Hauppauge WinTV HD PVR (H.264) screenshot - Page 19 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Baselworld is only a few weeks away. Getting the latest news is easy, Click Here for info on how to join the Watchuseek.com newsletter list. Follow our team for updates featuring event coverage, new product unveilings, watch industry news & more!


Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #541 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 01:10 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Star56's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: In my armed redoubt deep in the mountains of northern Ohio
Posts: 3,519
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked: 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by videojanitor View Post

Oh, I didn't mean to imply that. My "reaction" was to the fact that my order number is about one thousand higher than most of those being reported here.

Gotcha! I assume they still some in stock or we would see an out of stock notation.

I HOPE they have some in stock

42" in the dining room.
50" in the bedroom
80" in the living room

65" in the family room
106" in the family room


"There is another system"

Video Modes: SDTV-EDTV-XGA-HDTV-3D
All HD Modes: Blu Ray, HD DVD, DVHS

Star56 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #542 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 01:53 AM
Advanced Member
 
HT Slider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Ottawa, Ontario
Posts: 592
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by vladd View Post

I understand that the R5000 has worked for a lot of people and they are happy with it but I am of the opinion that the HD-PVR is a much more cost effective option with a much better cost to benefit ratio.

The HD-PVR is definitely one of the best options out there when you consider price.

I still much prefer the ability to record the digital stream directly over converted analog though. Plus, my STB would be a pain with the HD-PVR since once in HD mode, it only outputs HD. It also can only output 720p or 1080i (selectable through the setup menu) and it converts whatever the stream is into one of these before converting to analog and outputting through component. Without the ability to simply output using the native format, I am at the mercy of its internal deinterlacer and scaler. It also does a terrible job of both deinterlacing and scaling compared to my ATI HD 2600XT.

If you consider the situation where your STB is locked at outputting either 720p or 1080i, yet the source content is in 480i, 720p and 1080i; depending on the channel, you can see no matter what there isn't a good option. Depending on the output selection, there could be multiple and unnecessary deinterlacing, interlacing and/or scaling steps going on.

As long as you have an STB that automatically outputs using the native format, this isn't an issue.

Do most STBs switch output formats to match the source content, or do they behave like mine and force you to configure it to always output one and only one format through component video?

On the other hand, one of my biggest concerns with the R5000HD is the fact that Media Center isn't designed to handle glitches in the video stream. The HD-PVR will always provide a clean video stream, regardless of signal quality; while the R5000HD currently feeds glitches to Media Center if the signal isn't perfect. I don't know if this will be a problem with the new Media Center drivers, but with FireSTB every now and then I had to transcode the transport stream file manually into a dvr-ms file in order to clean up errors in the stream. With the new driver, it will probably require the ability to somehow detect errors and clean up or send blank video temporarily to Media Center to get around this. The problem is much more significant during heavy rain, heavy snow, sunspots, or when snow builds up on the dish, but even in the best of conditions glitches show up more often than ideal. It doesn't matter how good the image quality is if your wife's favorite TV show isn't watchable because it crashes Media Center...

As far as the argument that the HD-PVR will create smaller files than the R5000HD, I am fairly certain that for similar quality that is not correct. Even though much of the raw digital transport streams use MPEG2, these streams are created using extremely high end encoders and use extremely low bitrates (especially with Satellite providers). The digital streams arriving already in h.264 will be even more highly optimized for compression. On top of that, once it has been converted to analog and re-encoded by the HD-PVR, you'll need to use a fairly high bit rate to not produce additional noticeable degradation to the image. The HD-PVR should still produce decent image quality, but it is impossible for the quality to be as good as the original digital source that your STB receives. You cannot improve image quality by decoding, converting to analog, capturing and re-encoding into a different compression format, so the HD-PVR can't be better than the original digital video.

I think the best way to look at it is the R5000HD is the best solution for image quality and the HD-PVR is the cost effective solution (this assumes both companies produce easy to install and use drivers for their products that work reliably). Competition is always a good thing for the end user.
HT Slider is offline  
post #543 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 02:47 AM
Newbie
 
sportz103's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 2
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by HT Slider View Post

As far as the argument that the HD-PVR will create smaller files than the R5000HD, I am fairly certain that for similar quality that is not correct.

