Official JVC DILA-X500R / RS49U / RS4910U Owners Thread - Page 85 - AVS Forum
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post #2521 of 2539 Old 10-13-2014, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bhartman67 View Post
No you are correct. I tilted the projector to line up the image and then used keystone correction.

I think I should have just used the lens shift to bring the image down?

I think that is what you are saying??
Yes, it is best to use the lens shift and not use the keystone correction (which digitally distorts the output image to "correct" for keystone).

- Jeff

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Small HT: JVC RS4910, Mits HC7900DW, Falcon 2.35:1 100-wide, Marantz SR7008, Triad Gold Omni SE & Silver Surrounds, PSA XS15-base, Oppo 103D, Tivo Mini, HTPC
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post #2522 of 2539 Old 10-13-2014, 03:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjcook View Post
I haven't really A/B the Mits HC7900DW with my JVC RS4910 yet (due in part to the calibration difficulties on the JVC and also lack of tinker time), so I'll just give some pros and cons about the Mits as a complement to my JVC.

Pros:
+ low lag (without impacting image quality!)
+ frame interpolation, with various levels
+ reasonably quiet, much better than the W1070 and HD26 but louder than JVC low lamp
+ image offset+shift up to about 45% above image, which I needed for my setup
+ 10 pt gamma, full CMS
+ price/perf
+ supposedly good 3D with FI

Cons:
- black level and on/off contrast
- poor dyn iris implementation, I keep this off as I get a shadow during low APL with max lens shift. This is what the JVC is for anyways

I had the HC8000, it was really good. I could live with that projector until 4K comes for cheap. I thought it was that good.
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post #2523 of 2539 Old 10-14-2014, 09:55 AM
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Thanks Bhartman, that screen looks incredible with all the lights on! That's a very nice setup.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bhartman67 View Post
Xer0dIn

I am at 18' throw distance.
I really like the constant height.
I am effectively a 114" Diagonal when I project 16:9.

The LED light kit is AWESOME as it makes the zero edge float off the wall.

The wife said I was wasting $500 on the LED kit, then she saw it and said OMG!

She won't watch TV without the LED's on.

http://www.screeninnovations.com/too...jector-wizard/

Use the projector wizard. at 15' throw you can have a :
139" (2.39) Diagonal or (54x128) Max - 2X Zoom.
  • 147" (16.9) Diagonal or (72x 128) Max - 2X Zoom.

I was equally worried about hot spots/ sparkles. I haven't seen anything. I think it is minimized with the JVC on low lamp.
The ambient light rejection which eliminates any washout on the screen more than makes up for any perceived hot spots.
When you combine the deep black of the JVC and the light rejection of the SI I think you have the best picture possible even far beyond this price range.

I watched the Giants game yesterday with the windows wide open and the lights on full blast. But I don't think there is any technology that could make a 27-0 beating look good. LOL.
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post #2524 of 2539 Old 10-14-2014, 10:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bhartman67 View Post
No you are correct. I tilted the projector to line up the image and then used keystone correction.

I think I should have just used the lens shift to bring the image down?

I think that is what you are saying??

Try to not use keystone correction - it's much better to use lens shift !

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post #2525 of 2539 Old 10-14-2014, 10:52 AM
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Question Which signal to send to the RS4910U?

I have mostly 1080p devices (DVD, PS4, Apple TV) and a Verizon FIOS (720p) cable box.

I have all the devices tied into my Marantz SR7007.


Marantz has the ability to upscale all the inputs to 1080p, 1080p 24frames or 4K.
I am finding that scaling to 1080p or passing through the signal at 1080p and allowing the JVC to "e-shift" the picture yield a good image.

Do you have any other thoughts or recommendations?
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post #2526 of 2539 Old 10-14-2014, 11:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bhartman67 View Post
I have all the devices tied into my Marantz SR7007.

Marantz has the ability to upscale all the inputs to 1080p, 1080p 24frames or 4K.
I am finding that scaling to 1080p or passing through the signal at 1080p and allowing the JVC to "e-shift" the picture yield a good image.

Do you have any other thoughts or recommendations?
I have the SR7008. As I understand it is unfortunately all or nothing with the 1080p/60 and 1080p/24 setting, i.e., 1080p/24 will be converted to 1080p/60, and vise-versa on the other setting. It is important for the projector to receive 1080p/24 or 1080p/60 original signal rate particularly if you are using the frame interpolation (CMD).

