Uber Light Cannon for 250-280" scope screen? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 10:11 AM - Thread Starter
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I have a 30x40ft out building on my property that is currently a guest house with a two car garage. I'm thinking of re-purposing it into a home theater if the cost isn't too outrageous. Keeping it heated over winter could be costly....

Anyway are there any < $5K projectors that could work for a screen this size? If need be I would be willing to use a pretty high gain, non-acoustically transparent screen, forgoing the center channel.

3D would be awesome for games, but I could careless about 3D movies.
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post #2 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 10:33 AM
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You just got a lot of people drooling over the thought of a 20 x 30 separate theater : )
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post #3 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 10:34 AM
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Whoa. 30 x 40. Even better
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post #4 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 11:29 AM
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The screen alone would cost a fortune. Unless it's a DIY project.
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post #5 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 12:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by edfowler View Post

Whoa. 30 x 40. Even better

Yeah - can't believe my luck! It's the perfect space in a lot of ways. Only a couple of little windows and sound proofing shouldn't be an issue since it's over 100 yards from the main house. It already has a little kitchen and bathroom.

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Originally Posted by Elix View Post

The screen alone would cost a fortune. Unless it's a DIY project.

I'll be DIYing the screen and I already have the perfect DIY speakers to fill this space with ease. I'll need to DIY a large array of horn loaded subs and room treatments.

I just need to know if there's an affordable projector for a screen this size. smile.gif
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post #6 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 12:26 PM
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Try browsing used market for a large venue projector. I'm sure you'll find something suitable. Be aware of old LCDs (they may have panel color degradation/banding problems) and old DLPs with slow color wheel speed (rainbowfest)...
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post #7 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 01:34 PM
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I'd take a look at the BenQ SH960. It's rated for 5500 lumens. It should be bright enough to fit a screen that size. You should be able to find one under $5000 easily. This is really one of the only options for a unit that costs (new) under $5000. That doesn't mean it's a bad unit. BenQ is known for making great products.

Check it out here:

http://www.projectorcentral.com/BenQ-SH960.htm

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post #8 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 02:37 PM
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There is also the Optoma th1060p which is almost the same as the Benq sh910.

Here is the shootout for it:
http://www.projectorcentral.com/benq_sh910_optoma_th1060p_projector_review.htm

There are other projectors that are about this bright in the under $5000 realm, although these two above are the most economical for the brightest image. The only concern is going to be RBE, I think these projectors are using 2x or 3x color wheels in order to maintain maximum brightness (although not absolute certain).

Panasonic, Epson, NEC, Eiki, and others also make many under $5000 units which can put out > 3000 lumens (many rated at 4000-5000 lumens) for this price. The problem is they are usually WUXGA (1920x1200) and they are not made for home theater that much, but you can find a few that are kind of crossover projectors.


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post #9 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 04:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the suggestions guys, I'll check them out tonight. In general do these PJ's have a picture quality that is comparable to the < 1600 lumen PJ's in the $2,000-3,000 range?
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post #10 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 04:57 PM
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How about a dual PJ setup? You could get two of the new lower end Epsons (maybe the 3020?) in your price range, with good PJ mounts it isn't that hard to get things lined up. You might even have a little left over for some video processing toys (the lumagen is fantaastic). You could also get two new bright dlp units, but it may be harder to line them up (they will need horizontal and vertical lens shift). The high lumens projectors you can get in this price range will probably look pretty bad, the other option is to keep your eyes out for a 720p 3 chip DLP, which come up for sale from time to time.
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post #11 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 05:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3dmaven View Post

How about a dual PJ setup? You could get two of the new lower end Epsons (maybe the 3020?) in your price range, with good PJ mounts it isn't that hard to get things lined up. You might even have a little left over for some video processing toys (the lumagen is fantaastic). You could also get two new bright dlp units, but it may be harder to line them up (they will need horizontal and vertical lens shift). The high lumens projectors you can get in this price range will probably look pretty bad, the other option is to keep your eyes out for a 720p 3 chip DLP, which come up for sale from time to time.

The 3020 has a fixed offset, so you can't stack them.

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post #12 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 05:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post

The 3020 has a fixed offset, so you can't stack them.

The BenQ W1070 would be a great alternative. They have enough vertical lens shift to make a setup like this work.

