Projector position and pre-wire question for new construction - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 16 Old 10-25-2012, 09:32 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
Keith Mickunas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Wylie, TX, USA
Posts: 704
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 41 Post(s)
Liked: 56
I'm building a new house with a dedicated media room that will be windowless and fully light controlled. The room is about 20' x 14', and I'm planning on putting the screen on the short wall. Initially I'll be using an RPTV, so it'll be a while before I put in a projector but I am at a point that I need to decide on the wiring location. I'm thinking of doing a constant height screen about 10' wide using a projector with lens memory like the Panasonic PT-AE8000.

I'm planning on a 16" riser of between 6-6.5 feet deep with a single step up putting the primary seating position between 12' - 13' from the screen. So my question is, where should I have them run the wiring? I was leaning towards having it about 15' back, which would still give me some leeway in placement. But now I'm wondering if perhaps placing it on a shelf at the back wall would be better. It might look nicer, put it further away from the primary seating, and allow me to mount it a little lower thus being more flexible about lens shift. Unfortunately I don't really have a lot of time to do more research on this before I finalize placement, and since it may be a year or more before I actually buy a projector it's kind of pointless to get too caught up trying to choose a specific projector model now. Is a 19' - 20' distance too far for proper light output for projectors like the Panasonic? According to Projector Central I might be looking at 13fl at that point. Is that enough in a light controlled room?

Download my IR hex codes for the Denon AVR-4810ci and other Denon receivers here.
For Logitech Harmony support, ask Logitech for the Denon receiver in the account kmickunas.

Keith Mickunas is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 16 Old 10-25-2012, 10:12 PM
AVS Special Member
 
bass addict's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: A padded room
Posts: 3,774
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 210
Well you could always wire for both positions to future proof yourself.

My take; I like the rear shelf idea. The closer you mount the projector the brighter the image, albeit at expense of CR. The rear shelf would allow you to run an HP screen and have more options for 3d (which everyone but me seems to like, lol).

For comparison I was firing an RS20 (not a light cannon by any means) from 19' away onto a 100" diagonal 1.0 screen with no issues in 2d brightness with average bulb life.

Achievement Unlocked

Psychotic Episode Averted

bass addict is offline  
post #3 of 16 Old 10-26-2012, 06:07 AM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
Keith Mickunas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Wylie, TX, USA
Posts: 704
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 41 Post(s)
Liked: 56
Well technically I'm not supposed to do any wiring myself, and it's $700 for an additional projector pre-wire. And unless electrical was already being run in that same space between the studs getting power there is also an issue if I did it myself. While being prepared would be nice, I'm better of making the decision now.

I think I will tell them to place the power outlet and projector run a few inches below the vault on the rear wall and when it comes time to buy a projector I'll just get one that works.

By the way, what is an HP screen? Hewlett-Packard? I've seen a few references to them and I don't know what the deal with them is.

Download my IR hex codes for the Denon AVR-4810ci and other Denon receivers here.
For Logitech Harmony support, ask Logitech for the Denon receiver in the account kmickunas.

Keith Mickunas is online now  
post #4 of 16 Old 10-26-2012, 09:45 AM
AVS Special Member
 
rovingtravler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Clovis, NM
Posts: 1,262
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
He is speaking about a High Power screen by da-lite. The screen has a high gain; I believe 2.0 and higher. This means if you would have 14FL of light on a 1.0 gain screen you would have 28FL of light on a 2.0 gain screen. The only issue is a projector needs to be as close to centered top to bottom for the gain to work properly.

Wow on the price. I am currently building as well and my builder included the wiring and HDMI cable (of my choice) and speaker wiring in the price of the house. I guess I got a better deal than I thought.

David

"You buy a Ferrari when you want to be somebody. You buy a Lamborghini when you are somebody." - Frank Sinatra
rovingtravler is offline  
post #5 of 16 Old 10-26-2012, 10:24 AM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
Keith Mickunas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Wylie, TX, USA
Posts: 704
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 41 Post(s)
Liked: 56
Ah, thanks for the clarification on the screen, that makes sense. I assume the screen has some structure to it, almost like a lenticular lens on an RPTV, that directs the light back to the viewer and so the closer to straight on the better. I wonder how far off you can be. I'd rather not have the screen too high and I'd like the projector high enough to be out of people's way. Although with the rear seating near the back wall I guess I could put the shelf at 6' or 7' high and it won't be in the way of anyone. The room is 10' high, with a vault down to 8' on most walls, so that does affect placement of the screen.

