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post #2371 of 3305 Old 09-14-2011, 05:25 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by kenglish View Post

It just never stops, does it?:

ITIF_Broadcasters_Should_Have_to_Share_Channels_Period

But what I read

The Rockefeller-Hutchison legislation, S.911, provides that no full-power TV licensee would be forced to give up spectrum for an incentive auction, but that those who do would receive a portion of the proceeds

If you share a channel you are giving up spectrum because you only get to use 3 MHz not 6 MHz.
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post #2372 of 3305 Old 09-14-2011, 07:04 AM
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Originally Posted by BCF68 View Post

But what I read

The Rockefeller-Hutchison legislation, S.911, provides that no full-power TV licensee would be forced to give up spectrum for an incentive auction, but that those who do would receive a portion of the proceeds

If you share a channel you are giving up spectrum because you only get to use 3 MHz not 6 MHz.

3 Mhz or less even... Can you imagine "repackaging" 4 station in a market maybe? And then all agreeing to go on one channel?

You never know where the LIMIT is until you EXCEED it... Dianne B. "Let's try that again... without the oops." (Will Smith and Jeff Goldblum in "Independence Day")
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post #2373 of 3305 Old 09-14-2011, 07:07 AM
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I wonder if it means that a station could sell the spectrum they are currently on, thereby eliminating it from ever being used (by a competitor) for broadcasting again, then use the money they get from the FCC to rent bandwidth from another station that stays on the air. Stations could, conceivably, start chopping away, until only a few, well-heeled channels exist in a market.

Another thing stations could do is, all share a few OTA channels at an un-watchably low bit-rate, then demand "must carry" on Cable and satellite. That would allow them to make money on the sale of "their" spectrum, lower their operational costs by combining a dozen channels in to one RF channel/transmitter, and still be "on the air" on Cable and sat. For a fee, they might even offer HDTV to the Cable and satellite companies, or charge for streaming of HDTV via broadband.


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post #2374 of 3305 Old 09-14-2011, 07:08 AM
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We really need a stickie for "Opening a can of worms".

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post #2375 of 3305 Old 09-14-2011, 08:09 AM
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Losing OTA is just a drop in the bucket. Soon there will be trading in spectrum with none left that will be free to use. No more CB, ham radio and yes, you will have to pay a monthly fee to use your garage door opener. This is what we should all be worried about.
At least there will soon be a day when there will be no need for the FCC.

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post #2376 of 3305 Old 09-14-2011, 09:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kenglish View Post

We really need a stickie for "Opening a can of worms".

Oh, oh, yes, yes! Absolutely!

You never know where the LIMIT is until you EXCEED it... Dianne B. "Let's try that again... without the oops." (Will Smith and Jeff Goldblum in "Independence Day")
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post #2377 of 3305 Old 09-14-2011, 11:23 AM
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The political stench coming out of Washington these days is growing stronger. First Harry Reid tries to sneak incentive auction legislation into the senate debt ceiling bill (no surprise there - Genachowski was his legislative assistant prior to his current job as chair of the FCC), failing in that effort, they now slip it into what they're calling a "Jobs creation" bill. By "they" I don't mean to imply any particular political party, since both are equally as adept at sponsoring backdoor legislation favoring special interests. How do we fix the inordinate influence of spectrum grabbing special interests in Washington? Unfortunately, a term limit bill will never pass in congress and campaign financing regulations are too easy to circumvent. It appears the only way to stop these special interests is to regularly vote the "career politicians" who sponsor such legislation out of office.
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post #2378 of 3305 Old 09-14-2011, 12:12 PM - Thread Starter
 
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The political stench coming out of Washington these days is growing stronger. First Harry Reid tries to sneak incentive auction legislation into the senate debt ceiling bill (no surprise there - Genachowski was his legislative assistant prior to his current job as chair of the FCC), failing in that effort, they now slip it into what they're calling a "Jobs creation" bill. By "they" I don't mean to imply any particular political party, since both are equally as adept at sponsoring backdoor legislation favoring special interests.

When Congress kills off OTA which I believe will eventually lead to broadcast networks becoming more like cable networks( afterall what would be the difference at that point? ) how many jobs will be lost then? At that point the networks can have just 2 stations if they really wanted too. One in NY and one in LA. If they wanted to be nice maybe 4; NY, LA, Chicago, Denver. One for each time zone. That way they can still claim to be "broadcast". How many employees does the average station have? When 1700 stations are no longer around how many lost jobs is that?
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post #2379 of 3305 Old 09-16-2011, 09:30 PM
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Originally Posted by kenglish View Post

It's Back.......

Reclaimed TV Spectrum Valued at $28 Billion in Obama Jobs Bill

http://www.tvtechnology.com/article/124414

Too bad that no one has an alternative plan...I guess Obama knows what he's doing, though .

