but with completely different goals. (Movie studio / Projector Market / TV's,) etc.

Please JVC / Epson stay out of the movie / TV / content streaming business...
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Old 06-24-2016, 10:53 AM - Thread Starter
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I know folks are getting excited for the upcoming Epson 5040 but just a few reality checks that will be curious to see how it plays out once Cine4home does the first preview. The reporting media close to Epson will be filled with 'OMG - best picture ever' but we've been down that road many times and always prefer to wait for the info from our trusted sources.


Lumen output - Epson has been stuck on that odd lumen rating that has no relevance to D65. The 5030's advertised #'s are off by a mile compared to real measurements at D65. Are they really going to be able to crank out 1800+ D65 lumens and 'outshine' their laser model by almost a factor of 2?

Color panel uniformity - Panasonic and Epson were previously in a battle for honors of worst panel uniformity. hide those 10-50 IRE partterns.. Is this a new LCD panel that can make a noticeable difference from it's predecessors?

Contrast - typical for the 5030 was around 5000:1 at mid throw and the iris didn't do much. What to expect for the 5040? Can they double it? triple it?

Noise - 5030's makes a heck of racket in high lamp mode, hopefully they made some major progress in this area.

Fill factor - 5030's LCD is one where I could see the occasional SDE @ 14 feet from my 142". Any changes here? I know the e-shift will mask it but want to see how it looks in 1080P non-shifted mode.

3D - 2016 JVC's surpassed the 5030's ability for x-talk, how will it perform on the new models?


I think it's great they are releasing something new that has current features in this price range. I'm sure the big question in the fall will be 'Epson 5040 vs. RS400'. Since Epson's prices are generally fixed, I am guessing JVC will do another 'pre-order' price this year which is a quite the bargain for those that participate in it.

Also, what is Sony going to do with the HW65 in this price range? Replace it with something similar? Their only major, remaining advantage over JVC and Epson is the low lag time.
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Old 06-24-2016, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post
I know folks are getting excited for the upcoming Epson 5040 but just a few reality checks that will be curious to see how it plays out once Cine4home does the first preview. The reporting media close to Epson will be filled with 'OMG - best picture ever' but we've been down that road many times and always prefer to wait for the info from our trusted sources.


Lumen output - Epson has been stuck on that odd lumen rating that has no relevance to D65. The 5030's advertised #'s are off by a mile compared to real measurements at D65. Are they really going to be able to crank out 1800+ D65 lumens and 'outshine' their laser model by almost a factor of 2?

Color panel uniformity - Panasonic and Epson were previously in a battle for honors of worst panel uniformity. hide those 10-50 IRE partterns.. Is this a new LCD panel that can make a noticeable difference from it's predecessors?

Contrast - typical for the 5030 was around 5000:1 at mid throw and the iris didn't do much. What to expect for the 5040? Can they double it? triple it?

Noise - 5030's makes a heck of racket in high lamp mode, hopefully they made some major progress in this area.

Fill factor - 5030's LCD is one where I could see the occasional SDE @ 14 feet from my 142". Any changes here? I know the e-shift will mask it but want to see how it looks in 1080P non-shifted mode.

3D - 2016 JVC's surpassed the 5030's ability for x-talk, how will it perform on the new models?


I think it's great they are releasing something new that has current features in this price range. I'm sure the big question in the fall will be 'Epson 5040 vs. RS400'. Since Epson's prices are generally fixed, I am guessing JVC will do another 'pre-order' price this year which is a quite the bargain for those that participate in it.

Also, what is Sony going to do with the HW65 in this price range? Replace it with something similar? Their only major, remaining advantage over JVC and Epson is the low lag time.
Great list. Pixel structure is one thing I've noticed in the past. Hopefully they've improved that. And motion handling, which seemed to improve in the last year or two, due to the firmware update they did.

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Old 06-24-2016, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post
I know folks are getting excited for the upcoming Epson 5040 but just a few reality checks that will be curious to see how it plays out once Cine4home does the first preview. The reporting media close to Epson will be filled with 'OMG - best picture ever' but we've been down that road many times and always prefer to wait for the info from our trusted sources.


