Official Sony VPL-VW500ES / VW600ES 4K Projector Thread - Page 116 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #3451 of 3651 Old 07-27-2014, 05:36 AM
Member
 
Debonaire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 199
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 117 Post(s)
Liked: 20
Wow, 45 minutes is a long time. My CRT projector took about 20 minutes and that's inferior analog tech.
Debonaire is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #3452 of 3651 Old 07-27-2014, 05:58 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
mark haflich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: brookeville, maryland, usa
Posts: 19,944
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 446 Post(s)
Liked: 489
Quote:
Originally Posted by RapalloAV View Post
Mark thanks for your advice, it was brilliant!
I really don't know why Sony and the others have default settings for sharpness and RC turned so high!
On a really large screen (scope 145") I was never that happy with all the artefacts I was seeing....


I finally used the S&M disc and set up the sharpness which I turned down to zero. RC resolution and smoothing was also turned down low. I used a bit of added sharpness from my Lumagen and bingo, my Sony now seems to have a look closer to my X900 used to.


Really Lumagen is the magic ingredient, it does wonders to the image.


Now I say turn all the other stuff on the projector to zero or almost off and use the Lumagen to make the magic!
Thank you. I am as you astutely observed brilliant but my advice should not be accorded this accolade. Sharpness has been adjusted by calibrators and consumers the same way for many years and is taught on the most basic of set up discs. It should be remembered that with digital units, a sharpness sliders 0 may in fact not be off but may be negative. This was not true in analogue days. 10 seems about right on the 1000ES/1100ES but this can be verified and tweaked using a sharpness pattern. when the lines noticeably thicken, go down one click. This is with your nose near the screen. RC is difficult to set because there are no test patterns that will help because pictures are active and changing while patters, say on off pixel grids are basically pure sq waves. RC will really screw these uop and just one click can really generate all sorts of artifacts. You can see this by using the Sony defaults and changing R and Noise Filter a bit. With the upgrade to the 1100ES and the 500/600 it is easier to see what small changes do at the low end. 1100ES users as a group have concluded that the picture is better with RC on but set to minimum for R and a bit more for noise filtering, say 3 or 4. This is not exact.

Sony seems to use RC as a way of compensating for less than pristine lenses on the 500/600 and the 55. This is not to dump on the 500/600 lens. It is not bad but is less good than the lens on the 1100. It needs a little help and using R as I recommended at about 8 seems right and noise filtering a little less. For the 55, no offense the plastic needs a lot of help from much higher R and noise Filter.
None of this is brilliant.

Re the Lumagen, the sharpness functions are provided by the now quite aged but good Gennum chip. Providing increased sharpness by it to me is no less worse than providing it by using the sharpness control too high on the Sony. I think by setting the sharpness to 0 on the Sony you have gone to far and are correcting by using the sharpness on the gennun chip to compensate. Probably not a good thing. try setting the Lumagen sharness setting to 0 vand setting the Sony to about 10 using the grid.

Most of the controls in the advanced Sony menu have rather minimal impact on picture quality. Smooth graduation can help a bit with low settings on banding. I do use gamma at 2.2 on the ciontrol etc.

Mark Haflich

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

call me at: 240 876 2536

Last edited by mark haflich; 07-28-2014 at 04:17 PM.
mark haflich is offline  
post #3453 of 3651 Old 07-27-2014, 07:19 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 7,740
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 418
Quote:
Originally Posted by pgwalsh View Post
That seems like a ridiculous amount of time to wait for the projector's image to look proper.

There is a difference in when the image is viewable and when the image is ready to use panel alignment. For panel alignment, you want the projector fully warmed up, so that movement is minimized. For picture enjoyment, the image will look stable after only a few minutes.
billqs and pgwalsh like this.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Brands we sell: 
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 
Call for B-stock projectors
Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI, Falcon & many more.
RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Technology, MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech.
AV Science Sales 5 is offline  
post #3454 of 3651 Old 07-27-2014, 07:22 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 7,740
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 418
Quote:
Originally Posted by Debonaire View Post
Wow, 45 minutes is a long time. My CRT projector took about 20 minutes and that's inferior analog tech.
I doubt that you can tell any difference after 10 or 15 minutes, but if you are going to make panel adjustments, you want to make sure everything is fully warmed up, so that the adjustments you make are final adjustments. In other words no movement afterwords.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Brands we sell: 
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 
Call for B-stock projectors
Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI, Falcon & many more.
RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Technology, MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech.
AV Science Sales 5 is offline  
post #3455 of 3651 Old 07-27-2014, 07:49 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
mark haflich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: brookeville, maryland, usa
Posts: 19,944
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 446 Post(s)
Liked: 489
On my Sony 1100ES, the picture is horrible when I first turn it on. The screen is blank for about 45 seconds and then it is really dim for another 30 seconds or so. After that it is really good. This waste of time could be avoided with an LED, laser or laser/phosphor hybrid projector. My dog thinks its ridiculous to wait over a minute for a projector with an MSRP of $28K.
Seegs108, pgwalsh and Debonaire like this.