I've been following the developments in the attempted spectrum grab by the fcc.

I do not think TV broadcasters should be forced to relinquish even 1 MHz more of spectrum then they already have. Millions of people, including myself, rely on local broadcasters for news, sports, entertainment, and a multitude of other diverse and quality entertainment. Many more millions of people cannot afford the skyrocketing pay-TV bills when they may be one paycheck away from a pink slip in this economy, custom-tailored by Washington politicians. I can think of many other bills that take priority over renting a coaxial cable and cable converter so I have nearly 100 channels of infomercials to watch after 1AM. Or seeing endless self-promotional commercials about how great the over-priced cable company is.

But something is persistently bothering me: Where is the NAB? Why are they not out there defending their turf? Why are the viewers the ones who are scrambling to write their overpaid and overperked congressperson or senator, begging for the right to continue doing what they have been able to do for over sixty years? Why are no broadcast networks airing PSAs about this spectrum-grab during their high-rated network programming? Why are the local newscasts airing FREE commercials in their newscasts for Apple everytime a new ipad, iphone, or any other spectrum-hungry device is released???

I, as a viewer, do not make a dime - not one penny - from watching OTA TV. Why am I expected to do all the legwork while the networks, station owners, NAB, and everyone else involved sit around and count their own money? I'm sure there are some in the industry who are trying and trying hard to stop this. But apparently, it isn't enough.

If a local or state government wants to use eminent domain to acquire a persons' property to then sell it to a private developer, the existing property owner has two options: Accept it or FIGHT it. TV broadcasters, however, seem to be choosing an invisible third option: Let the viewers do our work and defend us because we've been around for over sixty years so we've earned the right to sit around and let others do the grueling work.

I have no problem with contacting politicians and voicing my views and encouraging others to do so, but I do have a problem when those directly affected choose to sit idly by and do next to NOTHING.

The time for action by TV broadcasters is NOW! What kind of action? Advertising on buses, in magazines and newspapers, and on billboards in major U.S. cities and other highly populated regions. PSAs almost every single night on the most popular network programming. PSAs on high rated sporting events. PSAs on the late local newscasts. PSAs on local cable ad inserts. PSAs on the World Series and the Super Bowl.

At this point, if TV broadcasters lose the battle, they can really only look to themselves to blame. I think the viewers are doing the best they can with the tools they have been given. They sure as s**t haven't gotten much direction or education from the NAB, their local TV stations or TV networks about this serious matter.
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post #2380 of 3305 Old 09-17-2011, 03:03 AM
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^The NAB has been fighting this spectrum grab and a they did air commercials about it during the Debt Ceiling Bill negotiations. But I agree with the rest of the stuff you said.

Broadcast TV - a vital national public resource
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post #2381 of 3305 Old 09-17-2011, 10:49 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giacomo Siffredi View Post

EDITED BY MODERATOR

Discussions are better when they don't include off topic hyperbole.
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post #2382 of 3305 Old 09-19-2011, 04:59 AM
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Discussions are better when they don't include off topic hyperbole.
Amen.

It's fair and appropriate to criticize the handling of spectrum issues here -- because the spectrum policy is awful for anyone who cares about OTA television and that is certainly relevant to the AVS Forum.
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post #2383 of 3305 Old 09-19-2011, 12:35 PM
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Little Off-Air TV Protection Offered in American Jobs Act
http://tvtechnology.com/article/124530
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post #2384 of 3305 Old 09-19-2011, 02:05 PM
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It's fair and appropriate to criticize the Obama administration's handling of spectrum issues here -- because the administration's spectrum policy is awful for anyone who cares about OTA television and that is certainly relevant to the AVS Forum.

The point of a portion of my comments were to represent that millions of Americans, including myself, have many more important bills they are concerned with paying, and that a pay TV bill is not a top priority amongst them. I would hope that members here would choose to focus squarely with the spectrum issue, and the lackluster response so far by both the NAB and broadcast networks.
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post #2385 of 3305 Old 09-19-2011, 02:17 PM
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That's exactly what I heard..just a point of the frustration that many people feel.

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post #2386 of 3305 Old 09-20-2011, 05:39 PM
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Will Super Wi-Fi Live Up To Its Name?


The next generation of Wi-Fi was supposed to offer a big boost in capacity and range.


http://www.technologyreview.com/communications/38635/

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It's likely that a few years from now, Americans' laptops, smart phones, and other wireless devices will be able to get online using "Super Wi-Fi," a new standard that will increase capacity in places where regular Wi-Fi networks have become overcrowded. The bad news: most people won't be able to use those airwaves to make long-range connections, which was supposed to be the major technological advance that would put the "super" in Super Wi-Fi...