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post #13 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 05:35 PM
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Just because you have that much space does not mean you need a screen that big. I think in 16 by 9 format anything over 133" diagonal is a waste and will only degrade picture quality. Better to use the extra space for other purposes. There are allot of projectors that can handle a 133" diagonal screen.
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post #14 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 05:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by inky blacks View Post

Just because you have that much space does not mean you need a screen that big. I think in 16 by 9 format anything over 133" diagonal is a waste and will only degrade picture quality. Better to use the extra space for other purposes. There are allot of projectors that can handle a 133" diagonal screen.

That is a dumb argument. It all depends on how far seating distances are. Look at DCI machines in commercial cinemas. A lot of them are still running 2K on 20-30 foot screens. The resolution is only slightly higher than 1080p and yet it looks perfectly fine on screens that large. If he has the space and the budget there's no reason he can't enjoy an image that large. Just make sure you aren't sitting closer than 1.5 picture widths away and you'll be fine. Considering the huge space he has to work with I don't think that'll be an issue.

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post #15 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 05:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seegs108 View Post

The BenQ W1070 would be a great alternative. They have enough vertical lens shift to make a setup like this work.

Lots of projectors have enough lens shift to do this. I was just pointing out that the 3020 was not a candidate. The Benq would be a good low cost solution for this. Also I would only consider single chip DLP's for this application.

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post #16 of 36 Old 01-27-2013, 08:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the input guys, lots of research to do. I want the biggest screen that is practical to fit in the room. In a few years when 4K 3D laser PJ's have come down in price I can spend the big money if need be. Heck, it will probably be at least a year by the time the subs/surround speakers/room treatments are built and the room is close to being ready. I'm not in a big hurry, but I just wanted to know I could fill that screen with OK quality without spending over $4k or so.
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post #17 of 36 Old 01-29-2013, 11:06 PM
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The screen size seems too large.

Is 20x40 the whole building, or the size of the room for the HT? How tall are the ceilings?

Why sacrifice an AT screen and center channel just for a bigger screen? I would use the extra space for other stuff. Use 3'+ for a screen wall. 4'+ for a projector booth in back. Place your seating optimally in the room. Then pick a screen size based on your preferred FOV. The smaller the screen gets, the smaller your projector problem becomes.

 

 

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post #18 of 36 Old 01-30-2013, 03:50 PM
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If I could get a 250in+ screen I would jump on it. Why would he settle for a 130in screen? that's stupid. If he has the space, he should do it. Stack two projectors or build your theater and save up for a laser projector with an external light source like Red is doing.
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post #19 of 36 Old 01-30-2013, 06:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rabident View Post

The screen size seems too large.

Is 20x40 the whole building, or the size of the room for the HT? How tall are the ceilings?

Why sacrifice an AT screen and center channel just for a bigger screen? I would use the extra space for other stuff. Use 3'+ for a screen wall. 4'+ for a projector booth in back. Place your seating optimally in the room. Then pick a screen size based on your preferred FOV. The smaller the screen gets, the smaller your projector problem becomes.

The building is 30x40, so it's about 28x38 on the inside with all the insulation. There is a small bathroom and utility closet + kitchen. The ceiling is about 8.5ft at the edges and about 12ft at it's tallest, but I'll have to take down a ladder and measure. It will be the height of the screen that will be the limiting factor - I'm hoping for 9ft tall. I think I'd have to shrink the screen tremendously to use an acoustically transparent screen. My speakers are pretty directive (massive) horns that produce a very solid virtual center image in the sweet spot. Hopefully that sweet spot will be pretty big in this size room. But nothing is set in concrete at this stage.

I really don't want to shrink the room with a screen wall or projection room. The front speakers will be on display. I'm thinking I don't really want to build a space that looks exactly like a theater. Right now I'm thinking of going with a western theme. Kind of like a old 1800 saloon set up to show movies - reclaimed wood planks (dark and matte) on the inside. After all we are living in rural Colorado at 10,000ft.

Obviously there will have to be a balance between form and function....
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post #20 of 36 Old 01-30-2013, 06:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blee0120 View Post

If I could get a 250in+ screen I would jump on it. Why would he settle for a 130in screen? that's stupid. If he has the space, he should do it. Stack two projectors or build your theater and save up for a laser projector with an external light source like Red is doing.

