Projector Mini-Shootout Thread - Page 558 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #16711 of 16723 Old 05-26-2017, 10:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike Garrett View Post
Brightness matched the RS400/420 they are around the same native contrast of the 45/46.
See my previous post. "Close" is a good word, but unfortunately they gimped it too much in my opinion. It's a bit of a downgrade even compared to the previous bottom end unit. Though I suppose you could make the argument that the extra brightness makes up for the decrease in contrast performance. It really makes the RS520 a worthy purchase over it if the buyer can afford it. Though I suppose JVC did this purposefully to fix the "mistake" they'd made for a few years previous; making contrast performance of the higher end units to close to the bottom end unit.
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post #16712 of 16723 Old 05-27-2017, 11:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Seegs108 View Post
Yeah, it's closer but still worse off on the RS400. According to cine4home at around a 1000 lumens the RS46 will do 22000:1 vs 16000:1, at around 850 lumens the RS46 will be doing 27000:1 vs 23000 and with the iris clamped on the RS400 you're at 32000:1 vs 38000:1 on the RS46 at a lumen output comparable iris setting. With the RS46's iris clamped you get 46000:1. So while it can go about 600-700 lumens brighter, it seems when brightness matched it's never going to touch the RS46 for contrast. I think they gimped the low end unit too much, but I understand why.
Although it is annoying psychologically to lose that contrast, 32000:1 compared to 46000:1 is not much, it's almost a drop in the bucket. You could see the difference, but I'd imagine it'd be pretty hard to discern, probably equivalent to 1 - 2 steps on the JVC IRIS settings. I think the problem is the psychology of losing anything, who wants to lose

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post #16713 of 16723 Old Yesterday, 02:19 AM
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Originally Posted by coderguy View Post
Although it is annoying psychologically to lose that contrast, 32000:1 compared to 46000:1 is not much, it's almost a drop in the bucket. You could see the difference, but I'd imagine it'd be pretty hard to discern, probably equivalent to 1 - 2 steps on the JVC IRIS settings. I think the problem is the psychology of losing anything, who wants to lose
Yep, to really see a noticeable difference, you have to double the difference, so a 1/3rd difference is is not going to show much to the eye, but the number appears big.

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post #16714 of 16723 Old Yesterday, 07:13 AM
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Originally Posted by madshi View Post
It would probably require RGB lasers to get enough brightness. Or maybe it would be possible to stack 2 LED light sources?
The DPI 4k insight DLPs did dual stacked LEDs a while ago so definitely possible. Cost is the real question.

Note for stacked DMDs you can't use XPR. So that means you will need two 1.38" native 4k DMDs and a very big high quality lens to support them. Big bucks.

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post #16715 of 16723 Old Yesterday, 07:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Ruined View Post
The DPI 4k insight DLPs did dual stacked LEDs a while ago so definitely possible. Cost is the real question.

Note for stacked DMDs you can't use XPR. So that means you will need two 1.38" native 4k DMDs and a very big high quality lens to support them. Big bucks.
Maybe they will come out with a 0.9" native 4k DMD sooner or later? Of course it will have lower native contrast than 1.38", but a stacked design should much more than make up for that. To be honest, I would probably already be happy with a 1080p stacked projector. 4k would be nice, but high native on/off contrast is *so* much more important to me than the higher resolution.
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post #16716 of 16723 Old Yesterday, 08:00 AM
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Originally Posted by madshi View Post
Maybe they will come out with a 0.9" native 4k DMD sooner or later? Of course it will have lower native contrast than 1.38", but a stacked design should much more than make up for that. To be honest, I would probably already be happy with a 1080p stacked projector. 4k would be nice, but high native on/off contrast is *so* much more important to me than the higher resolution.
The problem is now making a big and expensive 1080p projector is pretty much marketing suicide, would be a niche within a niche of customers who wanted one.

