Panasonic PT-AE2000u review - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 11:42 AM
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My AE900U is 19.5 feet from a 118" Carada BW screen. According to my Lux meter I'm getting about 230 lumens. That's more than enough to give me a bright picture in a fully darkened room. I'm sure the AE2000 will be much brighter even after calibration.

"Not throwing my hands up or my dress above my ears don't mean I ain't awestruck." Al Swearengen

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post #92 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 11:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by dbh1960 View Post

Bull----. The salesperson should always keep in mind that there may be owners of the previous model in any demo of a new product. Everyone expects improvements. To say that the company made a mistake by releasing the previous model (because that's indeed what she is saying) is just wrong-and I believe actionable. I'm thinking of writing to Panasonic with a link to this thread and demanding an explanation. ~$3000.00 is too much money to spend to have somebody who represents the corporation essentially belittle the product-especially when that product is still on the market.

You need to know about enthusiasm and grow up. When you're excited, you that sort of sh!t. It's like when that Yankee ball player signed a ball for this kid, he wrote on it "Boston sucks!" The mother was pissed, the player should have been more sportsmanlike when the comment was said all in fun. During the demo it was get together, promoting how well hard they worked, more of a "yatta!", (I did it, woop!). Not a, "haw, nya nya nya, stupid foolish dbh1960 bought our reject!" It will be the same next year, with super duper holographic in surround image! Well, maybe not that far, but you get the point.
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post #93 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 11:48 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by dbh1960 View Post

Bull----. The salesperson should always keep in mind that there may be owners of the previous model in any demo of a new product. Everyone expects improvements. To say that the company made a mistake by releasing the previous model (because that's indeed what she is saying) is just wrong-and I believe actionable. I'm thinking of writing to Panasonic with a link to this thread and demanding an explanation. ~$3000.00 is too much money to spend to have somebody who represents the corporation essentially belittle the product-especially when that product is still on the market.

You need to know about enthusiasm and grow up. When you're excited, you that sort of thing. It's like when that Yankee ball player signed a ball for this kid, he wrote on it "Boston sucks!" The mother was pissed, the player should have been more sportsmanlike when the comment was said all in fun. By her saying that, did your projector all of a sudden magically become not what it was on Monday before this thread? Did before you bought the 1000u, did you read how Panasonic would be adding features later on, like HDMI 1.3a, like Microsoft promised with the Xbox 360, stating the current 360 platform would support HDMI when the market needed it, but then came out with a totally new device to be able to? During the demo it was get together, promoting how well hard they worked, more of a "yatta!", (I did it, woop!). Not a, "haw, nya nya nya, stupid foolish dbh1960 bought our reject!" It will be the same next year, with super duper holographic in surround image! Well, maybe not that far, but you get the point.
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post #94 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reio-ta View Post

Shows ANSI contrast.



The patches between the fog is super bright wreck havoc on low ANSI displays because the low light near the bow casting a shadow on the ship, such an image doesn't show a nice picture on most LCDs. On the 2000, it was no problem. The image of the singer on stage had her brightly lit, while the audience members where in shadows. The singer looked natural and "pop", while at the same time the members in the audience were still visible without any crushing.


Thx. That's certainly a useful observation.

Daniel, care to add anything in this regard. You've already said the AE2000 isn't DLP sharp (don't expect it to be). Do you care to comment re: ANSI /pop (again, I don't expect a DLP result, but am very curious re: observations relative to the Pearls, and the RS-1s of the world, i.e. LCD v.c DiLA/SXRD).
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post #95 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by reio-ta View Post

You need to know about enthusiasm and grow up. When you're excited, you that sort of thing. It's like when that Yankee ball player signed a ball for this kid, he wrote on it "Boston sucks!" The mother was pissed, the player should have been more sportsmanlike when the comment was said all in fun. By her saying that, did your projector all of a sudden magically become not what it was on Monday before this thread? Did before you bought the 1000u, did you read how Panasonic would be adding features later on, like HDMI 1.3a, like Microsoft promised with the Xbox 360, stating the current 360 platform would support HDMI when the market needed it, but then came out with a totally new device to be able to? During the demo it was get together, promoting how well hard they worked, more of a "yatta!", (I did it, woop!). Not a, "haw, nya nya nya, stupid foolish dbh1960 bought our reject!" It will be the same next year, with super duper holographic in surround image! Well, maybe not that far, but you get the point.

