HD4650: few deinterlacing options/fan control - Page 3 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #61 of 156 Old 03-06-2009, 05:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rigby Reardon View Post

The problem only occurs with certain 4650 cards (e.g. the Palit/Xpertvision, while e.g. the HIS 4650 is unaffected). It seems to be some unfortunate interaction between the VGA BIOS and the ATI driver that keeps the driver from properly recognizing the card. To add to the confusion, there are some drivers/configurations (e.g. the old "hotfix" driver from the Xpertvision web site, and, in my case, the 8.12 driver with deactivated Aero) where it does in fact work.

Aaargh I was planning to get a 4650 because of uncertainty over driver issues and uncertainty whether post processing performance of the 4550 was as good as the 4650, now I find this ;-(

Fortunately I guess the card I'm most likely to get is the HIS iSilence since it's the only passive 4650 I've seen here in NZ.
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post #62 of 156 Old 03-07-2009, 05:22 PM
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Thanks renethx & Rigby Reardon for the info, much appreciate it.
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post #63 of 156 Old 03-08-2009, 02:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Rigby,

i have detected following with the RC2 driver from Palit-site, which are the only one which worked in my environment:

With these drivers iam able to adjust all 5 deinterlacing options. Nevertheless, you know the flag in CCC? Please have a look at it: Normally (e.g. with my 2600XT) when the flag is just gone over the top bar above the window, the bar dont jitters at all. Not so with the 4650 and RC2 driver. It is adjusted Vector adaptive deinterlacing but what i get looks like BOB or WEAVE.

Please double check it at your drivers and report. Thanks
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post #64 of 156 Old 03-09-2009, 06:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rigby Reardon View Post

The problem only occurs with certain 4650 cards (e.g. the Palit/Xpertvision, while e.g. the HIS 4650 is unaffected). .....

Hey,

I found this is actually not completely true. I am a small home business reseller. I returned the PALIT 4650 to my wholesaler (RA) and they tested with same fault (greyed out options).

They got a HIS 4650 under my request and a PALIT 4670. They found the HIS 4650 had the same drivers issue while the 4670 was fine and uneffected by drivers bug.

So my advice to all is stay away from ATI 4650 and spend the extra $$$ and get a 4670.

While for HTPC use, a ATI 4550 is the way to go as a minumum because the 4350 only supports 1 Bluray video stream at a time (BD profile 1.x) whle 4550 onwards supports PIP (BD 2.0 profile) i.e. 2 bluray video streams at a time; as well a LPCM 7.1 over HDMI.

Happy viewing....
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post #65 of 156 Old 03-15-2009, 07:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mavmarek View Post

Hey,

I found this is actually not completely true. I am a small home business reseller. I returned the PALIT 4650 to my wholesaler (RA) and they tested with same fault (greyed out options).

They got a HIS 4650 under my request and a PALIT 4670. They found the HIS 4650 had the same drivers issue while the 4670 was fine and uneffected by drivers bug.

So my advice to all is stay away from ATI 4650 and spend the extra $$$ and get a 4670.

While for HTPC use, a ATI 4550 is the way to go as a minumum because the 4350 only supports 1 Bluray video stream at a time (BD profile 1.x) whle 4550 onwards supports PIP (BD 2.0 profile) i.e. 2 bluray video streams at a time; as well a LPCM 7.1 over HDMI.

Happy viewing....

IMHO the 4650 is the minimum for HTPC because it has the best post processing (well when it works :-P). Were it not for the bug, I would say 4670 is overkill for most HTPC exclusive but 4650 is just right (and 4550 too little).

BTW, do you remember what HIS card it was they tested? Was it a iSilence4 (passive)
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post #66 of 156 Old 03-15-2009, 08:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by topcaser View Post

i have detected following with the RC2 driver from Palit-site, which are the only one which worked in my environment:

With these drivers iam able to adjust all 5 deinterlacing options. Nevertheless, you know the flag in CCC? Please have a look at it: Normally (e.g. with my 2600XT) when the flag is just gone over the top bar above the window, the bar dont jitters at all. Not so with the 4650 and RC2 driver. It is adjusted Vector adaptive deinterlacing but what i get looks like BOB or WEAVE.

