*Official* Asus Xonar HDAV1.3 thread - Page 271 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #8101 of 9588 Old 10-28-2009, 05:41 PM
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hey guys,

I posted acouple of days ago about a problem I was having feeding video through the xonar, I have figured out my problem but now i dont now what to do about it. So I thought the xonar was refusing to keep my 1080i resolution,it constantly reset to 1080p24hz(tv's max resolution)but that wasnt the case at all. The real problem is that with my tv I get overscan to the point where i have to use a custom resolution (1862 x 1048)to be able to see the task bar on my desktop and this is what the xonar is flipping out about. Has anybody come across this problem and found away to shrink the desktop without lowering the resolution? I am using a pny nvidia 9800gtx+ And I am using the latest drivers, in the nvidia control pannel the only way to resize the desktop is to use a custom resolution.
Thanks in advance.

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post #8102 of 9588 Old 10-28-2009, 05:44 PM
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Phew! ... more and more handshaking issues! See Andy's post on the Gefen detectives and my post above for a solution.

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post #8103 of 9588 Old 10-28-2009, 06:05 PM
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Thank you Tulli, although I am not totaly convinced either of those solutions will work for me as I am not having a handshaking issue. The xonar just refuses to take my non standard resolution (1862 x 1048). when set to a standard 1920 x 1080i everything works fine except for the overscan wich is why I need the custom resolution. I guess what I am trying to say is I need a way to send my custom resolution (1862 x 1048)through a true 1920 x 1080 signal (if that makes any sense). but I will read through the recomended post to see if it can help me do what I want.

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post #8104 of 9588 Old 10-28-2009, 07:09 PM
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Yeah, you're definitely right as that resolution is non-HDMI standard.

EDIT:

The DVI/HDMI detective would solve your problem anyway:

1. Connect the graphic card to the display device in that non-standard resolution with no overscan.

2. Connect Xonar->Receiver->Gefen Detective (set to a standard HDMI resolution).

The Gefen would act as a true HDMI display device, "fooling" both receiver and the Xonar of course.

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post #8105 of 9588 Old 10-28-2009, 07:18 PM
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The funny part is that without the xonar in the chain the set up works perfectly. If asus would just relax the standard, but I doubt I could get them to do that. How does every body else deal with overscan on there desktops?Does anybody know of a way to reduce the size of the desktop without reducing to a custom resolution?

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post #8106 of 9588 Old 10-28-2009, 07:27 PM
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Ouch, see my EDIT above.

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post #8107 of 9588 Old 10-28-2009, 08:04 PM
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I am using that exact method now, only I am using an old popcorn hour a110 to generate the fake signal that the xonar needs. It just always bothered me that I had to resort to such antics to make it work. I guess I will have to ditch my pioneer 4270hd for a panasonic v10 that has the 1 to 1 pixel mapping for hdmi. I really dont want to as I love my pio even though its a liitle old it still has better pq than most of the true 1080p 60hz sets I have seen lately. But I have read good things about the v10. Now just to convince the wife. Ha Ha !

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post #8108 of 9588 Old 10-29-2009, 10:32 AM
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I have ATI HD5870 graphic card and Asus Xonar HDAV 1.3 install in my HTPC.
My Receiver is Sony STR-DA5400ES.

Question:
To get the best audio quality for HD movies watching using VLC, MPC or TMT3 players,
I should use HDMI connection direct out of ATI-HD5870 (audio pass through?)
or
Loop the HDMI of 5870 to Xonar first and connect the HDMI out of Xonar HDAV sound card?

Please tell me which patch I should take and why?
Thanks
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post #8109 of 9588 Old 10-29-2009, 11:37 AM
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Only reason to use the HDAV would be bitstreaming of DTS-HD MA or TrueHD with TMT3.

Otherwise it's just multichannel PCM, for which just use the ATI, and maybe even uninstall the HDAV as you won't need it.