In my setup I use my Marantz to pass the signal unfettered besides overlaying the volume, etc. The Oppo 103D to always output 1080p (24 & 60), which leaves Bluray unfettered, DVD and built-in apps upscaled to 1080p as necessary, and the TiVo Mini 720p/1080i signal upscaled to 1080p. This setup also allows me to use the 103D's built-in Darbee processing on all the video sources.

I have not tinkered with 4K upscaling on the Marantz too much as my HDMI connection is flaky at that bandwidth. As I input the Oppo into the Marantz I do not use the 4K upscale on the Oppo either. I input into the Marantz to get the volume and input/output audio signal overlays.

I wish there was an out-of-band method for devices to send overlays to a display device. I also wish I could turn off the 4K resolution in the Marantz without forcing 1080p/60 or 1080p/24.

- Jeff

WTB: PSA XS15 or XS15se, PM me.

Small HT: JVC RS4910, Mits HC7900DW, Falcon 2.35:1 100-wide, Marantz SR7008, Triad Gold Omni SE & Silver Surrounds, PSA XS15-base, Oppo 103D, Tivo Mini, HTPC
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post #2527 of 2539 Old 10-16-2014, 09:01 AM
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Hi

I have a 4910 and everything is fine except it never detects 3d side-by-side when set to auto. So i always have to switch manually. Is this normal?

A similar setting on my plasma works fine

Charker
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post #2528 of 2539 Old 10-18-2014, 08:07 AM
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DLA-4910 Image size problem

Hi - hoping someone can help me here!

I am installing a DLA 4910 and have run into a strange problem where the image is not square. No amount of adjustments seem to work. Here are the basics:

92" inch screen16:9
throw = 137"
ceiling mount, front. Projector is above screen, but totally within shift limits


When I use the lens control to adjust the image, the image box is not square. We did every adjustment possible with both lens control and the ceiling mount. We doubled checked to make sure there was not a manufacturing defect with the screen (it's right - 45 x 80, level, etc).

finally we measured the actual image outline in the lens control (the green lines used for focus, shift and zoom). We found that the left and right vertical lines (outer box) are not the same height - they are off by 1/2" . so facing the screen, the right hand side is 1/2" longer (lower) than the left hand side. Consequently there is no way to fit the image precisely in the 92" screen. we can get the top right, but then the bottom corner is way low, etcf.

I have contacted JVC support, and should get more info from them on Monday when there expert is in, but thought I'd post this on the chance that someone else has encountered this and it's a something simple. We did mess with the keystone setting, but it doesn't address the issue.

thanks for any help.
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post #2529 of 2539 Old 10-18-2014, 09:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shaboyi View Post
Hi - hoping someone can help me here!

I am installing a DLA 4910 and have run into a strange problem where the image is not square. No amount of adjustments seem to work. Here are the basics:

92" inch screen16:9
throw = 137"
ceiling mount, front. Projector is above screen, but totally within shift limits


When I use the lens control to adjust the image, the image box is not square. We did every adjustment possible with both lens control and the ceiling mount. We doubled checked to make sure there was not a manufacturing defect with the screen (it's right - 45 x 80, level, etc).

finally we measured the actual image outline in the lens control (the green lines used for focus, shift and zoom). We found that the left and right vertical lines (outer box) are not the same height - they are off by 1/2" . so facing the screen, the right hand side is 1/2" longer (lower) than the left hand side. Consequently there is no way to fit the image precisely in the 92" screen. we can get the top right, but then the bottom corner is way low, etcf.

I have contacted JVC support, and should get more info from them on Monday when there expert is in, but thought I'd post this on the chance that someone else has encountered this and it's a something simple. We did mess with the keystone setting, but it doesn't address the issue.

thanks for any help.
The screen may be level in the vertical plane, but what about in the horizontal plane? If the right side of the screen is slightly further back than the left side of the screen (relative to the projector lens) the right side of the image would be bigger.

What if you physically twist the projector to throw it more to the left then use lens shift to bring the image back to the right? Maybe if you play with that kind of adjustment it might help?
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post #2530 of 2539 Old 10-18-2014, 09:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shaboyi View Post
Hi - hoping someone can help me here!

