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post #1 of 24 Old 03-11-2015, 07:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Conversion lens for Sony-hw55

Hi,

I am thinking bying sony vpl hw55 but problem is my room size. Its only 2.68 (8 feet) metres long and sony takes 46cm of that so I could only produce about 1.5-1,6 metres wide image with sonys throw ratio and my goal is 2 metres or even 2.2 metres wide image.

Is there any compatible conversion lenses which would fit to this model with reasonable price tag.

For example I found this http://www.amazon.com/Sony-VCLHG0758.../dp/B000063XWC

In the comments one customer says. "Does a great job of widening the viewable image on a projector at short distance"

Is there any better lens options? or other options? does the quality of image suffer from using lenses?
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post #2 of 24 Old 03-11-2015, 08:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irpejoo View Post
Hi,

I am thinking bying sony vpl hw55 but problem is my room size. Its only 2.68 (8 feet) metres long and sony takes 46cm of that so I could only produce about 1.5-1,6 metres wide image with sonys throw ratio and my goal is 2 metres or even 2.2 metres wide image.

Is there any compatible conversion lenses which would fit to this model with reasonable price tag.

For example I found this http://www.amazon.com/Sony-VCLHG0758.../dp/B000063XWC

In the comments one customer says. "Does a great job of widening the viewable image on a projector at short distance"

Is there any better lens options? or other options? does the quality of image suffer from using lenses?

The only one I've used is the Navitar HDSSW065 0.65X HD Wide Angle Converter Lens. No distortion at all.


http://www.navitar.com/product/hd-sc...ar-lenses.aspx


They aren't cheap. Look for a used one perhaps.

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post #3 of 24 Old 03-11-2015, 09:53 AM
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I have a Navitar Screenstar 0.65x conversion lens for sale in the classifieds for much below retail (see my signature below for link). However, it is the standard-sized lens and not the HD-sized lens and so it is hard to say if it would work for you or not; if you needed the whole 0.65x power (53% wider image) of the lens then you may risk vignette but if say only ~0.8x conversion (25% wider image) then you may have a good chance of no vignette.

Another option is to use a first surface mirror on the rear wall to increase your throw distance, this is the method I use in my 10' deep theater room. I can elaborate if you are interested.

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post #4 of 24 Old 03-11-2015, 12:30 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for info and offers. I will consider your lens. I have already contacted navitar for their suitable lenses but no response yet.

Another option I have is to make a hole 22cm high x 50cm wide to top of my opposite wall because I have cabins behind that wall and 22cm free space over them so the projector It would kind come inside the wall and halfly over the cabins. Also I could put some panel over the cabins so you couldnt see the projector from another room and block some sound from another room. The space over the cabins is like 300cm x 60x so there would be enough air flow for projector to breath. Do you think it would be enough?

Do you think this would be better option than bying lenses. That way I could hide the whole projector and not use ugly mounting options. That way I could get 270 cm viewing distance and propably suitable 90" screen.
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post #5 of 24 Old 03-12-2015, 08:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjcook View Post
I have a Navitar Screenstar 0.65x conversion lens for sale in the classifieds for much below retail (see my signature below for link). However, it is the standard-sized lens and not the HD-sized lens and so it is hard to say if it would work for you or not; if you needed the whole 0.65x power (53% wider image) of the lens then you may risk vignette but if say only ~0.8x conversion (25% wider image) then you may have a good chance of no vignette.

Another option is to use a first surface mirror on the rear wall to increase your throw distance, this is the method I use in my 10' deep theater room. I can elaborate if you are interested.
Hi, JJ, You were talking about mirrors. What would you think would be the smallest size mirror which would work in opposite wall in my space to throw about 85" screen with sony hw55. Can you estimate would it be aesthetically ugly? Room size is about 8 feet (throw distance) x 8.9 feet wide and 7.2 feet high.
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post #6 of 24 Old 03-12-2015, 08:33 PM
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Originally Posted by irpejoo View Post
Hi, JJ, You were talking about mirrors. What would you think would be the smallest size mirror which would work in opposite wall in my space to throw about 85" screen with sony hw55. Can you estimate would it be aesthetically ugly? Room size is about 8 feet (throw distance) x 8.9 feet wide and 7.2 feet high.
Assuming 8 ft from screen to rear wall and assuming you mean a 85" diagonal 16:9 screen, then you need about 8.5 ft of throw distance at minimum throw, so the projector would need to be a minimum of 7 inches from rear wall. The mirror would be approximately 5.2 inch x 2.9 inch in size. However at that distance and if using maximum lens shift of 70% the light beam will only drop 1.15 inches and so will hit the projector. As such, you would need to angle the projector and mirror; at 15 degrees and 7 inch from wall you will raise the projector 1.85 inches. Combined that is about 3 inches, which still isn't enough to clear the projector bottom.

