FAQ for the 3D HTPC - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 1533 Old 04-04-2010, 02:58 PM - Thread Starter
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Link to Nvidia 3DTV Play setup manual
Look at this first, then look at the rest of the FAQ below.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ricabullah View Post


Lets start: (FAQ prepared by myself )

Do i need an nVidia 3D vision kit if i have a DLP TV- like Mitsubishi or DLP PJ- like Acer 5360

Yes and No;

YES; At least one pair of nVidia kit (for its emitter) is needed for setup nVidia 3D Vision drivers.
NO; any DLP link glasses will do the same job because dlp screen sends signals to your eye-wear.
But if you have any DLP device (TV/PJ) or if you want to play 3D games via nVidia card, you will need at least one nVidia emitter even your DLP Link eyewear doesn't use the nVidia emitter.
One emitter is needed to setup 3D Vision Drivers.
(be careful; your DLP glasses shouldn't see the emitter directly otherwise signals are interfered.)

btw i have one set of nVidia kit, two Xpan X102 DLP glasses and one pair of Optoma BG-ZD 101 DLP Link glasses and an Acer 5360 PJ.

OK i bought a pair of 3D vision kit glasses, can i use them with those new generation 3D TV play compatible 3D TVs?
No, never, new gen. TVs use their own glasses but you can use them with nVidia 4** or new 5** series cards.

But i had them already, where i gonna use them?
You can use them with DLP TVs and DLP PJs. But any DLP Link glasses will do the same job.

I have Geforce glasses, do i need to buy 3D TV Play software?
No, it's included in the Geforce nVidia 3D vision CD.

Ok , i have nvidia 3dVision glasses and 3D TV Play software, can i play 3D BD on my 3dTV?
No, you can only play games and videos with that SW on your 3DTV.
If you wanna watch 3DBD, you need an external SW like Corel, Arcsoft or Cyberlink.

Then can i watch 3DBD with my DLP TV or DLP PJ over nvidia glasses+3D TV Play SW?
No, you need the same external SW.

I don't have nVidia 3D Vision glasses and 3D TV Play SW but i have a 3DTV supported GPU by nVidia. Can i watch 3DBD or 3D video or play 3D games?
Yes you can; if you have any 3D commercial player like Corel WinDVD 10, Arcsoft TMT 5 or Cyberlink PDVD 10.

Q:Where is supported 3D TV list?
A:Link

For some new HW you will need this update:
Link

Any confusion left?

Link
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For a inexpensive HTPC I would recommend the lowest price Dell Inspiron (Inspiron 560) $449.00, and buying a Blu Ray drive for 70.00 and a Zotak ZT-20404-20L Video card for 98.00. Which is about 620.00 Canadian and includes Windows 7 OEM.
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Which GPUs will support 3D TVs? I checked the NVIDIA website and Fermi 430 supports HDMI 1.4a.
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NVIDIA GeForce GPUs have been tested to be compatible with HDMI 1.4a, and will work well with the 3D TVs, including the Panasonic VIERA TVs. The following are GPUs supported by NVIDIA 3DTV Play:

•Desktop GPU: Blu-ray 3D playback: Make sure your videocard has "PureVideo HD 4" or VP4. ATI videocards are listed in the HD3D link below.
GeForce GTX 480
GeForce GTX 470
GeForce GTX 465
GeForce GTX 460
GTS 450, GT 440 (October)
GT 430 (October)
GeForce GT 340
GeForce GT 320
GeForce GT 240 also supports VP4, but no HD audio bitstreaming.

•Laptop GPUs:
GeForce GT 240 Notebook
GeForce GTS 360M
GeForce GTS 350M
GeForce GT 335M
GeForce GT 330M
GeForce GT 325M
GeForce GT 320M

Nvidia Website for more information

•ATI has something called "HD3D". The site lists the videocards ATI says works with 3D Blu Ray: link

•Intel® Core™ Processors with Intel® HD Graphics
(Intel Core i5-600 Dual Core Processor)

In order to be able to use the integrated graphics in these Clarksdale processors you need to use the proper chipset and motherboard. These new chipsets include the Intel H55, H57 and Q57.
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What do I need for HW & SW??
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Display
You'll need 3D TV that has HDCP: DVI, HDMI, or Nvidia 3D Vision ready display.