Mark Haflich

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

call me at: 240 876 2536
mark haflich is offline  
post #3456 of 3651 Old 07-27-2014, 10:40 AM
AVS Special Member
 
pgwalsh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Colorado Springs
Posts: 1,410
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 59 Post(s)
Liked: 58
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post
My dog thinks its ridiculous to wait over a minute for a projector with an MSRP of $28K.
My kind of dog.

Mike, your explanation makes sense and is totally not ridiculous now.

Builds: 
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
, Dual Opposed MFW's x 2, Statements, 
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 x 5. 
pgwalsh is online now  
post #3457 of 3651 Old 07-28-2014, 08:39 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 7,740
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 418
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post
On my Sony 1100ES, the picture is horrible when I first turn it on. The screen is blank for about 45 seconds and then it is really dim for another 30 seconds or so. After that it is really good. This waste of time could be avoided with an LED, laser or laser/phosphor hybrid projector. My dog thinks its ridiculous to wait over a minute for a projector with an MSRP of $28K.

I would too, if seven years passed for every actual year.
mark haflich and Craig Peer like this.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Brands we sell: 
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 
Call for B-stock projectors
Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI, Falcon & many more.
RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Technology, MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech.
AV Science Sales 5 is offline  
post #3458 of 3651 Old 07-28-2014, 03:31 PM
Member
 
anmg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Orange County California
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Swithing hdmi inputs on the 600

I am using a Harmony Ultimate with my 600es. All controls seem to work fine except when I want to set an input switch from hdmi 1 to hdmi 2 or 2 to 1. There is no response to this command. Has anyone else come across this issue?
anmg is offline  
post #3459 of 3651 Old 07-28-2014, 06:36 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 7,740
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 418
Quote:
Originally Posted by anmg View Post
I am using a Harmony Ultimate with my 600es. All controls seem to work fine except when I want to set an input switch from hdmi 1 to hdmi 2 or 2 to 1. There is no response to this command. Has anyone else come across this issue?
Teach the command to the remote.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Brands we sell: 
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 
Call for B-stock projectors
Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI, Falcon & many more.
RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Technology, MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech.
AV Science Sales 5 is offline  
post #3460 of 3651 Old 07-28-2014, 08:41 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
mark haflich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: brookeville, maryland, usa
Posts: 19,944
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 446 Post(s)
Liked: 489
Six words. A classic response.

Mark Haflich

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

call me at: 240 876 2536
mark haflich is offline  
post #3461 of 3651 Old 07-29-2014, 08:03 AM
Member
 
anmg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Orange County California
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post
Teach the command to the remote.
The only way to switch inputs on the remote is to push the input button twice. First push brings up the sub menu and the second push switches the input from 1 to 2 or 2 to 1. How do you incorporate this 2 push solution into the harmony activity? I guess what I am saying is there is no discrete command for hdmi 1 or hdmi 2 on the 600 remote.


Thanks

Last edited by anmg; 07-29-2014 at 08:17 AM.
anmg is offline  
post #3462 of 3651 Old 07-29-2014, 09:59 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 7,740
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 418
Quote:
Originally Posted by anmg View Post
The only way to switch inputs on the remote is to push the input button twice. First push brings up the sub menu and the second push switches the input from 1 to 2 or 2 to 1. How do you incorporate this 2 push solution into the harmony activity? I guess what I am saying is there is no discrete command for hdmi 1 or hdmi 2 on the 600 remote.