Please double check it at your drivers and report. Thanks

As I reported earlier in this thread, I was also not quite sure whether the deinterlacing options actually work with the RC2 driver, as I was not able to see any difference on recorded TV material (interlaced). Not sure how good an indicator the "flag" is. So it is possible that the options don't actually work. However, I will not install the RC2 driver again since my current setup with 8.12 is working fine and I don't want to screw it up again. Have you tried a real test like the HQV deinterlacing test?
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post #67 of 156 Old 03-15-2009, 07:08 PM
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I have a Sapphire HD 4650 and am suffering from the same issues as everyone else. The specific features like de-noise and edge enhancement, along with deinterlacing are all greyed out. I am stuck using the hotfix drivers that give me those options, but I too feel as if they don't work regardless of being available.

I will try your 8.12 disable Aero option and see if that works for me. I am also in the process of contacting AMD like other people had, hoping to get the word out to them more that there is an issue here.
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post #68 of 156 Old 03-16-2009, 02:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Folks, all we need to do is to flash another BIOS. Palit support mentioned, that he has all deinterlacing options available with his early development BIOS.

His early BIOS version is:
VER011.011.000.000.000000

Mine is (s. attached picture)

at all, where the 4650 works well: Can you provide us with your BIOS version and maybe with the BIOS itself?
LL
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post #69 of 156 Old 03-18-2009, 04:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nil Einne View Post

IMHO the 4650 is the minimum for HTPC because it has the best post processing (well when it works :-P). Were it not for the bug, I would say 4670 is overkill for most HTPC exclusive but 4650 is just right (and 4550 too little).

BTW, do you remember what HIS card it was they tested? Was it a iSilence4 (passive)

Yep that's why i bought the 4650 as it was the middle ground. It was above the min standard (4550) and ATI claims it also got 100% on HQV SD and 100% on HD HQV video tests. Can't ask for better than that. But the drivers issue damn-it!!!

FYI it was the HIS-HD4650-E2-V2 that my supplier tested with the drivers issue (active cooling - not passive).
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post #70 of 156 Old 03-21-2009, 02:38 AM - Thread Starter
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Hi again,

i contacted one of the guys in another forum, who owns a HIS 3650 which works perfectly with all deinterlacing options. I asked him to provide the BIOS version. He has also stored this BIOS version on his graphics:
VER011.011.000.000.000000

Now my question: Is it possible, to flash his BIOS from the HIS to the Palit?
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post #71 of 156 Old 03-21-2009, 07:55 AM
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Anyone know if the ASUS EAH4650 has any of these de-interlacing issues? I have one ready to go into my HTPC (replacing a 2600XT), but if I'm going to have more issues than it's worth, I'll hold back.
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post #72 of 156 Old 03-22-2009, 04:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Folks, i flashed the BIOS from the 4650 HIS graphics card and all problems are gone. I can encourage everyone who has problems with this graphics card to flash this BIOS. It is very easy.

1. Preparation
A) save your BIOS to file with newest GPU-Z
B) Be sure that you have downloaded newest 3.60 atiflash version (since 4650 is supported)
C) Get a working BIOS version
D) Store atiflash, working BIOS (name it "RV730.bin") to a USB stick
E) Store also your original BIOS to USB Stick, just in case there is a problem during flashing you are able to do a blind flash. Choose the name RV730o.bin (o for original. Dont name it too long)

2. Boot your machine in a true DOS mode. E.g. boot from a Win2k CD or Win98 CD to get in DOS mode or from any other true DOS media.

3. Write all your steps down on a piece of paper how you get in that DOS mode (important for a unlikely blind flash)

4. cd to your USB drive. Make sure with "dir" that all files are there.

5. Reboot your machine and make a "blind" trial to get in the DOS mode and to your files.

6. type: atiflash -p 0 RV730.bin

7. Enjoy
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post #73 of 156 Old 03-23-2009, 06:11 PM
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Topcaser,

I have attached a jpg of GPU-Z for my PowerColor AX 4650 - S3 board.
This version (VER011.009.000.000000) does not show the advanced de interlacing options.

Do you think the HSI 4650 BIOS would work for this board?
LL
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post #74 of 156 Old 03-23-2009, 11:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rolfl View Post

Topcaser,

I have attached a jpg of GPU-Z for my PowerColor AX 4650 - S3 board.
This version (VER011.009.000.000000) does not show the advanced de interlacing options.

Do you think the HSI 4650 BIOS would work for this board?