Software
Nvidia will release a driver around august or september 2010 that will enable NVidia 3D Blu Ray Vision ready GPU's to play back 3D Blu Ray with Powerdvd 10 Ultra 3D Mark II or equivalent SW.

Nvidia 3D TV Play software needs to be used with Powerdvd 10 Ultra 3D Mark II or equivalent SW and enables HDMI 1.4 to autosense the 3D Content so the TV doesn't need to be manually set.
See the Misc info section for more detail.

Videocard
NVidia videocard that features VP4, Intel Clarksdale i5-600 processor with Intel H55, H57 and Q57 chipset.

The Nvidia 3D TV Play faq said the DVI can be used as long as it uses a HDMI adapter, they specify the use of HDMI cable is necessary: HDMI 1.3 Category 2 High Speed cable. However some reviews online said you can use a DVI cable and don't need a HDMI cable, so it's not yet known for sure if DVI can be used or not in the final 3D TV Play product.

Blu Ray Drive
Blu Ray drive with 2x BDMV (AACS Compliant Disc) read speed or faster

CPU
You can use a lower power cpu if you use a dedicated videocard that can decode 3D Blu Ray.
Or, Intel Core i5 661, AMD Athlon II X3 440 or better models for sw decode, sometimes called "NO GPU, uses the CPU for graphics processing".

"if you want to do 2D-3D conversion in PC (of HD contents; SD is easy), you still need a powerful processor (E7xxx or higher)" - renethx

Video card ram
in my opinion 1GB is the minimum amount of ram for the videocard.

System ram
2 GB minimum

Operating system
PC with Microsoft Windows 7, Vista* and XP SP3* (Windows XP Service Pack 3 is required)

What is the graphics card slot requirement?

The slot must have at least 10.2Gbps throughput.

PCIE 1.x single lane is 250MB/s.
Multiply that by 16 in a 16x slot and you have 32Gbps

AGP 3.0 8x Rate (MBps) 2133, (Gbps) 17.064

So both agp 3.0 8x and pcie 1.x 16x are compatible as far as having enough throughput from the videocard to the display.

Official Minimum system requirements: Nvidia

•Microsoft® Windows® Vista 32/64-bit or Windows 7 32/64-bit
•Intel® Core™2 Duo or AMD Athlon™ X2 CPU or higher
•1GB of system memory. (2GB is recommended)
•100 MB free disk space
•3D Vision-Ready Displays (See link for list)
•NVIDIA GeForce Graphics Cards: Must have VP4 capability

Official Minimum system requirements: Cyberlink

System Requirements for Blu-ray 3D with Hardware Acceleration

•Microsoft Windows 7, Vista* and XP SP3* (Windows XP Service Pack 3 is required)
•Intel Pentium D 950 (3.0GHz), AMD Athlon 64 X2 4600+ (2.4GHz) or above
•Intel Graphic Media Accelerator HD (Intel Core i3/i5), NVIDIA Geforce GTX 400, series and Gefore GT 240/320/340
•2 GB of system memory
•3D display and 3D glasses are required (NVIDIA 3D Vision*, 3D Ready HDTV, Micro-polarizer LCD or Anaglyph Red/Cyan Glasses). HDCP compliant display for digital output

*PowerDVD with NVIDIA 3D Vision is not supported under Windows Vista and XP

System Requirements for Blu-ray 3D without Hardware Acceleration

•Microsoft Windows 7, Vista* and XP SP3* (Windows XP Service Pack 3 is required)
•Intel Core 2 Duo E6750 (2.66GHz), AMD Phenom 9450 (2.10GHz) or above
•Intel G45, ATI Radeon HD2400, NVIDIA GeForce 8600GT or above.
•2 GB of system memory
•3D display and 3D glasses are required (NVIDIA 3D Vision*, 3D Ready HDTV, Micro-polarizer LCD or Anaglyph Red/Cyan Glasses). HDCP compliant display for digital output

Minimum cpu requirement: Tomshardware



"As you can see, the triple-core Athlon II X3 440 at 3 GHz is highly stressed during Blu-ray 3D playback.
It's difficult to make precise conclusions without per-core utilization data but CyberLink's software decoder appears to take advantage of threading, a feature that quad-core owners will appreciate.

