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post #31 of 56 Old 07-06-2009, 10:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dandan123 View Post

I believe MOCA is not compatible with dishnetwork ?

I have dishnetwork with the the dual HD tuner VIP622, the main tv is connected via HDMI and my second tv uses the the composite out.

Will I be able to use MOCA with this setup ?

Apparently you might be able to get it to work, but examples of how are practically impossible to find. From the Satellite forums I browsed, the Sat guys pretty much said it's impossible.
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post #32 of 56 Old 07-07-2009, 06:20 PM
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It appears the new F5D4076 has only a single RJ45 port on the remote unit when the F5D4075 has four. Has anyone tried a 10/100/1000 meg switch hooked in at the remote end to enable connection to multple devices?? I would think it should work, but there's nothin like hearing from someone who's done it. The same could be used for the D-Link DHP-301 that was top rated in a recent PC World Review (if it works).
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post #33 of 56 Old 07-07-2009, 06:55 PM
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I haven't tested it myself, but I looked into it a few months ago. The official MOCA site stated that it won't work with Dish Network or with DirecTV.
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post #34 of 56 Old 07-07-2009, 09:54 PM - Thread Starter
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I just drove 30min out of my way to find a Powerline HD pair just to test to see what kind of speeds I might get. Plugged it in and it fried! So I got 1 bridge that works and one that doesn't.
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post #35 of 56 Old 07-07-2009, 10:16 PM - Thread Starter
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Stumbled across a beta firmware upgrade for the Belkin F5D4076 dated July 1st/2009:

http://www.belkin.com/support/articl...14994&scid=251
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post #36 of 56 Old 07-08-2009, 08:18 AM
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So other than running an ethernet cable and MOCA there are no other options that work ?

That sucks as running a cable is out of the question for me and dishnetwork rules out MOCA. I was originally planning on using my 802.11N network till I read about wireless networks not being very reliable for streaming video.
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post #37 of 56 Old 07-08-2009, 10:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dandan123 View Post

So other than running an ethernet cable and MOCA there are no other options that work ?

That sucks as running a cable is out of the question for me and dishnetwork rules out MOCA. I was originally planning on using my 802.11N network till I read about wireless networks not being very reliable for streaming video.

What do you mean? There's Powerline, like this thread is about. There's also HPNA which runs over coax or phonelines and according to their website doesn't interfere with satellite. HPNA stuff seems to be difficult to come by though.
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post #38 of 56 Old 07-08-2009, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dandan123 View Post

So other than running an ethernet cable and MOCA there are no other options that work ?

That sucks as running a cable is out of the question for me and dishnetwork rules out MOCA. I was originally planning on using my 802.11N network till I read about wireless networks not being very reliable for streaming video.

I'm having the same problem. Been looking into dual 802.11N but the total cost seems to be $150+, and I am not sure I want to spend that much on something that may not work well enough in the end. MoCa is possible for us but our coax is already on the stressed side and I am loathe to add more load to the mix.

I don't think powerline is an option for me as I know that the two rooms I want to hook together don't run on the same circuit.

So now my question is starting to become... does anyone know what it does to your fire codes if you drill through a subfloor? And how to patch a ceiling/wall?
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post #39 of 56 Old 07-08-2009, 02:15 PM
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I didn't like the drilling thing so I did MoCA. It's probably a pretty worthwhile chance to take even with a stressed coax (as long as you buy returnable adapters). I get throughput of 75+ Mbps realworld speeds (copying an ISO from one machine to another) using bridged Actiontec routers.
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post #40 of 56 Old 07-08-2009, 02:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skriefal View Post

I haven't tested it myself, but I looked into it a few months ago. The official MOCA site stated that it won't work with Dish Network or with DirecTV.

Apparently you can get it to work (the quote is from D-Link's manual for their DXN-220 MoCA adapters).

http://forums.smallnetbuilder.com/showthread.php?t=1681


DBS Satellite Television with Terrestrial Television (Off-Air)
The Direct Broadcast Satellite (DBS) uses proprietary satellite channel-stacking switch or Low-Noise Block (LNB) to
distribute the resulting signal (usually 950 to 2150 MHz) in the same cable network that carries the lower-frequency
terrestrial television from an outdoor antenna. Another Diplexer then separates the signals to the receiver of the TV set
and the DBS set-top box (STB).
Most of the satellite switches are not designed to pass DXN-220 network signal and prevents it from forming a network.
It is recommended that satellite signal and DXN-220 network signal should remain on separate cable networks. If
separate wiring cannot be done, then additional components have to be installed:
1. Install Triplexer to separate UHF/VHF, DXN-220, and DBS signals.
2. Install MoCA Coupler switch before the satellite switch.

--------------------------------------------------

Here's a real-world example of it being used (also from the netbuilder website):

It works great with my home network and is faster and more reliable than wireless, but only if you use logic and not the diagrams they show you.