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post #8110 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 12:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tulli View Post

Only reason to use the HDAV would be bitstreaming of DTS-HD MA or TrueHD with TMT3.

Otherwise it's just multichannel PCM, for which just use the ATI, and maybe even uninstall the HDAV as you won't need it.

Thanks Tulli,

Is it true that ATI-HD5870 will pass through the original audio stream from all movie files un-touch without any down-scale/up-scale or decoding what so ever, and let my Sony STR-DA5400ES do the decoding job, because I will prefer this as the Sony surely will do the decoding way much better than any sound cards available in the market for PC.

Please commend.
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post #8111 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 03:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iwanrs View Post

Thanks Tulli,

Is it true that ATI-HD5870 will pass through the original audio stream from all movie files un-touch without any down-scale/up-scale or decoding what so ever, and let my Sony STR-DA5400ES do the decoding job, because I will prefer this as the Sony surely will do the decoding way much better than any sound cards available in the market for PC.

Please commend.

They will when a PDVD version or patch (and maybe a specific ATI driver) will be released that enable bitstreaming in a PAP for the 5xxx.

Till then the 5xxx are no different than current 4xxx cards, so that HD audio codecs are decoded/downsampled to multi-channel 16/48 PCM. But there are ways of getting a non-downsampled, bit-perfect multi-channel PCM audio stream passed-through the ATIs. Take a look at this thread for more details.

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post #8112 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 06:01 AM
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Ok, I got one of the old versions of this card without the firmware fix for the 24hz problem. This is not a problem for me becuase I did not want to route my video through the card and then the receiver to my Pio TV. So to get the video signal that the Hdav requires I use an ATI 4650 that I have installed in a linux server that is on all the time. And I feed a HDMI cable from that to the HDAV card.

I also have TMT 3 Platinum retail edition, with the latest .60 update.

With this solution I can get audio up to 96khz, if I select 192khz I get no sound. I can watch DVD's play music etc all fine. But, I can't get Dolby true HD or DTS MA passthrough at all. To get around this I plug the HMDI cable from my PS3 into the HDAV. Everything works fine if I do this.

Is this a PAP issue as well? Even though the ATI 4650 should support this? I have an ATI 4850 in my computer with the HDAV and when I put the video signal into that everything works as it should audio was, just I lose the 24hz and I would have to install splendid HD.

It's just a little annoying having to switch the PS3 cable all the time!!
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post #8113 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 06:19 AM
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There´s no way that the 4650 can pass-through HD audio, so the HDMI feed-in will carry a PCM audio stream into the Xonar (unless there´s a trick in Linux to bitstream with the 4xxx, but I have no idea).

The problem with 192khz should be in the source IMO. You could easily check this by plugging the 4650 directly into the AVR and see if there´s any sound at 192khz.

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post #8114 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 06:24 AM
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erm, I think you misunderstand Tulli.

The Xonar needs a video signal to operate or you get no sound at all. The way you are supposed to do it is to connect your video card to the HDAV and then the HDAV to your receiver all using HDMI.

I am just suppling a video feed from the the ATI 4650 that the HDAV needs to work. that's all,
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post #8115 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 06:30 AM
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Yea, it's a STUPID design on the part of the Xonar afaic. There should be NO requirement for a video signal to be passed through in order to get audio. It's complete nonsense. I see the problem you're having and honestly would recommend RMA'ing the Xonar to get it fixed for 24Hz so you can simply do pass through without having to do this nightmare routine.
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post #8116 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 06:42 AM
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Well, yeah terrible design :-) I am in Ireland and have been in contact with the crowd I bought it off, the few returns they got so far for the upgrade are taking well over a month, sometimes two. And besides, I would still want my video going straight to the TV.

but, It's not a nightmare scenario at all, if I could just figure out why the 4650 will not work when in the linux machine, but will work when in the same computer as the Hdav.

