Advice needed for first time projector buyer - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 15 Old 11-05-2012, 10:03 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
wildcard011's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 49
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Hi
I've been reading these forums for almost a year now and am now finally ready to make a plunge into the projector world. I have a few questions and was hoping some of you could help answer and offer opinions. I would also like to thank the members of this forum, the amount and type of information that is shared here is just unbelievable. Unlike other audio/video equipment there are very few places one can go to physically check the projectors out in person and having access this forum is a great way to gain valuable information before making a decision.

Let me describe the bat cave
Bat cave is located in the basement. So there is very little ambient light. Its completely controlled. Its a L shaped room but the viewing is confined in the longer rectangular space. The measurements are as follows: (Pics attached)
  • L: 22 ft
  • W: 12 ft
  • H: 6.5 ft
  • Seating distance : 12ft

Here is viewing preference:
  • Screen size will be between 110" -123" 16:9 (Budget is about $1000)
  • I want the best 2D I can get. Even when watching movies in theaters I prefer to watch the 2D versions. Will take 3D as a bonus, I guess it will be fun for the kids and fun to show off to friends.
  • I do like bright image though. I have preferred LCD over PLASMA. Love the pop but again not so much that it would look unnatural. For example to give you an idea, the recent pics that Zombie posted between the 5020 and ES50, I prefer the images of the SONY. They have enough brilliance with the right natural color. At least to my eyes it looks better. Especially the last two pictures.


Projectors that are being considered:
  • JVC RS 4610
  • JVC RS 4810
  • SONY HWES50

Finally the Questions:
  • My ceiling is low, so I would like to go with putting the projector on the shelf. With a 22 feet throw, will both SONY/JVC be able to give a bright enough picture.
  • Any benefits of having a fixed screen over a motorized tension. I would really like to make it fixed but the wife wants to keep the Samsung LED in place ;-(
  • While I will watch majority of the movies in the dark, I would like to be able to keep some ambient light so that the kids can watch and to also watch TV/SPORTS - So with that should I get a HP screen ? Any recommendations
  • At 12feet of distance is it worth spending an extra $1100 for eshift2 ? Is the image quality really that much better. (Sorry but have never seen a eshift proj in action)
  • I would like to paint my room so its more projector friendly. Is their any write ups on which colors to use. I googled a little and was thinking of painting the screen wall black and the rest dark brown ?
  • Final question and I know this is very subjective - If you were in my shoes which one would you get ? After seeing the latest images from Zombie for the SONY with RC, I really like what I am seeing. Is the picture quality of the JVC that much better (I know its hard to answer since these units have not yet shipped out - but would love you hear your opinions)


Regards,
Hasan


PS - Mike has been a great help and answered many of my questions. I just want to widen the audience to get as much info as possible before I make a decision.




wildcard011 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 15 Old 11-05-2012, 07:39 PM
AVS Special Member
 
rovingtravler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Clovis, NM
Posts: 1,262
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14

IMO the JVCs would have a problem with lights on in a room. They are not light cannons and are better suited for dark room viewing. That is not to say others do not use them in media rooms.

The benefit of a fixed screen over a motorized are it is less likely to develop wrinkles, but they are more prone to kids and finger prints. The other perk of a motorized is being able to use the TV behind the screen.

Painting the room will help with reflections.

eshift is nice, but it is not true 4k. I would get the sony and deal with 4k in the future.

I would get the Sony and that is just my opinion.
DrZaus likes this.

David

"You buy a Ferrari when you want to be somebody. You buy a Lamborghini when you are somebody." - Frank Sinatra
rovingtravler is offline  
post #3 of 15 Old 11-05-2012, 08:26 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 8,414
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 683 Post(s)
Liked: 537
Quote:
Originally Posted by wildcard011 View Post