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post #2387 of 3305 Old 09-21-2011, 05:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Giacomo Siffredi View Post

The point of a portion of my comments were to represent that millions of Americans, including myself, have many more important bills they are concerned with paying, and that a pay TV bill is not a top priority amongst them. I would hope that members here would choose to focus squarely with the spectrum issue, and the lackluster response so far by both the NAB and broadcast networks.

I agree with Ken in that we understand your point of frustration and the fact that we do not derail the main topic here. That's just my opinion. And I agree with you about the fact that all broadcasters and the NAB need to be taking a more agressive stance on OTA. It's called being proactive versus reactive.

Particularly outside of forums, such as this one, there are FAR too many uninformed Americans who know little to nothing about the spectrum grab and the political games that are being played by these special interest groups in Washington.

We can all write our representatives in congress and senators. It really is not that big of an effort on anyone's part. And it is my opinion that all of us who support OTA should do this. But there is no doubt that much more should be done. We can't fight this battle alone and need the NAB and broadcasters to take a more active role. Yes, I realize (like others) that the NAB ran those ads during the debt ceiling bill crisis. But it wasn't enough to really create the type of public awareness that we need.

Perhaps if some of these officials, such as Senator Harry Reid, were exposed on local broadcast channels in their home states, the information would help get them voted out of office during the next election! We know that retransmission fees from cable and satelite companies are an important source of revenue for broadcasters. But I would suspect that the majority of successful broadcasters would not want to lose their right to transmit their own signal, nor to have their signals degraded to the point that they aren't worth watching any longer OTA.

If the day ever comes where OTA is killed off, broadcasters will forever lose their unique character and perhaps could be nothing more than any other cable channel. I keep hoping it will never get that bad.
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post #2388 of 3305 Old 09-21-2011, 09:57 PM
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^ Actually, speaking of Harry Reid... The NBC affiliates for Las Vegas, Reno, and the Nevada part of the Salt Lake City market are all locally owned by Jim Rogers, who is a Democrat and a friend of Harry Reid. Rogers' stations all run a ton of political discussion programs too, so he would have the space to make an issue of it if he chose to do so. It would be interesting to see Rogers' take on this issue.

The number one thing that could save the local network affiliate model is if politicians believe that they need broadcasting to get re-elected through people being able to view their political ads. With satellite, the only local ads you get are through retransmitted local broadcast channels. That's probably why politicians have been willing to make it so difficult to get distant networks on satellite with people having to "move" instead.
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post #2389 of 3305 Old 09-23-2011, 03:12 AM
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The number one thing that could save the local network affiliate model is if politicians believe that they need broadcasting to get re-elected through people being able to view their political ads. With satellite, the only local ads you get are through retransmitted local broadcast channels. That's probably why politicians have been willing to make it so difficult to get distant networks on satellite with people having to "move" instead.

The politicians use the major broadcast networks for their speeches to get re-elected and the wireless companies use them to sale cell phones and other devices. If either one does something to harm broadcast television they will be biting the hand that feeds them.

Broadcast TV - a vital national public resource
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post #2390 of 3305 Old 09-23-2011, 03:41 AM
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The politicians use the major broadcast networks for their speeches to get re-elected and the wireless companies use them to sale cell phones and other devices. If either one does something to harm broadcast television they will be biting the hand that feeds them.

I don't want to be a nit picker, but thre are a lot of federal re-elction capaigns run on local television stations across a Representative's or Senator's regional districts...

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post #2391 of 3305 Old 09-23-2011, 03:18 PM
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^ Actually, speaking of Harry Reid... The NBC affiliates for Las Vegas, Reno, and the Nevada part of the Salt Lake City market are all locally owned by Jim Rogers, who is a Democrat and a friend of Harry Reid. Rogers' stations all run a ton of political discussion programs too, so he would have the space to make an issue of it if he chose to do so. It would be interesting to see Rogers' take on this issue.

If Rogers is good buddies with Reid, then I doubt there would be any exposure on the Nevada networks. I would expect Rogers wouldn't want to have anything broadcast which is negative concerning Senator Reid.
I don't know anything about independent stations in Vegas or Reno that may be owned by other individuals. However, if there are, it would be great to see Harry Reid get exposed on other local networks out there. The general public needs to hear about Reid's tactics. Perhaps, that would help get him voted out during the next election.
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post #2392 of 3305 Old 09-24-2011, 09:33 AM
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Most useful would be for Jim Rogers to make sure that Harry Reid understands the broadcasters' perspective on this issue. For all we know, Jim Rogers may have had some private converations with Harry Reid that may be useful for preserving broadcast spectrum. Of course we're unlikely to ever know, since I would suspect any such conversations would be kept very private.