With my setup the linux server is just in the room at the back of the TV and computer, so, it was a simple job to route the cable into the HDav.
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post #8117 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 07:00 AM
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That one I can't answer. However, what about something like this?

http://www.ecrater.com/product.php?pid=3158470

You could take your 4850 and split it, one to the tv and one to the Xonar. Wouldn't that work?
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post #8118 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 07:24 AM
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It might work :-) just like the warning says though

"To put it simply, some devices will consider a split of the signal to be a copyright violation, so it may decide that only one display should show at a time or may block the content entirely. This type of situation is considered to be a device compatibility issue and can not be fixed short of a firmware update by the individual device manufacturers"
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post #8119 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 08:22 AM
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True enough. I don't worry about HDCP myself as I use AnyDVD but that's a valid warning to be concerned about. It's a thought, though.
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post #8120 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 08:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davinleeds View Post

I've had no issues with a 605.

Yeah, I've had no problems with my Yamaha 663 either :shrug: I'm also bitstreaming I have my Xonar set to HDMI and 7.1 speakers, TMT to HDMI Passthrough, and Vista SP2 set to 7.1 speakers. My DTS-HD Master lights as well as my TrueHD on my Yamaha. I'm using the Asus version .139.
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post #8121 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 12:29 PM
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I decided to change one of my HTPC's from XP to Win7. My non-deluxe Xonar HDAV1.3 worked perfectly with xp. I cannot get bitstreaming to work with Win7. I am using the latest win7 64 drivers and i tried both the latest asus tmt and retail plat tmt. I also used the latest evga gt8800 win7 64 driver. I dont think it is a tmt problem at this point. I believe it is either a Xonar driver or gt8800 driver problem.

evga gt8800 version is 191.07
asus tmt version 3.0.13.139
retail tmt plat version 3.0.1.120
Xonar version 7.12.8.1775

I did make a complete back-up hdd image with xp before formating so its easy to switch back to xp if needed but i was hoping someone would have ideas on what i could try next?

I love being able to hot-swap my removable hdd's with win7

Thanks
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post #8122 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 12:33 PM
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Woa, good god. Please get the 160 patch for the retail TMT3. And make sure that the Xonar CP is set to HDMI. Try setting Speakers as the default device in Windows sound CP. And finally, when using the retail TMT3 160, set HDMI Pass-Through. You should be good to go at that point.
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post #8123 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 12:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SamuriHL View Post

Woa, good god. Please get the 160 patch for the retail TMT3. And make sure that the Xonar CP is set to HDMI. Try setting Speakers as the default device in Windows sound CP. And finally, when using the retail TMT3 160, set HDMI Pass-Through. You should be good to go at that point.

yes i have speakers set as default in windows sound (read about that earlier).
yes i have Xonar cp is set to hdmi
yes i have tmt retail set to hdmi passthrough
I guess i will try the patch

thanks
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post #8124 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 12:42 PM
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At the very least build 140 but even that's a mess. You really want build 160 and then try it again.
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post #8125 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 01:13 PM
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Guys, there's a very easy way to solve handshaking issues. Here's is a step by step guide that you may follow.

LAST REVISION: 11/25/2009.

This procedure will only work on Vista and Windows 7. See here.

First of all, the OBJECTIVE: to force a .inf file that will be the new monitor driver for the AVR HDMI display device.

So here are the steps:

1. DONWLOAD AND INSTALL MONINFO: get it from here.

2.GET AVR EDID:
  • - CONNECT THE GRAPHIC CARD TO HDAV HDMI-IN AND HDMI-OUT TO AVR, as usual (for non-HDAV users just connect from GRAPHIC CARD TO AVR). If you can't handshake the HDAV with the AVR, just connect directly from the graphic card HDMI out to the AVR.

    - RUN MONINFO AND GET EDID FROM AVR: in my case it's a DENON 988. So I look for first entry in Display IDs window with the tag "DENON-AVAMP" and "[Real time ...].

