Chattanooga: Went OTA this week... Knowledge requested :-) - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 20 Old 04-12-2013, 06:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Not entirely sure this thread is in correct section. redface.gif
This is the exact location of the antenna that is outdoors.
http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d1ddab356077b95

It is 30ft off the ground on top of the house.
This is the antenna I bought.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001DFTGR4/ref=oh_details_o01_s01_i00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

It feeds 3 TVs, all cable is RG6.

From the antenna it is connected to a 50ft cable, that goes into a cable extension adapter. From there it is a 25ft cable that goes into a 4-way splitter. From the splitter the cables are basically ~50ft to each TV. All the TVs pick up the channels. Not sure about reception on two of them because they are just displayed in bars, while my Panasonic actually gives me a %.

The Antenna is pointing as good as I can at primarily WTCI. My hope was to also maybe get WNGH as well as those towers are basically catacorner from my house.
All the green is 90~100% (Virt 42 and 29 are 90%)
Real 40 is 70%
Real 16, 21, 18, 6 are all ~50%


I do not pick up real channel 14 or 33 which are the main channels I'd like to pick up if possible. I'm not really worried about any other stations.
I was just surprised that we didn't get all in the yellow with the antenna I got.
We had a storm go through last night and reception dropped 5~10%. All the stations that are at 50% would come and go, but they really are not that big except for maybe Real 6. Has some ok stuff on it.


How is the setup and is there a way to maybe get 14 and 33?
Should I also consider getting a pre-amp and moving the antenna? Where might be an ideal location? It is basically pointing where most all the stations are. I'd figure 33 too would at least come in but it doesn't.


Edit: Sry, Real 14 is supposed Virt 14, so Real 51. eek.gif
I do however get Real 16 (~55%), but not Real 14. Not even sure what stations are on real 14.
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post #2 of 20 Old 04-12-2013, 06:25 PM
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Real 33 is in the exact opposite direction from where your antenna is pointed (Real 29.) Real 14 is about 50 degrees from Real 29, and 120 degrees from Real 33. Methinks you're gonna need a rotor . . . eek.gif

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post #3 of 20 Old 04-12-2013, 06:35 PM - Thread Starter
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So antenna's just like this one are only like one one direction?

I would have thought stuff coming in from the direct backside of the antenna would pick up just as well as stuff coming from the antenna's front side. It is still getting the same coverage area / amount of surface to hit on the antenna. Or does stuff coming from the rear side cancel out somehow? Stuff from the sides has less coverage area, still comes in but at a weaker signal.
I guess I just incorrectly assumed that this antenna rated for 50 miles would at least pick up everything within 20 miles (Real 33 is 20 miles out). I'll just blame that on the hilly terrain and not so much my lack of knowledge. tongue.gif


Sorry for the potential newb in me.


Edit: Sry, Real 14 is supposed Virt 14, so Real 51. eek.gif
I do however get Real 16, but not Real 14. Not even sure what stations are on real 14.
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post #4 of 20 Old 04-12-2013, 06:57 PM
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Most antennas are much more sensitive on the front than on the back or the sides. If you are trying to get 51 and 33, then point your antenna that way. But again, since most all of your channels are in a circle around you, and all are roughly the same distance away (20-30mi), you are likely going to need a rotor. Omnidirectional antennas are available, but they are mainly useful when you are located closer to the transmitters.

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post #5 of 20 Old 04-12-2013, 08:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Hmmm...

So now it is a question of is those channels worth it. I could test with my antenna what happens when I turn it around towards those two towers.

Real 51 is
ION
Qubo
IONlife
Future Airbox stations

Real 33 is
PBS
PBS Kids
World Channel


All seem worth it. Though what kind of antenna might be required to pick up 51? I doubt mine will be sufficient at 53 miles out.
Another ~$50 though just for Real 33 is meh.
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post #6 of 20 Old 04-13-2013, 04:27 AM
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To get 33 and 51, either you need a rotor to turn the antenna around 180 degrees, or you can get a UHF only antenna and point it towards those stations. Mount the antenna on the same mast, and use a joiner/combiner to combine the 2 antenna leads into 1.
But getting 51 might be a challenge due to terrain in your area based on the 2 edge reception indictaed on tv fool. As a test, turn your antenna around towards real 51 or 33 and do a re-scan on your tv, and see if you can get it. If you can, then your ok. If not, then you are going to have to stick with your existing channels.

