Official Sandy Bridge / LGA1155 for HTPCs Thread - Page 66 - AVS Forum
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post #1951 of 2223 Old 10-13-2011, 12:28 AM
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I am planning to go with this for my i5 build that I will be doing this weekend. Most of the parts I already have except these two:

ASRock H61M/U3S3

SB i5 2500 CPU

The motherboard is compatible with the "K" series CPU but I have no plans to overclock so I will go with the non-K CPU. Doesn't change the performance either way. Should be good enough of a system for MadVR and the LAV decoders. I will be using the EVGA GTS 450 video card with this build.
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post #1952 of 2223 Old 10-14-2011, 07:36 PM
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VR-Zone: Intel CPUs Overclocked: Sandy Easy, Ivy Easier, Haswell Easiest!

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post #1953 of 2223 Old 10-14-2011, 07:42 PM
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Wow......definitely some cool stuff coming
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post #1954 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 12:24 AM
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Wow. Terrific information here. I have learned so much by reading these responses here.

I'm currently in a bit of a dilemma, which brought me here. I originally was lead on to believe the Sandy Bridge lineup is the best you can get for a HTPC, etc. After some further reading it sounds like there's a common bug as you folks have been referring to for the better part of 66 pages now.

That said, my HTPC build is kind of at a halt, as I'm at a crossroads with a few options.

1 - I have an Athlon X2 64 processor laying around, along with DDR2 RAM, HDD, and case. I could snag an AM2 board to match it and get a hold of a GT430 or GT520 or something from ATI and call it a day. The problem is, I'm not sure if the Athlon X2 would be a powerful enough/good enough processor to handle the tasks. Think it would be? Not only that, but I'm worried about not finding an AM2 board with a PCIE x16 2.0 slot for the 430/520... I have yet to find one...

2 - I could always get a Sandy Bridge setup and just not use the integrated graphics and still use a 430/520 in the mix. The problem is, I'd be spending a few bucks on the Sandy Bridge option when I wouldn't even utilize it. That said, it's not THAT expensive, but of course the less I have to drop on a basic budget HTPC build, the better.

3 - And of course there's always AMD. I haven't heard much from AMD in regard to their Llano lineup, besides reading a quick bench mark on Google suggesting Llano seemed to be less performing than Sandy Bridge in some regards. But perhaps Llano is worth checking out??

My end goal is to have a basic HTPC that presents me with a very solid 1080 picture without sync issues. If there's even a hint of a chance of that happening with Sandy Bridge, then I'm crossing it off the list. I saw some people referenced Nvidia with having similar issues, but I also saw an equal amount of people saying "uh, no, I own a Nvidia and it's perfectly fine."

If I'm aiming for the best picture quality, what should I go with? Would the Athlon work or is that a dead end? Should I just get the Sandy Bridge/1155 socket gear with the dedicated GPU and be done with it? And of course, if I get a dedicated GPU, is a 430 or 520 a sure-fire winner? Or does ATI have something I need to see?
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post #1955 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 01:12 AM
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Without going into details on most of your points - stay away from the 520, its just too slow.
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post #1956 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 05:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevcairiel View Post

Without going into details on most of your points - stay away from the 520, its just too slow.

I've heard of lots of people say that both of these graphics cards would be overkill for a HTPC with 1080 playback. How is it too slow? I'm hearing such conflicting responses everywhere I go.
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post #1957 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 05:59 AM
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Originally Posted by JaSauders View Post

I've heard of lots of people say that both of these graphics cards would be overkill for a HTPC with 1080 playback. How is it too slow? I'm hearing such conflicting responses everywhere I go.

For just video playback the Intel IGP is perfectly fine, no graphics card needed

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post #1958 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 06:24 AM
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Originally Posted by dbone1026 View Post

For just video playback the Intel IGP is perfectly fine, no graphics card needed

Agreed.


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post #1959 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by dbone1026 View Post

For just video playback the Intel IGP is perfectly fine, no graphics card needed

Even for somebody who's incredibly anal about picture quality and doesn't want to deal with the frame skip?
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post #1960 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by JaSauders View Post

Even for somebody who's incredibly anal about picture quality and doesn't want to deal with the frame skip?

Try it out first to see what you think. If you aren't happy then get a discrete card and add it.

That was my approach and I am using the iGPU on both of my HTPCs.

You really have nothing to lose with this approach. I, and many others, don't notice the 24p issue. Others notice it and it drives them crazy. I don't think I could notice a 0.04 second stutter even if I tried.

