RS-1, Radiance Primary Gamut Correction - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 839 Old 10-19-2007, 05:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Because this is going to get forgotten...

THIS IS THE FIRST VERSION OF LUMAGEN'S Color Gamut Control!!!!

As it is right now the controls don't have enough range to get the blue/red in the RS-1 completely in line. I posted that on the beta forum and Lumagen has already responded that they will double the available range of their controls.

Again... LUMAGEN HAS ALREADY SAID THEY ARE GOING TO DOUBLE THE RANGE OF THEIR CONTROLS!!!!

Shawn
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post #2 of 839 Old 10-19-2007, 05:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Tweaked blue a little bit more....
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post #3 of 839 Old 10-19-2007, 06:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sfogg View Post

As it is right now the controls don't have enough range to get the blue/red in the RS-1 completely in line.


Shawn,

Thanks for posting this. I guess this means the RS2 will be even harder to pull in, unless the range extends far enough.

Mike
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post #4 of 839 Old 10-19-2007, 06:26 PM - Thread Starter
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"Thanks for posting this. I guess this means the RS2 will be even harder to pull in, unless the range extends far enough."

Lumagen is going to double the range and it will probably happen pretty quickly knowing Lumagen.

Shawn
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post #5 of 839 Old 10-19-2007, 06:31 PM - Thread Starter
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I've been watching a little of Casino Royal. I setup Lumagen Output Config0 to have the Gamut adjustments and Output Config1 not to. I then set Config0 to Input MemA and Config1 to InputMemB. This way I can switch between the two with a press of the button.

The color difference is dramatic. With the correction in place I had to back down on the Contrast level a little as it looks like I was getting white crush. The color correction literally adds color to the color being corrected. For example on GREEN the controls are ADD Red and ADD Blue.

Not that screen shots show everything but this should gives an idea on what the difference looks like.

Shawn
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post #6 of 839 Old 10-19-2007, 06:32 PM - Thread Starter
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Two more...
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post #7 of 839 Old 10-19-2007, 07:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Bob,

The Color Gamut Control is based on Red, Green and Blue.

The options in Red are Add Green Add Blue
Green is Add Red and Add Blue
Blue is Add Red and Add Green

There is no saturation control.

Shawn
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post #8 of 839 Old 10-19-2007, 09:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Few more pics...
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post #9 of 839 Old 10-19-2007, 09:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Another pair...
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post #10 of 839 Old 10-19-2007, 09:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Last pair..
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post #11 of 839 Old 10-19-2007, 09:37 PM
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Great stuff Shawn.

Ironically I would be willing to bet that the majority of jsp's would greatly prefer the over saturated shots to the more accurate ones. No doubt JVC believes this as well.

Kudos to Lumagen for doing this upgrade.
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post #12 of 839 Old 10-19-2007, 09:49 PM
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I'll take the correctly saturated on the first two and the oversaturated on the last one .
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post #13 of 839 Old 10-19-2007, 09:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sfogg View Post

Another pair...

Those pics were not what I was expecting based on your description!
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post #14 of 839 Old 10-19-2007, 10:17 PM
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Maybe Im just ignorant, but I prefer the oversaturated ones....

Whats the Lumagen cost?
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post #15 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 02:08 AM
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Bravo Lumagen! The no-ring scaling looks great as well. I never noticed the "ringing" before until I saw it corrected in Lumagen shot. Then I could clearly see it on the RS1. If you consider how much HDMI adds to the cost, the CMS, and the improvement made by the no ring scaling, the Lumagen seems like a good choice especially at the AVS pre-production price.

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post #16 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 02:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shamus View Post

Maybe Im just ignorant, but I prefer the oversaturated ones....

Whats the Lumagen cost?

At least with the CMS you will get to decide how much saturation you want. Maybe some will chose to eliminate some percentage of the oversaturation and not all. The RS1 has too much for my taste. When I purchase the Lumagen, I am just going to calibrate to the standards and let the director of the film decide how much oversaturation he wants to present if any in his film and not JVC. I can live with that.

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post #17 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 02:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sfogg View Post

I've been watching a little of Casino Royal. I setup Lumagen Output Config0 to have the Gamut adjustments and Output Config1 not to. I then set Config0 to Input MemA and Config1 to InputMemB. This way I can switch between the two with a press of the button.

The color difference is dramatic. With the correction in place I had to back down on the Contrast level a little as it looks like I was getting white crush. The color correction literally adds color to the color being corrected. For example on GREEN the controls are ADD Red and ADD Blue.