As I said before, I expected improvements, lots of them, and I certainly realize that things move very fast in this arena. The only thing I object to is that the product (AE1000) is described by the face of the corporation, as a mistake. This means that I bought a product that the company (admittedly), as of that demo, regrets foisting on the public. Oh yeah, I should just sit back and be happy about that.
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post #96 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by dbh1960 View Post

I'm thinking of writing to Panasonic with a link to this thread and demanding an explanation..

Go for it and please report back how that works out for you. I think it halarious to see folks run out and buy a high-tech and then have hurt feelings when the following year something much better comes out. In all seriousness if you find yourself easily frustrated you should stick to the used projector market where you won't take a huge loss in the first year and will know what the tech difference is between a used proj and the new one on the horizon.
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post #97 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 12:21 PM
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Few years back, when I bought my first Sharp PJ, I was worried about hdmi inputs. Since then I replaced two PJs. I enjoyed both my front PJs tremendously. Before you buy your next electronic stuff, it is already dinosaur. So buy it for today & enjoy it. I am already thinking of 2000 in couple of months when my bulb life expires. Bulbs are so expensive, it is better to replace PJ.

JHT
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post #98 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by oliverjg View Post

i think that is a typo in the spec list. the rest of the manual indicates power zoom and focus.

So it does have a power zoom & focus ? or doesn't ?
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post #99 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 12:51 PM
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It will be interesting to see the improvement in blacks with the AE2000U over the AX200U.

I just received the AX200U and while the blacks are good, they're not stellar. (ie. It's pretty much as I expected, but I wasn't prepared to shell out the extra bux for the AE2000U at this time, and I wanted the higher lumen output mode anyway.)
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post #100 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 12:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe_Black View Post

Kras in the past I've played with an AX100 to simulate a CMS. It had a feature where you could capture the color from a specific point of the onscreen image using a crosshair and adjust it like a CMS.

Instead of using a movie image I displayed a full field of each RGBCYM from an AVIA dvd and stored them in the projector's memory. Then calling up and adjusting them to manipulate the color points on the CIE gamut during calibration and then save that final result as a preset.

I suppose you could also use a signal generator instead of Avia if you had one handy (I didn't).

What's your opinion on simulating a CMS this way ?

The problem is that you are only replacing colors close to the selected color's hue, brightness, saturation - you are only correcting the displayed testpattern - another test pattern without those exact same colors will be wrong. Examine some full gamut color gradients and they are very wierd. AVIA PRO and DisplayMate are good test pattern sources to see that - as is the CIE chart that appears in most calibration software. A true gamut correction redefines RGB such that all colors are corrected at all brightness levels.

Color replacers are useful to maybe cut back on red push - until you realize you also have to sample orange, crimson, brick, pink, burnt umber, brown, etc.!
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post #101 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 01:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbh1960 View Post

As I said before, I expected improvements, lots of them, and I certainly realize that things move very fast in this arena. The only thing I object to is that the product (AE1000) is described by the face of the corporation, as a mistake. This means that I bought a product that the company (admittedly), as of that demo, regrets foisting on the public. Oh yeah, I should just sit back and be happy about that.


Where did the employee state that the product was a mistake? I think you are miscontruing her words. I believe she said something to the effect of "After seeing how great the 2000 is it's hard to believe that the 1000 was our best offering only a year ago." So they surprised themselves with how far they came in such a short period.
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post #102 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 01:33 PM
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reio-ta

Did you get to see the quality of the anamorphic stretch mode? Scaling issues? Do you have any sense of how the Panasonic Color1 compares with the VW60 in NORMAL gamut since Greg Rogers gives the 60 high marks in that mode?

Joe_Black I thought you had a hate on for SS. Just needling. I'm not so sure I could live with another LCD - even an SS'd one. Being a close-sitter (particularly in 2.35 situations) The granular feel and poor uniformity of LCD is displeasing.