As far as the cost, it's a bit of a mixed bag. I paid for a media wiring bundle in my contract, and for the cost of that I'm getting a lot, a total of 25 drops split between coax and ethernet, as well as wiring for two surround sound setups and stereo to the patio, plus the projector and a few other bits and pieces, and security wiring. But adding stuff ala carte is expensive. Also, they run 16ga speaker wire and CAT5e. To upgrade to CAT6 they want $1,000! But they said I could supply them 500' of speaker wire and 1000' of CAT6 and they'll use my cable. They don't discount for using my cable, but they are running additional speaker runs for the theater.

I could possibly run some stuff myself. My salesman says that's not allowed, but perhaps the builder will have a different view on that. However I know I better not try to run my own electrical in a place where it might stand out. And I really don't want to have a lot of extra wallplates for stuff I'll never use.

Download my IR hex codes for the Denon AVR-4810ci and other Denon receivers here.
For Logitech Harmony support, ask Logitech for the Denon receiver in the account kmickunas.

Keith Mickunas is online now  
post #6 of 16 Old 10-26-2012, 06:40 PM
AVS Special Member
 
rovingtravler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Clovis, NM
Posts: 1,262
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
Sounds like you are doing it right. My builder is letting me run my cable for speakers and then they will install the 12 sets of ceiling speakers for free. I am doing the Cat 6 as well. The cable and some other stuff is included too. Kind of like you I want to do this right the first time and not have to go back and redo anything after the fact. Like you I am doing a 7.2 system in the main area and a 5.1 in the master bedroom. Then all the ceiling speakers will be zoned as needed similar to you.

Are you doing a whole house surge protector in the breaker box? I would recommend it. Cheaper, easier and less hassle than doing individual ones for computers, TVs, projector, etc. etc.

David

"You buy a Ferrari when you want to be somebody. You buy a Lamborghini when you are somebody." - Frank Sinatra
rovingtravler is offline  
post #7 of 16 Old 10-26-2012, 07:30 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
Keith Mickunas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Wylie, TX, USA
Posts: 704
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 41 Post(s)
Liked: 56
I hadn't thought about the whole house surge protector. Do you know if I need to do it during construction or can I do it later?

I met with the builder today and we went over everything that is going in the house. He's going to get back to me on a dedicated circuit and ventilation for my gear closet. What I may end up doing is cutting a hole in the closet wall to the adjacent room and perhaps wire up some exhaust fans that turn on with the receiver to keep the temperature in there under control.

Download my IR hex codes for the Denon AVR-4810ci and other Denon receivers here.
For Logitech Harmony support, ask Logitech for the Denon receiver in the account kmickunas.

Keith Mickunas is online now  
post #8 of 16 Old 10-26-2012, 08:11 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 7,194
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 125 Post(s)
Liked: 341
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith Mickunas View Post

I'm building a new house with a dedicated media room that will be windowless and fully light controlled. The room is about 20' x 14', and I'm planning on putting the screen on the short wall. Initially I'll be using an RPTV, so it'll be a while before I put in a projector but I am at a point that I need to decide on the wiring location. I'm thinking of doing a constant height screen about 10' wide using a projector with lens memory like the Panasonic PT-AE8000.
I'm planning on a 16" riser of between 6-6.5 feet deep with a single step up putting the primary seating position between 12' - 13' from the screen. So my question is, where should I have them run the wiring? I was leaning towards having it about 15' back, which would still give me some leeway in placement. But now I'm wondering if perhaps placing it on a shelf at the back wall would be better. It might look nicer, put it further away from the primary seating, and allow me to mount it a little lower thus being more flexible about lens shift. Unfortunately I don't really have a lot of time to do more research on this before I finalize placement, and since it may be a year or more before I actually buy a projector it's kind of pointless to get too caught up trying to choose a specific projector model now. Is a 19' - 20' distance too far for proper light output for projectors like the Panasonic? According to Projector Central I might be looking at 13fl at that point. Is that enough in a light controlled room?