Also your antenna is designed for Chs 7-69, so Real 6 might give you some issues if you are trying to watch it, but it sounds as if you can still get it.
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post #7 of 20 Old 04-13-2013, 06:25 AM
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Please add a location to the subject line of all antenna help threads. See the sticky at the top of the forum.

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post #8 of 20 Old 04-13-2013, 08:31 AM - Thread Starter
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Yeah, Ill have to try that next week. Uber busy this week and not fond of getting of the roof. :-P.

I download TV Fool's Google Maps reception thing which is pretty cool.
Real 33 is boarder line yellow/blue and Real 51 is blue/purple.
Looking at Real 6, it is all blue where I am at and I am pointing right at it. Hopefully once I get up there and turn that sucker around I get 33 and 51.

So what 1Edge/2Edge, technically what is the difference.

If I add a second antenna, is there a minimum distance or can they be right on top of each other?


Sry Dr. Thanks for fixing me up. smile.gif
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post #9 of 20 Old 04-13-2013, 09:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reddog007 View Post

Yeah, Ill have to try that next week. Uber busy this week and not fond of getting of the roof. :-P.

I download TV Fool's Google Maps reception thing which is pretty cool.
Real 33 is boarder line yellow/blue and Real 51 is blue/purple.
Looking at Real 6, it is all blue where I am at and I am pointing right at it. Hopefully once I get up there and turn that sucker around I get 33 and 51.

So what 1Edge/2Edge, technically what is the difference.

If I add a second antenna, is there a minimum distance or can they be right on top of each other?


Sry Dr. Thanks for fixing me up. smile.gif

Yeah, the google maps reception tool is cool to look at.

1 edge means the signal has to bend once over a mountain or obstruction. 2 edge means it has 2 obstructions in the way, so it would have to bend twice. Click on a station on the tvfool report and it will show you a profile of the transmitter and terrain.

I would try to keep the 2 antennas at least 6-12 inches apart.
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post #10 of 20 Old 04-13-2013, 12:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Well I went out and got a Channel Master Distribution amp.

WOW!

I just got a 20% gain on all my channels!!! eek.gif I actually picked up another channel as well. It is coming in at 40% and unfortunately, 40% is not enough to have a consistent picture. Need 50% to have it play constantly. Maybe if I angle the antenna a touch more to the West I could pick it up, though I am not too concerned with that channel. Nothing on it. Hunting type channel it seems.

It is replacing the old splitter.

Antenna to amp is 75ft.
Amp to TVs is ~50ft.
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post #11 of 20 Old 04-13-2013, 02:06 PM - Thread Starter
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Could I expect even more gains with a signal amp at the base of the antenna? Is one generally a good idea when you have multiple antennas?

With getting a new channel (Real 44), I looked up on Google Maps what coverage looks like for me, and it is even worse to what Rear 51s spread is out here. I'd need to have that come in at 50%+ and if the new channel I just picked up isn't fully coming in I can't really expect Real 51 too either.
Granted I am not pointed directly at 44, which would probably fix that.

Maybe enough gain from a Signal Amp would work it worth it.
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post #12 of 20 Old 04-13-2013, 02:43 PM
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It may be better to place amp closer to antenna to avoid signal loss. With a 3 or 6ft cable coming out of the antenna into the amp. And place amp before splitters. The Channel Master dist amps can be used as a preamp if necessary if you purchase a remote power supply. But reportedly multipath due to hilly terrain may be a problem with Chatanooga reception. And parts of that area can receive Atlanta if interested.
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post #13 of 20 Old 04-13-2013, 03:11 PM
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In addition to what tylerSC said, be aware that antennas do not respond equally to every channel frequency. There are peaks and valleys in their response. So if your antenna has a slightly lower gain for ch-44 and a higher gain for ch-51, it may work out for you. Also, some of your channels may broadcast with higher power than others, so until you try pointing in different directions you won't know for sure.