I certainly would like to see some figures on Native CR.

ted
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post #103 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 01:44 PM
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Originally Posted by broadwayblue View Post

Where did the employee state that the product was a mistake? I think you are miscontruing her words. I believe she said something to the effect of "After seeing how great the 2000 is it's hard to believe that the 1000 was our best offering only a year ago." So they surprised themselves with how far they came in such a short period.

Exactly!

Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill.

When I got my first projector (BenQ PE-8700+...now for sale! ) The first thing i did was stop reading about new projectors! I knew that I would just be frustrated that the latest and greatest were better...that is to be expected. Panasonic is just happy with their newest offering...as they should be. They never said the first one was defective, just amazed at how far they've come.
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post #104 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 01:48 PM
 
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tvted

we didn't see the quality of the anamorphic stretch mode. When I asked if it could work internally with a lens they said yes and showed us in the menu where it was and they cycle thorough it and yes we saw it change the picture, but that was it. Cant tell you good bad or indifferent

Zenjabil

I cant really answer that question. The image was beautiful and it had pop and dimensionality and everthing you would want from a picture. The image is crisp and some of the material they showed had that looking through a window look to it. Without having the Pearl or the RS1 next to me, I cant tell you how they compare

Last year we had the AE1000 compared to the HC5000 and there you can see the differences between the two units. Neither one blew the other away and one did things better than the other.
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post #105 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 01:49 PM
 
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My goal in the next couple of months is to get an AE2000 to demo at the house and we can all compare it to my RS1 (which hasnt been hung yet)
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post #106 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 02:04 PM
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Originally Posted by GrantMeThePower View Post

When I got my first projector (BenQ PE-8700+...now for sale! ) The first thing i did was stop reading about new projectors! I knew that I would just be frustrated that the latest and greatest were better...that is to be expected. Panasonic is just happy with their newest offering...as they should be. They never said the first one was defective, just amazed at how far they've come.

You are exactly right. I'm hoping to buy a 1080p projector here real soon but as soon as I do I need to quit looking at the projector forum cause there will be something better and cheaper out. With my luck the new better\\cheaper projector will be announced the day after I can return mine...Doh!

Mike

WTB: DPI Cine LED 1000 projector
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post #107 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 02:06 PM
 
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Originally Posted by GrantMeThePower View Post

Exactly!

Talk about making a mountain out of a molehill.

When I got my first projector (BenQ PE-8700+...now for sale! ) The first thing i did was stop reading about new projectors! I knew that I would just be frustrated that the latest and greatest were better...that is to be expected. Panasonic is just happy with their newest offering...as they should be. They never said the first one was defective, just amazed at how far they've come.

Buyer's remorse is almost guaranteed on any high tech item. I bought my original projector almost a year and a half before we finished the room since I did not want to run into unknowns of where to run the signal cables and electrical outlets. If I would have waited another year a 720p DLP/LCD would have been in my price range.

Thankfully the new crop of LCDs are versatile enough that placement is less of an issue so I can still use existing cable runs and electrical outlets for my projector.
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post #108 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 02:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by tvted View Post

reio-ta

Did you get to see the quality of the anamorphic stretch mode? Scaling issues? Do you have any sense of how the Panasonic Color1 compares with the VW60 in NORMAL gamut since Greg Rogers gives the 60 high marks in that mode?

Joe_Black I thought you had a hate on for SS. Just needling. I'm not so sure I could live with another LCD - even an SS'd one. Being a close-sitter (particularly in 2.35 situations) The granular feel and poor uniformity of LCD is displeasing.

I certainly would like to see some figures on Native CR.

ted


She only showed how the function was activated, but it was of little use without an anamorphic lens.

The Cinema1 looked pretty much like the Pearl setup to the best it can do. Faces tended to have a golden red, instead of the tan to peach colors. Greens had a sort or lime tint to them. When set to Color1, the image just snapped to reality. As if the person was behind a glass window. I don't know what it is, but lots of people it seems like the Ted Turner colors.

I saw perfect uniformity. I'm very sensitive to that. People all said, "a DIY screen sprayed on with the proper spray gun will look just as good as a professional matte white screen." Were they ever wrong, I could see lines all over the place where the edge of the spray made band marks. I must be very sensitive because no one else who saw my DIY screen could even see the marks. On the 2000, there was no banding or differences in color brightness from the center, edges or corners.