Hi
I've been reading these forums for almost a year now and am now finally ready to make a plunge into the projector world. I have a few questions and was hoping some of you could help answer and offer opinions. I would also like to thank the members of this forum, the amount and type of information that is shared here is just unbelievable. Unlike other audio/video equipment there are very few places one can go to physically check the projectors out in person and having access this forum is a great way to gain valuable information before making a decision.
Let me describe the bat cave
Bat cave is located in the basement. So there is very little ambient light. Its completely controlled. Its a L shaped room but the viewing is confined in the longer rectangular space. The measurements are as follows: (Pics attached)
  • L: 22 ft
  • W: 12 ft
  • H: 6.5 ft
  • Seating distance : 12ft
Here is viewing preference:
  • Screen size will be between 110" -123" 16:9 (Budget is about $1000)
  • I want the best 2D I can get. Even when watching movies in theaters I prefer to watch the 2D versions. Will take 3D as a bonus, I guess it will be fun for the kids and fun to show off to friends.
  • I do like bright image though. I have preferred LCD over PLASMA. Love the pop but again not so much that it would look unnatural. For example to give you an idea, the recent pics that Zombie posted between the 5020 and ES50, I prefer the images of the SONY. They have enough brilliance with the right natural color. At least to my eyes it looks better. Especially the last two pictures.
Projectors that are being considered:
  • JVC RS 4610
  • JVC RS 4810
  • SONY HWES50
Finally the Questions:
  • My ceiling is low, so I would like to go with putting the projector on the shelf. With a 22 feet throw, will both SONY/JVC be able to give a bright enough picture.
  • Any benefits of having a fixed screen over a motorized tension. I would really like to make it fixed but the wife wants to keep the Samsung LED in place ;-(
  • While I will watch majority of the movies in the dark, I would like to be able to keep some ambient light so that the kids can watch and to also watch TV/SPORTS - So with that should I get a HP screen ? Any recommendations
  • At 12feet of distance is it worth spending an extra $1100 for eshift2 ? Is the image quality really that much better. (Sorry but have never seen a eshift proj in action)
  • I would like to paint my room so its more projector friendly. Is their any write ups on which colors to use. I googled a little and was thinking of painting the screen wall black and the rest dark brown ?
  • Final question and I know this is very subjective - If you were in my shoes which one would you get ? After seeing the latest images from Zombie for the SONY with RC, I really like what I am seeing. Is the picture quality of the JVC that much better (I know its hard to answer since these units have not yet shipped out - but would love you hear your opinions)
Regards,
Hasan
PS - Mike has been a great help and answered many of my questions. I just want to widen the audience to get as much info as possible before I make a decision.




You need to give them screen size, to get a better response.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me: Mike@AVScience.com
Brands we sell: http://avscience.com/brands/ 
Call for B-stock projectors
Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI, Falcon, DNP & more.
RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Tech., MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech, Denon, Marantz & Yamaha .
AV Science Sales 5 is offline  
post #4 of 15 Old 11-05-2012, 08:57 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
wildcard011's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 49
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Screen size will be 110"
wildcard011 is offline  
post #5 of 15 Old 11-05-2012, 09:01 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
wildcard011's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 49
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Thanks roving traveler, ur opinion and comments are much appreciated.
How about getting the JVC and using an hp screen, would that help in viewing with some lights on in the room.
wildcard011 is offline  
post #6 of 15 Old 11-05-2012, 09:10 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
coderguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 10,039
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 50 Post(s)
Liked: 153
If you can make it so that the lights are pointed AWAY from the projector screen towards the back of the room with only a modest amount of even light coming back towards the screen, then yes it will help. If you cannot do this, then it will help some but probably not enough.
Keep in mind though with the HP screen you will need to mount the projector lower and closer to the sofas to maximize gain (although without doing this you will still get some gain if you mount it relatively low).


Quick and Easy Shelf Mount Method for both one projector or dual stacks

Web Calculator v023 & v025
- Quick Peak at the new upcoming calculator
**Current Projector Calculator** -- http://www.eliteprojectorcalculator.com

Coder's Top Projector Picks of 2012 --http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread....

coderguy is offline  
post #7 of 15 Old 11-05-2012, 09:45 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
wildcard011's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 49
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Will both the Sony and JVC work with a 110" screen and throw distance of 20 feet ?
It feels like both are very close when it comes to picture quality but the Sony is brighter.
wildcard011 is offline  
post #8 of 15 Old 11-05-2012, 09:48 PM
AVS Special Member
 
