Any BenQ W9000 Owners Out There? - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 1162 Old 02-12-2007, 06:30 PM
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mrigsby -

Thanks for taking the plunge on behalf of the rest of us to buy sight unseen. And thanks the great review and follow-up information.

You can ship your unit to me if you need help breaking in that lamp

Brent
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post #92 of 1162 Old 02-12-2007, 06:44 PM
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Brent I think he was referring to the 10000, but it would be nice if he meant the 9000.

Dale
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post #93 of 1162 Old 02-12-2007, 06:46 PM
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I have seen some conflicting information on throw ratio. The latest wisdom is 100" diagonal at 4m or 156". I am wondering if the Projector Central calculator is correct. I want this thing as far back as possible from a 117" diagonal. The calculator shows 17.1 feet. I compute 15.1 feet.

What does the manual say about zoom range and placement?

K
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post #94 of 1162 Old 02-12-2007, 06:49 PM
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Thanks too to the early posters on this unit, and the 10000 also.

I really want a quiet projector, dont use it that much just for the odd movie, HDTV sports, I've used DLP for a few years and like the pixel perfect images it produces.

I think the w9000 is worth a try, I'm not clear on the differences from it and the w10000 so might as well give the lower costing one a try first. I might be able to have a look at the JVC soon too, but at 40-50% or so more, it would have to really exceed the Benq to justify the cost.

One thing, is the comments in Jason's review that the w10000 was soft, also I think Brian mentioned that with the w9000 he saw, the other web review mentions very good optics and a sharp image?

Also anyone know the minimum dist back for a 92" screen?


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post #95 of 1162 Old 02-12-2007, 08:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbacksfan51 View Post

So would you say it does OK with some Ambient Light? I dont have a bat cave, but rather a living room with Blackout shades. With my current PJ, I can get away with weekend football or sports with my .8 gain screen, but if I end up going with the W9000 I will most likely change my screen material to Carada's 1.4 gain. Movie watching will be done at night, when I can get the room pitch black.

I am referring to ANSI CR and not lumen output. It will do fine as far as brightness goes and probably be better than the Sharp in this area.

Eric Awtry
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post #96 of 1162 Old 02-12-2007, 08:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kiwishred View Post

From post #53Eric - From context, I think the CR numbers you measured are for the W9000, not the W10000. Can you confirm that ?

Also do you have the corresponding numbers for the W10000 (or W9000 as the case may be) ? Or can we infer from the previous post that they are 25-30% higher ?

Thanks,
Brent

No, I do not have a 9000 in my possession yet. All my measurements are from a W10000. I am being a bit specualtive based on conversations with BenQ.

Eric Awtry
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post #97 of 1162 Old 02-12-2007, 08:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JackLT View Post

Thanks too to the early posters on this unit, and the 10000 also.

I really want a quiet projector, dont use it that much just for the odd movie, HDTV sports, I've used DLP for a few years and like the pixel perfect images it produces.

I think the w9000 is worth a try, I'm not clear on the differences from it and the w10000 so might as well give the lower costing one a try first. I might be able to have a look at the JVC soon too, but at 40-50% or so more, it would have to really exceed the Benq to justify the cost.

One thing, is the comments in Jason's review that the w10000 was soft, also I think Brian mentioned that with the w9000 he saw, the other web review mentions very good optics and a sharp image?

Also anyone know the minimum dist back for a 92" screen?

I would like to speak to the softness. I have yet to see a new 1080p DLP (Marantz, Sharp or BenQ) that did not appear softer compared to its 720p counterpart. I spoke with Alan about this the other day and he seems to agree. I do not know if it has something to do with the new TI chip, the smaller pixels or what. I do have a theory the appearance of the softness is due to most of us being accustomed to the larger 720p pixel size and it giving more of a defined "jagged" edge to the image. I looked at a PE8720 again tonight and while it does appear sharper it also appears a good bit more "course" at my seating distance. Just a theory but there is some truth to the apparent softness.

