Are laser projectors worth waiting for? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 19 Old 01-24-2013, 04:03 PM - Thread Starter
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With the hype over LED, I wonder if they're worth waiting for? I've seen the new Panny geared towards businesses not home theater enthusiasts.
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post #2 of 19 Old 01-24-2013, 04:51 PM
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Generally, no new technology is worth waiting for because of the long time it might actually take to come to market and the high cionsumer cost of early adoption. The introduction of plasmas comes to mind, very expensive intially, not great blacks, and a very limited contrast range. waiting a few years and performance increased substantially and price came substantially. now performace is realy good and prices are very cheap.

Laser FPs are a way off and despite what some manufacturers are saying about introduction and pricing, there are substantial problems still be be solved (speckeling) and lasers sourced from third parties are still to high. The main advantage of lasersare long life. At this point, I would buy a bulbprojector and replace bulbs as needed.

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post #3 of 19 Old 01-24-2013, 05:22 PM
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The answer also depends on if you have something to watch while waiting. If not, get something NOW and follow Mark's advice, letting the dust settle. However, if you can enjoy or at least live with what you already have, then waiting for new tech might be a good option. Personally, that's my approach to 4K. I'd love to see Red come out with their promised 4K 3D laser at a good price point. However, being an earlier adopter has it's own set of perils.

I waited and skipped the whole 720p projector period. Of course, I ended up being an early adopter of 1080p. While I didn't drop the money that was needed for a Qualia, the price of Ruby in the beginning was still expensive. Waiting another year might have been wiser as the rest of the market caught up with 1080p.

In Mark's case, he has a 4K projector now and is enjoying it. I can't justify one now even if I could get it near cost, so I will live with my current PJ (with it's supplied extra lamp) for longer until something comes along that I just "have to have" that starts the upgrade cycle over again.

Life is short, so that has to be factored in too. In the end, only you can really answer the question you posed based on your needs and budget.

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post #4 of 19 Old 01-24-2013, 07:25 PM
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With Epson claiming 4,000 hours per bulb, the lust for lasers seems less urgent.
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post #5 of 19 Old 01-24-2013, 09:39 PM
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I wouldn't hold my breath, if they couldn't give any solid details at CES or were demoing at the show, I doubt it will be released at consumer level anytime soon. To be honest, I'l be suprised if it even makes it to CEDIA.
Personally, I'd buy a used older high end model to tide me over until its released. If, of course, it lives up to the hype
As said above, bulb life is not a big driver for this, it needs to differentiate itself on image quality

With LG just announcing a 70" OLED it makes you wonder what front projection can do in a short enough time frame to keep up, lasers or not.

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post #6 of 19 Old 01-25-2013, 12:28 AM
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Find current products that suit your needs/wants/budget and enjoy it now, waiting is futile as there is always something better that's 'just around the corner' rolleyes.gif.

Plan for tomorrow but live for today. biggrin.gif

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post #7 of 19 Old 01-25-2013, 01:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inky blacks View Post

With Epson claiming 4,000 hours per bulb, the lust for lasers seems less urgent.

Manufacturers frequently claim rediculous long life for the bulbs they procure from third parties. I'll believe a manufacturers claimed life hours when their bulb warranty matches the specification claimed.

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post #8 of 19 Old 01-25-2013, 01:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danieledmunds View Post

I wouldn't hold my breath, if they couldn't give any solid details at CES or were demoing at the show, I doubt it will be released at consumer level anytime soon. To be honest, I'l be suprised if it even makes it to CEDIA.
Personally, I'd buy a used older high end model to tide me over until its released. If, of course, it lives up to the hype
As said above, bulb life is not a big driver for this, it needs to differentiate itself on image quality

With LG just announcing a 70" OLED it makes you wonder what front projection can do in a short enough time frame to keep up, lasers or not.

I think you are referring to the Red projector. Cedia is not a show for red. They do not have resellers and Cedia is technically not a consumer show.

And I do agree with you. Red will not be selling a consumer projector this year.

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post #9 of 19 Old 01-25-2013, 03:14 PM
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Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

I think you are referring to the Red projector. Cedia is not a show for red. They do not have resellers and Cedia is technically not a consumer show.

And I do agree with you. Red will not be selling a consumer projector this year.

