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Old 01-02-2014, 05:16 PM
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SOWK, sorry to hear that man! Im still in wait mode for mine as UPS is running really delayed in my area. Its taken a full week to get a unit from NJ to Mass. All of a 4 hour drive.

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Old 01-02-2014, 05:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mariob33 View Post

SOWK, sorry to hear that man! Im still in wait mode for mine as UPS is running really delayed in my area. Its taken a full week to get a unit from NJ to Mass. All of a 4 hour drive.

Mine arrived across the peninsula at Hialeah the morning of the 30th and it's still there, two hours away. UPS promises delivery tomorrow sometime.

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Old 01-02-2014, 06:26 PM
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Very nice, where did you get the velvet I want to do that in my front wall in the mini cinema biggrin.gif
Jo-Ann. Also make sure to use 50% coupon. They have it most of the time. The catch is that if they have Velvet on sale then you can't use the coupon. Really doesn't make any sense but that's how they operate. This Rayal 3 Black Velvet goes for $15 / yard and if they have is for sale then you get it for $12 but go to their site and look for 50%. They post it every now and then. Then call local store and make sure that they don't have this velvet on sale or else they won't accept the coupon. If they don't have it on sale, they will accept your coupon and you'll end up paying 7.50 / yard then. Send me a pm if you decide to go for it. I'll give you a few tips I learned. It's better to learn from others mistakes:-)
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Old 01-02-2014, 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted by SOWK View Post

I haven't posted as I need to get a different unit. frown.gif

No matter what gamma I choose. It stars super low, raises super high, then back super low.


Example: selecting gamma 2.2. Starts at 1.8 @ 10IRE

By 40IRE it is gamma 2.6, and then drops to 1.8 again by 90IRE

Iris is off.

Tried everything I can think of...

Turn projector off then back on.
Tried three different calibration meters.
Uninstalled and reinstalled calibration software.
Turned off computer then back on.

Turn off RC too.

Plus my grey scale is completely ununiform. 0.1 dE at 80IRE, then something like 5 dE at 40IRE, then 1.2 dE @ 30...
Oh that's sad. It also makes me worried. I don't have any of these equipments. If I buy one, I won't even know what's wrong with it.
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Old 01-02-2014, 06:42 PM
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2014: Does the 4 Stand for 4K?

http://www.soundandvision.com/content/2014-does-4-stand-4k

 

Hopefully that will happen as well for projectors and OLED :)

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Old 01-02-2014, 08:32 PM
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It stands for UHD. smile.gif For JVC, the 4 (e-shift 3)ed to 2015 but shown at Cedia.

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Old 01-02-2014, 08:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roxiedog13 View Post

My unit is not like this on start up . It does get a little brighter after 15+ minutes but I never see this level of misconvergence . The blue may be off a little, I can barely see it though. If it were this bad I would have been calling for a replacement ASAP .

Sorry guys, I have to revise my comments. My convergence is off after a REALLY REALLY close inspection following start up tonight. My blue is off about 1/4 of what is shown in post # 85 above and also interesting is the blue is off in the opposite direction ( bottom instead of top) of others I have seen.
Took about 20 minutes to settle down and fully converge .
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Old 01-02-2014, 08:44 PM
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Does yours revert to a reasonable convergence after the required 20-30 min

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Old 01-02-2014, 11:40 PM
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Just got my projector and set up this evening.

On the AVS 709 HD on the resolution patterns I'm getting weird color splotches.

Any ideas? Possibly a setting that needs adjustment?

Thanks!



Edit: So I tried the menu screen on my Panasonic plasma and it had the same diagonal lines and weird pulsing in the background, therefore I can assume it is not a problem with the projector, therefore I deleted the images of the background and text (as it is not a projector problem). The remaining issue with the resolution patterns is still there as the plasma handles these with no issues. I will plan to do some more testing over the weekend, but focus did not seem as impressive as others have stated. I will have to check alignment and report back.