You made this point about size for similar quality, but then only talked about quality. The fact is that the HD-PVR will not have the exact same quality as an R5000, we can all deal with that. 95% of people wont be able to see the difference anyway, but some certainly will. But the argument about size is not so cut and dry.

The R5000 has a bitrate of over 10 mbps for HD, this is set by the channel broadcasting. Because as you said, it captures the exact stream, bit for bit.

The hauppauge allows you to set your bitrate between 1-13.5 mbps. If you take a look at the old sample clip they provided, it was about 1.5 mbps for a 1080i video with very clear quality.

So while the quality of an HD-PVR may be slightly less, the files should be much much smaller.

I don't have either of these devices (although one is ordered) So if I am wrong about anything please feel free to correct me.
sportz103 is offline  
post #544 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 04:44 AM
Advanced Member
 
Largo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Fremont, Ca
Posts: 560
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
So I guess no one really has this yet? I'm suppose to receive mine on Tuesday. Guess the first ones to get it will be on Monday.

"How come you haven't changed anything?"-Omar
Largo is offline  
post #545 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 06:04 AM
Advanced Member
 
wokwokabc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 624
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by HT Slider View Post

Do most STBs switch output formats to match the source content, or do they behave like mine and force you to configure it to always output one and only one format through component video?

I don't know about most, but my Scientific Atlanta 8240HDC PVR has an "auto" mode where it puts out whatever format it receives. So a 480i channel goes to the TV as 480i, a 720p channel goes to the TV as 720p, a 1080i channel goes out as 1080i. You can select a subset of output formats in case your TV doesn't support some of them. The deselected formats are converted to one of the others.

I have only used this feature via the HDMI cable. I don't know for sure if it works with the component outputs.
wokwokabc is offline  
post #546 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 06:35 AM
CFC
Advanced Member
 
CFC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Houston, TX
Posts: 720
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 14
My old Motorola DCT6200 would keep 480i sources native, and would convert 720p sources up to 1080i since that's all my TV can accept. I assumed this was possible out of most STBs. I will be getting Dish service, and probably end up with a VIP211 or VIP222, I hope they are able to do this.

CFC

Signature goes here
CFC is offline  
post #547 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 09:44 AM
AVS Special Member
 
vladd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 5,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 39
As wokwoakabc and CFC said, the Scientific Atlanta boxes will output everything at native resolution and the Motorola boxes (6xxx and 34xx) will out 480i at native while HD content is output at 720p or 1080i. That's > 90% of the cable boxes out there.
vladd is offline  
post #548 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 09:45 AM
AVS Special Member
 
vladd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 5,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by Largo View Post

So I guess no one really has this yet? I'm suppose to receive mine on Tuesday. Guess the first ones to get it will be on Monday.

A couple of GB-PVR users got theirs yesterday.
vladd is offline  
post #549 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 02:47 PM
Advanced Member
 
Beefcake's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Charlton, MA USA
Posts: 934
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Well, then why hasn't ANYONE commented on its functionality? I'm patiently waiting to here back from people that actually have it now.

I also mainly interested in SageTV and this device as that is what I plan on going with in my new HTPC build coming in a few weeks.

-Brian
Beefcake is offline  
post #550 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 03:00 PM
 
cybrsage's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Harrisburg, PA
Posts: 8,074
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 153
Quote:
Originally Posted by vladd View Post

A couple of GB-PVR users got theirs yesterday.

A couple of people said they expected to get them yesterday. No one actually confirmed they received them yesterday.
cybrsage is offline  
post #551 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 04:12 PM
Senior Member
 
frankinla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 239
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Over at geek tonic stein posted some samples. downloading now
frankinla is offline  
post #552 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 04:50 PM
Senior Member
 
frankinla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 239
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
still downloading

Edit: Done... Gonna have to see some better samples...

Full rate looks good (some sort of audio sync issues), but it's the worst type of broadcast to get any quality gauge, may as well be looking at a cartoon.
Half rate sample just looks off... the golfers calves should not be blurry.
Lowest quality is... well the name says it all.