Judging from the performance we've seen, we think Blu-ray 3D can be comfortably played back with a triple-core CPU at 3 GHz or a quad-core CPU at 2.5 GHz using PowerDVD's software decoder."
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What kind of TV is supported?
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Blu-ray 3D playback: Make sure your display is listed 3D Vision-Ready Displays

Acer GD245HQ 120Hz LCD 1920x1080
Acer GD235HZ 120Hz LCD 1920x1080
Acer X1261-3D 1280x720
Acer X1130P 1024x768
Acer H5360 1280x720
Acer X1110 800x600
Acer HN274H 27" LCD
Acer GN245HQ 24" LCD


Alienware™ OptX™ AW2310 120Hz 1920x1080

ASUS VG236H 120 Hz 1920x1080

DepthQ® HD 3D Projector by LightSpeed Design, Inc. 1280x720
DQ-3120 by LightSpeed Design, Inc. 800x600

LG W2363D 120 Hz 1920x1080
LG W2363DB 120 Hz 1920x1080


Mitsubishi® 1080p DLP® Home Theater TV:
WD-57833
WD-60735
WD-60737
WD-60C8
WD-60C9
WD-65735
WD-65736
WD-65737
WD-65C8
WD-65C9
WD-65833
WD-65835
WD-65837
WD-73735
WD-73736
WD-73737
WD-73833
WD-73835
WD-73837
WD-73C8
WD-73C9
WD-82737
WD-82837
L65-A90

NEC NP216 1024x768

Optoma GT360 800x600
Optoma GT720 1280x800
Optoma HD67 1280x720
Optoma HD66 1280x800

Panasonic TC-P50VT20/TC-P50VT25

Samsung UN467000
Samsung UN557000

ViewSonic PJD6531w 1280x720
ViewSonic PJD6220-3D 1024x768
ViewSonic PJD6210-3D 1024x768
ViewSonic PJD5351 1024x768
ViewSonic PJD5111 800x600
ViewSonic PJD6381 1024x768
ViewSonic PJD6211 1024x768
ViewSonic PJD6221 1024x768
ViewSonic PJD6241 1024x768
ViewSonic PJD5112 1024x768

Link to updated list.

"The list is hardware components that support "NVIDIA 3D Vision" (NVIDIA's proprietary IR emitter and glasses). GeForce 4xx supports every display device supporting HDMI 1.4a 3D." - renethx

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What kind of TV for 3D Blu Ray?
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Nvidia says 120Hz 3d tv that has hdmi input is the minimum standard. However 120Hz 3D is mainly for gaming, not movies.
For movies, 3D Blu Ray movies you'll need a TV that has very little crosstalk, and this means faster than 120Hz.

If the TV is certified for HDMI 1.4a it will work, so passive polarized TV's are ok too. You don't Need to use only active polarized 3D TV's, the kind that use the shutter glasses.

Crosstalk affects the quality of the 3D TV by creating a luma halo type effect around a picture that is shown to either the left or right eye.

Acer GD235HZ works
Alienware OptX AW2310 works
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Is my videocard already capable of dual stream acceleration?
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Dual stream acceleration simply means the videocard can output 3D blu ray to a 3D tv.
To see if your videocard is capable, download a program called "DXVA checker". In the Decoder device tab check each from the list and click Dual stream acceleration to see if your videocard is already 3D compatible. However only NVidia cards have the MVC codec HW acceleration right now I think. MVC is the codec 3D blu ray wil use, so the fact that the videocard supports dual stream acceleration is pointless as no 3D blu ray wil use any other codec but MVC I think.

link



As you can see in the list in the picture there is no mention of MVC. Only certain NVidia cards may have MVC listed at this point in time.



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Various bits of misc info
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HDMI 1.3 is not automatically sensing the type of 3D signal: side by side.
HDMI 1.3 requires you to set the cable box, or HTPC, to the right 3D signal mode, and then set the television to that 3D mode.

HDMI 1.4 with 3D TV Play automatically senses what the 3D source content is: 1080p 24fps, 720p 50fps, 720p 60fps, and you don't need to set the TV or HTPC, it just works.

To watch 3d Blu Ray you only need the Driver Update, for gaming on 3d TV's you need to buy the NVidia 3d TV Play.
3D TV Play lets you use HDMI 1.4 so it senses the 3D content and you don't need to set this manually.