Eric Awtry
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post #98 of 1162 Old 02-12-2007, 08:58 PM
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Interesting, as the recent review of the JVC unit indicated it looked sharper than the Sharp DLP.

I also tried the 20000 DLP and compared to the Mits HC5000 with the same 1080P still photos, the LCD based Mits appeared sharper as well.

I figured it might be the video processing within the JVC and Mits, both use name brand processors?


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post #99 of 1162 Old 02-12-2007, 09:37 PM
 
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For the posters wondering about throw distance

Mine is 18 feet away from my 133' screen, any closer and the projected image would be too small.
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post #100 of 1162 Old 02-13-2007, 05:35 AM
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http://www.benq.com/products/Projector/?product=921#

Click the gray box just above the lens, it is kind of hard to locate.

Once up, change model to "Home Projector" then change the specific model to W9000.

Now, grab the projector with your mouse and slide it backwards or forwards .... or enter a throw distance in the box below the projector. I entered 17.5' (feet) with Units = Imperial on the left and aspect ratio set to 16:9 with a ceiling mount.

This calculator shows a screen diagonal of 133.38" to 115.99" is supported in the zoom range. Since I desire a 117" diagonal, this throw distance will work for me at or near zoom = 1.0. The max screen size of 133.38" diagonal occurs at zoom setting of 1.15 approx. It is my understanding that you want to operate a projector at or near zoom = 1.0.

This projector works for me and I am comfortable with the lumens since I plan a high power screen. I also desire an ANSI contrast ratio >500 and I am hoping proper ISF calibration will yield this number. I have discovered I am most satisfied with an ANSI contrast ratio of >500. You can't get this ANSI contrast with LCD technology, lucky to get 275 with LCD's. I'll bet the RS1U is no different.

k
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post #101 of 1162 Old 02-13-2007, 05:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevivoe View Post

I have discovered I am most satisfied with an ANSI contrast ratio of >500. You can't get this ANSI contrast with LCD technology, lucky to get 275 with LCD's. I'll bet the RS1U is no different.

k

From initial reports I believe the JVC hit around 235:1 on the ANSI CR. This is what I have always struggled with with LCOS. I love everything else about them but the ANSI keeps bringing me back to DLP. And BTW, you will easily get >500:1 on the 9000.

Eric Awtry
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post #102 of 1162 Old 02-13-2007, 06:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by awtryau89 View Post

From initial reports I believe the JVC hit around 235:1 on the ANSI CR. This is what I have always struggled with with LCOS. I love everything else about them but the ANSI keeps bringing me back to DLP. And BTW, you will easily get >500:1 on the 9000.

Very disappointing news on the JVC but half expected. Can you provide a review where this was measured? I am confident in the W9000 getting >500.

Do you actually perform calibrations? I would be interested in a mail in calibration if reasonable considering the round trip UPS charges.

K
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post #103 of 1162 Old 02-13-2007, 06:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by awtryau89 View Post

Gentlemen,
I would like to offer some information on the 9000 and the 10000. I get my information directly from the source and that means "people who know" at BenQ. They have intimate knowledge of the product namely because they designed it. Anyway, I also have worked closely with BenQ on the 8720. I have not really worked with them on the W10000 because it did not need much input from "the field", meaning it was very good from the start.

Now on the the differences of the 2 PJs. There is one difference and only one difference. The W9000 is a Darkchip 2 PJ and the W10000 is a Darkchip 3 PJ. There are no differences in the sizes of the chips, lenses, iris, fans, processing, cases, power cords, boxes, manuals, and on and on. Thats it, end of story.