Mark, you're probably correct concerning Red's time frame. I'm enjoying my Epson and consider it "good enough" to hold me over until someone (Red, Sony, or JVC) comes out with an affordable 4K 3D laser projector. I only have 400 hours on the current lamp and have the spare that came with the 6010, plus it's got a long warranty. I have a meter to measure and will replace the lamp when my eyes and the measurement says so. I'll continue to auto-calibrate my Radiance to keep it all looking as good as it can too. I can hold out as long as I don't go looking at someone else's latest PJ and get envious. I've gotten off the yearly evolutionary JVC upgrade bandwagon and am happy with the Epson. Hopefully, there's a revolutionary advancement in projector technology in the not too distance future. For now, 2K media and 3D look pretty good on the Epson. Springing for e-shift or expensive 4K with no real source just doesn't make sense for me, especially after getting burned by JVC lamp issue. The Epson will be my last lamp based PJ.

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post #10 of 19 Old 01-25-2013, 03:43 PM
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I've always wondered what Epson's been waiting for regarding their reflective lcd panels. It'd be cool if they released that technology with a laser as a light source.

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post #11 of 19 Old 01-25-2013, 04:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the very wise and informative answers! I guess I'll be buying something now as life is indeed short.
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post #12 of 19 Old 01-25-2013, 04:33 PM
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If I had a functioning projector I could get by with I would hang a while longer, if I didn't, I'd buy a mid range projector to tide me over......till the Laser Era dawns.

I feel lasers will bring a significant contrast boost to LCoS, while increasing brightness. 3D lovers rejoyce! Hopefully stackable external laser source/s, incoherent laser light sent down the optical cables to the head unit, polarized in the head unit.

No need for DI's or user adjustable Irises, user dimmable or/and dynamically dimmable light source, making lens cost cheaper. Due to less heat in the head unit, possibly that too may be cheaper to manufacture. Auto full fade to black. An advantage being able to turn on or off frequently without worring about shortening the life of the light source. Constant light output for the life of the lasers, no reapeat calibration.

I do wish RED well, I'm sure RED will deliver their product.....the question is when?.........but their efforts and publicising such would have got the likes of Sony, Panasonic and JVC to speed up product development for the upcoming Laser Wars.............Sony has had their stackable laser modules for years now just waiting for the right time to introduce such tech...available to all manufactures BTW:



DNP has their Green de-speckle hologram chip:



Panasonic appear to be using a phosphor wheel to tackle speckle(could it be a variation of the DNP chip), using a blue laser to create green:



RED has had a major impact in the video camera market, projector manufacturers won't stand idle and let their projector manufacturing units decline(sure the market is small....but the profits are there, I'm guessing they are far higher per unit than flat panels?) No doubt manufacturers will keep milking the globed projector market for as long as possible...........but LASER will be the must have word in brochures........ by the time RED delivers it's baby. smile.gif

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post #13 of 19 Old 01-27-2013, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Highjinx View Post

No need for DI's or user adjustable Irises, user dimmable or/and dynamically dimmable light source, making lens cost cheaper.

What does DI or irises have to do with the lens?

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post #14 of 19 Old 01-27-2013, 05:13 PM
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What does DI or irises have to do with the lens?

Some companies, like Sony and some BenQ models, have manual and dynamic irises inside the lens.

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post #15 of 19 Old 01-27-2013, 06:25 PM
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Originally Posted by noah katz View Post

What does DI or irises have to do with the lens?

As Seegs108 said.

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post #16 of 19 Old 01-27-2013, 06:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seegs108 View Post

Some companies, like Sony and some BenQ models, have manual and dynamic irises inside the lens.
\\

It is the same iris I believe. The irises are motor operated. They can be set at a fixed position of the users choice or they can be automatically operated off of picture analyzing algs that vary the gamma and the iris openings to maximize the blacks and boost the whites to compensate for reducing the iris opening to enhance the blacks.

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post #17 of 19 Old 01-27-2013, 06:40 PM
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Yes, I didn't mean it to sound like there are two separate irises. Some models the irises are manual only, some irises are only dynamic and some can be used in either mode.

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post #18 of 19 Old 01-28-2013, 06:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Seegs108 View Post

Some companies, like Sony and some BenQ models, have manual and dynamic irises inside the lens.

I see, I thought you were saying DI affected the quality/cost of the lens itself

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post #19 of 19 Old 01-28-2013, 07:55 PM
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It doesn't have to effect the quality of the lens but it should influence the cost in some way or another. Considering the lens is built with the iris in mind it's going to have some affect on cost. I'm sure that the space the iris takes up inside the lens necessitates the optics to be placed differently or other optical changes needed, thus effecting cost.

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