Thanks
No discrete commands. You would either have to teach both commands or make a macro. Something you could try. Sony uses a lot of the same codes. You could hunt up the HDMI input codes for other Sony products and see if those work. Another option, I have taught two or three commands to one button using IR learning mode. Did this all the time with older remotes years ago. Since both commands are coming from the same remote, I would use three remotes to do this. Take a cheap IR learning remote and teach it the second command. Then aim both remotes to the Harmony and send the first command and then immediately send the second command. This would be for HDMI 1. Then do the same thing for HDMI 2.
zombie10k likes this.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Brands we sell: 
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 
Call for B-stock projectors
Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI, Falcon & many more.
RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Technology, MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech.
AV Science Sales 5 is offline  
post #3463 of 3651 Old 07-29-2014, 11:13 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
mark haflich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: brookeville, maryland, usa
Posts: 19,944
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 446 Post(s)
Liked: 489
Try to post that again using 10 words or less.

Mark Haflich

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

call me at: 240 876 2536
mark haflich is offline  
post #3464 of 3651 Old 07-29-2014, 11:34 AM
Advanced Member
 
bweissman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: California, USA
Posts: 755
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 32
None of these contortions should be necessary. Harmonys are activity-based remotes. Your "Watch 4K Media" activity should set the projector to HDMI 2. All other activities should use HDMI 1. The place to teach the Harmony how to change inputs on the projector is in the MyHarmony device settings for the projector.

If you find it works to switch inputs by changing activities after everything is turned on, but does not switch to the correct input at startup, then you need to lengthen the projector's startup delay in MyHarmony.
bweissman is offline  
post #3465 of 3651 Old 07-29-2014, 12:04 PM
Member
 
anmg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Orange County California
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by bweissman View Post
None of these contortions should be necessary. Harmonys are activity-based remotes. Your "Watch 4K Media" activity should set the projector to HDMI 2. All other activities should use HDMI 1. The place to teach the Harmony how to change inputs on the projector is in the MyHarmony device settings for the projector.

If you find it works to switch inputs by changing activities after everything is turned on, but does not switch to the correct input at startup, then you need to lengthen the projector's startup delay in MyHarmony.
I spent over an hour on the phone with Logitech support yesterday. They could not make it work and escalated me to level 2 support. I'm now waiting for a call so I thought I would try here first. The Logitech codes for hdmi 1 or hdmi 2 do not work, with or without a delay. The only thing that works is to push the function button on the projector remote twice.

I found these:

Input: HDMI 1

Device Code: 84 Function: 111
0000 0068 0000 0010 0060 0018 0030 0018 0030 0018 0030 0018 0030 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0030 0018 0018 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0018 02FD

Input: HDMI 2

Device Code: 84 Function: 112
0000 0068 0000 0010 0060 0018 0018 0018 0018 0018 0018 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0030 0018 0030 0018 0018 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0018 0345

But I don't know how to add them to the logitec codes. Do you?

Thanks
anmg is offline  
post #3466 of 3651 Old 07-29-2014, 12:17 PM
AVS Special Member
 
mariob33's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Holbrook, Ma
Posts: 1,710
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Send a message via Skype™ to mariob33
Quote:
Originally Posted by anmg View Post
I spent over an hour on the phone with Logitech support yesterday. They could not make it work and escalated me to level 2 support. I'm now waiting for a call so I thought I would try here first. The Logitech codes for hdmi 1 or hdmi 2 do not work, with or without a delay. The only thing that works is to push the function button on the projector remote twice.



I found these:



Input: HDMI 1



Device Code: 84 Function: 111

0000 0068 0000 0010 0060 0018 0030 0018 0030 0018 0030 0018 0030 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0030 0018 0018 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0018 02FD



Input: HDMI 2



Device Code: 84 Function: 112

0000 0068 0000 0010 0060 0018 0018 0018 0018 0018 0018 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0030 0018 0030 0018 0018 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0018 0018 0030 0018 0018 0345



But I don't know how to add them to the logitec codes. Do you?



Thanks
I used the 1000 as the pj in my harmony setup as the 600 was not available and my Harmony 900 works fine to change the input. Keep in mind that this means you will have to tell or fake the harmony out to use command sets for two PJ in the same activity. If I recall it means the activity is now manually configured

In search of video bliss...
mariob33 is offline  
post #3467 of 3651 Old 07-29-2014, 02:32 PM
Advanced Member
 
bweissman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: California, USA
Posts: 755
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 32
I'm also having an issue switching inputs on the 600 via the Harmony Ultimate. I have tried telling the Harmony the projector was a 500 and a 1000 because the 600 isn't in the database. That doesn't make any difference, 500 acts the same as 1000 for me.

My Harmony's INPUT soft button works fine. I can manually change inputs with no problem.