Now if you want to draw any conclusions to performance of one vs the other from this you may. There is not a great deal of performance difference out of the box except for a 25-30% drop in contrast. I will say that anyone that gets either PJ is getting a great PJ for the money. There are better but cost much more. Now from a calibration standpoint, the W9000/10000 is very good and this is the main area I have noticed BenQ has improved these units over the 8720. A good calibrator, as myself , can really dig in and make this unit shine to the level of a Sharp or Marantz. The new BenQ service menu adjustments are so much more fine and allow the proper person to really dial it in. For instance, my personal unit has 3 different Gamma curves set up and saved. I can also dial in the Color Management for SD and HD color gamuts. Not to mention, very good grayscale tracking. I have also done some work with the Color Wheel delay and sharpness to really bring out the pop in the image. I have measured On/Off CR at nearly 4500:1 with the iris closed completely and the unit fully calibrated. I run my iris at 32 steps closed and get just under 3500:1 On/Off with an amazing 660:1 Ansi. Not quite Sharp numbers but very very good for a PJ costing a good bit less.

Anyway, I just wanted to chime in as I was mentioning this thread to a BenQ person today and I told them I would try to clear up any confusion.

Eric,
Have you seen the W9000/10000 side by side? Can you articulate the differences? How about the bottom line cost/warranty differences between the two? Does the W9000 have a more versatile throw ratio? Can you make any further comparisons between the two and the PE8720? I read about the "Panamorph lens-compatible" feature, have you any experience with this?

Thanks
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post #104 of 1162 Old 02-13-2007, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by humbland View Post

Eric,
Have you seen the W9000/10000 side by side? Can you articulate the differences? How about the bottom line cost/warranty differences between the two? Does the W9000 have a more versatile throw ratio? Can you make any further comparisons between the two and the PE8720? I read about the "Panamorph lens-compatible" feature, have you any experience with this?

Thanks

I have not seen the 9000 yet. I am making my assumptions from conversations with BenQ. I think it will be the hot DLP "pricepoint" product. I do not think either the 9000 or 10000 will work for you because of throw range. You are going to max out at 16-17 feet for a 110" screen.

Panamorph is a great lense system and is great for 2.35:2 setups.

Eric Awtry
Dream Theater Consulting
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post #105 of 1162 Old 02-13-2007, 08:02 AM
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Couple specific questions on the 9000 or 10000:

1) Does the VGA input support no overscan 1080p 60Hz from a PC or xBOX 360 / HD DVD?

2) Does the HDMI port support no overscan 1080p 60Hz from a PC or PS3 ?

3) Does the HDMI port support 1080p / 24 input, what does it output it at?

4) Distance needed from back wall to front feet for shelf mount?


Thanks!


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post #106 of 1162 Old 02-13-2007, 11:30 AM
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This is perhaps a dumb question. The specs state that this projector's throw distance is 13.1 - 26.2. Does that mean that it will literally not focus an image if positioned closer than 13' from the screen? I'm interested in this model, but would need to place it within 10'.

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post #107 of 1162 Old 02-14-2007, 07:04 AM
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Lens shift: What is the neutral setting?

Is the center of lens == vertical center of image, and you can shift up or down from there?
Or is it something else?

I want to ceiling mount this thing, and shift so that the top of image is about 10" below center of lens.

Is there an online manual somewhere? Can't seem to find it on BenQ's site.
Thanks

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post #108 of 1162 Old 02-14-2007, 08:39 AM
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Just wanted to let everyone know, I will have a W9000 in to compare against my W10000. It will take about 3 days to get the unit in and then a few days to burn in and tweak a bit. I will let everyone know what I come up with from a direct comparison. This should be fun and enlightning.

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post #109 of 1162 Old 02-14-2007, 09:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by awtryau89 View Post

Just wanted to let everyone know, I will have a W9000 in to compare against my W10000. It will take about 3 days to get the unit in and then a few days to burn in and tweak a bit. I will let everyone know what I come up with from a direct comparison. This should be fun and enlightning.


It will be good to hear your impressions. Can you actually post some measured data?

ANSI CR at closest 6500k setting (after calibration)
Lumens at closest 6500k setting (after calibration)

on/off CR at closest 6500k setting (after calibration) (not as important)
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post #110 of 1162 Old 02-14-2007, 10:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by awtryau89 View Post

Just wanted to let everyone know, I will have a W9000 in to compare against my W10000. It will take about 3 days to get the unit in and then a few days to burn in and tweak a bit. I will let everyone know what I come up with from a direct comparison. This should be fun and enlightning.


