Epson 5030/6030 Delayed Start Problem - AVS Forum
View Poll Results: Which of the following best describes your Epson 5030/6030 projector? You can select the last answer
Always starts normally. 8 42.11%
Delayed start seen rarely (less than 10% of the time). 2 10.53%
Delayed start fairly common (but less than half the time). 2 10.53%
Delayed start very common (half the time or more). 5 26.32%
Sometimes it doesn't start at all (orange light). 2 10.53%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 19. You may not vote on this poll

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post #1 of 18 Old 04-24-2014, 05:36 PM - Thread Starter
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On a normal start, these projectors show the EPSON logo on the screen as soon as the lens cover opens (about 30 seconds after power on), but sometimes the lamp strike is delayed and the fan goes into high-speed mode for up to two minutes before the EPSON logo appears.

Worse still, the lamp will sometimes fail to strike at all and the projector simply shuts down after a few minutes in the high fan mode (when this happens the orange lamp light comes on).

This poll is an attempt to find out how common the problem is. Please vote if you own one of these projectors, whether or not yours shows the problem.
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post #2 of 18 Old 04-24-2014, 05:41 PM - Thread Starter
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In my case I'm seeing approximately:
  • 50% normal start
  • 40% delayed start
  • 10% no start

After a failure to start it has always started on the next try. The problem is random, and doesn't seem to be getting worse with time.The temperature in my room is always the same (to within 1 degree). I tried removing and reinserting the lamp, and it made no difference.
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post #3 of 18 Old 04-24-2014, 08:14 PM
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I don't see it as a problem. I think it's a feature of the firmware, and the frequency and length of the extended fan cycle probably takes into account several factors like total hours, number of start/stop cycles, length of start/stop cycles, peak temperatures, etc. As there is no additional 'cooling' that needs to be done on a startup, my best guess it they are using it as a periodic extended cleaning cycle - to blow any accumulated dust out of the light path.

A lot of newer electronics take into account variable factors like that. My car has an oil change indicator that is based primarily on gasoline consumed - drive it easily, and the oil change interval is extended considerably. Drive it aggressively or primarily in stop/go city traffic, and the oil change interval is considerably reduced - as it should be.

It doesn't account for the orange light, of course ... but I haven't run across that one yet. smile.gif
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post #4 of 18 Old 04-25-2014, 05:37 AM - Thread Starter
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I think you're giving Epson too much credit. It's random and I'm sure it's not a design feature (for one thing they would document that behaviour).

And I only wish it was useful at blowing out dust. If anything I think it's actually what caused the minor dust blob that I now have (high fan blowing dust around inside). Opening it up to clean the panels will be another thread at some point in the future smile.gif.

It would be interesting to know what replacing the blub does (meaning a new bulb, not just reseating the old one). But I don't have a spare and I'm not going to buy one just yet as a test.
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post #5 of 18 Old 04-25-2014, 07:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kriktsemaj99 View Post

I think you're giving Epson too much credit. It's random and I'm sure it's not a design feature (for one thing they would document that behaviour).

And I only wish it was useful at blowing out dust. If anything I think it's actually what caused the minor dust blob that I now have (high fan blowing dust around inside). Opening it up to clean the panels will be another thread at some point in the future smile.gif.

It would be interesting to know what replacing the blub does (meaning a new bulb, not just reseating the old one). But I don't have a spare and I'm not going to buy one just yet as a test.

The fan is controlled (like everything else) via programmed logic, in concert with user inputs, saved parameters, and real time sensors. Some criteria has been established to use when setting the timing interval (and speed) of the fan when the projector goes through its boot cycle, and I doubt it's a random number algorithm. I don't see why they would document it, as it's not something that is under user control - much like the speed change between normal and inverted mounting positions.

