G11 or G15 ?? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 15 Old 04-20-2001, 02:08 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm still looking at Digital Projectors, and have not definitely decided to go DILA, but I have a question for the group..

If you were me, and you wanted a Digital projector for a dedicated HT..

Would you:

Get a new calibrated G-11 with guaranteed no dead pixels??

Or for about 2K more get a new, uncalibrated G-15, with no guarantees on dead pixels??

What is the biggest differences between the G-11 and the G-15 other than more brightness??

Is that difference worth 2k, with no guarantee of dead pixels??

Thoughts, opinions??

-- Cain

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post #2 of 15 Old 04-20-2001, 04:53 PM
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Where can one find a new calibrated G11 with a definite no-dead-pixels?

I personally would go for that, but if choosing between a calibrated G15 and a calibrated G11, I'd go for the G15.

paulb
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post #3 of 15 Old 04-20-2001, 05:22 PM
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Cain: This question is one I had recently. Take a look at the following link: http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/Forum10/HTML/005561.html

Good Luck!

Joe Andresen
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post #4 of 15 Old 04-20-2001, 05:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Thx Joe..

What did you decide to do???

-- Cain

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post #5 of 15 Old 04-20-2001, 05:36 PM
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jvc no longer makes g11, this model has been discontinued.

g15 is still in the making plus the extra brightness gives more of 3d effect to the images ( you can't ever get enough lumen:brightness of a projector!)

the choice is obvious. good luck.

seng
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post #6 of 15 Old 04-20-2001, 08:44 PM
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Hi Cain,

I remember that Joe (bluhorizon) picked up a G11. I thought for sure that he was going to jump in on the recent G15 PowerBuy at the last minute, so I kept checking that thread to see, but I guess he decided on a G11 instead.

I have to be honest with you, if I could do it all over again, I would pick up a G15 in a minute. In fact, as much as I love my G11, that thought still does cross my mind once in a while http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/biggrin.gif.

Mark Hunter
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Datacolor, Inc.
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post #7 of 15 Old 04-21-2001, 03:21 AM - Thread Starter
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Thx Mark, I knew you'd wade in here sooner or later ;-) So you'd jump on the G-15 in a sec, eh?? I was/am leaning that way. It also apparently has some screw or something that makes an upside down install work better (not sure what that means tho).

Mark, I get up to Raleigh for business every few months(my boss is there) and I would really like to stop by your place one time to take a look at your set-up, if possible. My room will easily accomodate an install similar to your through-the-wall set-up.

Can someone answer a quick question for me?? If my rear wall is 19'2" and I want to do a milori type installation, what screen sizes will this accomodate?? IOW, what screen sizes will a G-15 throw from 19'2", smallest and largest??

Many thanks for the help folks,

-- Cain


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post #8 of 15 Old 04-21-2001, 07:14 AM
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Cain,

If you mount the G15 19.2' from the screen, a 4:3 screen size would be in these ranges:

Diagonal Range: 98.3 - 152.3 in. ( 8.2 - 12.7 ft.)
Height Range: 59.0 - 91.4 in. ( 4.9 - 7.6 ft.)
Width Range: 78.7 - 121.9 in. ( 6.6 - 10.2 ft.)

If you are thinking about a 16:9 screen (you didn't specify), use the width measurements about and determine the height from the ratio (divide by 1.78).

A nice choice about in the middle would be the common 8 foot wide screen (96"x54" for a 16:9 screen), but if your room width can handle it, a 10 foot screen would be nice!

Cain, contact me by e-mail the next time you have a trip to Raleigh planned and we'll try to pull something together. Warning: My home theater "opens" and "closes" fairly frequently, and since my boxes of sensors arrived yesterday, I will probably close the theater soon and mess up my projector's gamma to work on Dilard. I can return it to "optimized" with a day's notice, though.