Terrific! Looking forward to your report.
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post #111 of 1162 Old 02-14-2007, 11:49 AM
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For the manual for the 9000 and 10000 do a google search for "benq w10000 manual" and will give you the link for it from benq site.
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post #112 of 1162 Old 02-14-2007, 12:25 PM
 
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Here's something interesting you guys might want to know, my ISF calibrator has just said that even though the W9000s are certified for the IFSccc, they haven't released the specs for that program yet. I said he might get the information before our sceduled calibration date, but he doesn't know.

Very interesting.
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post #113 of 1162 Old 02-14-2007, 01:04 PM
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Hello all, this is my first post here and I am hoping that someone can answer some questions for me regarding the W9000. I understand that this has a pretty good lens shift function which allows for placement where other DLP projectors can not be placed. I have a rather short ceiling at 7 1/2 feet and am looking for my first projector. I am considering the W9000 however, the review of the W10000 at Projector Central says the following
"The W10000 has powered vertical lens shift with a range of two screen heights total. Neutral position places the projected image half above and half below the lens centerline. From there, you can move the image entirely above the lens centerline or entirely below it, which gives reasonable flexibility for rear shelf mounting, but may be a bit tight for ceiling mounts unless you use a drop tube.
This seems to contradict the range of two full screens or am I missing something?
Also, as I am looking for my 1st projector I have been reading all of the information concerning DLP vs. LCD and am almost scared to death to purchase either type due to concerns of SDE and RBE. Along that line, I can't find any information from anyone concerning RBE from the W9000. The manual says it operates at 300Hz and this will eliminate all RBE effects. Would this be true? Does anyone have one of these and are there any RBE effects visible?
By the way..I really appreciate all of the knowledgable folks that post here!
Thanks,
Mark
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post #114 of 1162 Old 02-14-2007, 01:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mwkurt View Post

Hello all, this is my first post here and I am hoping that someone can answer some questions for me regarding the W9000. I understand that this has a pretty good lens shift function which allows for placement where other DLP projectors can not be placed. I have a rather short ceiling at 7 1/2 feet and am looking for my first projector. I am considering the W9000 however, the review of the W10000 at Projector Central says the following
"The W10000 has powered vertical lens shift with a range of two screen heights total. Neutral position places the projected image half above and half below the lens centerline. From there, you can move the image entirely above the lens centerline or entirely below it, which gives reasonable flexibility for rear shelf mounting, but may be a bit tight for ceiling mounts unless you use a drop tube.
This seems to contradict the range of two full screens or am I missing something?
Also, as I am looking for my 1st projector I have been reading all of the information concerning DLP vs. LCD and am almost scared to death to purchase either type due to concerns of SDE and RBE. Along that line, I can't find any information from anyone concerning RBE from the W9000. The manual says it operates at 300Hz and this will eliminate all RBE effects. Would this be true? Does anyone have one of these and are there any RBE effects visible?
By the way..I really appreciate all of the knowledgable folks that post here!
Thanks,
Mark

Hello Mark,

I know that all the info can be quite confusing and overwelming in the beginning. What you should know about lens shift is the following;

If a projector has 100% les shift, that means that the lens of the projector needs to be be anywhere between the bottom of the screen (image part of the screen, not including the black borders), and the top of the screen. If the projector has 120% lens shift, it can go above or below the screen by 10% of the screen height (again, not counting the black borders). I believe that the W9000 has 100% just as the W10000. The PE8720 has 120% lens shift. If you find a projector that doesn't have lens shift and has 30% offset (such as most Optoma models) then the lens needs to be 30% of the screen height above (if ceiling mounted, with the projector inverted obviously) or 30% of the screen height below the screen (leaving the projector on its feet ).

If you're looking into a W9000 be sure to check the distance that you will mount your projector from the screen, as this projector has a limited zoom range (1.15:1). You should check the BenQ calculator and click on the projector calculator right underneath the picture of the W10000, where you should select the W9000 from the list, set the screen to the aspect ratio you want, and enter the screen size. It will give you the distance that you can mount the projector.

