"Black" Theater Improvment Thread (Once you go black you never go back?) - Page 49 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1441 of 1455 Old 01-28-2015, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by airscapes View Post
The ceiling is treated 57" out in front of the screen and the side walls a bit father.. taking photos of a black hole makes it hard to see where the screen wall and side walls are. With the HP 2.8 the light is mostly sent back to the projector and this amount of treatment works great. If it had been up to me alone, I would have covered more but I gota live with the wife.
My mistake then...when I look at the picture it pretty much looks like the black simply extends horizontally across the back wall. But if you have it coming out 57", then that's actually a few inches more than my black velvet treatments extend on the side walls and ceiling, and they were still very effective at improving contrast and reducing reflections to what I feel is a negligible level. So I'm sure that you're also getting good results. But you're right about black being difficult to photography. If you over-expose to the point where you can see details in the black, then everything in the picture ends up looking like crap.

Anyway, I admire what you've been able to accomplish with the space-use limitations you have to work with. I'm fortunate to have a piece of the basement where I've been given a (somewhat) free hand.

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Originally Posted by airscapes View Post
Having the screen wall as black as the sides lets the screen float in blackness.
I actually kind of like being able to see my screen hanging on the wall. With the lights on, I think it looks cool, and with the lights off and an image on the screen I don't think I notice the wall anyway. But with you having a pull-down screen, it's a different situation.

My wall is brown, so it's still kind of dark, but not so dark that my screen frame disappears:



Now it's time to go play with my Darbee DVP-5000 that just arrived in the mail, and see if this thing lives up to all the hype!

My home theater gallery Epson 5010 Projector, 133" Cinemascope Screen, Klipsch RF-7

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post #1442 of 1455 Old 01-28-2015, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Edgar_in_Indy View Post
My mistake then...when I look at the picture it pretty much looks like the black simply extends horizontally across the back wall. But if you have it coming out 57", then that's actually a few inches more than my black velvet treatments extend on the side walls and ceiling, and they were still very effective at improving contrast and reducing reflections to what I feel is a negligible level. So I'm sure that you're also getting good results. But you're right about black being difficult to photography.

Anyway, I admire what you've been able to accomplish with the space-use limitations you have to work with. I'm fortunate to have a piece of the basement where I've been given a (somewhat) free hand.



I actually kind of like being able to see my screen hanging on the wall. With the lights on, I think it looks cool, and with the lights off and an image on the screen I don't think I notice the wall anyway. But with you having a pull-down screen, it's a different situation.

My wall is brown, so it's still kind of dark, but not so dark that my screen frame disappears:



Now it's time to go play with my Darbee DVP-5000 that just arrived in the mail, and see if this thing lives up to all the hype!
It's a very nice color scheme.....a nice room to show off. Well done. If you are like me, you'll LOVE what the darbee brings to the table.....must have for my set up. The fact that both Lumagen and OPPO both incorporated the darbee into their well respected video products is a testament to how good the product performs.

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post #1443 of 1455 Old 01-28-2015, 02:45 PM
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Originally Posted by rboster View Post
It's a very nice color scheme.....a nice room to show off. Well done. If you are like me, you'll LOVE what the darbee brings to the table.....must have for my set up. The fact that both Lumagen and OPPO both incorporated the darbee into their well respected video products is a testament to how good the product performs.
That's good to hear. I almost sold my Oppo BDP-93 to get the Darbee equipped 103D, but I ended up going with the discrete box so I can use if for all my sources.

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post #1444 of 1455 Old 01-28-2015, 03:01 PM
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Two different purposes. The side walls, floor, and ceiling treatment is for light control to reduce reflections back to the screen. The back wall is where people talk about creating "immersion" by making nothing but the projected picture visible. It's more about the viewing experience than the PQ.

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Originally Posted by n_m_d View Post
Actually, I'd think the 4 surfaces around the screen (side walls, floor, ceiling) and the surface in front of the screen (that is, the surface behind the viewer) are the ones that should be black - as they're those that will reflect the light back to the screen.