Lumen output - Epson has been stuck on that odd lumen rating that has no relevance to D65. The 5030's advertised #'s are off by a mile compared to real measurements at D65. Are they really going to be able to crank out 1800+ D65 lumens and 'outshine' their laser model by almost a factor of 2?

Color panel uniformity - Panasonic and Epson were previously in a battle for honors of worst panel uniformity. hide those 10-50 IRE partterns.. Is this a new LCD panel that can make a noticeable difference from it's predecessors?

Contrast - typical for the 5030 was around 5000:1 at mid throw and the iris didn't do much. What to expect for the 5040? Can they double it? triple it?

Noise - 5030's makes a heck of racket in high lamp mode, hopefully they made some major progress in this area.

Fill factor - 5030's LCD is one where I could see the occasional SDE @ 14 feet from my 142". Any changes here? I know the e-shift will mask it but want to see how it looks in 1080P non-shifted mode.

3D - 2016 JVC's surpassed the 5030's ability for x-talk, how will it perform on the new models?


I think it's great they are releasing something new that has current features in this price range. I'm sure the big question in the fall will be 'Epson 5040 vs. RS400'. Since Epson's prices are generally fixed, I am guessing JVC will do another 'pre-order' price this year which is a quite the bargain for those that participate in it.

Also, what is Sony going to do with the HW65 in this price range? Replace it with something similar? Their only major, remaining advantage over JVC and Epson is the low lag time.
having owned a couple of previous epsons and now a couple of jvcs…. I've got a little bit of respect for epson…but also know full well what the jvcs are capable off….

bang for buck, I found the previous epsons incredible. and look thats probably going to be hard to beat. and for those on a budget am sure a very viable option will remain….warranty is another one….my epson had a 3 year warranty INCLUDING the bulb…which was pretty amazing. not sure they will repeat or any other brand has anything similar at the price range.

flexibility, of installation too the espon was king …in my setup anyways with its zoom range. the jvc second and the sony a bit borderline… though these things might change.

new optics, am pretty wrapped to read epson has upgraded its optics with all glass… this will help no end…probably another serious challenge to sony who in my opinion has been getting away with sub par optics for just about one enough with their lower range product.

light engine and reliability, one achilles heel with the epson though has been their light engine I do hope they have done something there, my first epson it went to the grave on just that…and there was really no fix apart from replacing light engines and putting refurbed average light engines into the unit wasn't really good enough each had their issues… and replacement with new was all that helped. reliability really an issue with epsons…that 3 year warranty sure helps, both my units made their fair share of trips to the doctor…and while service was always prompt and friendly….I notice my local doctor for them has shut up shop and I always wondered what life would be like post warranty ? my last jvc had no issue to be attended to in the 3 or so years I owned it. my x7000 first unit was really a DOA with so many issues I can only imagine it was an early escapee of their QA/QC systems… service from jvc was second to none though and the replacement unit has been faultless !

screen door, on the epsons not as bad as previous 720p LCDs though still not in the league of the jvc….I do wonder if something addressed with in this new series or they going to just rely on e-shift I wonder ? the jvc are amazing in this regard though e-shift or not for my use anyways

3D indeed was excellent with the last series epson…certainly better than the jvc x35 I owned after…but yes the current range of jvc has surpassed ! no question !

light output, the epsons I suspect like previous models will win here…but at what cost. my last two espons were really only accurate on eco low lamp setting…. the jvcs really rein supreme here low output or high,

Iris, the last epsons … the iris was never manually adjustable like jvc have. so can't really tweak to optimise for output… the auto iris on the epsons was quite noisy … not really useable is actually my surmise… as would distract quite a bit…am not sure this is something they will improve with the new series….but jvc have this mastered … the dual iris and an auto iris that works away seamlessly

black levels, i really don't car what anyone says here…. but I saw a clear and very obvious unmistakable jump up in black levels going from the epson to the jvc. and this even in my lounge room setting ! which does have good light control but is far from black hole conditions ! so if epson take a jump on jvc in black levels man I would say they would really need to pull a rabbit out the hat here…a bloody big one… !

at end of it I agree with you zombie there will be a lot of hype….look good on epson quite frankly… like they did with 3D they are a conservative company…but a giant ! and what they come up will I am sure will work….but there will be compromises …. kind of compromises you have to make to pull something in within a cost.