3D TV Play is for the listed Nvidia Videocards, but as far as supporting Intel and AMD graphics, they have not yet said that they will.
They said they will work with Microsoft to get the media center overlay working, and if they will do that then maybe if Intel and AMD ask NVidia for 3D TV Play support NVidia will support theire goods.

In the 2011 Intel will release Sandybridge, designed with HDMI 1.4a and built for 3D Blu Ray.

" there are two lines of chipsets for consumer desktops: H and P series. The H series supports Sandy Bridge’s on-die graphics, while the P series is strictly for discrete graphics.

At launch we’ll have P67 and H67 based motherboards, both of which are in testing right now. A quarter later we’ll see value H61 motherboards added to the mix." - Source

So if your building a 3D Blu Ray HTPC it should use these new parts and not the i5 661. Just wait for the new parts in 2011.

For this new build you would get the new chipset (LGA-1155), the new cpu, ram (DDR3-1333)and heatsink LGA-1155 heatsink.

Remember, the i5 chipset is HDMI 1.3a, not HDMI 1.4a, so you'll need to adjust the HTPC and TV to use the correct 3D mode.
If NVidia 3D TV Play will use the new Intel chipset that has HDMI 1.4a and let it autosense the 3D source is not yet known,
or even if the new cpu will need 3D TV Play to autosense the 3D source.

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Best monitor?
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The best monitor is the one that doesn't strain your eyes, and this means no crosstalk. For this you would buy a Mitsubishi 3D DLP TV. Look at a mitsubishi model and research it to see if it needs a upgrade or has no crosstalk or is 3D blu ray compatible. This is the way it is in November 2010, in the future the Plasma and LCD TV's may offer no crosstalk.

Checkout the tru3d website, they offer the dlp TV and adapter kit. (I'm not affiliated with any of these people in any way. I got this name 'tru3d' from the 3d forum and googled the link I'm providing now.) link

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Passive Projector Section
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solid_dvd View Post

Hi!

I posted a bit similar topic in another thread, but I guess this would have been the perfect spot to ask.

My plan is to watch 3D BR and .mkv-files with HPTC. I have built a passive system consisting of GT430, 2 x Optoma 3D-XL, which divides the signal into right and left and two projectors, JVC DLA-HD1, which through filters display the picture on a silver screen. I cannot get the HTPC to play the 3D Blu-rays though in 3D.

And then the question: Apparently I do not need for movie watching the Nvidia 3D vision kit with the emitter. But how in earth do I configure the Stereoscopic view as I do not have Nvidia Vision, Wired Glasses etc. - which is the right option to choose there? Any help via a vis the HTPC configuration is appreciated.

Thanks for advice!

Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

Hardware: Dual-Projector 3D Theater Checklist ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by solid_dvd View Post

Seems that my problem lies with the HDMI-splitter. It most probably is not HDMI 1.4/3D capable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rdjam View Post

I got a 1 to 4 Gefen "tool box" splitter - it's technically a HDMI 1.3 splitter but it's 3D and HD Audio compatible. (1 to 4 means, 1 HDMI in and 4 HDMI outputs).

If you have a 1.3 AVR, you could run your device to the splitter first, then send 1 output to the AVR, and 2 outputs to the 3DXL boxes.

Re: passive or active - The Gefen box has a switch to let you select whether the HDMI handshake happens with the Gefen, or with the passthru device, and another switch lets you choose whether you are passing multichannel audio or 2 channel (ie SPDIF) audio.

The Gefen is discounted on Amazon, but there may well be cheaper options out there. There is a Sewell HDMI 1.4 switch that is about to ship - only $75. I haven't hooked up the Gefen yet, expect to be able to test all the options over the weekend, so can report how much of that flexibility was actually needed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Linn View Post

Wouldn't that depend on whether the receiver was connected before or after the 3D-XL? Doesn't the box output 720P at 120 Hz? Does that require a 3D receiver or is a 3D receiver only required for 1080P 120 Hz?

Joe

Quote:
Originally Posted by rdjam View Post

Was only outlining a dual pj setup with a HDMI 1.3 AVR. Different setups vary. With my 4311CI, I have all sources to AVR first, then one of the HDMI outputs will feed splitter, which feeds the pjs. The other output on the AVR goes to a Panny 3D plasma.

This will vary again if someone is using the 3DXL for a single pj DLP-Link setup. In Doug's case (if that is his setup) he would go to the splitter first, then split to AVR and the 3DXL.