Concerning the RBE, this depends on the person, some people see it others don't (I'm lucky enough to never have see one ), on the other hand, the W9000 should not give you much trouble with that. The best thing you can do is to go and demo one at a local dealer, or if they don't have the W9000 (most likely), just demo another DLP model, at least you will know if you notice them or not.

Hope this helps a bit, good luck with your install! You will see that once you have a projector-based setup, you'll never want to go back to watch movies on anything else
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post #115 of 1162 Old 02-14-2007, 01:59 PM
 
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The ceiling I have mine mounted on is 7 feet 9 inches up (alomst 7 1/5) and I have absolutely no problem setting the lens to it fits perfectly on the screen.

How high are you going to place the screen?

As for RBE, only something like 1% (don't quote me on this) of people see RBE and on the new 1080p projectors and their level of technology, it is even slimer. SDE is very hard to see with LCD as well with 1080p.

I don't even see a hint of RBE on this one, but of course I've never had that problem.

But of course, I would follow the adivce above and go out and demo a DLP and an LCD to be sure.
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post #116 of 1162 Old 02-14-2007, 06:31 PM
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Mark if you are sensitive to RBE you will know once you go into a store like Circuit City or A BB store and look at most current DLP Rear Projection TVs. It will most likely be 50% of there current stock.

Dale
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post #117 of 1162 Old 02-14-2007, 07:58 PM
 
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I'm currently looking into a panamorph lense to see if I want to go 2.35:1. The projector is compatible (does it's own scaling) with the lens, so i thought I might try it.

I'll let you know if I do it and how it works.



Oh, and one other thing, the way I have my projector mounted is a step down from the ceiling. In other words I have a block that runs across the back of my room, I have my projector mounted on the underside of this block. I also have a steepled ceiling in this room, this is to give you an idea of the environment. So, my projector is mounted 7 feet from the floor and about 4 feet from the ceiling.

This PJ does have some light spill. I noticed it for the first time tonight when I stepped back toward my components (which are in the back of the room). I looked up and there was a light arc across the ceiling, I have a white ceiling (wife won't let me make the room a complete cave) it's not distractiong because it's directly above the sitting area. Anyway, I don't think it would be that big of a deal if the projector was closer to the ceiling or sitting on a shelf that cam out a little farther than the lense.

It doesn't effect the brightness of the room at all, but I just wnate dto share that with you guys.
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post #118 of 1162 Old 02-15-2007, 03:46 AM
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Thanks for all of the information guys. I was actually wondering if the RBE thing was present in DLP projection TV's as well. I will give a go at BB and CC this weekend to check it out. My only problem now is to convince my accountant to add another $1500.00 to my projector fund. Sometimes she doesn't see the wisdom of my choice
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post #119 of 1162 Old 02-15-2007, 04:50 AM
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Quote:
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Sometimes she doesn't see the wisdom of my choice

She said yes to your marriage proposal didn't she?

k
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post #120 of 1162 Old 02-15-2007, 07:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

This is perhaps a dumb question. The specs state that this projector's throw distance is 13.1 - 26.2. Does that mean that it will literally not focus an image if positioned closer than 13' from the screen? I'm interested in this model, but would need to place it within 10'.

Does anyone have an answer to this? I've found conflicting sources that claim the W9000's throw distance is either "13.1 - 26.2" or "6.5ft. ~ 26.2ft." The projection calculator on BenQ's site seems to suggest the former, with 13.12' being the minimum distance it allows you to calculate.

My room is small and I've measured that my current projector is 9 feet from the screen. I cannot move it any further back.

Image size issues notwithstanding, I just want to make sure that the W9000 will focus properly on a screen at 9 feet. Does anyone know?

Josh Z
Writer/Editor, High-Def Digest (Blog updated daily!)
Curator, Laserdisc Forever

My opinions are my own, and do not necessarily reflect those of my employers.

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