B.
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Old 01-03-2014, 05:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mariob33 View Post

Does yours revert to a reasonable convergence after the required 20-30 min
Quote:
Originally Posted by mariob33 View Post

Does yours revert to a reasonable convergence after the required 20-30 min

I'm going to say yes, the blue does converge so that it is no longer noticeable after 20 minutes. Up really close , initially , the letters show the blue fringing ever so slightly to the outside and the individual letters look a mosaic blended yellow and white . After twenty minutes I see mostly white letters with just a hint
of a yellow/amber hue. Going to have to take some macro pictures with my camera tonight and post with time line I suppose.

One thing is for sure, the picture is awesome after 20-30 minutes. I suppose most projectors have a lamp warm up time anyway, I'm just getting use to turning on the PJ 20 minutes prior to a movie now. Most of the time my guests are slow to assemble in the theater and most are not discriminating anyway.

What I have personally noticed that somewhere around the 30-40 minute mark ( must time this precisely next time ) the PQ becomes noticeably better. Probably a combination of convergence, lamp brightness and our eyes have adjusted to the darker room. I bet nobody factored in the adjustment for a darker
room but it is very important. Pause the movie, turn up the house lamps or go to the washroom with bright lighting and see what happens to the apparent brightness , I guarantee it will look dimmer .
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Old 01-03-2014, 07:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B View Post

Just got my projector and set up this evening.

On the AVS 709 HD misc. pattern screen I'm getting weird changing diagonal distortions--see pics. When I run the resolution patterns I'm getting weird color splotches.

Any ideas? Possibly a setting that needs adjustment?

Thanks!




I bet none of this translates to any abnormally when watching video. My guess based on the 1000ES is that it is caused by the RC (particularly the noise filtering interacting with the non real life torture test of the pattern). Shut the RC off and then reexamine the pattern. One of the problems with RC is using or finding a test pattern that can be used to adjust it properly. On off pixel patterns (square waves etc) are out.

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Old 01-03-2014, 09:06 AM
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hi sorry for my poor English (i'm French)

welcome in my nightmare mad.gif

http://www.hdfever.fr/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=3691&start=500

all (all must) 500es have many issues... (France,England,Swizerland,Luxembourg.....)

Convergences "mooving"

focus (left to right)

noze (sky,night)

and...some 500es are "so good" .....for 100 hours.....after.....welcome in the twilight zone.biggrin.gif

In Europe we think 600es are the must....but no!!
biggrin.gif
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Old 01-03-2014, 10:07 AM
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Hello

Most of the pictures are taken from my 500ES...pretty scary isn't it ?eek.gif
I also have some artefacts issues ( noise,compression artefacts) which are visible starting on this page with Tron legacy BD: http://www.hdfever.fr/forum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=3691&start=860
And continue with Edge of Darkness BD and Oblivion BD
I'm waiting for a replacement model regarding the convergences issue but i'm not sure it will solved all of issues affecting my 500ES:mad:
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Old 01-03-2014, 10:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich View Post

I bet none of this translates to any abnormally when watching video. My guess based on the 1000ES is that it is caused by the RC (particularly the noise filtering interacting with the non real life torture test of the pattern). Shut the RC off and then reexamine the pattern. One of the problems with RC is using or finding a test pattern that can be used to adjust it properly. On off pixel patterns (square waves etc) are out.

Those pictures are with RC off. That is my concern. I edited my original post re: the menu background. However, there is still some color splotchiness with the resolution patterns. Curious if anyone else with this projector could do a quick test and see if they are seeing the same thing?

B.
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Old 01-03-2014, 10:44 AM
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Well after what seemed like an eternity the wait is finally over. The unit is thawing out!
The unit seems in tact (haven't fired it up yet) but the actual Sony box seems to have taken some abuse. The outside double box was fine, so I cant blame UPS! The beating seems to have happened at the distributor which you figure for the $$ paid the distributor would be a bit more careful.. Keeping my fingers crossed that she is ok.







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Old 01-03-2014, 03:07 PM
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Mario

Don't fear my friend. We have more than 15 of these installed and all running well with no issues. We did have a few guys who struggled with the 4K server and getting it setup because sony in their infinite wisdom made the documentation a 4" Fold up handout that most people overlooked.

Go slow and be positive smile.gif

And don't forget that Sony has the most amazing support on their ES support line. They stand behind their ES product like no other and if you do have any issues they are there for you.