Hi Rofl,

your BIOS version seems to be older than all other versions i have seen yet. Nevertheless, the GPU-Z jpg looks pretty much the same as mine on the Palit.

The only thing, the HIS is different, is in the Default clock: 500MHz.

But imo it is no problem. Iam pretty sure that the BIOS from the HIS fixes all your issues. But be aware, it is important:

1. Save your BIOS to file and backup it so that it cant go lost. (Do you see this little symbol right next to the BIOS version in the GPU-Z window: Click on it to save your BIOS.

2. Please demand a fix from Powercolor anyway regardless if you flash the HIS BIOS. So you get sure that you have the correct BIOS on your card. I write this, because i had yesterday two system crashes and i dont know if it is the new HIS BIOS version: the first one was this annoying watchdog.sys bluescreen, which is again and again a problem in poor driver development @ATI. The second one was a hang up during channel switch. But i had this hang up already with the original Palit BIOS rarely.

Apart from this the HIS BIOS version works like a charm during several hours. I will watch this hang ups and report here.

As long as i get the OK from the HIS BIOS version owner to make it public i will upload the BIOS. Stay tuned.
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post #75 of 156 Old 03-24-2009, 04:15 AM
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It works for me............

Give me an email addy and I will send this BIOS (from an HIS 4650).

Nevermind, I figured out how to upload it.

Now if you brick your video card flashing this BIOS, I take no responsibility at all...proceed at your own risk.

Hope this helps.
LL
LL

 

RV730.zip 38.896484375k . file
Attached Files
File Type: zip RV730.zip (38.9 KB, 30 views)
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post #76 of 156 Old 03-24-2009, 08:14 AM - Thread Starter
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Ha, perfect jnporter.
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post #77 of 156 Old 04-13-2009, 10:46 AM
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Just a warning: I also tried to flash the HIS BIOS to my Xpertvision 4650. But with this BIOS, the integrated HDMI output didn't work anymore under Windows. I only could get it to work again by reverting back to the original BIOS (using the integrated GPU of my motherboard for display during the flashing process), so I'm back where I started.

Catalyst 9.4 does not enable the missing options either, BTW ...
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post #78 of 156 Old 04-14-2009, 09:01 AM
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If I were in your situation I would email the manufacturer of my card an angry message explaining that cards from their competitors (i.e. HIS) work alright, and even worse, the missing features can be enabled by flashing a BIOS from a competitor's model. Maybe that way they'll understand that they should support their products a bit better.
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post #79 of 156 Old 04-14-2009, 10:20 AM
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Been there, done that, didn't help. Most of the time the support person is totally clueless when you start about things like vector-adaptive deinterlacing and responds by sending some useless template text that doesn't help in the slightest. At least I haven't been able to get in touch with someone competent at Palit. Oh well, I will just stick with the one working software configuration that I found even if I can't use the latest drivers then.
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post #80 of 156 Old 04-14-2009, 12:13 PM - Thread Starter
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Rigby,

i was able to flash that BIOS. No problems any more, no system crashes - works really stable.

Send me a PN with your email and i will send you the BIOS which i have flashed.
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post #81 of 156 Old 04-15-2009, 09:01 AM
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Topcaser,

I flashed the bios from jnporter (HIS4650) on a Powercolor AX4650-S3.
It gave all the deinterlacing options and seemed nice and stable under Cat9.3.

However, after I installed Cat9.4 it seemed to get less stable.
Running the overdrive autotuning I lost picture during the test.
In the 'test current settings' I had one blue-screen.

Have you seen any change in stability with cat9.4?

Are you running the HIS4650 bios from jnporter or some other version?

-Rolf
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post #82 of 156 Old 04-15-2009, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rolfl View Post

Topcaser,

I flashed the bios from jnporter (HIS4650) on a Powercolor AX4650-S3.
It gave all the deinterlacing options and seemed nice and stable under Cat9.3.

However, after I installed Cat9.4 it seemed to get less stable.
Running the overdrive autotuning I lost picture during the test.
In the 'test current settings' I had one blue-screen.

Have you seen any change in stability with cat9.4?

Are you running the HIS4650 bios from jnporter or some other version?

-Rolf

Hello Rolf,

I really don't understand why you would overclock a card intended for HTPC use? Overclocking a video card always makes the card more unstable. If you want stability and you want all the post-processing options, you should just turn off overdrive and leave well enough alone. If the BIOS I posted worked well until you tried to overclock, then there is your problem.