Mark Hunter
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Datacolor, Inc.
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post #9 of 15 Old 04-21-2001, 09:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Thx Mark.. My next Raleigh trip looks to be July 17th, I'll drop you an e-mail..

Yes, I was thinking 16:9 and I am also thinking 8 foot wide screen, it sounds like the throw distances work out perfectly.

Take care, thanks for the info,

-- John Cain

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post #10 of 15 Old 04-22-2001, 05:06 AM
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I have a G11 and an ISCO with a 19 ft throw distance. I think if you spend the money on an ISCO you will get a larger picture (horizontal expansion) with good brightness. Remember if you use a G15 in a 16:9 setup without the lens, you are losing about 25% of the pixels-- 1365x1024 vs 1365x768--and therefore 25% of the brightness of the projector.

You would have good impact with the G15 on an 8 ft screen witha foot lambert calc of 31 (no ISCO), on an 11 ft screen it would be 22 (with ISCO).

I am running an 11 ft screen and am very pleased. With my G11, I have about 15 foot lamberts, more than enough, I think, based on what I have read. This is comparable to what Dean Mc Manis is running with his G15, ISCO and a 15 ft wide screen!

For me, the bright scenes are plenty bright, and i have good light control with a black rug and ceiling, so there is little washout.

Hope this helps


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post #11 of 15 Old 04-22-2001, 06:22 AM
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Just to add a bit to the dead pixel question...

I have not heard of this being a possibility offered on these projectors, even if paying more for the guarantee of it. I believe dead pixels are an inherent fault within the digital technology altogether, and cannot be overcome, at least not yet.

If this were not the case, please feel free to point me in the right direction, as my projector has recently developed a stuck-on pixel out of the blue and after 150 hrs of use. I was very surprised this happened the way it happened.

Luca
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post #12 of 15 Old 04-22-2001, 08:53 AM
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John:

I just recently purchased a 20 hr old G11 for $5000. If money were no object, certainly the G15 offers several advantages. However I wanted to budget in a Stewart Grayhawk screen, htpc, hushbox, and possibly an ISCO lens as well. I also figured that I would need some extra money to buy some DVD's! Finally, I hope to upgrade to the next generation 1920X1080 Dila as soon as it becomes available.

Joe Andresen
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post #13 of 15 Old 04-22-2001, 08:16 PM
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Joe,

Here is what Tom Stites of JVC [then] had to say about the
1920X1080 or QXGA D-ILA device:
http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/Forum10/HTML/004124.html

where Tom states:

"Our QXGA based product is actually a little ahead of schedule but,
don't get all excited about it though, it's 7000 lumens and priced
around $200K"

Greg

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post #14 of 15 Old 04-22-2001, 09:07 PM
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I remember that thread. I got very upset at JVC for the (IMHO) direction of marketing towards the high end and flamed a bit.

Anyhow, a link I just found is the JVC NAB 2001 information at:

http://www.jvc.com/pro/pr/2001/qxga.htm

Note that the device is a 1.3" device or about a 6 cm^2 die size. The Pentium 4 has a 2.17 cm2 die size. However, most of the DILA chip's size is open area and should not be sensitive to small defects (< .5 um). Even if the yield is 25% of the Pentium 4, a retail price for a single chip should be less than $1K in volume.

In a one-chip implelementation, i.e.
http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/Forum10/HTML/005837.html
a projector could retail (street price) for $5K easily.

JVC will milk it for the high end, as long as possible. Until there is LCOS competition, I don't expect this to change. Note that JVC makes a big deal about its patent portfolio. I'm happy to see that they are at least OEM'ing the chips.




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Ken Elliott

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post #15 of 15 Old 04-23-2001, 09:50 PM
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Ken,

Thank you for the link to JVC NAB 2001

The title of the release says it all:

"Development of Ultra-high Resolution (QXGA)
Large-screen Projection Technology"

Anytime JVC uses the words "Large-screen", they are not talking
about home theater - they are talking about commercial movie
theaters.

Greg

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