New 2013 Panasonic Plasma (TC-P65S60) Locking Up Receiver - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 31 Old 04-03-2013, 09:54 PM - Thread Starter
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I have a Denon AVR-887 that has worked great for the last 6 or so years.....until now. I swapped out my 8 year old 42" Panasonic for a new 65"er. When the new TV is connected to the receiver, the receiver locks up. None of the buttons on the unit are responsive. I can't change volume, can't turn it off using the soft button. To get it back I have to pull the plug....then of course it just locks up again within about 5-20 seconds. Here's what I've tried so far.

- Disabled Panasonic Viera-Link (HDMI CEC I assume)
- Checked the Denon for CEC configuration; there is none and documentation online suggests CEC is not a feature in the unit.
- Checked for updated firmware for the TV and the receiver. TV is current and receiver cannot be updated.
- Removed all devices from the Denon except for the connection to the Panasonic and the issue still exists.
- Tried connecting the Denon to another TV to confirm it hadn't shat the bed. It still works fine. Just not with this new P65S60. Argh!

I see the Denon is sporting HDMI 1.1 and the new Panasonic is 1.3. So I'm wondering if there are possibly some newer 1.3 signals shooting across HDMI that are freaking out the Denon.

I'm considering using an HDMI switch separate from the Denon then just pushing all the audio from the Panasonic's light pipe out to the Denon. But I hate to give in and do this without really understanding what's going on here. I was also thinking maybe there's a device that will down-rev or dither HDMI 1.3 back down to 1.1 to see if that would help.

I would really appreciate any insight on how I can get HDMI to work.
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post #2 of 31 Old 04-04-2013, 06:48 AM
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Have you tried component instead of HDMI?
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post #3 of 31 Old 04-04-2013, 10:42 PM - Thread Starter
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I haven't tried component as I thought it was limited to 1080i/720p. I'm also not sure my receiver will do the d2a. I did hookup the digital audio out (toslink) on the TV. Found out it only sends 2 channels to the receiver. So that's not an option. Also tried resetting the controller/settings on the Denon and Panasonic. Still nothing. Any other thoughts folks?
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post #4 of 31 Old 04-05-2013, 11:49 AM
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Component technically can support 1080p, but most CE devices don't support it over component.

That said I was just suggesting it as a troubleshooting step. Trying to verify if it is something in the HDMI connection between the two, or if it is just an issue with them being hooked up to each other period (or possibly just being on in the same room together).

Some TV's can send out a bunch of infrared that overwhelms other devices in the same room to the point where they no longer respond to their remote and seem locked up. I'm wondering if that might be the issue here. If you hook up over component and it is still happening then this very well could be the issue. The next step to verify that would then be to cover up the IR receiver on your DENON and see if the problem goes away.
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post #5 of 31 Old 04-06-2013, 09:57 PM
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I am experiencing the same issue. I just purchased a P65S60 and have a Denon AVR-2807, which also has HDMI 1.1. The receiver does the same thing...it locks up and nothing works via remote or manually on the receiver - no volume, no signal (although sometimes I can get picture but no sound, or sound but no picture). I thought it might be a handshake issue, so I disconnected everything and just connected my amp to the TV to get the base menu display....still no luck as it locks up with nothing connected. Looking at the specs, it says HDMI compatible up to 1.3c, so I'm not sure where the issue lies or why. If I bypass the receiver and put DirecTV straight in, I get a picture and sound, so it's something with the receiver upswitching. Netflix via the wifi shows a beautiful picture, so I know the TV works.