I have absolutely no doubt this will win a lot with the price point

the big question though remains on their laser model….will it stay with e - shift for 4k …. I suspect it will. will it gain light output …will it gain like its little brothers full HDR bt2020 support … suspect it will .. this is probably the real jvc/sony challenger ! the world doesnt sit still, can't hold back the pace of progress
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Old 06-25-2016, 10:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Epson is really sticking to their guns here on the lumen rating.

I have been difficult on this topic but it's only because it's been so far off from D65, especially for the 5030.

I'm anxious to see the real calibrated lumens and what hit they will take with the WCG filter.



I just took a closer look at the MSRP, so 3K for the white version and 4K for the black version?

A $1000 difference for color change? The ISF certification is relatively meaningless so that leaves 1 year extra warranty and the ceiling mount.

The white model as in the past will have WAF so that's a good thing.

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Old 06-25-2016, 10:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Wow I just realized over 900K views on this thread - one of the highest on this sub-forum in a while.

Thank you to everyone who has contributed over the years.
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Old 06-25-2016, 01:04 PM
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Wow I just realized over 900K views on this thread - one of the highest on this sub-forum in a while.

Thank you to everyone who has contributed over the years.
Congratulations thread starter! 97,510 more and it will be 1M!
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Old 06-25-2016, 03:06 PM
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I just took a closer look at the MSRP, so 3K for the white version and 4K for the black version?

A $1000 difference for color change? The ISF certification is relatively meaningless so that leaves 1 year extra warranty and the ceiling mount.
IIRC the Pro Cinemas come with a lamp too. FWIW, this is basically the same as the difference between an RS500 and an RS600.

I'm also not sure what all the swooning is for, these are all right in the ballpark of the RS400 price wise. They've got some big shoes to fill if an LCD wants to go toe to toe with a great LCoS.
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Old 06-25-2016, 04:43 PM - Thread Starter
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I thought so too on the lamp, but it wasn't in any of the announcements I read. Just the ceiling mount + extra warranty. We'll find out soon i'm sure.

http://www.epson.com/alf_upload/pdfs...brightness.pdf

who exactly are the 'committee of display experts' that came up with this for a home theater projector? We have a standard, it's D65.
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Old 06-25-2016, 04:53 PM
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Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post

I just took a closer look at the MSRP, so 3K for the white version and 4K for the black version?

A $1000 difference for color change? The ISF certification is relatively meaningless so that leaves 1 year extra warranty and the ceiling mount.

The white model as in the past will have WAF so that's a good thing.
Black spray paint is pretty cheap these days.

Didn't the 6xxx version also include a vertical stretch mode for anamorphic lenses that the 5xxx version lacked? Does anyone know if that's changed with these new units?
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Old 06-25-2016, 05:37 PM
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I thought so too on the lamp, but it wasn't in any of the announcements I read. Just the ceiling mount + extra warranty. We'll find out soon i'm sure.

http://www.epson.com/alf_upload/pdfs...brightness.pdf

who exactly are the 'committee of display experts' that came up with this for a home theater projector? We have a standard, it's D65.
dunno... if they are talking light output...well we have the smpte's recommendations ...

ps the upper model epson I had .... did have a thx mode the lower didnt ... was handy out of box and to be honest in calibration was actually as found pretty close to the calibration so useful for some I imagine.

yes there was the scope option as well. no idea on the newer models if follow the same line.

re the white / black there is always plastic coating/vinyl wrap so not permanent.

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Old 06-25-2016, 05:38 PM
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Black spray paint is pretty cheap these days.

