Is it possible to get HD audio full bitrate, over analog 5.1, EVEN if downsampled? - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 202 Old 10-17-2010, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandeBoma View Post

1) because i have the playback software on the other partition and i don't intend to switch to vista since i am gaming on xp
2) because changing the set up of the panel is tedious since if i open it the content is not displayed, I have to change the filter list to open pvd9 audio decoder, switch to 6 channel, then rechange the filters and pdvd10 audio decoder will import the settings from left from the other decoder. Then I have to take the screenshot and post it and then repeat the process to restore the 2 channel setting since I use it for stereo music
3) why would I lie about this? I don't have a motive, powerdvd10 audio decoder DOES connect to the mpc gabest splitter for m2ts and this is already estabilished, it does so in whichever speaker setting you want provided you instruct it correctly and it does decode dts and dts hd in the original bit depth and sample frequency (this has also been estabilished by screenshots)

I am not saying you are telling a lie. I just wrote the conclusion from your ReClock screenshot. Simply I have no reason to believe you or not to believe you without a proof (i.e. a proper screenshot)...

Your version of MPC-HC is 1.3.1922.0. That might be a trick. The latest build of PowerDVD 10 is 10.0.2113.51. What's your build? The information may be useful for others to get bit-perfect DTS-HD decoding from CyberLink Audio Decoder.
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post #32 of 202 Old 10-17-2010, 01:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nighthog View Post

Yeah, it says exactly the same as you have in that image for me. Though I have it set to 4 channel surround instead.
Going by this trueHD is working then?

I'll be checking out the TMT3 trial later.

Yes. As long as "Input" is TrueHD, ffdshow Audio Decoder either bitstream or decode it.
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post #33 of 202 Old 10-17-2010, 01:36 PM
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here is the proof... I don't know about mpc version or power dvd version ( i use 10.0.1516.51), perhaps newer versions have lost this capability, I am not going to update anything since I have nirvana now and everything works
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post #34 of 202 Old 10-17-2010, 01:44 PM
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post #35 of 202 Old 10-17-2010, 01:57 PM
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@GrandeBoma

One more question: Your ReClock version? Thx.
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post #36 of 202 Old 10-17-2010, 02:48 PM
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I think it explains:



And no manual control is available on Audio Decoder.



Chronical Tester
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post #37 of 202 Old 10-17-2010, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandeBoma View Post

here is the proof... I don't know about mpc version or power dvd version ( i use 10.0.1516.51), perhaps newer versions have lost this capability, I am not going to update anything since I have nirvana now and everything works

I suspect you are decoding the DTS Core only.
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post #38 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 12:04 AM
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@ricabullah... the cyberlink audio decoder (from pdvd 10) is setup by default at 2 channels and it is not possible to change this setting because if you try to open the tab it will show an empty screen. BUT if you make the settings on the cyberlink audio decoder from pdvd 9 the settings you make in this tab WILL be copied on the audio decoder of pdvd 10 and reclock is correctly showing the number of channels as I showed you in picture number 3 (playback3.jpg)

@vladd IF I am getting the dts core only, answer this: how is it possible that the bitrate of audio in the program box (bottom of picture playback3.jpg) is reporting more than 3 megabytes? and how is it possible that the only dts hd ma track I have in 96/24 (baraka blu-ray) is showing 96 kHz, 24 bits, 6 channel? Please note that the dts core of this track does NOT feature 96 khz, rather 48 khz. Now, IF I was decoding the core I'd get 1.5 mb (or 765 kb) in the info box of mpc, and reclock would report 48 khz. As a matter of fact, the latter two DO happen if I set ffdshow as an audio decoder. NOW THAT is a situation where the dts core only is being decoded
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post #39 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 12:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

@GrandeBoma

One more question: Your ReClock version? Thx.

latest
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post #40 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 01:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandeBoma View Post

@ricabullah... the cyberlink audio decoder (from pdvd 10) is setup by default at 2 channels and it is not possible to change this setting because if you try to open the tab it will show an empty screen. BUT if you make the settings on the cyberlink audio decoder from pdvd 9 the settings you make in this tab WILL be copied on the audio decoder of pdvd 10 and reclock is correctly showing the number of channels as I showed you in picture number 3 (playback3.jpg)

Which build of your PowerDVD 9 is? It looks like CyberLink modifies each decoder with each build. For example, I tested PDVD 9 Build 2528 and there is no tab on channel numbers (so I got 96kHz, stereo, 24 bit LPCM from 96kHz, 6 channel, 24 bit DTS-HD; 96kHz means it processes DTS-HD anyway).
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post #41 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 01:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

Which build of your PowerDVD 9 is? It looks like CyberLink modifies each decoder with each build. For example, I tested PDVD 9 Build 2528 and there is no tab on channel numbers (so I got 96kHz, stereo, 24 bit LPCM from 96kHz, 6 channel, 24 bit DTS-HD).