I am installing a DLA 4910 and have run into a strange problem where the image is not square. No amount of adjustments seem to work. Here are the basics:

92" inch screen16:9
throw = 137"
ceiling mount, front. Projector is above screen, but totally within shift limits


When I use the lens control to adjust the image, the image box is not square. We did every adjustment possible with both lens control and the ceiling mount. We doubled checked to make sure there was not a manufacturing defect with the screen (it's right - 45 x 80, level, etc).

finally we measured the actual image outline in the lens control (the green lines used for focus, shift and zoom). We found that the left and right vertical lines (outer box) are not the same height - they are off by 1/2" . so facing the screen, the right hand side is 1/2" longer (lower) than the left hand side. Consequently there is no way to fit the image precisely in the 92" screen. we can get the top right, but then the bottom corner is way low, etcf.

I have contacted JVC support, and should get more info from them on Monday when there expert is in, but thought I'd post this on the chance that someone else has encountered this and it's a something simple. We did mess with the keystone setting, but it doesn't address the issue.

thanks for any help.
Most likely (90%) this is a setup problem, not a projector problem. Screen may not be perfectly in one plane and/or the projector may not be aligned with the screen perfectly. A picture with the projected image about a 1/2" smaller than the screen would help us to see what the problem is. From what I am reading above, it sounds like the projector is not aligned with the screen. If the right side vertical line is longer than the left, then the projector lens needs to be rotated toward the left side of the screen, just slightly, then lens shifted back to the right.

Always make the image slightly smaller than the screen, so that you can see the relationship of the image to the screen frame and knowing how to read that, tells you what to do with the projector. Generally you swing the lens, toward the small side.

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post #2531 of 2539 Old 10-18-2014, 09:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AV Science Sales 5 View Post
Most likely (90%) this is a setup problem, not a projector problem. Screen may not be perfectly in one plane and/or the projector may not be aligned with the screen perfectly. A picture with the projected image about a 1/2" smaller than the screen would help us to see what the problem is. From what I am reading above, it sounds like the projector is not aligned with the screen. If the right side vertical line is longer than the left, then the projector lens needs to be rotated toward the left side of the screen, just slightly, then lens shifted back to the right.

Always make the image slightly smaller than the screen, so that you can see the relationship of the image to the screen frame and knowing how to read that, tells you what to do with the projector. Generally you swing the lens, toward the small side.
Mike is right on. Any chance your screen wall isn't plumb or out of square with the room?
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post #2532 of 2539 Old 10-18-2014, 10:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shaboyi View Post
finally we measured the actual image outline in the lens control (the green lines used for focus, shift and zoom). We found that the left and right vertical lines (outer box) are not the same height - they are off by 1/2" . so facing the screen, the right hand side is 1/2" longer (lower) than the left hand side. Consequently there is no way to fit the image precisely in the 92" screen. we can get the top right, but then the bottom corner is way low, etcf.
Reset the keystone settings to neutral. You need to yaw left and roll left, then use lens shift to re-center.

This is projector alignment 101, though I've never seen a good visual explanation of it.
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post #2533 of 2539 Old 10-18-2014, 10:28 AM
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thanks for the replys. I'm not at the site now, but the horizontal plain of the screen is level (ie, putting a level on the bottom of the screen when down). I guess it is possible that the entire recessed box is skewed (front right of box a bit back relative to the left side). I think that is what you Mike is suggesting. It's possible and I will certainly check that. Let's assume that is the case. the ceiling is done. so adjusting the recessed box is not really an option. I take it then I would need to adjust the ceiling mount to align it better with the skewed box. I am using a Peerless PRG-Unv mount. Did try various adjustments with no luck. (it should be the roll adjustment - but will certainly try again)

But if this is the problem, and the mount adjustments are insufficient, is it safe to assume that in the worse case I can reposition the entire mount by rotating it slightly to the right (right side of the projector front is a tad closer to the screen)?

thanks again. very helfpful
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post #2534 of 2539 Old Yesterday, 03:32 PM
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Official JVC DILA-X500R / RS49U / RS4910U Owners Thread

2:35 > 16:9 > IMAX scene shift question

For those using a 2:35 screen, during a movie like Dark Knight Rises where a scene in the movie shifts from 2:35 to 16:9 (to fit IMAX shot), how does the 4910 resolve this? Does the zoom stay locked at the full 2:35 width and crop the 16:9 image, zoom in to display a full 16:9 image, or stay at 2:35 and not zoom to let the 16:9 image spill off top and bottom? Or something else?