Edit: Viewed Full rate file in nero and zoomed in... some sort of "jitter" is present... more samples please!!

Go on over to geek tonic (Link above) for files and recording notes.
frankinla is offline  
post #553 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 05:38 PM
Member
 
killervette's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 134
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
im at 83% done...
killervette is offline  
post #554 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 05:46 PM
Member
 
JRChisolm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 165
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Only the firewire capture would play on my SageTV HD-100.
JRChisolm is offline  
post #555 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 05:59 PM
Senior Member
 
Hanson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Montclair, NJ
Posts: 260
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I haven't seen the samples, but the fact that it seems to crap out after only minutes of capture does not bode well.

I ordered mine through Amazon so it won't ship until the end of this week, but my finger is on the cancel button unless some better notes from the field come up.

The SPDIF issue is actually a known issue. Until they have the 5.1 muxing fixed, it will not take the SPDIF input at all. It will convert stereo audio into DD 2.0 for now.
Hanson is offline  
post #556 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 06:41 PM
Member
 
killervette's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 134
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Liked: 10
The samples dont look bad to me. Agreed that the source should have been a better choice than golf, but it looks good to me. i have not changed my mind about wanting one
killervette is offline  
post #557 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 06:59 PM
Advanced Member
 
wokwokabc's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 624
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
One thing to keep in mind is that the samples linked at geek tonic were from a 1080i channel, converted to 720p by the cable box, then captured as 720p. The vertical jitter people are seeing looks to be caused by a simple bob deinterlace (by the cable box).
wokwokabc is offline  
post #558 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 07:52 PM
Member
 
JRChisolm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Columbus, OH
Posts: 165
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
The other thing about the samples is that NBC does a horrendous job with its golf broadcasts. Much of the broadcast are widescreen 480p, depending on which cameras they use within a given broadcast.
JRChisolm is offline  
post #559 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 08:17 PM
Advanced Member
 
Largo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Fremont, Ca
Posts: 560
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I agree! NBC would not be the best choice to sample this puppy out. Horrendous blocking and artifacts via Dish local HD.

"How come you haven't changed anything?"-Omar
Largo is offline  
post #560 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 09:10 PM
Advanced Member
 
HT Slider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Ottawa, Ontario
Posts: 592
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by sportz103 View Post

You made this point about size for similar quality, but then only talked about quality. The fact is that the HD-PVR will not have the exact same quality as an R5000, we can all deal with that. 95% of people wont be able to see the difference anyway, but some certainly will. But the argument about size is not so cut and dry.

The R5000 has a bitrate of over 10 mbps for HD, this is set by the channel broadcasting. Because as you said, it captures the exact stream, bit for bit.

The hauppauge allows you to set your bitrate between 1-13.5 mbps. If you take a look at the old sample clip they provided, it was about 1.5 mbps for a 1080i video with very clear quality.

So while the quality of an HD-PVR may be slightly less, the files should be much much smaller.

I don't have either of these devices (although one is ordered) So if I am wrong about anything please feel free to correct me.

While we all wish our STBs were recieving HD at bitrates over 10mbps, the truth is we are not (at least I am not). In fact it isn't uncommon to recieve HD at bitrates that are close to 1/2 of that. Note that this is Satellite reception (that I have), where the network does major variabe bitrate recompression on all content in order to handle their overall bitrate cap.

At the same time, they are using incredibly efficient (bitrate wise) pre-processing and MPEG2 encoding algorithms that not only produce compression rates essentially the same as the best h.264 algorithms do, the image quality is also maintained at a surprisingly impressive level of quality(considering the exceptionally low bitrate). The processing power that the Satellite networks using in their video compression is far more than a simple hardware device such as the HD-PVR does. They also significantly change the bitrate as a function of the specific content. A typical TV show without a high level of detail uses much more compression compared to a block buster film with many distant shots with much fine detail. All of this make it very difficult to compete with an external device as far as the ratio of image quality vs bitrate.

The end result is the R5000HD produces recording sizes that vary depending on the content between typically 2.5 GB/hour to 4.5 GB/hour (5.5-10 mbps). Sometimes a big budget movie file size will might as high as 9GB/hour or more (over 19 mbps), but this isn't all that common. Most HD content ends up in the 3-3.5 GB/hour (6.5 to 7.5 mbps).