LL


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post #2 of 1533 Old 04-08-2010, 09:05 AM
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Does NVIDIA 3DTV Play support 1080p60?
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Currently there are no 3D TVs that support 1080p60. When these products are available, NVIDA will investigate supporting them with our GPUs.

So no S3D PC gaming @ 1080p50/60 fp & sbs ?
I know it is specified as optional in HDMI1.4a, not mandatory.

I hope that the panasonic vt20 will support it at least, they seem to have been working with nvidia (nvidia 3DTV Play). So I hope nvidia at least stressed out the importance of 1080p50/60 for PC gaming.
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post #3 of 1533 Old 04-13-2010, 09:09 PM
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so 3d blu-ray wont work on the samsung 2233rz like 3d games do with the 3d vision kit?
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post #4 of 1533 Old 04-14-2010, 02:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGuyInTheChair View Post

so 3d blu-ray wont work on the samsung 2233rz like 3d games do with the 3d vision kit?

It looks like the videocard needs to connect to the display using hdmi. So if the videocard only had a dvi you would use a dvi to hdmi adapter to connect the videocard to the display. Dual link DVI, max. data throughput is 9.9Gbps.


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The way to send 120fps content to the unit is using a graphics card that has dual link DVI support. You cannot convert single link HDMI to dual link DVI and the monitor does not have an HDMI input connection. Also I am not aware of any graphic cards that output dual link HDMI or of a any dual link HDMI to dual link DVI adapters
I do not know if you can run a program like PowerDVD 10 Ultra to play 3D BR disk and have it output to the monitor using the Nvidia code just the same as a 3D game does.
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post #6 of 1533 Old 04-15-2010, 06:12 AM
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The confusion arises form the fact that there are basically two different types of 3D display.

The first, let's call it Type A, accepts in input a 120Hz signal, up to 1920x0180p. These are generally PC monitors used with nVidia 3D Vision, which sends a Frame Sequential format with two alternating images at 60Hz per eye. If you use a 720p/1080i resolution, you can use a DVI-to HDMI cable from the PC to the monitor/TV, but if you want 1080p, the required bandwidth (297MHz) is out of reach of any current HDMI chip (AFAIK), even though it is well inside the HDMI 1.3/1.4 standard (340MHz).

So, if you want 1080p in Type A displays, you are stuck to Dual-Link DVI.

Then there are Type B displays. These are the 3D HDTV with a HDMI 1.4 input. These HDTV accept "3D over HDMI", a set of protocols among which there is Frame Packing 1920x2205@24Hz used by Blu-Ray 3D, that is just 148,5MHz, like 1080p@60Hz and it is thus inside HDMI chips capability.

So you can't send a 1080p@120Hz to a Type B display, because they don't have a Dual Link DVI, but some of them (don't know which in detail) accept a 120Hz signal at 720p/1080i through HDMI.

Bottom line:
@petillan: you can't play games at 1080p@50/60Hz per eye on a 3D HDTV, but you can play at 720/1080i.

@TheGuyInTheChair: not at 1080p, but if you have a player that converts Blu-Ray 3D to Frame Sequential at 120Hz, you can watch them at 720p; I don't know if PDVD 10 MarkII will do this conversion, but PDVD 10 already does it for DVD 2d-3D conversion.

nVidia 3DTV Play does the opposite: it makes the video card to output a Frame Packing format to watch a Blu-Ray 3D on a 3D HDTV with HDMI 1.4.
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post #7 of 1533 Old 04-15-2010, 07:02 AM
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Ok, I'll bite and ask the question: What about ATI supporting the new generation 3d HTDV's?
Also, I'm not interested in a proprietary 3d solution from a computer graphics card (like Nvidia's solution). I want my TV to do the 3d because cable tv vendors are already sending 3d content (Comcast just did the masters partially in 3d).
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ATI hasn't announced anything yet about 3D HDTV compliance.

As for the cable TV, it seems that they are using a frame compatible format (like side-by-side half of Masters). These formats don't have problems: they simply pass to the TV because the video card manages them like a 2D frame and you just need to manually select side-by-side on the 3D HDTV to watch 3D.

The problem is for Blu-Ray 3D.
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post #9 of 1533 Old 04-18-2010, 08:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nalawod View Post

Ok, I'll bite and ask the question: What about ATI supporting the new generation 3d HTDV's?