Two weeks ago, this setup was working with no issues with the Vizio 65" LED (which I returned for quality issues).
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post #6 of 31 Old 04-07-2013, 11:02 AM
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So I called up Panasonic...completely worthless customer support. They claimed it's a problem with the Denon receiver, even though it worked perfectly with a 36" Sylvania, a 42" Samsung, and a 65" Vizio without any changes (basically hot plugging it with the smaller TVs right now). After I mentioned that, they fell back on the "the TV may not be compatible with the receiver" excuse, so I asked what would make the TV incompatible with a receiver, and what I should look for when I buy a new receiver. Said they don't know. With only two HDMI inputs I will be limited if I can't figure this out, as I planned to use my receiver to upswitch. I guess I can run my cable HDMI and DVD HDMI separately to the TV, and then run a composite input for my xBOX, then run a digital Toslink cable from the TV to my amp so I get my sound, and deal with the minor inconvenience of having to use the input switching on the TV instead of my amp. Not even sure if the TV delivers Dolby sound, so it may be better to really jack things up and run digital audio cables from my cable box and my DVD player to my amp, and then have to switch both amp and tv inputs when I want to watch something. What a pain in the butt, but better than spending $500 on a new receiver.

Beautiful picture though. Couldn't be more pleased with that.
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post #7 of 31 Old 04-07-2013, 11:10 AM - Thread Starter
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I called Panasonic yesterday. They escalated the issue to advanced support and are supposed to call me within then next couple of days. I did try running my hdmi devices through a switch, then to the TV, then toslink to the receiver. Unfortunately, the TV only passes 2 channels to the receiver this way. According to the manual, this is as designed. ??? I don't want to buy a new receiver either as I need two zones which isn't cheap. Aaaarrggh! I'll post when I hear back from Panasonic.
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post #8 of 31 Old 04-07-2013, 09:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KritterMan View Post

I called Panasonic yesterday. They escalated the issue to advanced support and are supposed to call me within then next couple of days. I did try running my hdmi devices through a switch, then to the TV, then toslink to the receiver. Unfortunately, the TV only passes 2 channels to the receiver this way. According to the manual, this is as designed. ??? I don't want to buy a new receiver either as I need two zones which isn't cheap. Aaaarrggh! I'll post when I hear back from Panasonic.
Excellent...let me know what they say as I'm sure it's the same issue. Thanks!
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post #9 of 31 Old 04-08-2013, 06:52 AM
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Have you tried covering up the IR sensor on the Denon like I suggested?
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post #10 of 31 Old 04-08-2013, 07:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beerstalker View Post

Have you tried covering up the IR sensor on the Denon like I suggested?
Yes, I tried that and it didn't make a difference. Everything works (including sound into the receiver) until I plug in the HDMI monitor cable to the TV. Then the receiver locks up and things don't work. I left everything on and brought in a small plasma and plugged it in right next to my wall mounted Panny, and it worked find right out of the gate with the Panny on right next to it.
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post #11 of 31 Old 04-08-2013, 09:40 AM
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Hopefully the advanced support can provide a better answer than the online support -

"If the HDMI port of the TV works with other source devices, you will need to contact the manufacturer of your receiver for more support with their product."

Does anyone know if the ARC function could have a negative impact on the functionality of a non-ARC receiver? Wondering if the audio return channel is jacking things up. Looking more and more like I have some excessive cabling to do (cheaper than buying a new amp at least).
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post #12 of 31 Old 04-08-2013, 09:43 AM
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If that is the case then it sounds to me like there is an issue with the HDMI ports on the Panny. Maybe return it for another one.

Edit/ Just thought of something else to check, have you made sure ARC (audio return channel) is turned off in the Panny?

Also have you checked out the owner's thread for your TV to see if any others have had similar issues?
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1461177/official-panasonic-s60-series-discussion-thread
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post #13 of 31 Old 04-08-2013, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beerstalker View Post

If that is the case then it sounds to me like there is an issue with the HDMI ports on the Panny. Maybe return it for another one.

Edit/ Just thought of something else to check, have you made sure ARC (audio return channel) is turned off in the Panny?