Sure the HD-PVR can match and even beat those numbers, but you likely will notice a reduction in image quality, especially on movies with lots of detail and recieved at higher bandwidths.

BTW, I downloaded a few of those sample clips going around and compared to typical recordings from the R5000HD, they were significantly inferior.
HT Slider is offline  
post #561 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 09:10 PM
AVS Special Member
 
ak3883's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Newport, RI
Posts: 1,828
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Well some good news, even though I don't have my unit yet nor have I received a shipping notice...(should only take 1 day to get from Hauppauge NY to Philly though)

Even though for now the unit only supports 2.0, I found you CAN change the audio output on my Comcast 3416 DVR to L-PCM, it's burried under the advanced HDMI settings in the display setup menu(press MENU after powering off the DVR).

Also for capture from DVHS, my JVC deck can also output 2ch L-PCM over the optical audio output, there is an option in the setup menus.


So at least I can setup the two devices I'll be testing it with to L-PCM for now.
ak3883 is offline  
post #562 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 09:18 PM
AVS Special Member
 
ak3883's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Newport, RI
Posts: 1,828
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by HT Slider View Post


Sure the HD-PVR can match and even beat those numbers, but you likely will notice a reduction in image quality, especially on movies with lots of detail and recieved at higher bandwidths.

Don't forget, 10Mbps using MPEG2 compression and 10Mbps using H.264 compression is NOT the same at all. H.264 has many many more improvements to compress video, and is capable of producing image quality equal to MPEG2 using at least half of the bandwidth, perhaps even less than 50% depending on the source.

Especially with Comcast recently putting 3 HD channels into 1 QAM slot, bitrates have been reduced(it shows!), so using a more efficient H.264, in theory there shouldn't be much of a quality loss, since the source is MPEG2 somewhere around 10-15Mbps.

Who knows if that will happen or if there will be other driver issues with this thing, but lower bitrates using H.264 are capable of retaining the visual quality of MPEG2 at bitrates that are a little higher.
ak3883 is offline  
post #563 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 09:25 PM
AVS Special Member
 
vladd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 5,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by cybrsage View Post

A couple of people said they expected to get them yesterday. No one actually confirmed they received them yesterday.

http://forums.gbpvr.com/showpost.php...05&postcount=4
user: thisisnotadrill
posted: 2008-05-30, 09:07 PM EDT
Quote:


i have added the HD-PVR as an Analog HD Recording Plugin Device

http://forums.gbpvr.com/showpost.php...5&postcount=31
user: philly_phenom
posted: 2008-05-30, 05:43 PM EDT
Quote:


I got mine today!!

I'm going to try to figure it out this weekend.

vladd is offline  
post #564 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 09:35 PM
Senior Member
 
GumboChief's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Chicago, IL
Posts: 248
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
I really dont get why this guy did not use his dvr to "replay" the identical source clip 3 times. Kind of stupid to have 4 different videos for a quality test.
Quote:
Originally Posted by frankinla View Post

Over at geek tonic stein posted some samples. downloading now

GumboChief is offline  
post #565 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 09:58 PM
Advanced Member
 
HT Slider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Ottawa, Ontario
Posts: 592
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by ak3883 View Post

Don't forget, 10Mbps using MPEG2 compression and 10Mbps using H.264 compression is NOT the same at all. H.264 has many many more improvements to compress video, and is capable of producing image quality equal to MPEG2 using at least half of the bandwidth, perhaps even less than 50% depending on the source.

Especially with Comcast recently putting 3 HD channels into 1 QAM slot, bitrates have been reduced(it shows!), so using a more efficient H.264, in theory there shouldn't be much of a quality loss, since the source is MPEG2 somewhere around 10-15Mbps.

Who knows if that will happen or if there will be other driver issues with this thing, but lower bitrates using H.264 are capable of retaining the visual quality of MPEG2 at bitrates that are a little higher.

Consider this. If the STB was to receive MPEG-2 at 10 Mbps and you were to let it decode, filter, feed it through the digital to analog converter, output it through analog component, send it through component cable, the HD-PVR then picks it up and sends it through its analog to digital converters, and then finally compress it to h.264 at 10 Mbps.