I added this to the first post;

Is my videocard already capable of dual stream acceleration?
________________________

Dual stream acceleration simply means the videocard can output 3D blu ray to a 3D tv.
To see if your videocard is capable, download a program called "DXVA checker". In the Decoder device tab check each from the list and click Dual stream acceleration to see if your videocard is already 3D compatible. However only NVidia cards have the MVC codec HW acceleration right now I think. MVC is the codec 3D blu ray wil use, so the fact that the videocard supports dual stream acceleration is pointless as no 3D blu ray wil use any other codec but MVC I think.

link



As you can see in the list in the picture there is no mention of MVC. Only certain NVidia cards may have MVC listed at this point in time.



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I am not aware of any ATI equivalent to the recently released Nvida 3DTV product described in the following link:

http://www.nvidia.com/object/io_1268635315649.html
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post #11 of 1533 Old 04-18-2010, 03:40 PM
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http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/15/a...iative-at-gdc/

They'll all work on it.

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post #12 of 1533 Old 04-27-2010, 09:07 AM
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I'm getting very close to plunging into a HTPC. I currently have my old desktop PC sending media to my Samsung DLNA LCDs. On the horizon is a new 3D unit for the main screen in the house. Would I be able to send 3D wirelessly over the DLNA from a properly built HTPC? Realistically, what 3D media I use would be BD or HDTV from my cable provider, but I'm just curious.
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post #13 of 1533 Old 04-27-2010, 07:54 PM - Thread Starter
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gwydionjhr,

dlna news

Sony Machine

The DLNA news site has nothing on 3D streaming, and the Sony Machine says it can stream to the DLNA TV. But the Sony machine's DLNA is not activated yet and won't be till the 3D is activated and about that time expect a announcement from the DLNA site I linked too about 3D.


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post #14 of 1533 Old 04-28-2010, 08:50 AM
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Merci! I'll keep an eye on that DLNA site.

Sammy's C6900 3D BD is DLNA as well.
http://www.samsung.com/ca/consumer/t...ail&returnurl=
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post #15 of 1533 Old 05-07-2010, 08:59 AM
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i am wondering is there any video card that is 100% 1.4a ready but not compatible?
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post #16 of 1533 Old 05-07-2010, 02:42 PM
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I'll wait for this panel to be produced in TV sizes and skip the whole $100 glasses fiasco:

http://www.tmdisplay.com/tm_dsp/pres...0-04-27_e.html

A 9 parallax display that changes the image depending on your viewing angle.
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post #17 of 1533 Old 05-07-2010, 06:43 PM
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wow... I wonder how good that is. I will refuse to do the glasses-in-my-living-room thing too.

HTPC always in progess...
things I've learned here:
"the sound of a power cord" is BS.
turn your center speaker 90 degrees.
avoid women who require WAF in a HT.
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post #18 of 1533 Old 05-07-2010, 08:28 PM
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I don't know how good it will be yet but I will definitely be keeping my eye on it. That panel is only a 21" but I may get one once it's released just to see it. I do hope they plan on making 47"+ versions though.
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post #19 of 1533 Old 05-10-2010, 12:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redass View Post

I will refuse to do the glasses-in-my-living-room thing too.

Same here. And what about people who need to wear glasses to see the TV clearly?
They have to wear two pairs !!!!!
I don't think so.
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post #20 of 1533 Old 05-13-2010, 08:37 AM
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mike5 info is more useful than the OP (for HTPCs)
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...0#post18486850


nvidia's setup is for gaming. Most people looking for 3d and their HTPC are using "3d" TVs, (samsung, panny new 2010 sets) - they are looking to use thier HTPC to play 3d bluray movies.

If you want to use nvidia propriety gaming setup you need a tv/mointor with 120hz input/output (i think only a few dlp tvs can do that).

When the ps3 and xbox 360 do "3d" they will be using the "3d" tvs - not the 120hz screens. Hopefully PC games will give use that option too.

hdmi 1.4 isn't required for any 3d setups.

for now only powerDVD 10 can play bluray 3d movies (any others?). It will use both 3D hdtv and nvidia 120hz.

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post #21 of 1533 Old 05-14-2010, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zielin View Post

for now only powerDVD 10 can play bluray 3d movies (any others?).