    - SELECT File->Create INF and SAVE TO AVR.inf.

3. OVERRIDE MONITOR DRIVER WITH MODIFIED AVR.inf FILE:
(I will show the procedure for 2 monitors, but works just the same for one. Procedure is for Windows 7)
  • - Right click on desktop and select "Personalize".

    - Click on Display->Change display settings.

    - Now click on the Screen of the AVR display.

    - Click on "Advanced settings"

    - Select Monitor Tab and click on "Properties".

    - Select Driver Tab and click on "Update Driver"

    - Select "Browse my computer for driver updates".

    - Select "Let me pick from a list of drivers on my computer".

    - Click on "Have Disk".

    - Click on "Browse".

    - Navigate to directory with the display device .inf file (Note: just in case, make sure that it's THE ONLY .inf file in that directory).

    - Click on Open, OK, and install the new driver.

    - Reboot.

Of course you may use the name you like for AVR.inf (I use AVR-988.inf for my Denon 988 AVR).

That's it, you should be free now of any more handshake issues. Enjoy!

PS:

If after applying the EDID Override you still have occasional handshake issues (especially with an ATI card):

1. Try with different drivers (latest > Cat 9.7 for ATI work best for me with a 4670 on Win7 x64).

2. Try reproducing the problem, go to Device Manager (Start->Computer, right click on Properties) and see if the EDID override driver is in fact selected under "Monitors". If not, then do the EDID override again there by updating the driver for the corresponding monitor to your DISPLAY.inf (see step 4 above).

Then reboot and try to reproduce the problem. As long as the EDID override driver is automatically selected by Windows you should not have any handshake problem.

For additional updated info see here.

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post #8126 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 01:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SamuriHL View Post

At the very least build 140 but even that's a mess. You really want build 160 and then try it again.

Just updated to .160 but no go..same exact problem. The only way to get any audio with tmt is setting audio to 5.1 or 7.1. Nothing when set to hdmi passthrough.

BTW i use a Denon 4308

I am thinking maybe i need to try some older Vista 64 bit drivers for either the Xonar or my GT8800 or both....just dont seem like a tmt problem to me since both versions worked with XP Sp3.
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post #8127 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 01:20 PM
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120 never worked well with W7. They fixed it mostly in 140 and 160 was definitely fixed for good. Maybe Tuilli has an idea on this one.
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post #8128 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 01:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SamuriHL View Post

Yea, it's a STUPID design on the part of the Xonar afaic. There should be NO requirement for a video signal to be passed through in order to get audio. It's complete nonsense.

No, it's not nonsense at all. You see, the HDMI audio is not carried on a seperate set of wires from the video. The audio is packetized and sent in between the video packets. The recieving end is expecting video packets and optionally additional packets for audio and/or control functions. To work indepenently, the card would need circuitry to generate a "dummy" but valid set of Video packets, thus driving up the cost of the card.


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post #8129 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 01:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jimwhite View Post

No, it's not nonsense at all. You see, the HDMI audio is not carried on a seperate set of wires from the video. The audio is packetized and sent in between the video packets. The recieving end is expecting video packets and optionally additional packets for audio and/or control functions. To work indepenently, the card would need circuitry to generate a "dummy" but valid set of Video packets, thus driving up the cost of the card.


Hmmm, fascinating. I knew the signal was mixed but I had no idea it REQUIRED a video signal in order to work properly. Good to know.
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post #8130 of 9588 Old 10-30-2009, 01:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldwing77 View Post

...
BTW i use a Denon 4308

....

I have to use HDMI4 on my 4308 to keep the HDCP handshake issues to a minimum.

I would definitely recommend staying with .160, as I found it more stable than the previous versions. Also use the latest Xonar drivers, they fixed some issues for me. Disclaimer: that is on a 32 bit system.

What are your exact settings in the Xonar CP?
____
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