First of all, when I first hooked it up trying to use their diagrams, it kept disconnecting the modem from the ISP and I could never get the setup to work. Perhaps I misunderstand or misinterpreted their diagrams, but perhaps they just were too vague. Getting through to their support team is difficult at best. It is not supported at the lower levels, you have to be routed to a Senior Product Manager who specializes in this device! I never did get any support.

Here is what I finally ended up doing and it works spectacularly and reliably.

1. If you have satellite, you need to buy a Tru Spec T-3 triplexer (or equivalent). It separates out satellite, FM, and CATV frequencies. Connect the triplexer to your wall. Connect the CATV port of your triplexer to your Coax IN port on the DXN 220. If you only have a cable TV and not satellite, just hook up the DXN 220 IN to the wall using a standard CATV cable (they supply two).

2. Connect the TV OUT (ignore the TV part, it is just an out from the diplexer contained within the DXN 220) to the input of a Channel Vision C-0314 1 In 4 Out Amplified Splitter (or equivalent).

3. Connect your Cable Modem Coax connection to one of the 4 output ports on the Channel Vision.

4. Connect an Ethernet cable from the DXN 220 to one of the LAN ports on your router.

5. Connect your WAN port on the router to your Cable Modem.

6. In the other room, connect the Coax IN to the Coax connection in the wall (you can insert a splitter first if you also watch TV in the room).

7. Connect an Ethernet cable from the DXN 220 to the computer.

If the Power, LAN, Coax and 100 Mbps LED lights are on, you have a connection and there is really no need to worry about installing the software and configuring anything; it just works. If the Coax LED in front of the DXN does not glow, you do not have a good Coax connection. The only things you configure are some passwords, the frequencey (or SCAN) and Pass All if you do not need to watch TV. The defaults were fine for me.

The Channel Vision not only amplifies the signal in order to prevent yourself from being disconnected from the ISP as I was, it also allows you some flexibility in how you add devices to your network. The Channel Vision also has an internal filter to eliminate noise.

Good luck with this. I would recommend this to my clients who have problems using wireless and I know that it would work just fine.

By the way, I am using Windows 7, Build 7100 on two built-to-spec computers, one built by me and one built by AVA-Direct. (AVA's build is neater and nicer than mine.)
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post #41 of 56 Old 07-09-2009, 04:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Was looking at a few of the reviews of the F5D4076 on the Bestbuy site, not many people did thoroughput test. However, a few did, and they mentioned the beta firmware I mentioned above helps attain faster speeds, and some saw 300-350Mbit which is pretty good. Definitely a YMMV situation.
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post #42 of 56 Old 07-16-2009, 06:06 AM
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I've been using the Linksys powerline kit with a built-in switch to connect my PS3, HD TiVo and Apple TV. Works pretty well, very stable. Now I'm thinking about upgrading to the Belkin gigabit unit for the better speed, but I would need to use a 4 or 5 port ethernet switch since the Belkin unit has only one output. Does anyone think that using a switch would create a problem?

Robert D Goldstein
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post #43 of 56 Old 07-16-2009, 09:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robgold View Post

I've been using the Linksys powerline kit with a built-in switch to connect my PS3, HD TiVo and Apple TV. Works pretty well, very stable. Now I'm thinking about upgrading to the Belkin gigabit unit for the better speed, but I would need to use a 4 or 5 port ethernet switch since the Belkin unit has only one output. Does anyone think that using a switch would create a problem?

Should be no problem.
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post #44 of 56 Old 07-16-2009, 10:12 AM
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There's some important gotchas to avoid with Powerline installation. Don't put them in a surge protector; best to plug them directly into the wall. Watch out for noisy AC-DC adapters. I had impaired throughput until I unplugged an AC-DC adapter. It must have been throwing off noise. Once I put the adapter in a surge protector, I got realworld speeds. If they aren't working as well as other reviewers speeds, perhaps popping some circuit breakers is the best way to uncover electrical noise issues.

PS: Some devices are so noisy that they have to be cascaded with several surge protectors.

Former Top 1000 Amazon reviewer bemoaning the loss of objective user reviews. Amazon, stop your complacency!
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post #45 of 56 Old 07-16-2009, 11:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobSalita View Post

There's some important gotchas to avoid with Powerline installation. Don't put them in a surge protector; best to plug them directly into the wall. Watch out for noisy AC-DC adapters. I had impaired throughput until I unplugged an AC-DC adapter. It must have been throwing off noise. Once I put the adapter in a surge protector, I got realworld speeds. If they aren't working as well as other reviewers speeds, perhaps popping some circuit breakers is the best way to uncover electrical noise issues.