The surface behind the screen doesn't get directly lit, and cannot reflect much light back to the screen. Marking it darker won't increase the contrast of the picture. IMHO, it does ensure the back wall isn't distracting, however you'll be more likely to notice the screen's unlit areas - especially when you're projecting 2.35:1 or 1.37:1 contents, in case you don't have black panels to cover these areas.
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post #1445 of 1455 Old 01-29-2015, 03:05 AM
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Originally Posted by ellisr63 View Post
We painted our HT flat black and then wrapped panels with black velvet, and black GOM, and it makes a big difference in the presentation. The GOM is just a bit darker than the flat black, but the black velvet is quite a bit blacker.
I'm about to hang some black curtains and black vilt on the walls, so thank you all for your reaction .


In the meanwhile I bought myself a new surround system. Actually it's second handed but in good quality; DALI Concept 8 fronts, Dali Concept Center and 2 Dali Concept 1 rears. I placed the fronts like in the next picture (not mine HT, just a random one from internet);



I got these fronts;



When I look at the picture, I see the reflection (off course) on the inside of the two front speakers. Does that have any effect on the contrastratio? I can always paint my fronts black or tape some vilt on them, but I like the original color actually .
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post #1446 of 1455 Old 01-29-2015, 05:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Loondijke View Post
When I look at the picture, I see the reflection (off course) on the inside of the two front speakers. Does that have any effect on the contrastratio? I can always paint my fronts black or tape some vilt on them, but I like the original color actually .
It could, especially if they are close to the screen. But rather than painting them or gluing/taping something onto them, I would probably just drape some velvet over them.

You could get a long narrow piece that drapes over both sides, or you could get a somewhat shorter piece that just drapes over the inside (the screen side) and is held in place by some kind of weight on top of the speaker. If you don't want it to look like you have something on top of your speaker, you could cut a piece of board to the same shape/size as the top of you speaker, and paint it black to match the velvet, or gray to match the face, or stain it to match the wood, and use that as the weight to hold the velvet.

My Klipsch RC-7 center speaker is black, but it is close to the bottom of the screen, much like in the picture you posted. I was getting reflections off it, so I draped a piece of velvet over the top and sides, and it now disappears. If you scroll up a couple posts to where I posted a picture of my theater, the RC-7 actually has the velvet on it in that picture, but I doubt anybody would notice it without me pointing it out.
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post #1447 of 1455 Old 01-29-2015, 06:43 AM
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That sounds superb, efficient and very easy to apply. It actually sounds like an idea which I could come up with myself . Thanks for your reply Edgar . What an awesome HT you have btw. Just awesome! Did you choose for the white ceiling and beige carpet? Or is that just because it's also used as something else than just Cinema? Looks really nice and the color combination is cool, but in an dedicated HT i would always try to get the best looking PQ.

I am going to order 10 x black velvet 45x100cm for € 5,- per piece. For the walls, speakers and other reflections. That will do the trick!

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post #1448 of 1455 Old 01-29-2015, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by acwebs View Post
Protostar Question?

I'm on my third order of Protostar and looking forward to finishing my HT blackout. I ordered 10 veneer panels in October of 2014 and my credit card was charged over $250 for the order but it never came. I've been calling and emailing since but no response. I was just wondering if other people have been getting orders since then? I know it takes weeks for an order to get fulfilled but I'm not sure what to do. I'm tempted to order again and forget about the other order just to get it done but I don't want to do that and loose more money.

Any advice?

Thanks!

I am in the same boat. I tried emailing and calling for awhile now with no answer or response. I've filed with paypal on it and decided to just paint the wall/ceiling. I really wanted to go the protostar route but looks like something has happened to the company/whomever runs it as they aren't fulfilling orders or responding these days. Hope it works out for you, glad I didn't wait and can file under paypal to get my funds back.

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post #1449 of 1455 Old 01-29-2015, 08:30 AM
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To follow up on my post yesterday....

I put together my last three panels using a light duty stapler (1/4 staples) with the jo ann velvet on underlayment boards (best price at home depot). I would cut the velvet with the board precut on top..leaving four inches on each side. I would fold over the velvet on one length and end taping the velvet to the board with gaffers tape. This first step holds the velvet in place. I would then turn the board over and start to pull the velvet tight over the board and staple the sides in place working my way around the last two sides. I'd go back to the taped sides and secure with staples. Any fabric loose on the back side would be taped down. The velvet looked very flat against the boards even after brad nailing the board to the wall. By far the best of the bunch. I'm going to go back now and pull the other boards/panels off the wall and tighten the velvet with the stapler.