With out knowing screen size and screen gain, it is hard to pick an optimal spot, but I would say, 15' should work for just about any screen that you could fit in that room. At least any screen that you would use with a 12' to 13' viewing distance. A 20' room is a little short for two rows. I would consider building a false wall and going with an AT screen.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales
Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me: Mike@AVScience.com

Brands we sell: http://avscience.com/brands/

 

Call for B-stock projectors

Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI & many more.
Klipsch, RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Technology, MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech.

AV Science Sales 5 is online now  
post #9 of 16 Old 10-26-2012, 08:44 PM
AVS Special Member
 
rovingtravler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Clovis, NM
Posts: 1,262
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
You need to at least talk to your builder about the whole house surge protector as it goes in the breaker box and usually takes up 2-4 slots depending on one you choice, so if the box is not big enough you will have a lot of work and cost to do it later. If he puts a large enough box in the cost will be minimal and it can be done later.

David

"You buy a Ferrari when you want to be somebody. You buy a Lamborghini when you are somebody." - Frank Sinatra
rovingtravler is offline  
post #10 of 16 Old 10-27-2012, 09:25 AM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
Keith Mickunas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Wylie, TX, USA
Posts: 704
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 41 Post(s)
Liked: 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

With out knowing screen size and screen gain, it is hard to pick an optimal spot, but I would say, 15' should work for just about any screen that you could fit in that room. At least any screen that you would use with a 12' to 13' viewing distance. A 20' room is a little short for two rows. I would consider building a false wall and going with an AT screen.

One of the most frustrating problems I've had with planning all this out is most of the stuff I see shows you what you can do with the equipment you've chosen. In this case I'm choosing the equipment based on the room. I can choose a screen and projector that is suitable for the size and position of everything in my room, rather than make the size and position of everything in the room fit the equipment. After all, the room is constant, it will be there long after I die, but the equipment has a relatively short life. I won't have the house until February at the earliest, and I won't have the money to do anything probably until later next year, after the next generation of equipment comes out. So it's kind of silly and pointless to choose a projector and screen now and wire for that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rovingtravler View Post

You need to at least talk to your builder about the whole house surge protector as it goes in the breaker box and usually takes up 2-4 slots depending on one you choice, so if the box is not big enough you will have a lot of work and cost to do it later. If he puts a large enough box in the cost will be minimal and it can be done later.
From what I've seen the box is plenty big so that shouldn't be a problem. But I'll send an e-mail to my salesman asking him about it.

Download my IR hex codes for the Denon AVR-4810ci and other Denon receivers here.
For Logitech Harmony support, ask Logitech for the Denon receiver in the account kmickunas.

Keith Mickunas is online now  
post #11 of 16 Old 10-29-2012, 06:44 PM
AVS Special Member
 
rovingtravler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Clovis, NM
Posts: 1,262
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
If you do not plan to install equipment until next year you can only plan for what would you do not or what are you thinking of doing in the future. What I mean is look at the lens ratios for projectors in your price range and figure out what the best distance would be and even then go to the mid point of zoom so that you have the ability to have a projector with a different ratio. Code Guy's projector calculator or projector central are both good ones to use. The main thing I would say is you need to decide whether you are going with LCOS/SXRD or DLP as the type of screen could change. With the lower light output of a JVC you might want a da-lite high gain screen, but this means your projector needs to be about head level, which would influence where you put the outlets. The opposite for DLP. You can mount the PJ higher up and would not need a high power screen. As said before about 15 to 17 feet is a normal distance, but that does not mean it is best for you. You are correct the equipment has a shorter life than the room. So you do not want it to be too custom if you plan to upgrade... you want some flexibility. Plan it as though you are building it now with equipment and you will probably end up with equipment that is similar and everything will workout.

David

"You buy a Ferrari when you want to be somebody. You buy a Lamborghini when you are somebody." - Frank Sinatra
rovingtravler is offline  
post #12 of 16 Old 10-29-2012, 08:59 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 7,194
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 125 Post(s)
Liked: 341
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keith Mickunas View Post

One of the most frustrating problems I've had with planning all this out is most of the stuff I see shows you what you can do with the equipment you've chosen. In this case I'm choosing the equipment based on the room. I can choose a screen and projector that is suitable for the size and position of everything in my room, rather than make the size and position of everything in the room fit the equipment. After all, the room is constant, it will be there long after I die, but the equipment has a relatively short life. I won't have the house until February at the earliest, and I won't have the money to do anything probably until later next year, after the next generation of equipment comes out. So it's kind of silly and pointless to choose a projector and screen now and wire for that.
From what I've seen the box is plenty big so that shouldn't be a problem. But I'll send an e-mail to my salesman asking him about it.