Also have you checked out the owner's thread for your TV to see if any others have had similar issues?
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1461177/official-panasonic-s60-series-discussion-thread

I asked the help desk if there was a way to turn off ARC and she said no. I don't see a way to disable it manually either.
As for the HDMI ports, they work fine...just not with my receiver (tried them both). Not sure it that's a flaw or something else. I am inclined to think it is not given that another Denon owner of an older amp is experiencing the same issue frown.gif I did post this in the S60 owners thread with a link to here.
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post #14 of 31 Old 04-11-2013, 07:32 AM
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Hey Kritterman...any news from advanced support?
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post #15 of 31 Old 04-11-2013, 05:59 PM - Thread Starter
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They sent me an email telling me it was a problem with my receiver and closed the call. They were useless. So I called denon who was very helpful. They said its an issue with the differences in hdmi 1.1 in the denon and 1.4 in the panasonic and specifically the content protection protocol. Then they continued to help me identify ways to work around. Superb support at denon.
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post #16 of 31 Old 04-11-2013, 06:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Anyone here had any issues with image bleeding on the S60s? Between the receiver incompatibility and the image bleeding I'm considering taking this thing back. frown.gif
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post #17 of 31 Old 04-11-2013, 09:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KritterMan View Post

They sent me an email telling me it was a problem with my receiver and closed the call. They were useless. So I called denon who was very helpful. They said its an issue with the differences in hdmi 1.1 in the denon and 1.4 in the panasonic and specifically the content protection protocol. Then they continued to help me identify ways to work around. Superb support at denon.

I have no image bleed that I've noticed. You should ask in the owners thread linked above.

Thanks for sharing the response from Panny. Seems like you got the same type of response I did with the phone support and online support at Panasonic. Can you share the workarounds (was it just direct connections into the TV from the equipment and using digital audio cables to the receiver?). I feared it was the backlevel HDMI of the receiver...ahh well.
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post #18 of 31 Old 04-13-2013, 08:43 AM
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Oh man... My 65" S60 won't work with my Onkyo TX-SR805 either.

No lock up, just a blank screen. Bypassing the AVR with component to my DVR is the only way to get an HD picture on the screen with audio via the TV speakers. My seven year old Samsung worked flawlessly in this set up.

Going to try a new HDMI cable this later afternoon. The honey-do list beckons.

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Panasonic P65S60|Toshiba HD-A2|SA8300HD|Harmony One
La Scala-Front|RC25-Center|RS25-Rear|KSW200 & KSW10-Subs
Onkyo TX-SR805|Technics SL-7|Pioneer BDP-320|Sony CDP CX-200|Xbox 360

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post #19 of 31 Old 04-22-2013, 09:06 AM
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New HDMI cable did the trick. Weird...

-iRONic™

 

Panasonic P65S60|Toshiba HD-A2|SA8300HD|Harmony One
La Scala-Front|RC25-Center|RS25-Rear|KSW200 & KSW10-Subs
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post #20 of 31 Old 04-27-2013, 12:28 PM
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Any update to this thread?? I have a Denon AVR-887 with the exact same problem. The Denon processor locks up almost instantly when the HDMI cable is plugged in from the Panasonic TC-L42E60...

Hate to upgrade the receiver!!
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post #21 of 31 Old 07-27-2013, 11:43 PM
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Just bought a s64 from costco and my Denon 887 receiver is doing the same lock up once I connect HDMI out to the TV....any updates?
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post #22 of 31 Old 08-08-2013, 03:40 AM
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I too just purchased a new 65" Panasonic plasma from Costco (TC-65PS64) and I have a Denon AVR-2807. If the TV is connected to the receiver, the receiver locks up, whether I use a high quality HDMI cable from Monoprice, or the one included with my DTV TiVo. The picture quality on the TV is great and a big improvement from my 2001 Mits. WS-65907 CRT rear projection television. If I plug my Sony BD player or TiVo directly into the TV, no problem, but like stated earlier, only 2-channel audio. I don't feel any of the devices are defective, just a change in technology and these two items are incompatible. I am totally blind-sided by this and bummed out. Only proper resolution I can think of is the Denon AVR-3313CI which is currently offered online at a nice discount, although still expensive. I have to have a receiver with pre-amp outs as I run a separate 7-channel Sunfire amplifier. I have an old Monoprice HDMI 4-port switch that I haven't ever used, but also cannot find it in my basement now. I thought of placing it between the receiver and TV to see if that might help. Has anyone tried this route yet?
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post #23 of 31 Old 08-10-2013, 07:16 AM
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I have the same issue - I just recently purchased a Panasonic TC-P65ST60 and have a Denon AVR-2807. The receiver works just fine (volume up/down, changing source, etc) until I turn on the TV. As soon as I turn on the TV, within a matter of seconds, the whole receiver locks up, nothing responds on it. I have the TV plugged into the HDMI output port and I have my DirecTV HR44-500 plugged into HDM1 Input 1. I also have an Apple TV plugged into HDMI Input 2. I receive picture just fine on the TV, but I can't get sound from either device. From reading the posts above, it appears to be a difference between HDMI1.1 (Denon) and HDMI 1.4 (Panasonic). I have no idea where to go from here as this is pretty darn frustrating (especially given how the speakers connect into the Denon (you all know what I'm talking about!).