I will have to check when I get back home. This is odd, all cyberlink decoder control boxes that I have seen always had the tab to select how many channels to output

Anyway, can we finally rule out the core dts theory and move on to see how to get it to multichannel output? help from the experts is needed here, instead of skepticism
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post #42 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 01:58 AM
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Yeah, I believe now CyberLink Audio Decoder (of a certain build) decodes DTS-HD in a DirectShow player. An issue is how to control the correct channel count.
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post #43 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 02:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

Yeah, I believe now CyberLink Audio Decoder (of a certain build) decodes DTS-HD in a DirectShow player. An issue is how to control the correct channel count.

renethx, as far as you know, was this known before this thread?

P.S. would a registry key changer do the job for the channel count? I know that the arcsoft decoder defaulting at stereo was also a problem and regkey changers were used to try to solve
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post #44 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 03:25 AM
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I have no idea. CyberLink constantly changes its components and the audio decoder of the latest build of PowerDVD 10 even can't be used in a DirectShow player (precisely speaking, it does not connect to any audio renderer).
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post #45 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 03:33 AM
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@renethx Does Arcsoft Audio Decoder HD from TMT3 connect with mpc splitter? If it does, is it decoding full 96/24 or is it limited to 48/16? If it is limited, can reclock+wasapi overcome this limitation like they do with cyberlink?
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post #46 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 04:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandeBoma View Post

@renethx Does Arcsoft Audio Decoder HD from TMT3 connect with mpc splitter? If it does, is it decoding full 96/24 or is it limited to 48/16? If it is limited, can reclock+wasapi overcome this limitation like they do with cyberlink?

Some splitters (SageTV's, LAVFSplitter v1.0) connect fine to ArcSoft Audio Decoder HD (for DTS-HD), some (MPC Matroska/Mpeg Splitter) don't and may need to hack (how to hack). ArcSoft Audio Decoder HD decodes DTS-HD bit-perfect.
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post #47 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 06:45 AM
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Partial success. I installed PowerDVD 9 Build 2320. I can select the number of speakers in CyberLink Audio Decoder Propertes (look at the post below). This decoder has issues in decoding DTS-HD (sometimes the playback does not start). So I updated it to Build 2528 (the last build of PowerDVD 9). I lose the speaker selection tab. However it seems that the speaker number is remembered somewhere and I got this:

A problem is even for the 5.0 channel source, it outputs 8 channel!
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post #48 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 06:50 AM
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It's nice seeing more options for getting DTS-HD decoded.

I've checked your 'tutorial' on the TMT3 DTS-HD. I read that there might be a few issues on some of the various links back and forth.
Can you clarify how well does it actually work?
I've just installed the TMT3 platinum trial and need a reboot and will be fixing with that soon enough but not before lunch.
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post #49 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 07:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nighthog View Post

It's nice seeing more options for getting DTS-HD decoded.

I've checked your 'tutorial' on the TMT3 DTS-HD. I read that there might be a few issues on some of the various links back and forth.
Can you clarify how well does it actually work?
I've just installed the TMT3 platinum trial and need a reboot and will be fixing with that soon enough but not before lunch.

ArcSoft Audio Decoder HD works perfect. There is no glitch at all.
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post #50 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 07:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post

A problem is even for the 5.0 channel source, it outputs 8 channel!

not necessarily a problem, in fact you can apply dolby pro logic IIx for upmixing to 6 or 8 channel if your receiver is connected with multichannel analog. I use pro logic to upmix stereo to 6 channel and if I don't do this in the player, no other components of my system will. The audio card has no plII and my receiver is pro logic "I" (it's old) and anyway it won't do anything over the multichannel analog input. It's more like an alternative
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post #51 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 07:38 AM
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Hmm, in my system this is an issue. Here are screenshots of CyberLink Audio Decoder Properties:

PowerDVD 9 Build 2320

I can select "Speaker environment" and "Output mode". I selected "8 speakers" and "Dolby Pro Logic IIx" (in "Movie mode" selectable in another tab). The audio playback of this build has lots of issues. So I had to upgrade it.

PowerDVD 9 Build 2528 (the last build)

Now I lose "Audio" tab. Fortunately "Speaker environment" is remembered. However it looks like "Output mode" is not (no sound from the rear speakers when playing back 5.1 DTS-HD).

@GrandeBoma

Is Dolby PLIIx by CyberLink Audio Decoder working in your system? Which build of PowerDVD 9 are you using?
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post #52 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 07:46 AM
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Another issue is that MPC Matroska Splitter does not connect to CyberLink Audio Decoder. Maybe a hack is necessary.

@GrandeBoma

Do you see this issue (or non-issue)?
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post #53 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 09:48 AM
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OK I found where the information is stored in the registry.