Yep we have lots of space in the main house, so we can claim all this space for a theater. Should be awesome for entertaining and kids parties etc (our kids will be school age before we know it!).

I really like the looks of that red laser PJ. Seems like this is the perfect time to be building with a 250"+ screen as 4K is just around the corner.

The budget is there to equip it out. Even if we decide we have to go a used professional cinema projector. But I'm a big believer in only spending what is necessary and not into the status of owning certain gear.

Then there is the possibility that we might have to move one day, so I don't want to put a ton of money into something that we'd have to take a big loss on.
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post #21 of 36 Old 01-30-2013, 08:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Here is a pic of the building as seen from the main house. It's kind of ugly to look at so I was thinking of adding a western style shop front with porch like this pic (see link).

http://www.nascar.com/content/dam/nascar/articles/2012/01/22/dearnhardtjr-western-town/main/120122034407-western-store-front.jpg


HT by ZapBlank, on Flickr
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post #22 of 36 Old 01-30-2013, 08:16 PM
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Wow, you have a nice backyard, I'm very jealous. With that kind of view who cares about how the building looks!


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post #23 of 36 Old 01-30-2013, 08:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Wow, you have a nice backyard, I'm very jealous. With that kind of view who cares about how the building looks!

Thanks! We love living here.
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post #24 of 36 Old 01-31-2013, 01:25 PM
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If you are considering large venue projectors, try and get a 3chip DLP machine.
The contrast ratio of the big bright machines is usually the first to be sacrificed for brightness, but the 3chip machines are alot better at getting a decent contrast ratio.

check brands like Christie, Barco (most barco stuff is 240v) Panasonic, Eiki, and Sanyo.

Also as i noted, make sure the machine you're considering is 120v, unless you have 240v in your outbuilding. But really if you're going to make it completely dark in there, then you're probably going to need about 5000 lumens, so there isn't really a need for a machine of that 240v caliber.
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post #25 of 36 Old 01-31-2013, 02:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stickygreen View Post

If you are considering large venue projectors, try and get a 3chip DLP machine.
The contrast ratio of the big bright machines is usually the first to be sacrificed for brightness, but the 3chip machines are alot better at getting a decent contrast ratio.

check brands like Christie, Barco (most barco stuff is 240v) Panasonic, Eiki, and Sanyo.

Also as i noted, make sure the machine you're considering is 120v, unless you have 240v in your outbuilding. But really if you're going to make it completely dark in there, then you're probably going to need about 5000 lumens, so there isn't really a need for a machine of that 240v caliber.

Thanks for the suggestions! There is a 240v outlet in the building, must have been for a big freezer or dryer.

The idea is to have the room completely light controlled. 5,000 lumen is a lot of light. Am I going to blind my kids if they look into that eek.gifbiggrin.gif
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Quote:
Originally Posted by steve71 View Post

Thanks for the suggestions! There is a 240v outlet in the building, must have been for a big freezer or dryer.

The idea is to have the room completely light controlled. 5,000 lumen is a lot of light going to blind my kids if they look into that eek.gifbiggrin.gif
For a 250in screen with a 5000 lumen projector its gonna be 26ftL and with a 280in it will be 21ftL. Since, you probably won't get 5000 lumens out of the projector, I think 5000 lumens projector is about what you need. 26ftL isn't blinding at all.
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post #27 of 36 Old 01-31-2013, 04:18 PM
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26ftL isn't blinding at all.

One gets used to 25 foot lamberts real fast in fact !! cool.gif

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post #28 of 36 Old 01-31-2013, 04:23 PM - Thread Starter
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I meant if they walk up to the screen, turn around and look into the projector.
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post #29 of 36 Old 01-31-2013, 04:41 PM
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I imagine if they stare too long, could hurt their eyes. With kids it is better to project from the ceiling and they won't look into the beam as much.
I've accidentally looked into some pretty bright PJ beams for up to about 1 second and it's probably not much different than glancing at the sun. I think most will turn away in time because of the utter discomfort of looking, hard to say with kids though.


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post #30 of 36 Old 01-31-2013, 08:31 PM - Thread Starter
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We'll be mounting the PJ to the ceiling, out of harms way for sure. Now that I think about it, buy the time we're ready to hang the PJ our youngest should be old enough able to understand, " Don't look into the Projector!!!"
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