Didn't the 6xxx version also include a vertical stretch mode for anamorphic lenses that the 5xxx version lacked? Does anyone know if that's changed with these new units?
I mentioned that earlier in these threads. Black case, 3 year warranty and stretch mode were the only differences between the 6030 and 5030, excluding the extras that came with the 6030

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Old 06-25-2016, 10:06 PM
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http://www.epson.com/alf_upload/pdfs...brightness.pdf

who exactly are the 'committee of display experts' that came up with this for a home theater projector? We have a standard, it's D65.
I've seen this brochure from Epson for a couple of years, but never paid much attention until just now. If you look a the end of the FAQ section there a link to this webpage. This page is a weak attempt to explain why "Color Brightness" is an important new metric alongside the older "White Brightness" or D65 measurement. The whole page is full of overblown and outdated examples. It looks like this page is so meaningless that Epson didn't even bother to update it with LS10000 measurements after 2 years now. If you're into hearing PhDs say next to nothing for 6 minutes, just click on the link that looks like a 3D gragh.

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Old 06-26-2016, 06:42 AM
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I've seen this brochure from Epson for a couple of years, but never paid much attention until just now. If you look a the end of the FAQ section there a link to this webpage. This page is a weak attempt to explain why "Color Brightness" is an important new metric alongside the older "White Brightness" or D65 measurement. The whole page is full of overblown and outdated examples. It looks like this page is so meaningless that Epson didn't even bother to update it with LS10000 measurements after 2 years now. If you're into hearing PhDs say next to nothing for 6 minutes, just click on the link that looks like a 3D gragh.
Ahh...but the maths is good my friend, the maths is good....and that is all you need now days.
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Old 06-26-2016, 08:40 AM - Thread Starter
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@Soulnight

Do you folks closely watch the content that you use to plot these graphs from the Epson thread?

After months of A/B stack, split source comparisons - I can quickly summarize the reality of the 25K MSRP Sony VW1100 which has similar native and better ANSI than the VW665 vs. the JVC RS600.

Go watch any movie with the typical low APL scene and it's clear as day the advantage the JVC has over the Sony in a velvet treated room in these scenes. There is only so much the DI can do.

It was easy to see in my particular setup and one of the primary reasons I sold it. Keep in mind the large price difference of the JVC's vs. the 4K Sony's in the US which makes the Sony a more difficult choice considering that some of the overall PQ features favor the JVC.


you are more than welcome to post your comparison discussions here.
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Old 06-29-2016, 10:07 AM - Thread Starter
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Kung Fu Panda 3D BD - Highly recommended!

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/kung-fu-...?skuId=4901166

One of the few BD review sites that deep dives into the 3D performance.

http://www.cinemablend.com/new/3D-Or...et-108807.html

Tons of potential x-talk here, JVC kills with this BD. lesser 3D capable projectors - say hello to the ghosts for us.
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Old 06-29-2016, 02:48 PM
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Kung Fu Panda 3D BD - Highly recommended!

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/kung-fu-...?skuId=4901166

One of the few BD review sites that deep dives into the 3D performance.

http://www.cinemablend.com/new/3D-Or...et-108807.html

Tons of potential x-talk here, JVC kills with this BD. lesser 3D capable projectors - say hello to the ghosts for us.

I saw this tonight on my JVC rs400 it was stunning in 3d!
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Old 06-29-2016, 03:04 PM
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Kung Fu Panda 3D BD - Highly recommended!

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/kung-fu-...?skuId=4901166

One of the few BD review sites that deep dives into the 3D performance.

http://www.cinemablend.com/new/3D-Or...et-108807.html

Tons of potential x-talk here, JVC kills with this BD. lesser 3D capable projectors - say hello to the ghosts for us.
Would I be inferring correctly that your current JVC has, all things considered, been your most satisfying projector?
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Old 06-29-2016, 04:18 PM
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Epson is really sticking to their guns here on the lumen rating.

I have been difficult on this topic but it's only because it's been so far off from D65, especially for the 5030.

I'm anxious to see the real calibrated lumens and what hit they will take with the WCG filter.




I just took a closer look at the MSRP, so 3K for the white version and 4K for the black version?

A $1000 difference for color change? The ISF certification is relatively meaningless so that leaves 1 year extra warranty and the ceiling mount.