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post #2535 of 2539 Old Yesterday, 03:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
2:35 > 16:9 > IMAX scene shift question

For those using a 2:35 screen, during a movie like Dark Knight Rises where a scene in the movie shifts from 2:35 to 16:9 (to fit IMAX shot), how does the 4910 resolve this? Does the zoom stay locked at the full 2:35 width and crop the 16:9 image, zoom in to display a full 16:9 image, or stay at 2:35 and not zoom to let the 16:9 image spill off top and bottom? Or something else?
The PJ doesn't know or care what the aspect ratio is. It only zooms when you tell it to. In this case it will spill off the top and bottom.

One way to resolve this is to use a video processor like a Lumagen Radiance to add a mask to the top and bottom of the picture so you won't see that extra part of the image. That's expensive and complicated.

Another way is to get an anamorphic lens, which will always crop the top and bottom automatically.

Another way is to watch the movie in 16:9 mode. That kinda sucks.

Another way is to rip the disc and re-encode the video to crop it to 2.35:1.

None of these are great solutions.
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post #2536 of 2539 Old Yesterday, 07:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
2:35 > 16:9 > IMAX scene shift question

For those using a 2:35 screen, during a movie like Dark Knight Rises where a scene in the movie shifts from 2:35 to 16:9 (to fit IMAX shot), how does the 4910 resolve this? Does the zoom stay locked at the full 2:35 width and crop the 16:9 image, zoom in to display a full 16:9 image, or stay at 2:35 and not zoom to let the 16:9 image spill off top and bottom? Or something else?
I have a scope screen and just suffered with the spilling of the image when watching the last two Dark Knight movies. My walls are black so it wasn't horrific, but I certainly didn't like it. I wish Nolan would have re-thought the shifting AR before releasing this as I found it annoying even on a flat panel.

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post #2537 of 2539 Old Yesterday, 07:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottJ View Post
The PJ doesn't know or care what the aspect ratio is. It only zooms when you tell it to. In this case it will spill off the top and bottom.

One way to resolve this is to use a video processor like a Lumagen Radiance to add a mask to the top and bottom of the picture so you won't see that extra part of the image. That's expensive and complicated.

Another way is to get an anamorphic lens, which will always crop the top and bottom automatically.

Another way is to watch the movie in 16:9 mode. That kinda sucks.

Another way is to rip the disc and re-encode the video to crop it to 2.35:1.

None of these are great solutions.
Thanks for confirming my fears. I started to question my decision to get a 2:35 screen and now wondering if I have to 'settle' for a 16:9.

So even when zoomed out for a 2:35 screen and movie is entirely 2:35, will the 4910 still be projecting black bars? Besides having to use an anomorphic lens, is there a way to maximize resolution/projection of just the 2:35 area?

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post #2538 of 2539 Old Yesterday, 08:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
So even when zoomed out for a 2:35 screen and movie is entirely 2:35, will the 4910 still be projecting black bars? Besides having to use an anomorphic lens, is there a way to maximize resolution/projection of just the 2:35 area?
Yes and no, respectively.

This really doesn't have anything to do with the 4910 specifically; you're likely to get much more discussion and better answers posting in the CIH forum.
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post #2539 of 2539 Old Yesterday, 08:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by asoofi1 View Post
Thanks for confirming my fears. I started to question my decision to get a 2:35 screen and now wondering if I have to 'settle' for a 16:9.

So even when zoomed out for a 2:35 screen and movie is entirely 2:35, will the 4910 still be projecting black bars? Besides having to use an anomorphic lens, is there a way to maximize resolution/projection of just the 2:35 area?
You won't have black bars unless the content is actually 2.40 or 2.55 (like Ben Hur)
Most is around 2.35...and the black bars on a 2.55 movie on a 2.35 screen are negligible imo.

There is no way to maximize true pixel res except with an anamorphic lens. But that kind of set up introduces it's own little quirks and demands.

What you would be able to do is to switch on the e-shift, which gives you a faux 4K resolution. In reality, it will smooth out the pixel structure when you are blowing up something that large. You can further add a Darbee for about $300 into the chain which will sharpen the image a little without introducing too many unwanted artifacts. But Frankly, the on board controls in the e-shift menu allow for some enhancement in the display and most people find that sufficient.
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