tigerfan33's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,194
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 51 Post(s)
Liked: 27
22' throw will be pretty long.
HP screen will help if you can go that route. Any way to move it closer?
Moving closer will give you more brightness. You could sit the projector on a shelf or dresser just behind the couch. As coder says get it as near eye level to get the most gain.
I have a 40w lamp on beside my projector when watching sports. Does not bother the HP screen at all. If it were a low gain screen, I would have a very washed out picture. HP will certainly give you that brightness you are looking for.
tigerfan33 is offline  
post #9 of 15 Old 11-05-2012, 09:49 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 8,414
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 683 Post(s)
Liked: 537
The JVC RS46 or 4810 in a light controlled room on a 110" screen of 1.1 gain can give you up to 32 Foot Lamberts of brightness in best image mode. You can easily put enough light at the back of the room that you could read fine print and still have an excellent image. The light just needs to be kept away from the screen. I have track lighting above my screen aimed toward the back of the room. I can turn on all three 65 watt flood lamps on high and still get a watchable image on my 9' wide scope 0.85 gain screen. I do use an A-lens, so I pick up brightness with it.. If I am eating in the HT room, I turn the lights up a little less than half and the image looks quite good. Even at mid zoom, you are still talking about 28/29 Foot Lamberts on a 1.1 gain screen. In a good room 12 to 14 Foot Lamberts is pretty bright. Keep in mind the OPer is not looking for 3D brightness, I would not go with an HP screen of 110" size in a dedicated, light controlled room. If you were getting 2.0 gain, mid zoom, you are looking at around 28 Foot Lamberts with the iris closed all the way down in low lamp. That is why too bright in a dedicated light controlled room.

Added
Forgot about the 20' to 22' throw. Even at 22' of throw you are looking at upper 26 FL for brightness on a 1.1 gain screen. The Sony HW50 is even brighter, but still say no to the High Power. Not needed in this case. if OPer was looking for 3D brightness, then yes to the HP screen.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me: Mike@AVScience.com
Brands we sell: http://avscience.com/brands/ 
Call for B-stock projectors
Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI, Falcon, DNP & more.
RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Tech., MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech, Denon, Marantz & Yamaha .
AV Science Sales 5 is offline  
post #10 of 15 Old 11-06-2012, 03:01 PM
Member
 
dmoneyman2323's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 171
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 15 Post(s)
Liked: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

The JVC RS46 or 4810 in a light controlled room on a 110" screen of 1.1 gain can give you up to 32 Foot Lamberts of brightness in best image mode. You can easily put enough light at the back of the room that you could read fine print and still have an excellent image. The light just needs to be kept away from the screen. I have track lighting above my screen aimed toward the back of the room. I can turn on all three 65 watt flood lamps on high and still get a watchable image on my 9' wide scope 0.85 gain screen. I do use an A-lens, so I pick up brightness with it.. If I am eating in the HT room, I turn the lights up a little less than half and the image looks quite good. Even at mid zoom, you are still talking about 28/29 Foot Lamberts on a 1.1 gain screen. In a good room 12 to 14 Foot Lamberts is pretty bright. Keep in mind the OPer is not looking for 3D brightness, I would not go with an HP screen of 110" size in a dedicated, light controlled room. If you were getting 2.0 gain, mid zoom, you are looking at around 28 Foot Lamberts with the iris closed all the way down in low lamp. That is why too bright in a dedicated light controlled room.
Added
Forgot about the 20' to 22' throw. Even at 22' of throw you are looking at upper 26 FL for brightness on a 1.1 gain screen. The Sony HW50 is even brighter, but still say no to the High Power. Not needed in this case. if OPer was looking for 3D brightness, then yes to the HP screen.

Where did you get these numbers from? On Projector Central I was seeing about 13 FL of brightness on a 1.1 gain 110" screen from 20 feet away. Just asking because I'm thinking about getting an Epson 5020 for the added 3d brightness compared to my Panasonic AE7000. I don't play games on my screen, I have a 58" behind my motorized screen for that.

But could you tell me how much FL of brightness I could expect on a 125" 2.35 screen 1.1 gain using the Epson 5020UB? I seen the numbers on projector central but they don't look correct compared to numbers that site shows for the Panasonic AE8000u which is rated at 2400 lumens just like the 5020UB is.
dmoneyman2323 is offline  
post #11 of 15 Old 11-08-2012, 08:20 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
mark haflich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: brookeville, maryland, usa
Posts: 20,245
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 627 Post(s)
Liked: 588
The Sony won't work with that long a throw. With an 8 ft wide screen, he would need a throw multiplier of 2.5, well within the JVC range of 1.4 to 2.8 but outside the range of the Sony. The obvious answer is at 20 ft is the HP 2.4 because the room set up with the LCD screams for a pull down or motorized and the screen budget is low. HP does not require or need or come available with tab tensioning. So it could be procured at near the price budget and the low ceiling height and planned shelf mounting mean the projector mounting requirements for HP can be met. The extra money for e-shift2 is clearly worth it. Only persons who have no experience with the effect of extra pixel density on a screen and how the processing JVC employs with eshift 2 improves the picture.