The white model as in the past will have WAF so that's a good thing.
I have treated manufacturer's lumen and contrast spec's as " un-substantiated rumors " ever since the Optoma H79 days. I much prefer independent reviewers such as yourself, with a good light meter and other test equipment.
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Epson is really sticking to their guns here on the lumen rating.
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I have treated manufacturer's lumen and contrast spec's as " un-substantiated rumors " ever since the Optoma H79 days. I much prefer independent reviewers such as yourself, with a good light meter and other test equipment.
Hmm. I wonder how these new Epsons will compare to the RS400.

I was pretty confident yesterday about buying a RS400 but now I'm not so sure.
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Old 06-29-2016, 06:31 PM
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Hmm. I wonder how these new Epsons will compare to the RS400.

I was pretty confident yesterday about buying a RS400 but now I'm not so sure.
It's not going to get to the same level of native contrast. If Epson could just barely do it with the LS10000 (but no where near the RS500/RS600) with their LCoQ panels, they won't be able to do it with their LCD panels. It also will very more than likely be many hundreds of lumens less bright. We'll also have to see how this lens stacks up to the JVCs which is quite amazing for the price at which the RS400 sells and it's also going to need to fix the eshift issues that plagued the LS10000, ie an inherent softness that's not there in JVCs implementation. 3D is also near perfect on the JVC too, surpassing any of Epson's previous LCD projectors in crosstalk performance. There's a lot of hurdles that need to be overcome. When you factor in the street price of an RS400 is only a couple hundred dollars more, Epson needs to accomplish a lot with this model if it wants to take away sales from JVC.
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Old 06-29-2016, 10:08 PM
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It's not going to get to the same level of native contrast. If Epson could just barely do it with the LS10000 (but no where near the RS500/RS600) with their LCoQ panels, they won't be able to do it with their LCD panels. It also will very more than likely be many hundreds of lumens less bright. We'll also have to see how this lens stacks up to the JVCs which is quite amazing for the price at which the RS400 sells and it's also going to need to fix the eshift issues that plagued the LS10000, ie an inherent softness that's not there in JVCs implementation. 3D is also near perfect on the JVC too, surpassing any of Epson's previous LCD projectors in crosstalk performance. There's a lot of hurdles that need to be overcome. When you factor in the street price of an RS400 is only a couple hundred dollars more, Epson needs to accomplish a lot with this model if it wants to take away sales from JVC.
Really? "Plagued"? Wouldn't a better choice of words been "crippled" or "doomed"?
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Old 06-29-2016, 10:37 PM
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Originally Posted by john2910 View Post
I saw this tonight on my JVC rs400 it was stunning in 3d!
It is. Even handles SBS and TB great.
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Old 06-30-2016, 03:08 AM
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I've looked on the numerous new Epson threads but can't seem to find any mention that these new models are using the same reflective LCD panes that the LS10000 uses. I don't know if they're the exact same panels or newer ones for these new models, but if they're RLCD then they will have a better pixel fill factor then the older LCD panels, along with rear cooling of the panels and a sealed light path:

http://hometheaterreview.com/epson-a...ement-and-hdr/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Epson
Following in the footsteps of the higher-end LS10000 and LS9600, all four of these new Pro and Home Cinema models use the same 3LCD Reflective technology and feature 4K signal input and pixel-shifting 4K Enhancement technology--at much lower price points ranging from $2,699 to $3,999
http://www.cine4home.de/tests/projek...10000_test.htm

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cine4home


(LS10000) Also new is a complete light engine and the underlying panel technology: After LCOS model Epson has its LCDs now virtually mirrored and this evolved into "Reflective LCDs". The advantages are obvious: Improved fill rate, increased luminous efficiency, optimized contrast, faster response, easier cooling, better dust protection, longer life expectancy, etc, etc ...
Looking at the LS10000 threads that have comparison images, you can see that JVC still has a better fill factor so less SDE than the RLCD panels.

So these new Epsons could be more than a step change to their previous models. Of course we need to wait and see what they're like for real with hands on reviews from people we trust (like Cine4home) to get the real details and performance to see if they are the good value they seem to be, especially actual native CR, lumens at D65 and if the DI is usable, plus of course SDE improvement. If they perform much like an LS10000 but with a lamp rather than laser, then we will be in for a treat IMHO, but still behind the JVC entry level model.