And then there's this whole thing...... Link

Intel get's it just as close as just about anybody.


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post #1961 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 09:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by assassin View Post

Try it out first to see what you think. If you aren't happy then get a discrete card and add it.

That was my approach and I am using the iGPU on both of my HTPCs.

You really have nothing to lose with this approach. I, and many others, don't notice the 24p issue. Others notice it and it drives them crazy. I don't think I could notice a 0.04 second stutter even if I tried.

And then there's this whole thing...... Link

Intel get's it just as close as just about anybody.

That is exactly what I would have said. You have nothing to lose using the Intel iGPU. If you don't like it is as easy as adding on a dGPU

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post #1962 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by assassin View Post


Try it out first to see what you think. If you aren't happy then get a discrete card and add it.

That was my approach and I am using the iGPU on both of my HTPCs.

You really have nothing to lose with this approach. I, and many others, don't notice the 24p issue. Others notice it and it drives them crazy. I don't think I could notice a 0.04 second stutter even if I tried.

And then there's this whole thing...... Link

Intel get's it just as close as just about anybody.

You mean Intel will have it as close as anyone with ivy bridge. I'm holding off for Trinity or ivy bridge.
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post #1963 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 10:06 AM
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I think I'm more of up in the air on which built route to go as opposed to whether to use the i3 graphics or not, at this point.

- I hate to go with an SB build with Ivy coming out soon, however, I have a hard time waiting to build one because this HTPC has a main purpose of supplying a web browser so web content can be streamed from Amazon, etc. That way my girlfriend can get off her 130 dollar/month bill and drop to DSL and a basic service and pay significantly less a month. So while the i3 is nice, I'd love to wait for Ivy if I were doing an integrated build. Otherwise, spending less to get my older rig up to speed might be more appealing.

- I also hate to go with SB in case my 1155 board wouldn't work with an Ivy proc. If I could go that route and the Ivy is coming in a 1155 format, that'd be much easier to handle. But from what I'm reading, it sounds conflicting and not really guaranteed which route things will go.

- Considering I have DDR2 RAM, a case, hard drive, and Athlon X2 processor here, I have a hard time just looking at this gear and not thinking it would handle the 1080 challenge. On a box like this a 430/520 should be able to do the job nicely, I would think. The only thing is, I'm not sure I can buy an AM2 board for my proc that has the PCIE 2.0 slot for the graphics card. All I'm seeing is regular 1.0 x16 slots.


One question I do have - I see users continually talking about the UAC. How would something like that effect me (if at all) being a Linux user that doesn't have UAC?
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post #1964 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by jeffkro View Post

You mean Intel will have it as close as anyone with ivy bridge. I'm holding off for Trinity or ivy bridge.

No, they have it as close as anyone now.

Read the thread. Don't ask for the highlights.


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post #1965 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by assassin View Post

No, they have it as close as anyone now.

Read the thread. Don't ask for the highlights.

So why did intel mostly "fix" it for ivy bridge? So Ivy bridge will have the 23.xxx problem pretty much correct and should be a significant boost in power efficiency over SB. We should get a good idea how trinity will handle HTPC pretty soon based on the soon to be released radeon HD 7000 series graphics card. For those people who can get by with their current systems they should most definitely wait.
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post #1966 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 10:43 AM
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Originally Posted by jeffkro View Post

So why did intel mostly "fix" it for ivy bridge? So Ivy bridge will have the 23.xxx problem pretty much correct and should be a significant boost in power efficiency over SB. We should get a good idea how trinity will handle HTPC pretty soon based on the soon to be released radeon HD 7000 series graphics card. For those people who can get by with their current systems they should most definitely wait.

Again, read the thread I posted above. You might learn something. Lots of very valuable information in there from many people beside myself.


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post #1967 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 10:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by assassin View Post

No, they have it as close as anyone now.

Except with NVIDIA you can configure it to get closer - with Intel you can try to configure it, but the clock is too inaccurate to get any closer.
Thats at least one fact your first post in that thread in big bold letters forgets to mention. (Sadly alot of people stop reading there already)

Granted, 23.973 is better then 24.000, but if you're that anal about it, either get an ATI and hope its factory mode is pretty close (usually is half-good), or get an NVIDIA and configure the timings to get very close (23.9762 for me, +0.0002)
Ivy Bridge will "fix" it so that you can get much closer, and the default will be as well, i assume.
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post #1968 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 11:08 AM
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Realistically we are probably 4-6 months away from Ivy Bridge release, multiple products being available and reviews being available. And that's assuming there aren't any setbacks like there have been with the latest Intel and AMD releases.