(To be continued)

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If instead you place the projector 12 inches from rear wall, the light beam will drop 1.9 inches, and at 15 degree angle will raise the projector by 3.2 inches, a total of 5.1 inches which would likely clear the projector bottom. At 12 inches from wall, the mirror would be 8.4 x 4.75 inches.

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post #8 of 24 Old 03-12-2015, 09:57 PM
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Here is a link to a post showing my 25x15 inch mirror:
Need a $4000 projector with good 2D AND 3D performance

And a panoramic shot of the room:
Need a $4000 projector with good 2D AND 3D performance

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post #9 of 24 Old 03-14-2015, 12:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jjcook View Post
If instead you place the projector 12 inches from rear wall, the light beam will drop 1.9 inches, and at 15 degree angle will raise the projector by 3.2 inches, a total of 5.1 inches which would likely clear the projector bottom. At 12 inches from wall, the mirror would be 8.4 x 4.75 inches.
Wow that sound great! Thanks for info! So I needed to tilt the projector and mirror about 15 degrees. How high the top of the screen is going to be if I do this option with max lens shift? Do I have to put the mirror lower if using lens shift. Is there any calculator anywhere where I can measure these things more carefully or how the calculations are done. Do you recommend the mirror to be also little larger so that I dont have to be so precise with mounting and leave some room with zooming the picture perfectly.
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post #10 of 24 Old 03-14-2015, 09:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irpejoo View Post
Wow that sound great! Thanks for info! So I needed to tilt the projector and mirror about 15 degrees. How high the top of the screen is going to be if I do this option with max lens shift? Do I have to put the mirror lower if using lens shift. Is there any calculator anywhere where I can measure these things more carefully or how the calculations are done. Do you recommend the mirror to be also little larger so that I dont have to be so precise with mounting and leave some room with zooming the picture perfectly.
As the screen is 41.7 inches tall, using the 70% lens shift (20% above screen top) is 8.3 inches plus the 3.2 inches from tilting, so center of lens would be about 11.5 inches above screen top.

There is no projector-tilt-mirror calculator that I am aware of, just trigonometry and paper

If nothing is mounted yet, I would recommend first mounting the projector and tilting it to 15 degrees, then using maximum zoom and maximum lens shift to find the mirror size and location that you need. The mirror will be at 7.5 degrees. After getting the mirror and mounting it, you can then mount the screen where the image is projected. Getting a mirror slightly larger (or adjustable mount) will give you tolerance for fine adjustment.

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post #11 of 24 Old 03-15-2015, 05:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jjcook View Post
As the screen is 41.7 inches tall, using the 70% lens shift (20% above screen top) is 8.3 inches plus the 3.2 inches from tilting, so center of lens would be about 11.5 inches above screen top.

There is no projector-tilt-mirror calculator that I am aware of, just trigonometry and paper

If nothing is mounted yet, I would recommend first mounting the projector and tilting it to 15 degrees, then using maximum zoom and maximum lens shift to find the mirror size and location that you need. The mirror will be at 7.5 degrees. After getting the mirror and mounting it, you can then mount the screen where the image is projected. Getting a mirror slightly larger (or adjustable mount) will give you tolerance for fine adjustment.
If I mount the projector to my ceiling with my current mount, http://www.tvwallmount.co.uk/monoprojector-silver.html ), the projector will be at 5.7 inch from ceiling and increasing tilting 15 degrees with half of the projectors length the projector goes down additional 2.4 inches. Addition to this the lamp is situated about half way in projectors high distance so it adds additional 3.5 inches downwards. So at this setup the lamp is located 11.6 inches from ceiling and if you add lens shift and zooming (11.5 inches) the top of the picture will be at 23.1 inches from ceiling. Are my calculations correct?

Anyway, I would prefer the top of the screen would be about 4 inch lower. What adjustmens should I take. Does this mean putting the projector further from back wall and increasing the mirror size? I assume I can also do this by buying a mount is 4 inch higher or adjustable to 4 inch lower than my current one.

Do you have any experience using 2 mirror setups instead of one?

Your plan with mounting and assembling sounds good to me otherwise
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post #12 of 24 Old 03-15-2015, 05:20 AM
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Hi jjcook,

as you are selling your navistar and installed a mirror solution, does that imply that you find the mirror solution superior to the navistar lens? I also went the mirror route and already have the surface mirror sitting here ready for installation. I am wondering why you angled the projector and the mirror. I plan to put the projector 1 meter from the backwall with the mirror. Both the mirror and projector are parallel and i wanted to use the lenseshift to clear the lower part of the projector when the beam comes back from the mirror. Am I missing something here? Or is your room extraordinarily high or low?

great to find a fellow mirror user!