The problem is going to the "Watch 4K Content" activity, which is supposed to switch the 600 to HDMI 2. It stays stuck on HDMI 1. The projector blinks, its input menu briefly appears, but does not go to HDMI 2. I can manually go to HDMI 2 easily and use the activity. (The 4K server is always on, so there is always signal going to HDMI 2.)

There is no problem going from the Watch 4K activity to any of the activities which use HDMI 1. The projector happily switches back to HDMI 1 from HDMI 2 as part of an activity change.

Summary: the projector won't switch from HDMI 1 to HDMI 2 as part of an activity change. I have played with all the Harmony delays without any luck, but because it will switch from HDMI 2 to HDMI 1, I don't think it's a Harmony delay issue. If anyone has a solution to this particular problem, I'd love to hear it.

So discrete commands would be nice. End users can't add them. You have to contact Logitech and ask very nicely pretty please add these commands.
bweissman is offline  
post #3468 of 3651 Old 07-30-2014, 07:34 AM
Member
 
anmg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Orange County California
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by bweissman View Post
I'm also having an issue switching inputs on the 600 via the Harmony Ultimate. I have tried telling the Harmony the projector was a 500 and a 1000 because the 600 isn't in the database. That doesn't make any difference, 500 acts the same as 1000 for me.

My Harmony's INPUT soft button works fine. I can manually change inputs with no problem.

The problem is going to the "Watch 4K Content" activity, which is supposed to switch the 600 to HDMI 2. It stays stuck on HDMI 1. The projector blinks, its input menu briefly appears, but does not go to HDMI 2. I can manually go to HDMI 2 easily and use the activity. (The 4K server is always on, so there is always signal going to HDMI 2.)

There is no problem going from the Watch 4K activity to any of the activities which use HDMI 1. The projector happily switches back to HDMI 1 from HDMI 2 as part of an activity change.

Summary: the projector won't switch from HDMI 1 to HDMI 2 as part of an activity change. I have played with all the Harmony delays without any luck, but because it will switch from HDMI 2 to HDMI 1, I don't think it's a Harmony delay issue. If anyone has a solution to this particular problem, I'd love to hear it.

So discrete commands would be nice. End users can't add them. You have to contact Logitech and ask very nicely pretty please add these commands.

Problem solved by Harmony level 2 support for $29 (I am passed the 90 day free help). It turns out that there are discrete codes for hdmi 1 and 2. In the Harmony data base they are listed as video 2 and video 3 (at least on my remote under the Sony projector device). No need for delays. I'm not sure if video 2 and video 3 were there to begin with or if the support guy put them there. When he got it to work using those discrete codes he then renamed them Input Hdmi 1 and Input Hdmi 2. Check your projector device codes and see if they are there. If you are still having no luck, call Harmony support (866-291-1505). My reference number is 140729-001721. If you give them that number they should be able to apply the solution to your remote.

Hope that helps.

Last edited by anmg; 07-30-2014 at 07:37 AM. Reason: changes
anmg is offline  
post #3469 of 3651 Old 07-30-2014, 12:47 PM
Advanced Member
 
bweissman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: California, USA
Posts: 755
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 29 Post(s)
Liked: 32
Quote:
Originally Posted by anmg View Post
Problem solved by Harmony level 2 support for $29 (I am passed the 90 day free help). It turns out that there are discrete codes for hdmi 1 and 2. In the Harmony data base they are listed as video 2 and video 3 (at least on my remote under the Sony projector device). No need for delays. I'm not sure if video 2 and video 3 were there to begin with or if the support guy put them there.
Thanks for the info. I have video2 and video3 in my list of inputs, but they have no commands associated with them in my account.

Which exact model of projector did you use in your Harmony setup? I will try replacing my existing device with the same one you are using and see whether I get an update.
bweissman is offline  
post #3470 of 3651 Old 07-30-2014, 03:21 PM
Member
 
anmg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Orange County California
Posts: 102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by bweissman View Post
Thanks for the info. I have video2 and video3 in my list of inputs, but they have no commands associated with them in my account.