Cine4home says the preproduction has about 18,000:1 CR DI and over 3700:1 native.
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post #109 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 02:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Eternal_Sunshine View Post

The cine4home preview clearly states that the colour filter in the AE2000 can be moved in and out of the light path.



Yes, same mechanic as in the PT-AE1000.

Regards,
Ekekhart, Cine4Home
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post #110 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by reio-ta View Post

Shows ANSI contrast.
..

That picture does not show ANSI CR. ANSI CR is measured with a 4x4 Full Black x Full White checkerboard. It is not even a good test of intrascene contrast. Any modern projector will do fine on that image!
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post #111 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 04:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by HoustonHoyaFan View Post

That picture does not show ANSI CR. ANSI CR is measured with a 4x4 Full Black x Full White checkerboard. It is not even a good test of intrascene contrast. Any modern projector will do fine on that image!

You have a point. Don't buy the 1000, get four Marantz VP-15S1 DLPs and have the ultimate chess game! I guess Panasonic just doesn't appreciate a good game of chess?
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post #112 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 04:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HoustonHoyaFan View Post

That picture does not show ANSI CR. ANSI CR is measured with a 4x4 Full Black x Full White checkerboard. It is not even a good test of intrascene contrast. Any modern projector will do fine on that image!


You need to evaluate a projector with your naked eyes rather than a with a photo
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post #113 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 04:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Jithtproject View Post

Few years back, when I bought my first Sharp PJ, I was worried about hdmi inputs. Since then I replaced two PJs. I enjoyed both my front PJs tremendously. Before you buy your next electronic stuff, it is already dinosaur. So buy it for today & enjoy it. I am already thinking of 2000 in couple of months when my bulb life expires. Bulbs are so expensive, it is better to replace PJ.

So what did you do with your old projectors? Did you sell them? What percentage of the initial purchase price did you get back? Who the hell buys used projectors?

IB
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post #114 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by FremontRich View Post

You need to evaluate a projector with your naked eyes rather than a with a photo

Maybe you should direct that comment to the original poster of the photo! I made no evaluation of any projector.
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post #115 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by inky blacks View Post

So what did you do with your old projectors? Did you sell them? What percentage of the initial purchase price did you get back? Who the hell buys used projectors?

IB

Thats what i'm trying to figure out as i'm trying to sell mine! haha...if he has any insight, i'd appreciate the help too.
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post #116 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 06:24 PM
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Who the hell buys used projectors?

IB

I did
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post #117 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 06:31 PM
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anyone else seen the ae2000?
what did you think compared to other pjs?
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post #118 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 06:33 PM
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uh people buy used of everything, PJs certainly NOT excluded!

Current Projects:
IN PROGRESS (80%) - Building 3D Theater room.
IN PROGRESS (30%) - Building Lounge/Hallway Area.
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post #119 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 07:13 PM
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yeah, i too would most certainly buy a higher end used projector like a marantz if the price were right.
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post #120 of 444 Old 10-11-2007, 09:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbh1960 View Post

The only thing I object to is that the product (AE1000) is described by the face of the corporation, as a mistake. This means that I bought a product that the company (admittedly), as of that demo, regrets foisting on the public. Oh yeah, I should just sit back and be happy about that.

Perhaps you have calmed-down by now dbh1960, but I'm reading this thread from today and it seems to me you have attached a little too much credibility to second- and third-hand info here. The original forum member said there was a Japanese engineer, and a lady "translator". Yes he said he "has a good memory" but it's possible his recollection of what she said may be inaccurate, and indeed what she said may have been her best effort at translating what the engineer said, or what the engineer may have told her earlier, but in any case the language barrier between Japan and the U.S. is VERY REAL even today--I have experienced it both here and in Japan many times.

Someone also said she was in "sales" and that was pure speculation also. I'd guess that she was from their International liaison office and sent to the U.S. to help, and to observe and learn as well. Even the very young engineers that I have known (I worked with Matsushita, the parent company) are extremely marginal in their working knowledge of English despite that classes are now mandatory for Japanese students--they just don't get much practical experience with it.

But in the end, since I have heard nothing but good things from happy owners of the AE1000, who do you want to believe? that the projector is terrific, or that it's an exceedingly well-disguised POS???
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