Here is my trouble. I have a Roku 3 which only has an HDMI out. MY Denon home theatre receiver recently got spanked by a lightning strike. The HDMI to TV output is fried. There is no alternative video output from receiver to TV. This the extent of my need. Can I use a simple splitter, to send 1 cable to audio and 1 to TV? The Denon audio still works perfectly. I would rather not have to buy a new receiver for this very simple operation?
I THINK that since the Roku only has ONE HDMI Output, when negotiating the I/F's AV Format, the connected TV will FORCE the HDMI Output to be STEREO....so AVR connected to the other side of the HDMI Splitter will ONLY play back in STEREO. [Which is why most BD/UD-Players have TWO INDEPENDENTLY Configurable HDMI Outputs for connection to HDTV/UDTV and AVR.....or connect TV to OUTPUT of AVR which performs the correct "Downconversion" of Surround to Stereo: L=Lf+0.5*Ctr, R=Rf+0.5*Ctr]
BTW: If the Surround Capable AVR were to become the HDMI Switch "Master" [I don't KNOW whether HDMI Switch can actually DO this], it would FORCE the HDMI IF to the TV to be Lf+Rf ONLY and will be MISSING the CENTER Channel, which carries MOST of the Audio Signal. So, if you want to listen through TV Speakers, you would need to AVOID this configuration.
If you want to hear SURROUND (presuming Roku is actually providing it), you would need to connect Roku's Digital Audio Output (Optical or SPDIF Coax) to the AVR.
Perhaps others can comment on whether there are any HDMI Switches that AVOID this problem by performing the Surround-to-Stereo "Downconversion" within the Switch?????
I THINK that since the Roku only has ONE HDMI Output, when negotiating the I/F's AV Format, the connected TV will FORCE the HDMI Output to be STEREO....so AVR connected to the other side of the HDMI Splitter will ONLY play back in STEREO. [Which is why most BD/UD-Players have TWO INDEPENDENTLY Configurable HDMI Outputs for connection to HDTV/UDTV and AVR.....or connect TV to OUTPUT of AVR which performs the correct "Downconversion" of Surround to Stereo: L=Lf+0.5*Ctr, R=Rf+0.5*Ctr]
Wouldn't most AVRs do either Lo/Ro or Lt/Rt downconversion (usually as flagged in the Dolby metadata)? Both these methods would also add some Ls and Rs components - Lo/Ro without any phase alteration, Lt/Rt with phase alteration to matrix the surround information in.
I was trying to (over) simplify the "Downmixing" description contained in ATSC 53B, para 7.8.2, in order to get to the MEAT of the "Missing Center Channel" issue.
Para 7.8.2 states that Lo/Ro are to be the "Downmixed" Outputs for 5.1 (or 4.1 with only ONE Rear Surround) Input Signals, providing THREE different Formulas for 1) Stereo Output, 2) Mono Output and 3) Stereo Output with only ONE Rear Surround. And just to keep things interesting, the "clev" and "slev" Center/Surround Mix Levels can be DIFFERENT, depending on Operating Mode, as defined in Tables on pg37. [Yup, it IS over-complicated........]
Para 7.8.2 also states that [presumably DIFFERENT] Lt/Rt are to be the "Downmixed" Outputs for 5.1 (or 4.1) Input Signals that ALSO include Pro-Logic (or Equivalent) Matrix Encoding....where Ls and Rs signals are OUT-OF-PHASE and SHOULD NOT simply be added into Front Signals. Since this is an AVR, rather than a TV problem, ATSC A/53B provides NO FURTHER description re this pesky subject. [BTW: They don't even bother to DEFINE what Lt and Rt are.....]
I was trying to (over) simplify the "Downmixing" description contained in ATSC 53B, para 7.8.2, in order to get to the MEAT of the "Missing Center Channel" issue.
Para 7.8.2 states that Lo/Ro are to be the "Downmixed" Outputs for 5.1 (or 4.1 with only ONE Rear Surround) Input Signals, providing THREE different Formulas for 1) Stereo Output, 2) Mono Output and 3) Stereo Output with only ONE Rear Surround. And just to keep things interesting, the "clev" and "slev" Center/Surround Mix Levels can be DIFFERENT, depending on Operating Mode, as defined in Tables on pg37. [Yup, it IS over-complicated........]
Para 7.8.2 also states that [presumably DIFFERENT] Lt/Rt are to be the "Downmixed" Outputs for 5.1 (or 4.1) Input Signals that ALSO include Pro-Logic (or Equivalent) Matrix Encoding....where Ls and Rs signals are OUT-OF-PHASE and SHOULD NOT simply be added into Front Signals. Since this is an AVR, rather than a TV problem, ATSC A/53B provides NO FURTHER description re this pesky subject.
Yep - it gets even more complicated if you aren't entirely Dolby in your chain... In the UK we are Dolby AC3 2.0/5.1 (or AC3 2.0 only in some cases) for satellite and cable HD channels, but our OTA HD DVB-T2 platform uses AAC 2.0/5.1 - and the metadata is slightly different for each (and includes stuff like Lo/Ro vs Lt/Rt downmix preferences, mix down settings, dialogue normalisation, surround downmix settings for Lo/Ro and Lt/Rt variations etc.)
AIUI the broadcast chain in the UK used to be entirely Dolby E (so nicely embedded metadata from source to encoder) - but now increasingly playout areas are based around discrete audio (and discrete 5.1 audio tracks are delivered rather than Dolby E on some HD Cam SR and AS-11 DPP AVCi100 file deliveries) - which means metadata has to be handled really carefully. (We've had some catastrophic metadata issues in the UK - including one famous music show broadcast where the 5.1 audio was broadcast as centre-channel only... Which meant you got live vocals and no backing track... )
We also have had had some 4.0 broadcasts here (No LFE, No Centre - just front and rear left and right) From memory Wimbledon was in this format for the first few years it was broadcast in HD with surround sound.
I'm curious, why not just connect the Roku 3 to the TV and use the audio out on the TV? There should be a fiber optic or coax option, this way you bypass the HDMI switch on the receiver entirely.
Most DTV's don't have ANY Outputs EXCEPT Digital Audio (OPTICAL). And in MANY DTV's the Optical Output ONLY works with the OTA or SMART TV Functions and does NOT have "Pass-Thru" for the HDMI Inputs. And for those that DO Have "Pass-Thru", most are going to tell the HDMI SOURCE that the DTV only supports STEREO....so you can't HEAR Surround via that method.
Going through AVR [HDMI or Digital Audio Optical or Coax SPDIF] is much better since you can listen to SURROUND (even new Hi-Rez Loss-Less Audio Formats) while AVR DownMixes to Stereo for HDMI, Optical or L/R RCA Output to TV if you still want to turn the AVR's Volume Control all the way down and listen to a softer, quieter sound via DTV's Speakers.
Well that sucks for him. Great info shared here tho. Thanks!
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