Not that screen shots show everything but this should gives an idea on what the difference looks like.

Shawn

What type of signal are you outputting? 10 bit? Wondering if you can finally settle the concern about that. Great job with the pics.

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post #18 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 04:20 AM
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Yes what kind of signal does the Lumagen box send out?
Will this CMS feature come to a range of Lumagen products. Correcting the color at many thousands of dollars is kind of expensive for those on a budget.

Mattias Ohlson
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post #19 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 05:22 AM - Thread Starter
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"What type of signal are you outputting? 10 bit?"

Right now I think just 8 bit RGB. The options for 10 and 12 bit 4:2:2 are not in the software yet.

Shawn
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post #20 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 05:24 AM - Thread Starter
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"The no-ring scaling looks great as well. I never noticed the "ringing" before until I saw it corrected in Lumagen shot."

FWIW even those these are 1080p24 out of the RS1 they have all been scaled because of my ISCO II that is always in the light path.

Shawn
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post #21 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 05:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bulldogger View Post

the Lumagen seems like a good choice especially at the AVS pre-production price.

Where do I find further information on this?

Kerry
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post #22 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 05:49 AM
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sfogg
Is it clear that Lumagen will improve the softare to finally use 12 bit 4:2:2?
Radiance is an overkill for many. Do you know if there are plans for a product accepting only a couple of hdms and component with hdmi out, this with the CMS and a lower price?

Mattias Ohlson
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post #23 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 05:54 AM
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Quote:
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Where do I find further information on this?

The Unofficial RadianceXD FAQ has more info.

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post #24 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 05:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sfogg View Post

"The no-ring scaling looks great as well. I never noticed the "ringing" before until I saw it corrected in Lumagen shot."

FWIW even those these are 1080p24 out of the RS1 they have all been scaled because of my ISCO II that is always in the light path.

Shawn

I saw the pic of no ring scaling on the Lumagen thread.

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post #25 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 06:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohlson View Post

sfogg
Is it clear that Lumagen will improve the softare to finally use 12 bit 4:2:2?
Radiance is an overkill for many. Do you know if there are plans for a product accepting only a couple of hdms and component with hdmi out, this with the CMS and a lower price?

I asked this question about 6 months ago. I was told that yes there are other products planned in the new line they will be lower priced. As to when to expect them, I was told it would be some time out because they were still developing the Radiance XD. If your figure in the cost of having HDMI then even a lower priced solution is still going to cost a bit. A small company like Lumagen is not really going to be able to sell such a volume as to not pass the significant cost of having HDMI. Even at half the price it is still a lot more than what JVC could have done it. Here from the unoffical thread, "...Anyhow, on top of the XD and the Pro, Lumagen is also planning a RadianceXS - that would be the 'light' (aka cheaper) version of the XD. No feature list, no schedule, but fewer inputs is pretty much a certainty.

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post #26 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 06:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kthacher View Post

Where do I find further information on this?

I called Jason here on AVS and he gave me the price.

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post #27 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 06:05 AM
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http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...5#post11473155 No ring scaling. Just scroll down so that you can only see the last two pics. You can clearly see the ringing on the VP50 shot. No ringing on the Lumagen Radiance shot.

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post #28 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 06:25 AM
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Sfogg,

Thanks for the info. The end results look very promising, even with a half-way fix things look much better. Since many of us have jury-rigged reduced saturation using the color control I'd be interested to see what relative differences your camera portrays with the no primary correction but the color control at -15 or so. Could you snap a few pics using a couple of the same scenes already posted?

Also, using Lumagens CMS are the secondaries untouched?
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post #29 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 06:37 AM
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One last comment about ringing on the RS1, from the Projector Central review,"The RS1's sharpness control has a range of -30 to +30, with a factory default at zero. Settings above zero introduce progressively more ringing and edge effects. But settings toward the softer end of the scale introduce excessive blurriness.."

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post #30 of 839 Old 10-20-2007, 07:19 AM
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Bulldogger,

In my setup ringing is completely eliminated only when the RS1's sharpness control is at -30. I suspect JVC has added a little sharpening to all settings except -30 to help offset some acuity issues elswhere. At times -30 works great other times I prefer much higher settings. Using resolution patterns have noticed that JVC's sharpness control, apart from typical and significant moire, introduces coloring to high frequency patterns. Further testing with my XA2's edge enhancement feature has shown it to be superior to the JVC's sharpness control by not introducing coloring to the same patterns so I use this at level 1 with JVC's sharpness control at -30.

Perhaps this discussion should be moved to owners thread.
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