If I had a well functioning HTPC would I wait until then to upgrade? Probably.

If I wanted to get into HTPC today would I wait? No. There is always something better on the horizon. By the time Ivy Bridge is here who knows what else will be on the horizon.


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post #1969 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Nevcairiel View Post

Except with NVIDIA you can configure it to get closer - with Intel you can try to configure it, but the clock is too inaccurate to get any closer.
Thats at least one fact your first post in that thread in big bold letters forgets to mention. (Sadly alot of people stop reading there already)

Granted, 23.973 is better then 24.000, but if you're that anal about it, either get an ATI and hope its factory mode is pretty close (usually is half-good), or get an NVIDIA and configure the timings to get very close (23.9762 for me, +0.0002)
Ivy Bridge will "fix" it so that you can get much closer, and the default will be as well, i assume.

The point is they all aren't perfect. Yet Intel has this reputation as being this horrid monster where you can't even watch anything because the "24p issue" is so bad.

That's simply not true. You can split hairs all you want here.


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post #1970 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 11:21 AM
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Realistically we are probably 4-6 months away from Ivy Bridge release, multiple products being available and reviews being available.

My understanding is that IVB will launch March/April of 2012.

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post #1971 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 11:23 AM
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My understanding is that IVB will launch March/April of 2012.

Its usually at least a month after the launch before we have a really good selection of motherboards.

So we are looking at probably 6 months at least.

That's forever in the PC world. You'd be better served getting the SB build and using a card if you wanted to get into a HTPC now and were worried about the 24p issue.

That's my opinion, anyway.


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post #1972 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 11:27 AM
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Its usually at least a month after the launch before we have a really good selection of motherboards.

So we are looking at probably 6 months at least.

That's forever in the PC world. You'd be better served getting the SB build and using a card if you wanted to get into a HTPC now and were worried about the 24p issue.

That's my opinion, anyway.

What is it about SB that would benefit me with using:

SB G620T w/ H67 MSI board w/ GT 430
vs
Athlon X2 w/ AM2 board w/ GT 430

What is it about SB that would benefit me to buy an SB proc, SB board, DDR3 ram, as opposed to using DDR2 ram I already have, the Athlon X2 proc I already have, and simply buying the AM2 board to marry it?
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post #1973 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by JaSauders View Post

What is it about SB that would benefit me with using:

SB G620T w/ H67 MSI board w/ GT 430
vs
Athlon X2 w/ AM2 board w/ GT 430

What is it about SB that would benefit me to buy an SB proc, SB board, DDR3 ram, as opposed to using DDR2 ram I already have, the Athlon X2 proc I already have, and simply buying the AM2 board to marry it?

Lower power consumption, More powerful CPU.

Probably not worth spending a lot to save a little. Both are capable.


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post #1974 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 11:47 AM
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Lower power consumption, More powerful CPU.

Probably not worth spending a lot to save a little. Both are capable.

My thought process is leaning towards utilizing the Athlon X2 gear I have, and then upgrade to Ivy gear maybe by summer. By then I should be able to drop a few more dollars on updated gear without second guessing it.

My concern is the Athlon X2 not being powerful enough. If the Athlon X2 and GT 430 is a pretty powerful combo to use for a HTPC then I'll go that route. That way I don't have to dip into my house savings too much for the time being. :P

As far as lower power consumption, I'm sure it'll balance out to mere dollars per year. I did a power survey at my last job, and came to the conclusion that our older Pentium 4 systems (the most power hungry ones we have) cost about 510 dollars a year to power 30 of them in a lab (school district) for 7 hours a day, 181 days a year. That breaks down to 16-17 dollars per system per year. Now, compare that to Atom systems and it's more like 2 dollars a year for each box. If you have 2,000 systems like we did, it holds more water, but one single HTPC sucking up some extra watts isn't something I'm going to sneeze at.


For what it's worth (if memory serves me) the idea was to buy Atom boxes to use as thin clients with an Ubuntu LTSP setup to replace all of the P4 boxes. By upgrading our systems with Asus Atom boxes @ 200 dollars per seat to use as thin clients (PLENTY powerful enough to use as a thin client) we would have to use them for 11 years in order for their expenses to balance out with electricity savings.
</ semi off topic>
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post #1975 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 02:48 PM
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As far as lower power consumption, I'm sure it'll balance out to mere dollars per year. I did a power survey at my last job, and came to the conclusion that our older Pentium 4 systems (the most power hungry ones we have) cost about 510 dollars a year to power 30 of them in a lab (school district) for 7 hours a day, 181 days a year. That breaks down to 16-17 dollars per system per year. Now, compare that to Atom systems and it's more like 2 dollars a year for each box. If you have 2,000 systems like we did, it holds more water, but one single HTPC sucking up some extra watts isn't something I'm going to sneeze at.