Which exact model of projector did you use in your Harmony setup? I will try replacing my existing device with the same one you are using and see whether I get an update.
I am using the 500 in my setup.
anmg is offline  
post #3471 of 3651 Old 08-04-2014, 04:36 PM
bdy
Newbie
 
bdy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 2
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 0
Reality Creation

I recently set up a VW600 and a Stewart 130 137" diagonal 235:1 screen in my basement. I am using an Oppo 103 to play blu rays. My previous projector was an older JVC from about 6 years ago. The picture is generally very good as many have posted. I struggle with the reality creation settings though. Some have suggested to set resolution around 20 or 30 and I believe this is the default on the Reference setting. I was watching American Hustle the other day, and found the artifacts too distracting at that setting. Specifically, whenever the actors' teeth were visible, they looked a little bit cartoonish with a white border around the teeth outlining them. Turning off RC made this go away at the expense of some sharpness, which was primarily visible when the image was paused. With the image paused, whites looked rather odd with edges at the teeth and eyes. Other things looked razor sharp without a distracting unnatural edge. I have found that a setting around 3 or so allows for a big jump in sharpness with less artifacts such as the teeth but they are still there once you have seen them. In some ways I prefer RC off because the image is so smooth and "film like" but other times I do like the sharpness RC provides. There were terrible artifacts playing the older Star Wars movies on blu ray with RC on that again went away or were much less visible with RC off. Even set at 3 on Star Wars, the artifact noise was pretty distracting. I am surprised that more people aren't commenting on the artifacts with RC on. Are others not seeing these things? Or are you seeing them but not minding them with the added sharpness to the image overall? I realize this is a personal taste thing that is totally subjective and there is no right answer but I am surprised that there are posts suggesting that RC should definitely be on in order to get a great image. In motion, I think with it off films actually look very good, just softer but without unnatural edges to certain things. I do not think it is obvious that RC just needs to be "on" to get a good image. Any thoughts on this from others who have played around with the settings?
bdy is offline  
post #3472 of 3651 Old 08-04-2014, 04:41 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Seegs108's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Schenectady, New York
Posts: 4,151
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 343 Post(s)
Liked: 244
Many people share your opinion. I would personally leave it off for most material. I've gotten a chance to play with RC on a 50ES and 600ES. RC should really only be used on super clean content (no grain or other noise inherent in the source). Like you said, even at lower settings it can give the image an "unnatural" look. There are some who don't mind the extra noise and processed look because it gives them a very sharp looking image at all times.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
Seegs108 is online now  
post #3473 of 3651 Old 08-04-2014, 06:49 PM
AVS Special Member
 
RapalloAV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Posts: 1,803
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 87 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by bdy View Post
I recently set up a VW600 and a Stewart 130 137" diagonal 235:1 screen in my basement. I am using an Oppo 103 to play blu rays. My previous projector was an older JVC from about 6 years ago. The picture is generally very good as many have posted. I struggle with the reality creation settings though. Some have suggested to set resolution around 20 or 30 and I believe this is the default on the Reference setting. I was watching American Hustle the other day, and found the artifacts too distracting at that setting. Specifically, whenever the actors' teeth were visible, they looked a little bit cartoonish with a white border around the teeth outlining them. Turning off RC made this go away at the expense of some sharpness, which was primarily visible when the image was paused. With the image paused, whites looked rather odd with edges at the teeth and eyes. Other things looked razor sharp without a distracting unnatural edge. I have found that a setting around 3 or so allows for a big jump in sharpness with less artifacts such as the teeth but they are still there once you have seen them. In some ways I prefer RC off because the image is so smooth and "film like" but other times I do like the sharpness RC provides. There were terrible artifacts playing the older Star Wars movies on blu ray with RC on that again went away or were much less visible with RC off. Even set at 3 on Star Wars, the artifact noise was pretty distracting. I am surprised that more people aren't commenting on the artifacts with RC on. Are others not seeing these things? Or are you seeing them but not minding them with the added sharpness to the image overall? I realize this is a personal taste thing that is totally subjective and there is no right answer but I am surprised that there are posts suggesting that RC should definitely be on in order to get a great image. In motion, I think with it off films actually look very good, just softer but without unnatural edges to certain things. I do not think it is obvious that RC just needs to be "on" to get a good image. Any thoughts on this from others who have played around with the settings?

I like it turned on, but my setting is exactly the same as yours "3", higher than this its all out of whack! Just put a sharpness test on the screen and stand close to it and watch what happens to the edges of the lines when you go higher than 3.

Murray Thompson

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

RapalloAV is online now  
post #3474 of 3651 Old 08-05-2014, 05:02 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
mark haflich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: brookeville, maryland, usa
Posts: 19,944
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 446 Post(s)
Liked: 489
Where do you set the noise filter part of the RC, I find it interesting that you prefer the resolution set to 3 while 1000/1100ES owners seem to like the resolution set to minimum with the noise component set to about 3 or 4. The preference of 500/600ES owners to set the resolution to 3 reflects perhaps the lesser quality lens and the need to help it a tad.