If you want a gaming card, get a more powerful card. This card (4650) was not intended to be a good gaming card. Just my opinion, mind you.

JN Porter
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post #83 of 156 Old 04-15-2009, 09:54 AM
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I believe there is some kind of incompatibility of this BIOS with the Xpertvision card. To exclude any possible software problem, I today imaged my hard drive and tried installing a fresh Vista from the installation DVD with the HIS BIOS flashed into my card. It crashed already during the hardware initialisation that Vista does during the installation. I guess the BIOS sets some parameters (VRAM clock or something like that) out of spec for the Xpertvision, and it depends a bit on luck whether it works with a particular card or not.
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post #84 of 156 Old 04-15-2009, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jnporter View Post

Hello Rolf,

I really don't understand why you would overclock a card intended for HTPC use? Overclocking a video card always makes the card more unstable. If you want stability and you want all the post-processing options, you should just turn off overdrive and leave well enough alone. If the BIOS I posted worked well until you tried to overclock, then there is your problem.

If you want a gaming card, get a more powerful card. This card (4650) was not intended to be a good gaming card. Just my opinion, mind you.

JN Porter

JN Porter,
Actually I was not trying to overclock , I was trying to check stability since the HIS bios has MemClk at 500MHz vs 400MHz for Powercolor and I had seen a blue screen with default HIS MHz settings.

I have tried modifying the MemClk on the HIS bios to 400MHz, but this results in no deinterlace options again. So it looks like the driver is keying off the MemClk to determine if I get deinterlace or not.

Note with Powercolor bios, MemClk at 500MHz is a non-starter as it gives bad artifacts. I suspect HIS bios has relaxed DDR timing parameters.

-Rolf
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post #85 of 156 Old 04-23-2009, 07:41 AM
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I've hit the same wall as you guys have mentioned. My card is a HIS 4650 but this model: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16814161262 I get artifacting when I drop in this bios and I'm assuming it's because this card has memory rated at 400mhz (800 effectively). I'm going to email HIS today about this and hopefully get some help. I hate how Newegg won't let you exchange without getting hit with the 15% restocking fee... I'd much rather have another card at this point.
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post #86 of 156 Old 04-30-2009, 02:46 PM
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I have the Sapphire low profile 4650 with DDR2 512MB running @400Mhz.. I've emailed a ticket with Sapphire about the problem of disabled options in the Catalyst Avivo options. Also I've given them a link to this thread.... Has anybody else tried flashing a Sapphire card with the HIS 4650 firmware with the DDR2 running @ 500 Mhz instead of 400Mhz ?
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post #87 of 156 Old 04-30-2009, 03:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by daveydguk View Post

I have the Sapphire low profile 4650 with DDR2 512MB running @400Mhz.. I've emailed a ticket with Sapphire about the problem of disabled options in the Catalyst Avivo options. Also I've given them a link to this thread.... Has anybody else tried flashing a Sapphire card with the HIS 4650 firmware with the DDR2 running @ 500 Mhz instead of 400Mhz ?

Glad (sad?) to hear that your Sapphire low-profile HD 4650 has this issue. Mine too, but everybody says it's a great card in Newegg reviews, so I thought the issue is specific to mine.

It's totally beyond my understanding how a reputable manufacturer like Sapphire can release this defective product.
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post #88 of 156 Old 05-02-2009, 03:41 AM
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I've tried running my card memory at 500Mhz on the overdrive feature and it fails, so there's no point in testing the HIS firmware as attached on this thread as the DDR2 is running at 500Mhz and not 400Mhz.. Anybody with the HIS DDR2 400Mhz version firmware ?
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post #89 of 156 Old 05-04-2009, 08:19 AM
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Sapphire have now asked me for the P/N and SKU details on the card I purchased.. I've also given them my hardware/software details e.g. AMD X2 4800, 4GB RAM, windows XP SP3, Cat 9.4 etc etc..

Hopefully they will look into this problem as even a clean install doesnt seem to enable these options in the drivers.
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post #90 of 156 Old 05-05-2009, 02:24 PM
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Ok.. I've now been asked to email the bios from my card to Sapphire as they say they have tested on the same setup and the options are enabled.

My Bios version is VER011.015.000.012.000000

What Bios are you running renethx ?
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