As far as the blue convergence its definitely pushed on every sony projector we have ever installed. Mark will tell you the same thing.

I don't know but I am pretty sure Sony does this to get the color to what they deem Sony XBR like coloring.

Its so hard on the forum when you look at close up camera views showing blue push but what you don't realize is that when you put a picture on the screen it looks perfect.

We can anguish all day about perfect convergence but sometimes it doesn't help the picture.

Walk up to a Brand new LG or Samsung or Sony television and look at the Blur in peoples faces and then stand back 10' and voila it looks awesome. Same concept..

Craig
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Old 01-03-2014, 03:37 PM
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The server set up is so easy, even I could do it. The recent problem is with a software update that causes a message to appear on the tablet that the source for buying new titles is down. Not the case. One needs to delete the app from the tablet and do the install of the app etc again.

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Old 01-03-2014, 05:47 PM
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So all the convergence problems are non issues?
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Old 01-03-2014, 08:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B View Post

Just got my projector and set up this evening.

On the AVS 709 HD on the resolution patterns I'm getting weird color splotches.

Any ideas? Possibly a setting that needs adjustment?

Thanks!


B.

Brian,

I ran that pattern on my unit and it shows the exact same as yours. I played with RC and off or on the blotchiness remains.


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Old 01-03-2014, 09:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mariob33 View Post

Well after what seemed like an eternity the wait is finally over. The unit is thawing out!
The unit seems in tact (haven't fired it up yet) but the actual Sony box seems to have taken some abuse. The outside double box was fine, so I cant blame UPS! The beating seems to have happened at the distributor which you figure for the $$ paid the distributor would be a bit more careful.. Keeping my fingers crossed that she is ok.






That's bad! Hopefully it is well protected inside

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Old 01-03-2014, 11:10 PM
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Brian,

I ran that pattern on my unit and it shows the exact same as yours. I played with RC and off or on the blotchiness remains.


Thanks for the sanity check. Now...knowing that it does that, does it bother you?

I'm not seeing the big leap in focus I was hoping for. Brighter, yes. Good color performance, yes. Black level, okay. I'll see what Sony says about the pretty rainbows and then possibly run a calibration.

B.
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Old 01-04-2014, 06:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by mariob33 View Post

Brian,

I ran that pattern on my unit and it shows the exact same as yours. I played with RC and off or on the blotchiness remains.


Thanks for the sanity check. Now...knowing that it does that, does it bother you?

I'm not seeing the big leap in focus I was hoping for. Brighter, yes. Good color performance, yes. Black level, okay. I'll see what Sony says about the pretty rainbows and then possibly run a calibration.

B.

It does bother me a little. I plan on putting a call in to Sony support to get some feedback. I played for over 1.5 hours with settings on both the Oppo and the 600 last night to no avail. Something about the resolution images is tripping up the machine. I tried direct bypassing my AVR same results.

The focus seems pretty close (maybe a tad bit better) to my old JVC units. My colors are spot on and blacks are very good imo. I tried to do a quick greyscale check last night, but I must have had some setting wrong because they weren't great out of the box. I plan to let it run for an hour or so this afternoon/evening and then see. I will admit, if it wasn't for the OCD in me, the OOB settings are wonderful.

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Old 01-04-2014, 07:02 AM
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Oh, one little peeve mad.gif
Why is it that Mfg's have decided to go "green" with the damn user manuals but only put it on disk. Its ok to do so, but at least provide a method to get it off the disk so I can use it on my ipad/tablet. Who the heck still has laptops with built in DVD/CD. Please provide multiple methods of downloads for those of us who are too lazy to search online..

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Old 01-04-2014, 02:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Guys the AVS Disk is 1080P the panels are 2160P

There is scaling artifacts with what would have been 1:1 on 1080P

The blotches you see are normal.
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Old 01-04-2014, 03:11 PM
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Quote:
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Oh, one little peeve mad.gif
Why is it that Mfg's have decided to go "green" with the damn user manuals but only put it on disk. Its ok to do so, but at least provide a method to get it off the disk so I can use it on my ipad/tablet. Who the heck still has laptops with built in DVD/CD. Please provide multiple methods of downloads for those of us who are too lazy to search online..