BTW Its hopeless using sharpness or other patterns to set the RC. Patterns that use lines
are virtually digital sq waves and are an unreal non realistic torture test for scalars and the like.

Mark Haflich

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

call me at: 240 876 2536

Last edited by mark haflich; 08-06-2014 at 03:14 AM.
mark haflich is offline  
post #3475 of 3651 Old 08-05-2014, 06:06 AM
wse
AVS Special Member
 
wse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 6,791
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 418 Post(s)
Liked: 339
So question of the day will Sony have competition from JVC and Epson this year at CEDIA, what do you think?

My humble Cinema
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
wse is offline  
post #3476 of 3651 Old 08-05-2014, 06:41 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
AV Science Sales 5's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: A beautiful view of a lake
Posts: 7,740
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Liked: 418
Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post
So question of the day will Sony have competition from JVC and Epson this year at CEDIA, what do you think?
My guess is no on Epson and maybe from JVC.

Mike Garrett, AV Science Sales Call Me: 585-671-2968
Email Me:
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Brands we sell: 
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 
Call for B-stock projectors
Stewart, Seymour, SE, SI, Falcon & many more.
RBH, Martin Logan, Triad, Atlantic Technology, MK Sound, BG Radia, SVS & Def Tech.
AV Science Sales 5 is offline  
post #3477 of 3651 Old 08-05-2014, 07:50 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
mark haflich's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: brookeville, maryland, usa
Posts: 19,944
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 446 Post(s)
Liked: 489
I agree with Mike as I usually do. That man is good. I would not be disappointed if JVC had no UHD projector this year. Things are changing rapidly and with a 4K blu ray standard coming by CES I suspect and chips still not available for full HDMI 2.0 and the need to have HDCP 2.2 or its equivalent in order to meet CEA's criteria to be called a UHD display, I think JVC would be better to wait another year.
DavidHir likes this.

Mark Haflich

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

call me at: 240 876 2536
mark haflich is offline  
post #3478 of 3651 Old 08-05-2014, 10:03 PM
wse
AVS Special Member
 
wse's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: USA
Posts: 6,791
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 418 Post(s)
Liked: 339
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post
I agree with Mike as I usually do. That man is good. I would not be disappointed if JVC had no UHD projector this year. Things are changing rapidly and with a 4K blu ray standard coming by CES I suspect and chips still not available for full HDMI 2.0 and the need to have HDCP 2.2 or its equivalent in order to meet CEA's criteria to be called a UHD display, I think JVC would be better to wait another year.
Oh well if that's the case then I will wait an other year

My humble Cinema
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
wse is offline  
post #3479 of 3651 Old 08-05-2014, 10:54 PM
AVS Special Member
 
RapalloAV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Posts: 1,803
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 87 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post
Where do you set the noise filter part of the RC, I find it interesting that you prefer the resolution set to 3 while 1000/1100ES owners seem to like the resolution set to minimum with the noise component set to about 3 or 4. The preference of 500/600ES owners to set the resolution to 3 reflects perhaps the lesser quality lens and the need to help it a tad.


BTW Its hopeless using patterns to set the RC. Patters that use guys are using are virtually digital sq waves and are an unreal non realistic torture test for scalars and the like.

If a sharpness test disc from S&M or DVE is no good for setting RC, what is?

What do you use then to set RC Mark?

Murray Thompson

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

RapalloAV is online now  
post #3480 of 3651 Old 08-06-2014, 12:22 AM
Advanced Member
 
antorsae's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Spain
Posts: 696
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Hey, for those who want to do gaming on the VW600: I've tested the 4K @ 60 Hz resolution using Nvidia's latest (non-beta now) drivers with a Kepler card (I got a 780 ti), and there is a SIGNIFICANT improvement on latency.

I have not done any actual measurements yet, but it is immediately noticeable. I am using 4096x2160p @ 60 Hz. For those worried about 4:2:0 subsampling I really don't notice the difference at my seating distance.

OOO CRT Blend powered OOO
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
antorsae is offline  
Reply Digital Hi-End Projectors - $3,000+ USD MSRP

Tags
Sony Vpl Vw500es , Sony Vpl Vw1000es Projector , Sony Fmp X1 4k Ultra Hd Media Player
Gear in this thread

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off