1.38" DMD is already packed tight in pixel density; it essentially has the same density as a 0.67" XPR DMD (which is already criticized for contrast). So I'm not sure 0.9" native would be a good idea... Barco already has implemented a 0.9" 4k XPR based on the projectiondesign 2560x1600 1080p DLP designs, but this DMD doesn't have the 17 degree mirror tilt as it is an older DMD retrofitted with XPR - so its possible a new 0.9 XPR DMD with the 17 degree tilt could push things a bit further than the current 0.9 XPR available.

Last edited by Ruined; Yesterday at 08:04 AM.
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post #16717 of 16723 Old Yesterday, 09:16 AM - Thread Starter
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We watched Logan last night. wow was this a violent movie. I didn't not expect that ending.... ATMOS track sounded excellent. Overall color looked very good, not reference which is why you may want to check out the Noir version. First 'B&W' UHD disk i've owned and the JVC nails the greyfield in all APL ranges.





Also high recommend to pick up the Great wall 3D, very intense 3D throughout the entire movie. The color gamut does look excellent in HDR so this could be a double dip if you want some 2D/3D eye candle demo material.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/The-Great-Wa...-/162510121228



We also had a 2nd viewing of Swordmaster 3D. 3D is alive and well in china and I love the 3D in this movie. another high recommend especially fans of Crouching Tiger genre.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Sword-Master...-/182550568111


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post #16718 of 16723 Old Yesterday, 09:56 AM
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Hey Zombie, what did you think of the bass/audio in great wall and is the 3d version region free?

JVC CMD Vertical Banding: Affects all currently shipping lamp based JVC Projectors
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post #16719 of 16723 Old Yesterday, 10:17 AM - Thread Starter
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this is the one I have, it's region A + ATMOS

http://www.ebay.com/itm/the-Great-Wa.../272681477802?

I agree with Ralph's 100 rating, it's one of the best ATMOS tracks i've heard. Both the UHD and 3D versions are excellent demo material, especially the battle scenes. The 18"s were pushing hard this weekend between Logan and Great Wall.
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post #16720 of 16723 Old Yesterday, 09:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Ruined View Post
1.38" DMD is already packed tight in pixel density; it essentially has the same density as a 0.67" XPR DMD (which is already criticized for contrast).
By my calculation a 8M pixel 1.38" chip should have about half the density as a 4M pixel 0.67" chip, being 4 times the area.

--Darin
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post #16721 of 16723 Old Today, 10:57 AM - Thread Starter
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As the price goes up, the contrast gets better and top UHD65 model is best to avoid RBE. Not sure how much contrast is gained due to typical PR-inflated contrast numbers!

Optoma UHD65 - $3299 (black)
Certified true 4K UHD by CTA (exceeds 8 million active pixels, double the pixel amount of Epson/JVC eShift)
Input resolution 3840x2160
Native resolution 2716x1528
Composite resolution 5432x3056
2200 lumens (lamp)
1200000:1 dynamic contrast
RGBRGB color wheel for reduced RBE
No 3D
BT2020 tone-mapped down to rec709 colorspace
HDR10

Double the detail without triple the price

Are you planning on picking this up when it's released in June?
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post #16722 of 16723 Old Today, 03:19 PM
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Are you planning on picking this up when it's released in June?
Nope.

Buying around mar/apr next year. So far only projector definitely in the running is Epson Ls10500. But I am a little reluctant to spend 8000 on something that will depreciate super fast due to only being native 1080p and not having the official 4k uhd logo. We'll see. Would be nice if there was another decent 4k-ish laser/led available under 10k. Epson is the only one right now without some major flaw. Would love to see some DLP LED competition but the x12000 is too far from ideal to consider.

If I did buy another lamp pj I wouldn't spend more than 4000.

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post #16723 of 16723 Old Today, 03:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darinp View Post
By my calculation a 8M pixel 1.38" chip should have about half the density as a 4M pixel 0.67" chip, being 4 times the area.

--Darin
Yep I miscalculated. So this 1.38" DMD is probably capable of a very nice picture... Lens cost is main barrier.

Mainly seems to be used by over 50k range projectors.
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