Quote:
Originally Posted by jjcook View Post
As the screen is 41.7 inches tall, using the 70% lens shift (20% above screen top) is 8.3 inches plus the 3.2 inches from tilting, so center of lens would be about 11.5 inches above screen top.

There is no projector-tilt-mirror calculator that I am aware of, just trigonometry and paper

If nothing is mounted yet, I would recommend first mounting the projector and tilting it to 15 degrees, then using maximum zoom and maximum lens shift to find the mirror size and location that you need. The mirror will be at 7.5 degrees. After getting the mirror and mounting it, you can then mount the screen where the image is projected. Getting a mirror slightly larger (or adjustable mount) will give you tolerance for fine adjustment.
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post #13 of 24 Old 03-17-2015, 07:36 AM
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Originally Posted by irpejoo View Post
So at this setup the lamp is located 11.6 inches from ceiling and if you add lens shift and zooming (11.5 inches) the top of the picture will be at 23.1 inches from ceiling. Are my calculations correct?

Anyway, I would prefer the top of the screen would be about 4 inch lower. What adjustmens should I take. Does this mean putting the projector further from back wall and increasing the mirror size? I assume I can also do this by buying a mount is 4 inch higher or adjustable to 4 inch lower than my current one.

Do you have any experience using 2 mirror setups instead of one?

Your plan with mounting and assembling sounds good to me otherwise
Your calculations are essentially correct. What is good to do is over shoot the screen -- I mean keeping the projector at 15 degrees, lower the projector with an extension tube until at max lens shift the picture should be slightly below the final height you'd like, then you can simply use a little less lens shift to bring the picture up to final height.

Pulling the projector further back from the wall but using the same mounting distance from ceiling would work instead of an extension pole; you'd need to be about 27-28 inches (instead of 12) from wall to lower 4 inches; mirror would be about 16.5x9.5.

Two mirrors is considered very difficult to align properly, I'd stay away from that unless absolutely necessary.

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Originally Posted by jojodyne View Post
Hi jjcook,

as you are selling your navistar and installed a mirror solution, does that imply that you find the mirror solution superior to the navistar lens? I also went the mirror route and already have the surface mirror sitting here ready for installation. I am wondering why you angled the projector and the mirror. I plan to put the projector 1 meter from the backwall with the mirror. Both the mirror and projector are parallel and i wanted to use the lenseshift to clear the lower part of the projector when the beam comes back from the mirror. Am I missing something here? Or is your room extraordinarily high or low?

great to find a fellow mirror user!
I never had the Navitar in my set up to compare (the one I'm selling is too small for my configuration and was not acquired for it).

The mirror/projector are angled primarily to raise the projector closer to my 9 foot ceiling, but also I didn't need to mount the projector as far from the back wall to clear the bottom had I kept it parallel to the floor.

I've had the mirror set up for about 14 months and I'm very happy with it. I just use a hand lens air puffer to blow dust off of it every 2-3 months.

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I really should take the time to write up a mirror FAQ too

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post #16 of 24 Old 03-18-2015, 06:35 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jjcook View Post
Your calculations are essentially correct. What is good to do is over shoot the screen -- I mean keeping the projector at 15 degrees, lower the projector with an extension tube until at max lens shift the picture should be slightly below the final height you'd like, then you can simply use a little less lens shift to bring the picture up to final height.

Pulling the projector further back from the wall but using the same mounting distance from ceiling would work instead of an extension pole; you'd need to be about 27-28 inches (instead of 12) from wall to lower 4 inches; mirror would be about 16.5x9.5.

Two mirrors is considered very difficult to align properly, I'd stay away from that unless absolutely necessary.
Thank you for info! I will go for extended mount. I will update how its going to end up finally.
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Originally Posted by jjcook View Post
Your calculations are essentially correct. What is good to do is over shoot the screen -- I mean keeping the projector at 15 degrees, lower the projector with an extension tube until at max lens shift the picture should be slightly below the final height you'd like, then you can simply use a little less lens shift to bring the picture up to final height.

Pulling the projector further back from the wall but using the same mounting distance from ceiling would work instead of an extension pole; you'd need to be about 27-28 inches (instead of 12) from wall to lower 4 inches; mirror would be about 16.5x9.5.