I'm planning on calling an authorized Denon service repair center today to get their take. I'm hoping there is some kind of firmware update for the receiver to support HDMI 1.4, if that is in fact the issue. If they can't help me, then I'll talk with Denon's customer service first thing on Monday morning when they open. I'll post any updates. In the meantime, it looks like Kritterman (and others) are experiencing the same issues, however, Kritterman spoke with Denon and it looks like he found a work around per his comment above "So I called denon who was very helpful. They said its an issue with the differences in hdmi 1.1 in the denon and 1.4 in the panasonic and specifically the content protection protocol. Then they continued to help me identify ways to work around. Superb support at denon."

I'll send Kritterman a separate PM to see if he can share what he learned from Denon.

Thanks all and if anyone has any way around this without getting Denon folks involved, I'm all ears!
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post #24 of 31 Old 08-10-2013, 02:07 PM
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Looking forward to what you can find out about this. I want to get my room up and running again ASAP and the only solution I've found so far is to order the Denon AVR-3313CI which is currently discounted online at C-Field, thus destroying my finances for the rest of the month. Any workable updates, I am very interested in and I wish you the best of luck dealing with those customer service folks.
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post #25 of 31 Old 08-10-2013, 03:39 PM
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Ok. Couple of updates.

1) I spoke with a local Denon service repair shop in town and sadly the gentlemen never heard of this problem, but offered to take a look at the receiver. I'm not shelling out money for a perfectly working receiver - I don't think the issue lies with the receiver per se. Heck, just a few days ago, the receiver worked just fine with my older Panasonic. So that avenue has been explored w/o any positive feedback/results.

2) Because this is incredibly frustrating and I'm not done troubleshooting, I did a couple of things and I'm able to get sound and picture! However - the receiver still appears to be a slave of the TV and locks up. Here's what I did.

Step 1) I turned the TV on first.
Step 2) I turned on the DirecTV DVR
Step 3) I turned on the AVR-2807

Voila! Picture and sound. However - as soon as I turn on the receiver, you can hear a little clicking noise and the receiver goes into a locked state. The weird thing is, I can adjust the volume in one direction only and it's whichever one I choose first (meaning, if I choose to turn it down, the master volume knob will continue to allow me to turn it down, but if I attempt to turn the volume up, no dice). Also, no other buttons on the receiver will do anything (source; system setup, etc).

Here's my setup in case you're curious:

TV - Panasonic TC-P65ST60 with HDMI cable plugged into HDMI1 on TV and into the lone HDMI output port of the Denon
DirecTV HR44-500 with HDMI cable plugged into input HDMI 2 on AVR-2807

Also, I turned off the VieraLink setting on the TV (found under System > Viera Link) as I saw that on other forums. Like I said, I have picture and sound, but clearly the receiver is not functioning properly.

You guys know how you can see all your speakers on the left hand side of the Denon when it turns on. If I turn on my Denon first, followed by the DirecTV box, I see the speakers and of course hear sound. If I then turn on the TV, the speakers disappear as soon as I hear that clicking noise on the Denon and then the receiver locks up. Also, if I go in the order mentioned above (Receiver, Cable, TV), I only get picture, no sound.