The manual is In a .pdf format. I prefer a paper manual too. I do like the ability to search--I put in "2.35" and found the place where it tells you how to set the zoom position.

B.
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Old 01-04-2014, 03:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SOWK View Post

Guys the AVS Disk is 1080P the panels are 2160P

There is scaling artifacts with what would have been 1:1 on 1080P

The blotches you see are normal.

I realize the panel is a different shape/horizontally larger; however, when I set it up the actual area of the panel being used is not the full panel. I.e. when you set up the projector and select one of the patterns (focus/zoom/shift) the screen shows you where 1.78 is (and it is well in from the edge). This is the same with 2.35. I originally set it where I thought it would be correct, but it makes sense that it needs to be well in from the edge as well. (This isn't explained well in the manual by numerous diagrams and with the image showing where the different aspect ratios will display on the panel).

So, from what I can tell the projected image is in fact 1920x1080 and not 2160 x 1080.

Therefore, it should still have no problem reproducing the images I posted earlier.

B.
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Old 01-04-2014, 03:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian B View Post

I realize the panel is a different shape/horizontally larger; however, when I set it up the actual area of the panel being used is not the full panel. I.e. when you set up the projector and select one of the patterns (focus/zoom/shift) the screen shows you where 1.78 is (and it is well in from the edge). This is the same with 2.35. I originally set it where I thought it would be correct, but it makes sense that it needs to be well in from the edge as well. (This isn't explained well in the manual by numerous diagrams and with the image showing where the different aspect ratios will display on the panel).

So, from what I can tell the projected image is in fact 1920x1080 and not 2160 x 1080.

Therefore, it should still have no problem reproducing the images I posted earlier.

B.

Aspect ratio (1.78) and pixel density (2K/1080p vs 4K/2160p) are two different things.

The 1080p pattern from the AVS HD disc is displayed in 1.78 on the 500/600ES and takes the whole screen, but it is upscaled from 1080p to 2160p otherwise it would only take one quarter of the screen (as it would use only one quarter of the UHD section of the 2160p panel).

So when this 1080p pattern is upscaled to fill the 2160p screen, this is when these weird artefacts are generated.

They are not generated on real content, it's only because of the very specific design of the test patterns which are meant to be used on displays with 1080p native panels (1:1).

Hopefully the AVS HD guys will give us an AVS UHD/4K disc soon smile.gif

In the meantime, you can get the Burosch 4K patterns if you want native 4K test patterns.

For the Sony 500/600ES, get the projector (beamer) version, they are in 4K and you can easily crop them into UHD resolution. If you get the UHD ones, well they are in UHD resolution and you'll have to pad them to get 4K resolution. Don't expect anything special, it's only a bunch of test patterns in 4K/UHD depending on the version you purchase.
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Old 01-04-2014, 03:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Manni, thanks for posting a better explanation.

Bottom line...

Nothing to worry about and normal for a display that has to scale the image to match the native panel or native 1.78:1 panel larger then 1920x1080.
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Old 01-04-2014, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SOWK View Post

Manni, thanks for the better explanation.

No problem, you were entirely right in the first place smile.gif. Just thought I could try to clarify and offer the link to the 4K/UHD patterns, which do not create such artefacts as they are 1:1 with the 500/600 panels, as you explained.
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Old 01-04-2014, 03:48 PM
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QUESTION FOR ALL 500/600ES OWNERS:

WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THE BLACK LEVELS OF YOUR NEW PROJECTOR?

The new Sony has tempted a number of JVC owners over to the Sony Empire, and one area of concern/interest was if the relatively lower contrast of the new
Sonys would leave anyone "wanting," or satisfied in terms of black levels in dark movies, images.

And, please, for anyone itching to pedantically
jump in and point out there is no single "black level performance" for these projectors, as its all going to alter relative to many factors (screen, throw, iris setting, zoom ratio, etc)....we know.

I'm just looking for the general sense of satisfaction, or not and the perceptual results people are experiencing in their own set ups.

To anyone answering, it would be nice to mention what projector you had before, whether you've chosen to use the dynamic iris (and if not, why not) or anything else relevant to this question.

Thanks
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