As for this being a method used for dust control, it's pure speculation on my part - but who's to say your dust problems wouldn't be worse without it? smile.gif
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post #6 of 18 Old 04-25-2014, 09:58 AM - Thread Starter
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I do know that I start the projector under almost identical circumstances each time. It's a basement room with very little temperature variation, and it's always been at least 24 hours since the last start so the unit is fully cooled.

I'm sure there's logic in the firmware to run the fan when deemed necessary after reading various sensors. But I suspect that logic is either acting on changes in sensor readings that are to small to be important, or the sensors on some units are faulty (not producing reliable output). If it's the former, a firmware update could give us consistent short start times.

Anyhow, if enough owners vote in the poll to get reliable statistics, I'll try and get some response from Epson.
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post #7 of 18 Old 04-25-2014, 10:39 AM
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I sent a request to Epson support this morning, to see what they have to say about the controlling factors that vary the startup process. While I was at it, I also asked about the fan speed change when toggling from FRONT projection to FRONT/CEILING.
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post #8 of 18 Old 04-25-2014, 10:52 AM - Thread Starter
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That's great. Although the stock answer from level one support might not be that useful.
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post #9 of 18 Old 04-27-2014, 01:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WestCDA View Post

I sent a request to Epson support this morning, to see what they have to say about the controlling factors that vary the startup process. While I was at it, I also asked about the fan speed change when toggling from FRONT projection to FRONT/CEILING.

This is simply useless information for what I am seeing happen with these units. This didnt happen when it was first purchased and doesnt happen all the time. Something that is inconsistent generally is not something was part of the design but rather a design flaw. If this continues this 2nd unit I have gotten will be going back.
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post #10 of 18 Old 04-27-2014, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlynch34 View Post

This is simply useless information ... .

You're welcome!
Quote:
Originally Posted by dlynch34 View Post

This didnt happen when it was first purchased and doesnt happen all the time. Something that is inconsistent generally is not something was part of the design but rather a design flaw.

Mine has done it since new - I think. I honestly never even gave it a second thought until someone asked about it. Sometimes the projector is ready in 15 seconds, sometimes it takes up to two minutes - I have other equipment like computers that behave the same way and even take a lot longer - I don't give them much thought either.

How do you know the PJ startup time is 'inconsistent', without knowing what factors the PJ takes into account in the boot cycle? I'm guessing that it's probably very consistent - when working with the exact same set of parameters on startup. As I don't know what those parameters are any more than you do, I hope to get some additional information on it from Epson. That may or may not be forthcoming, but I'll certainly pass along anything I find out.
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Originally Posted by dlynch34 View Post

If this continues this 2nd unit I have gotten will be going back.

If you have a recurring issue where the lamp fails to start at all, I'd send it back too. If you find occasionally waiting a few extra seconds during projector startup unacceptable, you're a tough man to please ... smile.gif
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post #11 of 18 Old 06-05-2014, 08:52 PM
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Any updates on this issue? I just started noticing the same issue with mine (6030ub with only about 25 hours on it)...Fan running in high speed for a min or 2 upon start-up BEFORE bulb turns on...once bulb turns on fan speed drops...mine is ceiling mounted...has happened the last 2-3 times I turned it on...
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post #12 of 18 Old 06-05-2014, 09:57 PM
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I had a few back and forth emails with Epson on this, and the fellow responding from support actually went to the effort of querying the engineering group about both this and the fan speed difference in the ceiling mount/inverted position. Regarding the fan duration on startup, the answer he was given was the firmware works with various inputs for fan control - basically if the projector is not overheating the system is working properly. As expected, the higher speed when ceiling mounted is by design, to compensate for anticipated higher temps in that position.

My inquiry was out of curiosity. I really have no concerns when preparing to watch a two hour movie whether the fan initially runs for 20 seconds or 90 seconds on startup - it's just not something I pay any attention to. 😊
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post #13 of 18 Old 06-06-2014, 05:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the update. My unit continues to show the same statistics it did before: approx. 50% immediate starts, 40% delayed starts and 10% no start.