The key

HKEY_CURRENT_USER\\Software\\CyberLink\\PowerDVD9\\PowerDVD9

stores the user settings of PowerDVD 9, while the key

HKEY_CURRENT_USER\\Software\\CyberLink\\

Common\\CLAud\\mpc-hc stores the user settings of MPC-HomeCinema. That's why the audio settings of PowerDVD 9 are valid for those of PowerDVD 10.
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post #54 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 10:04 AM
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I don't know about mkv, I don't use them, sorry

Well I have pdvd 9 only for the purpose of changing the setup of pdvd 10...

I use pdvd 10 for bd but I used to use other players when my configuration of stereo + sub was a pain in the ass and I needed the mixer of ffdshow. now I own 5.1 so I no longer need this, but I used to use pdvd 10 audio decoder with mpc-hc for playback and I set up plIIx for stereo sources and it would output 6 channels (but this is pdvd10, not pdvd9, I don't know about the latter)

we should find a way to modify pdvd 10 tabs without using this pdvd9 nonsense, I see that you have found the registry keys, that is a good start
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post #55 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 10:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandeBoma View Post

@vladd IF I am getting the dts core only, answer this: how is it possible that the bitrate of audio in the program box (bottom of picture playback3.jpg) is reporting more than 3 megabytes?

Because MPC-HC is reporting the stream information. If you checked the properties on the audio decoders input pin though, I suspect that you would see a subtype of "MEDIASUBTYPE_DTS" or "{E06D8033-DB46-11CF-B4D1-00805F6CBBEA}".

The Cyberlink Audio Decoder will only decode full DTS-HD when the subtype is reported as "{6A644687-5756-4D0D-8AA3-178ACF48DEC9}" and if you are not playing a disc in PDVD, the audio decoder will not connect to any renderer when that is the input subtype.

You can test this by using the "FileSource (Async)" and "Cyberlink Demux 2.0" instead of the the MPC source filter.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandeBoma View Post

and how is it possible that the only dts hd ma track I have in 96/24 (baraka blu-ray) is showing 96 kHz, 24 bits, 6 channel? Please note that the dts core of this track does NOT feature 96 khz, rather 48 khz. Now, IF I was decoding the core I'd get 1.5 mb (or 765 kb) in the info box of mpc, and reclock would report 48 khz. As a matter of fact, the latter two DO happen if I set ffdshow as an audio decoder. NOW THAT is a situation where the dts core only is being decoded

Because a 96/24 DTS-HD track = 96/24 DTS Core + Extra HD header. DTS Core is inside the DTS-HD track, not a separate track.
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post #56 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 12:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vladd View Post

Because a 96/24 DTS-HD track = 96/24 DTS Core + Extra HD header. DTS Core is inside the DTS-HD track, not a separate track.

from dts.com:

"DTS-HD Audio Core and Extension Elements

DTS-HD Audio consists of a backwards-compatible 5.1-channel core (44.1 kHz or 48 kHz sampling frequency) and new
coding extensions for improved audio performance and features to support new high definition HD DVD and Blu-ray
Disc optical disc formats."

there is no such thing like 96 khz dts core, dts 96/24 is a totally different dts and it is not used as a core for dts hd. renethx also has estabilished that it is using dts hd and not the core
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post #57 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrandeBoma View Post

from dts.com:

"DTS-HD Audio Core and Extension Elements

DTS-HD Audio consists of a backwards-compatible 5.1-channel core (44.1 kHz or 48 kHz sampling frequency) and new
coding extensions for improved audio performance and features to support new high definition HD DVD and Blu-ray
Disc optical disc formats."

there is no such thing like 96 khz dts core, dts 96/24 is a totally different dts and it is not used as a core for dts hd. renethx also has estabilished that it is using dts hd and not the core

From the DTS-HD whitepaper (last page):

Quote:


The DTS core can be encoded with a data rate of 768 kbps or 1,509 kbps with 5.1 channels, 96 kHz/24-bit playback, plus a DTS-HD High Resolution Audio extension for higher data rates up to 3.0 Mbps for HD DVD and 6.0 Mbps for Blu-ray Disc


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post #58 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 12:40 PM
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Here is a screenshot when the same movie as this post is played back with ffdshow Audio Decoder decoding *core* DTS. The output is 48kHz. As "Resample" is not selected in ffdshow, the core part is only 48kHz.

ffdshow Icon at *core* DTS decoding. Input is 48kHz and the output is also 48kHz.

ffdshow Icon at DTS-HD bitstreaming. Input is 96kHz.

But this does not tell anything on what's going on inside CyberLink Audio Decoder.
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post #59 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 12:44 PM
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Which movie is that?

And just to clarify, I sincerely hope that I am wrong about the Cyberlink decoder. I'm just not convinced yet.
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post #60 of 202 Old 10-18-2010, 12:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vladd View Post

Which movie is that?

And just to clarify, I sincerely hope that I am wrong about the Cyberlink decoder. I'm just not convinced yet.

Nature's Journey (2007).
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