Having said that, during split screen demos with L10000, 4k Sony (520 IIRC) and JVC X5000, I preferred the LS10000 overall. So if that translates to these new Epsons, they could pick up a lot of sales.
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Originally Posted by elmalloc
Who says Cameron is "right" and why do we care about him so much - lol!

I trust Gary Lightfoot more than James Cameron.

Last edited by Gary Lightfoot; 06-30-2016 at 03:12 AM.
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Old 06-30-2016, 04:19 AM
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On one of the other Epson threads, Ellebob just pointed out to me that these new models aren't using RLCD, just updated LCD as shown on the website:

http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/j...&UseCookie=yes

Bummer...

Can only hope HTR are right, and the Epson website is using cut and paste from the blurb for the earlier models. We'll have to wait for Cine4home to rip one apart I guess...

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Originally Posted by elmalloc
Who says Cameron is "right" and why do we care about him so much - lol!

I trust Gary Lightfoot more than James Cameron.

Last edited by Gary Lightfoot; 06-30-2016 at 04:27 AM.
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Old 06-30-2016, 06:54 AM - Thread Starter
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We'll have to wait and see, i'm sure Cine4home will do his full tear down as soon as he gets it. Maybe it would make sense since the 5030 panels are so outdated, it probably would have been a monumental task to get them up to 2016 specs.

I'd like to see more tests with the LS10K / Sony VW665 and the JVC's for UHD. These frames were compared between the JVC / VW665 and the LS10K.

JVC UHD / Epson UHD

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/177013

JVC UHD / Sony UHD (this one is surprising - where is the 15K MSRP value here?)

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/175443

Sony UHD / Epson UHD

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/175335

imo I think the JVC renders it the best of the 3 but that's just my preference. UHD on the JVC RS600 looks remarkable, they did quite a good job as the first one out with the full HDMI chipset.

Last edited by zombie10k; 06-30-2016 at 06:57 AM.
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Old 06-30-2016, 06:57 AM
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In those shots, it seems like there is a little more warmer/color saturation with the Epson and Sony, but less resolution.


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Old 06-30-2016, 07:14 AM
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Because of the HTR comments saying they were using the same reflective tech as the LS10000, I've been trying to find what the pixel fill ratio is. I couldn't find a percentage, but found some similar images/comparisons of a boat that showed the JVC has a better fill ratio so less SDE. Those images certainly make the Sony look less sharp than I would expect though. Maybe that's down to the lens?

Quote:
Originally Posted by elmalloc
Who says Cameron is "right" and why do we care about him so much - lol!

I trust Gary Lightfoot more than James Cameron.
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Old 06-30-2016, 07:29 AM
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Yes, it's been speculated the lens is the issue. I would be curious how the 1100ES with its superior lens would resolve the detail, but zombie could probably comment since he used to have one and he still preferred the RS600 if I recall.


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Old 06-30-2016, 08:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zombie10k View Post
We'll have to wait and see, i'm sure Cine4home will do his full tear down as soon as he gets it. Maybe it would make sense since the 5030 panels are so outdated, it probably would have been a monumental task to get them up to 2016 specs.

I'd like to see more tests with the LS10K / Sony VW665 and the JVC's for UHD. These frames were compared between the JVC / VW665 and the LS10K.

JVC UHD / Epson UHD

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/177013

JVC UHD / Sony UHD (this one is surprising - where is the 15K MSRP value here?)

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/175443

Sony UHD / Epson UHD

http://screenshotcomparison.com/comparison/175335

imo I think the JVC renders it the best of the 3 but that's just my preference. UHD on the JVC RS600 looks remarkable, they did quite a good job as the first one out with the full HDMI chipset.
That's a great comparison. The only thing missing is motion handling, which is a big part of the picture ( no pun intended ). Coming from 10+ years of watching DLP, I can say I've gotten to like the motion on the JVC. This is one thing that can only be seen in person, unfortunately.

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