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post #14 of 20 Old 04-13-2013, 03:40 PM - Thread Starter
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Hmm...
The new channel, one TV does not pick up, one picks up loud a clear (does not show signal strength on this set), and one is in and out.

I'll get up there after my exams and have my wife help me see if I can get it dialed in better and test those stations out from Georgia. Get the ground wire attached while I am up there. redface.gif Also see about ordering up a second antenna and pre-amp if I get those stations from Georgia. Not sure where the single amp power would come from atm. How long can the RG6 that provides power to the signal amp reliably be? Closest power outlet is ~35ft away.


I'll download Atlanta's .kmz and see what is up there.
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post #15 of 20 Old 04-13-2013, 04:51 PM
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Until the end of February, I lived in Chattanooga on Missionary Ridge, and worked for the owner of WOOT-LD in town. (I was also featured in the Times-Free Press a few months ago.) I had the exact opposite problem, WNGH and WPXA were my strongest local signals, and I couldn't receive anything else from Chattanooga! (Wrong side off the mountain.)

Based on your TVFool, I'm guessing you're near Apison. I suspect WNGH will be doable but WPXA probably will not be. It really depends, too, on how much effort you want to put into it.

I'll be curious to hear your results after your exams.

- Trip

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Comments are my own and not that of the FCC (my employer) or anyone else.

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post #16 of 20 Old 04-13-2013, 06:18 PM - Thread Starter
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For a UHF, is there really much of a difference between these two in real world?

http://www.amazon.com/WINEGARD-HD-9032-High-Gain-35-Element-Antenna/dp/B0029U2XCC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1365901970&sr=8-1&keywords=winegard+9032

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001UKMU0M/ref=as_li_ss_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=B001UKMU0M&linkCode=as2&tag=ibank4reviews-20


Will also be getting one for my brother. I think I have him on the OTA bandwagon idea. All his stuff is LOS from one direction, but a decent distant out of ~30 miles. No VHF where he lives.



I keep you posted Trip. Might be second week of next month until I can get an additional antenna up there and to even readjust the current antenna. Forgot I was going out of town.
Also, love your website. I stumbled across a few days ago. biggrin.gif
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post #17 of 20 Old 04-14-2013, 07:02 AM
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Winegard makes good antennas, but if you need a strong performer, then the 91XG from Antennas Direct may be the best choice for UHF. Also the pricey DUV-XF from Digitenna is a very good performer, if you can find it at at a wholesale price for $99. But the 91XG runs about $52 from Solid Signal. And a good low noise preamp can also be important, such as Kitztech 200. But I have had very good results with the Motorola BDA-S1 used as a preamp with remote power supply. It uses phemt circuitry, a gallium arsenide design which reportedly is recommended technology. Not a tech expert, but have had best results with these 2 amps. Although Winegard preamps can be very good in most applications.
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post #18 of 20 Old 04-16-2013, 08:56 AM - Thread Starter
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Winegard ANWI8700 Winegard AP Signal Amplifier

Ok, so I am getting some designs going if I add a second antenna. From the antennas, the RG6 will be 3ft feeding into a coupler and then from there 1.5ft or 3ft into this signal amp.

How effective would this be if the power injector is 50ft down the line?
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post #19 of 20 Old 04-16-2013, 03:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post

Winegard makes good antennas, but if you need a strong performer, then the 91XG from Antennas Direct may be the best choice for UHF.

Reading up on this, it doesn't seem to do as good short range. One of the channels that I want to get is 2 Edge and 20 miles out. Would the 91XG be able to excel in a situation like this considering the short range?
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post #20 of 20 Old 04-16-2013, 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted by reddog007 View Post

Reading up on this, it doesn't seem to do as good short range. One of the channels that I want to get is 2 Edge and 20 miles out. Would the 91XG be able to excel in a situation like this considering the short range?

The 91XG is fine for short range, especially in multipath-ridden areas. Just keep in mind how directional it is and that it is intended for UHF reception.
Quote:
How effective would this be if the power injector is 50ft down the line?

It can easily be 150-200' downstream if you use solid copper RG6.
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