Two mirrors is considered very difficult to align properly, I'd stay away from that unless absolutely necessary.
I dont get it. My setup is pretty much done. I installed my projector to ceiling and put the projector on and zoomed image to fit my 8.4" wide mirror. The result was only about 140 cm wide image as it should have been 187 cm wide (73"). How is that possible. I thougt the distance from projector to wall was an extension added to from wall to screen. Your mirror is 25" wide and mine is 8", are you sure it works this way. I am confused. Spent a lot of money to mirror and cutting it. The distance from projector lamp to wall is about 14" instead of 12". Missed some calculations. Does this matter`?
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What's the distance from the lens on the projector to the mirror and what's the distance from the mirror to your screen?

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post #19 of 24 Old Yesterday, 08:41 AM - Thread Starter
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What's the distance from the lens on the projector to the mirror and what's the distance from the mirror to your screen?
Distance from projector lens to mirror is 14" and distance from mirror to screen is about 103". I got it to work with abot 10" wide mirror at that distance. Luckily I had leftover piece of that front mirror so I can use it. The guys at the mirror cutting company soiled my mirror with fingerprints. Is there special way to clean the mirror.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by irpejoo View Post
I dont get it. My setup is pretty much done. I installed my projector to ceiling and put the projector on and zoomed image to fit my 8.4" wide mirror. The result was only about 140 cm wide image as it should have been 187 cm wide (73"). How is that possible. I thougt the distance from projector to wall was an extension added to from wall to screen. Your mirror is 25" wide and mine is 8", are you sure it works this way. I am confused. Spent a lot of money to mirror and cutting it. The distance from projector lamp to wall is about 14" instead of 12". Missed some calculations. Does this matter`?
Quote:
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Distance from projector lens to mirror is 14" and distance from mirror to screen is about 103". I got it to work with abot 10" wide mirror at that distance. Luckily I had leftover piece of that front mirror so I can use it. The guys at the mirror cutting company soiled my mirror with fingerprints. Is there special way to clean the mirror.
Well first of all I had calculated 8.4 inches minimum mirror width based on 12" from projector to wall and for a 8 ft (96") distance from wall to screen (per your prior posts) not 103". If the lens is 14" from the rear wall (measuring parallel to the ceiling), then the mirror needs to be at least (screenwidth)*14/(14+103) inches wide (assuming the image is a point source at the lens, which it is not); for your ~85" diagonal 16:9 screen that is 187 cm (73.6 inches) wide, that is 73.6*14/(14+103) = 8.8 inches at minimum. Furthermore, that was without providing for any tolerance. It seems you did not follow my suggestion to mount the projector first and actually measure the image size on the rear wall to confirm mirror size and to get a slightly larger mirror for tolerance.

I'm glad to hear your 10" mirror will work out. I don't have any first surface mirror cleaning directions as I've never needed to do so, but you can find that with search on the web.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jjcook View Post
If nothing is mounted yet, I would recommend first mounting the projector and tilting it to 15 degrees, then using maximum zoom and maximum lens shift to find the mirror size and location that you need. The mirror will be at 7.5 degrees. After getting the mirror and mounting it, you can then mount the screen where the image is projected. Getting a mirror slightly larger (or adjustable mount) will give you tolerance for fine adjustment.

For Sale: Navitar SSW065 short throw conversion lens
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post #21 of 24 Old Yesterday, 10:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Well first of all I had calculated 8.4 inches minimum mirror width based on 12" from projector to wall and for a 8 ft (96") distance from wall to screen (per your prior posts) not 103". If the lens is 14" from the rear wall (measuring parallel to the ceiling), then the mirror needs to be at least (screenwidth)*14/(14+103) inches wide (assuming the image is a point source at the lens, which it is not); for your ~85" diagonal 16:9 screen that is 187 cm (73.6 inches) wide, that is 73.6*14/(14+103) = 8.8 inches at minimum. Furthermore, that was without providing for any tolerance. It seems you did not follow my suggestion to mount the projector first and actually measure the image size on the rear wall to confirm mirror size and to get a slightly larger mirror for tolerance.

I'm glad to hear your 10" mirror will work out. I don't have any first surface mirror cleaning directions as I've never needed to do so, but you can find that with search on the web.
Yes, this was my bad. I "remembered" 1 foot being 33 cm and not 30 cm as it is so that was the error I made. I will have to mount it somehow but luckily dont have to order a new one. Thanks for quick reply.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irpejoo View Post
Yes, this was my bad. I "remembered" 1 foot being 33 cm and not 30 cm as it is so that was the error I made. I will have to mount it somehow but luckily dont have to order a new one. Thanks for quick reply.
Once you have everything set up, it would be great if you could post a picture of your set up.

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post #23 of 24 Unread Today, 01:05 AM
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I have already contacted navitar for their suitable lenses but no response yet.
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post #24 of 24 Unread Today, 01:40 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by jjcook View Post
Once you have everything set up, it would be great if you could post a picture of your set up.
I will
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