It's quite believable that they would check temperature sensors at startup before striking the lamp, but I still believe the firmware is unnecessarily making the startup time so variable when the unit is cold (and at a very consistent temperature in my case).

When I get the "no start" condition after 2 minutes of high fan speed, the combination of lights is documented as "lamp has a problem". So I will try and get a new lamp out of Epson to see if that solves the issue (I already reseated it and it made no difference). Swapping the projector will be a last resort, given that it's otherwise near perfect and I've spent time calibrating it.
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post #14 of 18 Old 06-06-2014, 07:28 AM
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I have a 6020 and experience a similar start up delays but NOT at the frequency you do. For reference, my 6020 is shelf mounted.

For me it's:
78% immediate starts,
20% delayed starts and
2% no start

IMO, It's a design flaw in the system check down process. (is power ok, is the bulb too hot, does the bulb have a good connection, etc)

For my three no starts (over the past year of use), one had "The lamp light flashes red", unplug.... plug back in and it's fine. If the check down process was put together well an unplug would not remedy this. It's basically a false positive.

But it's a flaw I'll live with at my delay rate smile.gif

I don't think I could live with a 10% no start rate.

Here is my build thread:

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post #15 of 18 Old 06-06-2014, 08:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the info.

I hope all owners will vote in the poll (with only 14 votes I suspect not everyone has).
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post #16 of 18 Old 06-06-2014, 08:42 AM
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I was hoping (but not expecting) that Epson might indicate what factors and sensors were being used to set the fan duration on startup, as I was curious - but I wasn't surprised with their less than detailed answer. My projector starts up in virtually identical conditions each time - it's usually been sitting for days, ceiling mounted in a cool basement room that is probably almost always right about 18C/65F in temp. As stated, the fan runs for variable durations when it starts. Their startup logic could be looking at any number of things other than temperature, such as number of starts, total run time, time since last start, duration of last power up interval, average run time, etc. It could be a combination of stored variable data points and real time sensors like temperature, voltage, rotational speed of the fan, power draw, etc. They could be using the occasional extended fan interval to help purge dust, or to ensure the bearings remain noise free over the life of the projector. Who knows? (Beside Epson) smile.gif

Bottom line for me - I don't really care, as long as it works.

If my projector consistently failed to light on startup, with the orange 'lamp error' indicator, I would be more concerned about that. I believe that happened once shortly after receiving the projector, and I simply cycled the power and was back in business. If it was a regular occurrence I'd be contacting Epson support about it. That sounds like a likely candidate for a firmware fix, as there does not appear to be any actual fault based on the reports I've seen so far. If a simple power cycle fixes it, they should be able to make the system verify the 'bad' reading in the initial startup by clearing any internal registers and checking it again, doing a second start attempt on the bulb, etc.

As mentioned, it could be a bad bulb issue - perhaps some bulbs have a higher internal resistance to starting than others, and a simple swap would eliminate the problem. If you do go that route, please let us know the results.
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post #17 of 18 Old 06-16-2014, 04:06 AM
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My 6030 is 6 months old - 2 weeks ago it failed to start went to high speed fan then orange flashing light then shut down. I restarted with no problem. It has done this 3 times since and I was going to replace the bulb to see if that would resolve the problem but it since went back to starting immediately every time.
I also had a dust blob (blueish spot left bottom of screen) that seems to have almost disappeared since the start-up problem first appeared. I will post again if the start-up problem reappears.
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post #18 of 18 Old 09-03-2014, 03:04 PM
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I am 6030 Owner, and I have experienced the delayed start issue.

At one point, my installer happened to be over and it happened to not start at all, orange light and all.

We unplugged it, it started and ran just fine. It has occasionally done the delayed startup thing in the weeks since, but has never failed and shut off again. I don't mind it so much, it runs perfectly well after it's on.

I do wonder why, though.

"You advance yourself only by my good graces."
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