That brings up a good point. What do you do about surge protection for the powerline units? I know monster builds some that have it built in. How about the other manufacturers. Is it just a too bad kinda thing...
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post #46 of 56 Old 07-20-2009, 02:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Just got my Belkin Gigabit Powerline units, probably going to return them though. Best thoroughput I could get at a resonable distance was 40Mbit using iperf. Just for testing I tried the units side by side on the same wall and was able to get 85-90Mbit but my Dell m1330 laptop only has a 100Mbit NIC. This was with the latest beta firmware as well. I'll probably keep them around for a few weeks and try and test different outlets around the house but I already tried 5-6 outlets and all had rather anemic results. And these things run pretty hot.
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post #47 of 56 Old 07-20-2009, 08:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stoked View Post

Just got my Belkin Gigabit Powerline units, probably going to return them though. Best thoroughput I could get at a resonable distance was 40Mbit using iperf. Just for testing I tried the units side by side on the same wall and was able to get 85-90Mbit but my Dell m1330 laptop only has a 100Mbit NIC. This was with the latest beta firmware as well. I'll probably keep them around for a few weeks and try and test different outlets around the house but I already tried 5-6 outlets and all had rather anemic results. And these things run pretty hot.

Do you have a GigE NIC to do some more tests?


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post #48 of 56 Old 07-20-2009, 09:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iatacs19 View Post

Do you have a GigE NIC to do some more tests?

I do but the only time I the 100Mbit NIC was the bottleneck was when the adapters were practically on the same wall outlet.
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post #49 of 56 Old 08-05-2009, 03:40 PM
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I am trying these out now; trying to decide whether to return them to Best Buy. I'm using them to extend my network up three floors in a 120 year old house - don't know if the age of the electrical affects performance.

The firmware update was a necessity - got no connection before the update. Now they will frustratingly work for a couple hours, then the connectivity becomes sporadic. I have a Squeezebox hooked up on one end (through a network switch), so when the musics starts and stops it's not pleasant.

I'll go try another outlet in the basement, but I don't understand why they'd work at first, and then fail hours later...
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post #50 of 56 Old 08-05-2009, 04:10 PM
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This is a very good review:
http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/content/view/30888/51/

It shows that the Belkin can work well under ideal conditions, but the Netgear device is more robust. The Belkin's performance drops of fast with any adverse (real-world) factors.
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post #51 of 56 Old 08-05-2009, 04:16 PM
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There's a review up at Small Net Builder

http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/content/view/30888/51/
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post #52 of 56 Old 08-05-2009, 05:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jensph View Post

I am trying these out now; trying to decide whether to return them to Best Buy. I'm using them to extend my network up three floors in a 120 year old house - don't know if the age of the electrical affects performance.

The firmware update was a necessity - got no connection before the update. Now they will frustratingly work for a couple hours, then the connectivity becomes sporadic. I have a Squeezebox hooked up on one end (through a network switch), so when the musics starts and stops it's not pleasant.

I'll go try another outlet in the basement, but I don't understand why they'd work at first, and then fail hours later...

I'm returning mine, they just don't work well enough in my environment to justify the cost. The best speeds I could get was 60Mbit from any reasonable placement(not side by side). However, thoroughput aside, they were unreliable, the connection would intermittently lag or die until I reset the devices. I also tried the last two revisions of the beta firmware with little success. I've resigned to pulling cat5e at least for the particular run I was using the Belkin for. These may work well for some, but they didn't work well for me and my envrionment.
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post #53 of 56 Old 08-06-2009, 04:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stoked View Post

I'm returning mine, they just don't work well enough in my environment to justify the cost. The best speeds I could get was 60Mbit from any reasonable placement(not side by side). However, thoroughput aside, they were unreliable, the connection would intermittently lag or die until I reset the devices. I also tried the last two revisions of the beta firmware with little success. I've resigned to pulling cat5e at least for the particular run I was using the Belkin for. These may work well for some, but they didn't work well for me and my envrionment.

Sounds like my attempt about a year ago using the HD200 powerline adapters. Much lower than expected speeds and poor connectivity. The things couldn't be trusted so they went back to Best Buy.

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post #54 of 56 Old 08-06-2009, 05:03 AM
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If not using dish, moca is by far the best option. I get 80-95mbps from across the house and paid about 75.

..

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post #55 of 56 Old 08-06-2009, 08:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ocZZZZ View Post

If not using dish, moca is by far the best option. I get 80-95mbps from across the house and paid about 75.

Yeah-I was hoping that the Belkin adapters would would turn out better than previous products, since there are places where I don't have coax easily accessible. But, yeah, MoCA works great where I have it. I get about 50 between floors (with lots of splitters in between) and 80 on the same floor. And it seems to work consistently well for everyone.
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post #56 of 56 Old 08-06-2009, 10:00 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bryansj View Post

Sounds like my attempt about a year ago using the HD200 powerline adapters. Much lower than expected speeds and poor connectivity. The things couldn't be trusted so they went back to Best Buy.

Ironically, my crappy no-name Powerline v1.0 units are pretty stable, just not fast enough.
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