You have to have some kind of starting point. Based on what size screens most people get for a 12' to 13' viewing distance, a 15' throw should work, based on what sizes, I know people buy. All of this is a guess, since I do not know your viewing habits.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales
Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me: Mike@AVScience.com

Brands we sell: http://avscience.com/brands/

 

Call for B-stock projectors

Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI & many more.
Klipsch, RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Technology, MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech.

AV Science Sales 5 is online now  
post #13 of 16 Old 11-11-2012, 10:19 AM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
Keith Mickunas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Wylie, TX, USA
Posts: 704
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 41 Post(s)
Liked: 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by rovingtravler View Post

You need to at least talk to your builder about the whole house surge protector as it goes in the breaker box and usually takes up 2-4 slots depending on one you choice, so if the box is not big enough you will have a lot of work and cost to do it later. If he puts a large enough box in the cost will be minimal and it can be done later.

I heard back from my builder on the surge protector. They want $1,000 to install it. Eeek! From what I've found online it's not a terribly complicated job, although I'd best have an electrician do it. Still, I don't think it'll cost $1,000, perhaps just $200 - $300.

Download my IR hex codes for the Denon AVR-4810ci and other Denon receivers here.
For Logitech Harmony support, ask Logitech for the Denon receiver in the account kmickunas.

Keith Mickunas is online now  
post #14 of 16 Old 11-11-2012, 03:55 PM
Senior Member
 
Ben Withrow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: NC
Posts: 311
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
I've implemented a two stage system, which from my research is the best way to go. The first stage is a whole house system that sits outside of the house-not in the breaker box. The power company, in my case, Progress Energy installed it for a nominal charge of $50 or less and charge about $5 bucks a month to keep it. The second stage is a good local surge protector, which you can get from the power company or buy separately. If you get it from the power company, it is a little pricey, but the warranty is very nice. I had to go with a second source due to current demands. The second one should be used for your equipment and also be used to protect your cable and phone lines as well, as they are as likely, if not more likely, to cause you grief depending on how your utilities are delivered to your house. The external setup is pretty beefy and intended to suppress huge surges to a level that is easily handled inside. You won't have to worry about squeezing anything into a box or risking it arching over to other circuits.

Ben
Ben Withrow is offline  
post #15 of 16 Old 11-11-2012, 04:53 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
Keith Mickunas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Wylie, TX, USA
Posts: 704
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 41 Post(s)
Liked: 56
That's interesting Ben, I've never considered talking to my electric company. I'll look into that.

As it is, everything comes in underground in my neighborhood, which I believe helps a lot. Also I'll have FiOS, so that's fiber to the house, which I'm sure is beneficial also. I've lived in the same area that I'm building in for 10 years now, and have yet to have any issues with lightning and haven't heard of any from my neighbors (aside from a house a few blocks away that was hit and gutted). Still better safe than sorry.

About 12 years ago, when I was in my last apartment, there was a nearby lightning strike that appeared to come in via my cable modem. My cable modem, network switch, network cards, a printer, and a stereo connected to one of the PC's were fried. The PC's were mostly ok. My TV was fine, but my TiVo's modem was fried as was the home theater receiver. And my thermostat was fried. It was weird.

Download my IR hex codes for the Denon AVR-4810ci and other Denon receivers here.
For Logitech Harmony support, ask Logitech for the Denon receiver in the account kmickunas.

Keith Mickunas is online now  
post #16 of 16 Old 11-12-2012, 08:54 PM
Senior Member
 
Ben Withrow's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: NC
Posts: 311
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
My utilities are underground as well. The power co. equipment is just before the meter.

Ben
Ben Withrow is offline  
Reply Digital Hi-End Projectors - $3,000+ USD MSRP

Tags
Panasonic Ptae8000u Hd Projector
Gear in this thread

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off