Very happy with the outcome of velvet panels vs the commando cloth.

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post #1450 of 1455 Old 01-29-2015, 09:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Loondijke View Post
What an awesome HT you have btw. Just awesome! Did you choose for the white ceiling and beige carpet? Or is that just because it's also used as something else than just Cinema?
The beige carpet was in the house when it was built, but I can't say that I notice it much during viewing. It's not as close to the screen as the ceiling and walls were, and shag carpet isn't exactly the most reflective surface, and the tan-ish color does darken it a bit. I don't think it's having much of an impact, but if I did, I would put a rug over it.

Yes, the home theater is at the end of a large, multi-purpose basement room. Although the ceiling is white, the screen is in an alcove, and I treated the ceiling of the alcove with black velvet, and it made a huge difference in picture quality. So with the velvet ceiling and velvet drapes on each side of the screen, and my walls (in the theater area) painted brown, I no longer notice a loss of contrast when there is a scene with a lot of bright areas mixed with dark areas.

The treated ceiling is kind of hard to perceive in the wide shot I posted above, but here are a couple other angles that show it off better:



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Last edited by Edgar_in_Indy; 01-29-2015 at 10:54 AM.
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post #1451 of 1455 Old 01-30-2015, 01:11 AM
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That looks a lot different then the pictures above . It looks really nice and well thought off and you really made it work . The deep screen is a superb solution! In my next house I really need a larger room to create such an HT.

I will post some pictures this weekend of my new HT with the black velvet and new curtains .

Another question; What is the best way to show your big frontspeakers? With or without the black covers? Not for the looks, because I like them both. But for the light in the HT? I would say with the black covers.

Example;



Without the covers the surfaces do reflect light more I think.

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post #1452 of 1455 Old 01-30-2015, 05:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Loondijke View Post
Another question; What is the best way to show your big frontspeakers? With or without the black covers? Not for the looks, because I like them both. But for the light in the HT? I would say with the black covers.
I like behind the screen, then you don't have to worry about it

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post #1453 of 1455 Old 01-30-2015, 07:13 AM
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Well for those interested, I found an alternative to protostar flocking. It's from scopestuff and looks to be pretty much the exact same stuff. Price looks about the same and I found a few reviews online including one that compares it to protostar. It's self-adhesive in 1ft x 47'' or 23.5''x47'' sections. I ordered some last night so will let you guys know.

http://www.scopestuff.com/ss_flok.htm

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post #1454 of 1455 Old 01-30-2015, 07:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Loondijke View Post
Another question; What is the best way to show your big frontspeakers? With or without the black covers? Not for the looks, because I like them both. But for the light in the HT? I would say with the black covers.

Without the covers the surfaces do reflect light more I think.
As far as impact on screen reflections, I think the impact would be negligible since the speakers face away from the screen. So it would probably just come down to aesthetics.

Personally, if the speakers are good looking, then I like seeing them. I usually keep my covers off, but now that we have another little one that's crawling around and can't be trusted, I've put the grills back on. But once she's old enough to be trusted not to touch the speakers, I'll probably take the covers back off.

But for those who make a big deal about having their screen "floating" in a total black hole, I suppose they would probably prefer grills on, since it would make it hard to see the speaker. That's never been a concern for me, but if you are a "black-holer" , then you'll want the grills on.

My home theater gallery Epson 5010 Projector, 133" Cinemascope Screen, Klipsch RF-7
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post #1455 of 1455 Unread Today, 12:32 PM
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Originally Posted by tuckerpc389 View Post
Well for those interested, I found an alternative to protostar flocking. It's from scopestuff and looks to be pretty much the exact same stuff. Price looks about the same and I found a few reviews online including one that compares it to protostar. It's self-adhesive in 1ft x 47'' or 23.5''x47'' sections. I ordered some last night so will let you guys know.

http://www.scopestuff.com/ss_flok.htm

Awesome! Thanks for sharing. Please let me know if/when you get the product and what you think.


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