To me, lower power consumption has nothing to do with a couple of bucks on the electric bill, and everything to do with less heat being generated, and thus a quieter, easier to cool system. Similarly, the biggest advantage of not using a discrete video card is not having to cool the substantial extra heat a video card generates.

Using a Sandy Bridge and the onchip GPU is the easiest way to build a quiet, cool, low power system. If you're putting it in a closet or the like, that doesn't really matter.
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post #1976 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 06:32 PM
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To me, lower power consumption has nothing to do with a couple of bucks on the electric bill, and everything to do with less heat being generated, and thus a quieter, easier to cool system. Similarly, the biggest advantage of not using a discrete video card is not having to cool the substantial extra heat a video card generates.

Using a Sandy Bridge and the onchip GPU is the easiest way to build a quiet, cool, low power system. If you're putting it in a closet or the like, that doesn't really matter.

Hmmm very good points. I never really had an HTPC before so I was just defaulting to thinking that you guys were talking from a financial standpoint.

That said, I will be using a Micro ATX tower, however being that the tower is simple and jet black all over it'll blend nicely. Likewise, the motherboard I'm looking at has an integrated ATI HD 4250 card with HDMI out. Based on what I read, some users reported this was a good card to use with 1080 playback.

The board that I'm eyeing up is an AM2/AM2+/AM3, and the proc I have laying around is an X2 AM2 3800 Windsor 2.0ghz.

I wonder (and hope) this combo would be a solid setup. It would save me a lot of money as I have *everything* for this build except the board. If I were to get an SB build it would cost a lot more as I don't have any spare parts that would fit that build.

Think the integrated HD 4250 w/ the AM2 Athlon X2 2.0ghz proc would be a good match? Or should I ditch the idea and just spend the extra dough for something more and be done with it?
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post #1977 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 06:39 PM
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Hmmm very good points. I never really had an HTPC before so I was just defaulting to thinking that you guys were talking from a financial standpoint.

That said, I will be using a Micro ATX tower, however being that the tower is simple and jet black all over it'll blend nicely. Likewise, the motherboard I'm looking at has an integrated ATI HD 4250 card with HDMI out. Based on what I read, some users reported this was a good card to use with 1080 playback.

The board that I'm eyeing up is an AM2/AM2+/AM3, and the proc I have laying around is an X2 AM2 3800 Windsor 2.0ghz.

I wonder (and hope) this combo would be a solid setup. It would save me a lot of money as I have *everything* for this build except the board. If I were to get an SB build it would cost a lot more as I don't have any spare parts that would fit that build.

Think the integrated HD 4250 w/ the AM2 Athlon X2 2.0ghz proc would be a good match? Or should I ditch the idea and just spend the extra dough for something more and be done with it?

The ATI 4xxx cards can't bitstream HD Audio. I would do with a 5xxx if you don't need/want 3D or get a NVidia 430 if you need 3D (I think the NVidia drivers are much better than ATI).

Its up to you about building new. If you have the money then I say go for it. If not then keep what you have.

Or better yet just get a card that you can use in either HTPC choice and try it with what you have. If it works then stay put for a while. If you aren't completely satisfied then use the card in your new build.


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post #1978 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 07:08 PM
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Oh, I didn't realize the 4xxx cards didn't do that. Hmm...

I suppose a GT430 is definitely in my future then, assuming that's the best bang for the buck.

Now in regard to the proc, that's another concern of mine. Any insight on that?
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post #1979 of 2223 Old 10-16-2011, 07:15 PM
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Why don't you list your entire current system. Maybe all you need is a new graphics card and don't need a new motherboard at all. Or do you not have a motherboard for that cpu?

You might want to consider starting a new thread and asking for help on this though. This is the Sandy Bridge/1155 thread, after all.
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post #1980 of 2223 Old 10-17-2011, 03:37 AM
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- Procesory Ivy Bridge - Core i7-3700K pouze 77W.
- Original article (Chinese)

IVB dual core is 55W. The current SNB QC is 95W, DC is 65W.


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