As for voting Reid out of office -- no reason to believe that would make a whole lot of difference here, since the lead on this particular issue seems to be coming from the FCC and the White House, not from the Senate. In any event, don't expect Harry Reid to go anywhere anytime soon -- the Republicans pretty much blew their best opportunity to knock him out last year when they chose to run someone who was essentially unelectable against him. The likelihood that the political environment will be equally hostile to the Democratic party next time Reid's up for reelection is probably not real high.
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post #2393 of 3305 Old 09-24-2011, 08:52 PM
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Most useful would be for Jim Rogers to make sure that Harry Reid understands the broadcasters' perspective on this issue. For all we know, Jim Rogers may have had some private converations with Harry Reid that may be useful for preserving broadcast spectrum. Of course we're unlikely to ever know, since I would suspect any such conversations would be kept very private.

As for voting Reid out of office -- no reason to believe that would make a whole lot of difference here, since the lead on this particular issue seems to be coming from the FCC and the White House, not from the Senate. In any event, don't expect Harry Reid to go anywhere anytime soon -- the Republicans pretty much blew their best opportunity to knock him out last year when they chose to run someone who was essentially unelectable against him. The likelihood that the political environment will be equally hostile to the Democratic party next time Reid's up for reelection is probably not real high.

Yes, good points and I agree with what you've stated where Reid is concerned. As for the FCC, there would be a change in leadership at the FCC in the event the Republicans take the White House after the next election. However, it's still anyone's guess how that may affect OTA since there seems to be some members of both the Republican and Democratic parties who are sympathetic to the lobbies working against broadcasters. That's why I feel the NAB and broadcasters need to take a more agressive position in getting the word out to the general public.
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post #2394 of 3305 Old 09-25-2011, 09:26 AM
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Discussions are better when they don't include off topic hyperbole.

Agree. The quoted comment in your post was edited.

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post #2395 of 3305 Old 09-25-2011, 09:31 AM
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A number of overtly political comments have been edited and/or deleted.

In general, AVS rules do not allow political discussion. I agree that for this particular issue the discussion of politics is sometimes unavoidable, but is allowed here only when one political party or view is not purported as being better or worse than the other, etc.

I'm trying to give this topic as much leeway as possible, but please keep focused on the subject and keep the political comments to a minimum.

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post #2396 of 3305 Old 09-27-2011, 02:09 AM
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We just got another new channel called Bounce TV. It was added to a subchannel in my city. So OTA in the digital age continues to grow with more free channels than ever. This is the golden age of OTA TV. The pay TV companies know it and are scared of losing more customers.

Broadcast TV - a vital national public resource
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post #2397 of 3305 Old 09-27-2011, 03:38 AM
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Analyst: Spectrum Control is Constraining Supply

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NEW YORK: Squatting is the main problem with spectrum, not a looming shortage. That’s the conclusion of a pair of analysts at Citigroup.

“Too much spectrum is controlled by companies that are not planning on rolling out services or face business and financial challenges,” wrote Jason Bazinet and Michael Rollins. “We do not believe the U.S. faces a spectrum shortage.”

The Federal Communications Commission is using the specter of a looming shortage to push through the redesignation of 120 MHz of broadcast spectrum for wireless broadband. The commission cites the exploding growth of smartphone and table computer usage for crowding airwaves devoted to cellphone services. Even so, plenty of spectrum remains undeveloped, Bazinet and Rollins said.

“Today, U.S. carriers have 538 MHz of spectrum, and an additional 300 MHz of additional spectrum waiting in the wings. But only 192 MHz is in use today,” they said.

http://www.televisionbroadcast.com/article/124760


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post #2398 of 3305 Old 09-27-2011, 05:48 AM
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Pork Bellies.

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post #2399 of 3305 Old 09-27-2011, 06:00 AM
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WHEN YOU SIGN ON TOMORROW MORNING YOU WILL BE PROMPTED FOR PAYMENT INFO...IT IS OFFICIAL IT WAS EVEN ON THE NEWS. FACEBOOK WILL START CHARGING DUE TO THE NEW PROFILE CHANGES. IF YOU COPY THIS ON YOUR WALL YOUR ICON WILL TURN BLUE AND FACEBOOK WILL BE FREE FOR YOU. PLEASE PASS THIS MESSAGE ON IF NOT YOUR ACCOUNT WILL BE DELETED IF YOU DO NOT PAY

And, to think that a hoax like this has been passed along on Facebook about 40 million times in the last few days, wasting billions of meg of wireless data.
For that sort of thing, the government says we need to give up our spectrum.

Back to Farmville.

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post #2400 of 3305 Old 09-27-2011, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi Master View Post

We just got another new channel called Bounce TV. It was added to a subchannel in my city. So OTA in the digital age continues to grow with more free channels than ever. This is the golden age of OTA TV. The pay TV companies know it and are scared of losing more customers.

Thanks for your opinion.
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