Not available to consumers yet. At this point, only internal builds of PDVD 10 can play them. Current consumer builds can only "upgrade" 2D DVDs/videos to 3D.
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post #22 of 1533 Old 05-14-2010, 01:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redass View Post

wow... I wonder how good that is. I will refuse to do the glasses-in-my-living-room thing too.

That is what I want to do too. So when we refer 3D here, is that mean watching these movies with or without glasses?
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post #23 of 1533 Old 05-22-2010, 03:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Updated first post.


There is new, and then you are new.
This is a moral of the bears and their cereal.
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post #24 of 1533 Old 05-27-2010, 12:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 8:13 View Post


link



As you can see in the list in the picture there is no mention of MVC. Only certain NVidia cards may have MVC listed at this point in time.


good stuff
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post #25 of 1533 Old 05-28-2010, 11:15 AM
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The article in the following link lists the Nvidia cards that have MVC decoding support.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/...er,2636-6.html
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post #26 of 1533 Old 06-01-2010, 12:36 PM
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I am confused by one thing with all of this. Pretty much any movie you watch is 23.976 fps or 24 fps. If you have 24 left eye frames and then 24 right eye frames you end up with 48 frames of movie info shown instead of 24. If my TV is running 60 frames why is it not capable of showing me what I want to see? I am lost on why you need 120Hz monitors in order to show 48 frames of movie per second.

Sorry if this sounds dumb, but I just bought a new 55" LED backlit LCD TV 3-4 months ago and do not like the idea of it being dumpster fodder at the end of the year.
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post #27 of 1533 Old 06-02-2010, 09:57 AM
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The problem is that 60 is not an mutliple of 24.

Let's begin with a 2D TV. Suppose the movie is 24fps (framerate) and the TV works at 60Hz (refresh rate). Each frame must stay visible exactly 1/24th of second on the screen, otherwise the movie speed changes. If the TV were refreshing at 48Hz, the solution would be simple: repeat each frame two times in a row: the first 48th of second the TV shows the first frame, the second 48th of second it still shows the first frame and because 1/48 + 1/48 = 1/24 the frame lasts exactly 1/24th of second.

But the TV is 60Hz. If the TV shows the first frame in the first 60th of second and again the first frame in the second 60th of second, until now the frame has lasted 1/60 + 1/60 = 1/30th of second, less than the right value 1/24th of second.

At this point the TV has two choices:
- to begin showing the second frame: but in this case the first frame has a too short duration of 1/30th of second;
- to show one more time the first frame: but in this case the first frame has a too long duration of 1/60 + 1/60 + 1/60 = 1/20th of second.

The solution of the dilemma chosen in NTSC land is in the middle: to show alternatively 3 times and two times the frame, giving an average 1/24th of second duration of the frame. It is called 3:2 pulldown. The problem is that it gives judder.

120Hz is good because is a multiple of 24 (x5), so it behaves like 48Hz (x2). 72Hz (x3) and 96Hz(x4) are good refresh rates, too.

In 3D sets the problem is the same, but separately for each eye. Each eye watches a different movie, one made with the left views and the other with the right views. Each movie is 24fps and a 120Hz 3DTV is 60Hz per eye, giving the problem explained above.

You need a 144Hz refresh rate, at least, to solve the problem in 3D. Each eye has 72Hz, that is a multiple of 24 (48 is too low and gives flicker to most people).

I hope to have been clear.
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post #28 of 1533 Old 06-02-2010, 03:15 PM
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The new 240Hz Tvs are better (for 3D) since you get 120Hz for the left view and 120Hz for the right view. I seen the demo briefly at Future Shop and Best Buy - they had Monsters vs Aliens 3D on and it made the screen/picture look like it was about 18" deep. If you are looking at 3D TV - the 240Hz TVs are the way to go.
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post #29 of 1533 Old 06-02-2010, 11:14 PM
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The 240Hz models use black frame insertion to fight ghosting, so the final refersh rate is still 60Hz per eye (1/60 = 1/240 left eye + 1/240 black frame + 1/240 right eye + 1/240 black frame).
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post #30 of 1533 Old 06-03-2010, 08:58 AM
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The specific TV in question is a Toshiba 55SV670U with Clearscan 240. I know that it's not an actual 240Hz refresh, but I am surprised that there's not some way to use it even at a reduced level. I guess I can wait until all of this matures and then sell/buy new.
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