Which is going to look better when played back? The original digital stream, or the h.264 digital stream that the HD-PVR produced at the end of the chain. No matter how good the HD-PVR is, it simply cannot compete for image quality at the same bitrates. The reality is the HD-PVR will have a very tough time competing with the top of the line professional video compression tools that the networks use to produce their MPEG-2 and h.264. If the goal was to record at a lower quality, lower bitrate, perhaps there might be arguments for the HD-PVR. Most of us are already complaining that the image quality our STB are producing is sub-standard so why would be want to reduce it further?

When you consider that a 500 GB hard drive costs around $80 these days, saving a little space by reducing the image quality significantly really doesn't make much sense.

As far as h.264 vs MPEG-2, have a look at this link and take a look at the MPEG-2 sample videos:

http://www.digigami.com/press/pr/pr....-12-22.pr.html

Compare them to what the HD-PVR is producing at similar bitrates and you'll get an idea of what STBs are receiving.

On top of that, the newer R5000HDs do support h.264. So if the network is using h.264, it will record the unaltered h.264 stream.

No matter how you cut it, taking the highly optimized digital stream (either MPEG-2 or h.264) directly from the STB vs uncompressing it, filtering it to get rid of compression artifacts, converting it to analog, capturing the analog again, and again recompressing it to h.264; it is clearly superior to simply record the original digital stream (if possible).

Also note that I am not saying that the HD-PVR is no good. On the contrary - it is fantastic that we can finally record component video. This is a huge step forward. It is just that sticking with digital and not re-encoding it at all is bound to produce better image quality for the given bitrate.
HT Slider is offline  
post #566 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 10:05 PM
Advanced Member
 
MichaelLAX's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 915
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by HT Slider View Post

It is just that sticking with digital and not re-encoding it at all is bound to produce better image quality for the given bitrate.

You preaching to the wrong chorus: those of us purchasing the HD-PVR know that it is a digital --> analog and one generational loss of quality. If we had a way to record the broadcast stream, we would!

That being said, for my purposes, archiving my DirecTV HD programming to watch on my AppleTV, I am very excited about the prospects for this device.
MichaelLAX is offline  
post #567 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 10:15 PM
AVS Special Member
 
vladd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 5,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 39
Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelLAX View Post

You preaching to the wrong chorus: those of us purchasing the HD-PVR know that it is a digital --> analog and one generational loss of quality.

And we are completely satisfied with that for the price and the ability to do it without sending off a box to be modded. We are DIYers after all.

Also, 10Mbps MPEG2 does NOT equal 10Mbps H.264. Try about 6Mbps H.264 for equivalent quality. It is a much more efficient codec.
vladd is offline  
post #568 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 10:15 PM
Advanced Member
 
HT Slider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Ottawa, Ontario
Posts: 592
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelLAX View Post

You preaching to the wrong chorus: those of us purchasing the HD-PVR know that it is a digital --> analog and one generational loss of quality. If we had a way to record the broadcast stream, we would!

That being said, for my purposes, archiving my DirecTV HD programming to watch on my AppleTV, I am very excited about the prospects for this device.

From what others are posting, I'm not sure that they do understand that there will be a significant loss of quality.

The HD-PVR is obviously the #1 device out there if you can't access the digital stream, but I don't understand unwillingness to accept that recording the digital stream is superior. It is and it always will be.
HT Slider is offline  
post #569 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 10:17 PM
Advanced Member
 
MichaelLAX's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 915
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by HT Slider View Post

...but I don't understand unwillingness to accept that recording the digital stream is superior. It is and it always will be.

I also accept that it is warmer in Baja California, but still choose to live in Los Angeles...
MichaelLAX is offline  
post #570 of 5201 Old 05-31-2008, 10:19 PM
AVS Special Member
 
vladd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 5,471
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Liked: 39
We are not saying that there is not a loss of quality. We are saying that the "significant" loss of quality is subjective. It may be significant for you but not for others particularly since we have seen actual recordings from the device. The price difference for me and others is much more signifiant than the quality loss.
vladd is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Home Theater Computers

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off