Mark Haflich
markhaflich@yahoo.com
call me at: 240 876 2536
mark haflich is online now  
post #12 of 15 Old 11-08-2012, 09:17 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 8,414
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 683 Post(s)
Liked: 537
Lets recap. Poster has a light controlled room. Note that the room shown has light colored walls, but poster has already said he is going to paint the room so that it is projector friendly. Poster is not concerned with 3D. Poster said he will have a throw of 20' shooting onto a 110" screen. At that throw distance, using the JVC, the poster would get mid 20's FL using high lamp, shooting onto a 1.1 gain screen. Going to a HP screen we are talking mid 40's. Low lamp with the HP and you are still looking at around 28 FL. I don't see him needing that kind of brightness in a light controlled room. A family room setup without light control or if wanting 3D, then yes to the HP, but I don't think it is needed in this case.

Added
I own an HP screen. I use it with a low lumen Marantz VP-12S4. I have that setup in a family room with nearly white walls. I am shooting onto a 106" HP screen from 14'-4". I use the Marantz in low lamp mode and at night time the image looks like a plasma TV. Room has a lot of large uncovered windows, so day time viewing is out of the question. Now the Marantz is probably only putting out 275 lumens and my HP screen is the older 2.8 gain material, but it is very bright at around 18FL.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me: Mike@AVScience.com
Brands we sell: http://avscience.com/brands/ 
Call for B-stock projectors
Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI, Falcon, DNP & more.
RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Tech., MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech, Denon, Marantz & Yamaha .
AV Science Sales 5 is offline  
post #13 of 15 Old 11-08-2012, 09:18 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 8,414
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 683 Post(s)
Liked: 537
Quote:
Originally Posted by dmoneyman2323 View Post

Where did you get these numbers from? On Projector Central I was seeing about 13 FL of brightness on a 1.1 gain 110" screen from 20 feet away. Just asking because I'm thinking about getting an Epson 5020 for the added 3d brightness compared to my Panasonic AE7000. I don't play games on my screen, I have a 58" behind my motorized screen for that.
But could you tell me how much FL of brightness I could expect on a 125" 2.35 screen 1.1 gain using the Epson 5020UB? I seen the numbers on projector central but they don't look correct compared to numbers that site shows for the Panasonic AE8000u which is rated at 2400 lumens just like the 5020UB is.

You take the lumen output from reviews and run the math yourself. I am using last years numbers for the RS45.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me: Mike@AVScience.com
Brands we sell: http://avscience.com/brands/ 
Call for B-stock projectors
Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI, Falcon, DNP & more.
RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Tech., MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech, Denon, Marantz & Yamaha .
AV Science Sales 5 is offline  
post #14 of 15 Old 11-08-2012, 09:50 AM
AVS Special Member
 
tigerfan33's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,194
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 51 Post(s)
Liked: 27
OP.
Those lumen numbers are max lumens for those projectors. Not a very good picture to watch. The Sony and JVC will give you much higher best mode lumen out put than the Epson or Panny.
tigerfan33 is offline  
post #15 of 15 Old 11-08-2012, 11:50 AM - Thread Starter
Member
 
wildcard011's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 49
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by tigerfan33 View Post

OP.
Those lumen numbers are max lumens for those projectors. Not a very good picture to watch. The Sony and JVC will give you much higher best mode lumen out put than the Epson or Panny.

Well it looks like the SONY is out of the equation, since it wont be able to work with my setup (20 ft throw distance). Now I have to decide on the screen and between getting eshift2 or not. Experts here seem to agree that its worth it.
wildcard011 is offline  
Reply Digital Hi-End Projectors - $3,000+ USD MSRP

Tags
Epson 5020ub Powerlite Home Cinema 3d Front Projector , Sony Vpl Hw50es 3d Projector , Jvc Dla Rs4810 3d Home Theater Projector , Jvc Dla Rs46 Projector , Panasonic Ptae8000u Hd Projector
Gear in this thread

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off