So to recap:

TV > Cable > Receiver - Sound + Picture, but receiver becomes a slave of the TV (or so it seems)
Receiver > Cable > TV - Picture only.

Now you guys tell me, WTF. Oh btw, I also swapped HDMI cables and no dice. Same issue(s). I'm still planning on calling Denon on Monday to see what they suggest. I swear, if I have to buy a new receiver b/c the HDMI people couldn't figure out how to make HDMI versions work together (which I didn't know existed until last night)....Let me know if anyone comes up with anything before I call Denon customer service bright and early on Monday.

Thanks all.
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post #26 of 31 Old 08-10-2013, 06:03 PM
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I also tried different brands/quality of HDMI cables and was able to get just a picture, no sound, the receiver always locks up in under 10 seconds. And yes, my volume was the only thing to work going "down", nothing else. The standby button on my receiver doesn't work when locked up either. I have to hit the "power off" button next to it to turn the thing off. I too feel very burned by this HDMI incompatibility and the cost of the new receiver has literally destroyed my finances for the rest of the month. Beware, if you do need to get a new receiver, hurry and get it at the reduced rate at C-Field if you're looking for a similar feature set. The 3313 is the lowest I can go as I need the pre-amp outputs as I run a separate 7-channel amp. I don't think there's anything wrong with your receiver as mine does the same. Curious as to why Denon couldn't provide some kind of firmware update, but how one would install it, I don't know. My Sony BD (old one too), I've just burned a disc and followed the instructions. Don't think the 2807 can connect to the internet to do this and would have to be done at a service center, which again, more money. Please keep us up to date; great job!
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post #27 of 31 Old 08-14-2013, 09:03 AM
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I had the same issue as several on this post. I have a Denon AVR-2807 outputting to an older 50" Panasonic Plasma. On the input side of the Denon, I have a DirecTV Genie DVR and a Sony PS3. All using HDMI connections and working fine. I decided to upgrade to a new Panasonic TC-65PS64 65" Plasma. As soon as I hook up my new Panasonic via HDMI, the Denon gets lockjaw and needs a power reset to come back to life. I plug back into the older Panasonic and everything works. Spoke with both Denon and Panasonic tech support with the final result being an HDMI version incompatibility. Denon 2807 uses HDMI 1.1 and Panasonic uses 1.4. HDMI 1.4 is a two way communication so that the new Smart TV's can send sound from their internet apps (netflix, you tube, etc.) down to the surround sound receiver. Denon says the 2807 can't be upgraded in any way and something coming from Panasonic is the issue. Panasonic says the problem isn't them. I don't really care about Smart TV features because the apps are available on the PS3 or DirecTV box anyway. The only thing I like about a Smart TV is the ability for the TV to receive firmware updates via the internet.

As an experiment, I decided to try another manufacturer's TV. This is why I love Costco's no hassle return policy. I picked up a new Sony KDL-60R520A 60" LED Smart TV. I hooked it up and everything works perfectly. No issues. Panasonic must do something in the handshaking that freaks out the Denon. The Sony doesn't. My first choice was Panasonic but I don't have any interest in replacing my perfectly good Denon AVR-2807. The Sony picture looks great so I returned my Panasonic back to Costco. Sorry Panasonic, I gave you a chance.
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post #28 of 31 Old 09-22-2013, 06:19 PM
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I wonder if an avr-1713 would have issued also?
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post #29 of 31 Old 09-22-2013, 07:38 PM
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Your Denon AVR-1713 should work fine with the Panasonic; looks like its running the current hdmi version. I did replace my AVR-2807 (did not work with Panasonic TV) with a Denon AVR-3313 and it works just fine with the TV.
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post #30 of 31 Old 09-22-2013, 08:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jrjake View Post

Your Denon AVR-1713 should work fine with the Panasonic; looks like its running the current hdmi version. I did replace my AVR-2807 (did not work with Panasonic TV) with a Denon AVR-3313 and it works just fine with the TV.

Thanks, I may pick up the TC65PS64 model as my sams club has some in stock and I hear it has slightly less glare than the P65S60 and the least amount of input lag for gaming.
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