Windows 32bit or 64, wich works better for HTPC use? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 07:02 AM - Thread Starter
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I wanted to get some peoples input on if they think a 32 bit version or 64 bit version of Windows 7 is more compatible with Htpc software and hardware. I guess mainly regarding bitsreaming, BLURAY playback, and encoding.

Does one work better than the other for bitstreaming with out any problems, I'm personally going to be using a gtx 460 and Onkyo receiver.

What about BLURAY playback in disc and different type file formats playing back smoothly without stuttering and 24p issue, in various players ie: tmt, pdvd,wmc, mpc-HC, xbmc, etc.

Also as far as ripping discs, encoding, muxing, transcoding, etc. with all the various brands and types of software for these tasks.

Has anybody used both 32 and 64 and noticed a real difference with one over the other and actually narrowed it down to that being the problem?

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post #2 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 07:08 AM
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I've tried both, 32 bit has less problems. 64 bit requires TWO sets of codec packs for MKV playback. I didn't see any performance increase with 64 bit, the only reason I'd run 64 bit is if I had over 3GB of RAM.
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post #3 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 07:09 AM
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I'm sure some people will come up with some anecdote and provide an argument why 32bit is still better, however, i don't think there is any difference.

All 32-bit apps work fine on a 64-bit system.
What it comes down to is drivers, and assuming you have hardware out of this century, there will be drivers available, and there won't be any problem

Personally, i'm running Win7 64-bit on every system i have, including my HTPC.
I am running my media related apps in 32bit however, mostly because they don't have a 64bit version. But as noted above, they run just fine on the 64bit Windows.
This includes TMT5 for BluRays (24p and bitstreaming working just fine), and MPC-HC for MKV and other media files. (Before anyone posts how MPC-HC has a 64bit version, yes it does, but some other DirectShow components i use don't, like ReClock and madVR)

I have a GTS 450 in the HTPC, so your 460 should be working just fine as well.

@Servicetech571:
You only need two codec packs when you mix your players (one being 32bit, one 64bit). Use one player for everything (or at least all of them for the same architecture), and everything is just fine.
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post #4 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 07:45 AM
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If you're using Windows Media Center with no external players, 32-bit is less of a hassle. It's really too bad Microsoft didn't ship both 32-bit and 64-bit versions of WMC. I wonder, is there any technical limitation hence they only shipped one version? Perhaps it has to do with drivers for TV tuner cards?
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post #5 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 07:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Servicetech571 View Post

I've tried both, 32 bit has less problems. 64 bit requires TWO sets of codec packs for MKV playback. I didn't see any performance increase with 64 bit, the only reason I'd run 64 bit is if I had over 3GB of RAM.

I'm using 6gb RAM, and I'm running 4 in my 32gb system now and everything isfine, but I've read threads where people say you can't put over 2gb and then others say 3gb, but I know thats not true. What's the deal with that, why do people say that.

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post #6 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 07:50 AM
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I use both in my several machines. Most are 32 bit but one or two are 64 bit, and they are slightly more trouble in that I have to download and register two versions of some filters, depending on which software I use for playback.
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post #7 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 07:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeydrunk View Post

I'm using 6gb RAM, and I'm running 4 in my 32gb system now and everything isfine, but I've read threads where people say you can't put over 2gb and then others say 3gb, but I know thats not true. What's the deal with that, why do people say that.

You can put in as much as you want in a 32 bit system but that doesn't mean it will all be available. Open the task manager and see how much memory you have. Should be right around 3 I think.
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post #8 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 08:13 AM
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To be short. If you don't really need to use a lot of RAM stay with x86 and your HTPC life will be mach easier.

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post #9 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 08:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeydrunk View Post

I'm using 6gb RAM, and I'm running 4 in my 32gb system now and everything isfine, but I've read threads where people say you can't put over 2gb and then others say 3gb, but I know thats not true. What's the deal with that, why do people say that.

2e32 = 4,294,967,296
The 2 comes from Binary Code (machine language of 0s & 1s).
32 is for the 32 bits of addressing lines....
....which equals 4GB.
No matter how much memory you put in; the system has no way of accessing more than 4GB. Furthermore, Windows x86 (or 32-bit OS) has a limitation which restricts that 4GB to only 3.5GB.
Thus, 3.5 GB is the maximum memory that a 32-bit Windows OS can see and use.

Now, for a 64 bit system, this number becomes:
2e64 = 18,446,744,073,709,551,616
That is 18 Exabytes (10e18), which I don't believe we will see in our lifetime.

And that is the end of class for today!

=====================
Edit:
Btw, I used to have 32-bit in my HTPC and when I rebuilt it with a new CPU, I installed Win 7, 64-bit (just for kicks & experimentation). It works fine without a problem but I don't see a need for it in HTPCs. I have never seen my memory usage go above 1.2 GB.
So even 2 is fine, 4 is overkill and anything above that is just a waste of money (unless you do gaming or heavy photo/video editing on the machine).
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post #10 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 08:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hirent View Post

2e32 = 4,294,967,296
The 2 comes from Binary Code (machine language of 0s & 1s).
32 is for the 32 bits of addressing lines....
....which equals 4GB.
No matter how much memory you put in; the system has no way of accessing more than 4GB. Furthermore, Windows x86 (or 32-bit OS) has a limitation which restricts that 4GB to only 3.5GB.
Thus, 3.5 GB is the maximum memory that a 32-bit Windows OS can see and use.

Now, for a 64 bit system, this number becomes:
2e64 = 18,446,744,073,709,551,616
That is 18 Exabytes (10e18), which I don't believe we will see in our lifetime.

And that is the end of class for today!

=====================
Edit:
Btw, I used to have 32-bit in my HTPC and when I rebuilt it with a new CPU, I installed Win 7, 64-bit (just for kicks & experimentation). It works fine without a problem but I don't see a need for it in HTPCs. I have never seen my memory usage go above 1.2 GB.
So even 2 is fine, 4 is overkill and anything above that is just a waste of money (unless you do gaming or heavy photo/video editing on the machine).

Good job hirent, I was going to post this as well.
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post #11 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 09:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hirent View Post

2e32 = 4,294,967,296
The 2 comes from Binary Code (machine language of 0s & 1s).
32 is for the 32 bits of addressing lines....
......
And that is the end of class for today!

just want to add 1 little bit to this....
the reason some people say don't add more the 2-3GB when running Win 32 is because the motherboard needs some of the memory map for its own evil purposes...
now with modern motherboards that's not a problem... you just only get to use 3.xGB out of your 4GB...

but on some older MB's that would cause nasty random crashing issues...
so basically, those people saying never put more than 3GB in a 32 bit system are just old timers who got burnt by some funky MB/memory crashes...


anyway, for a HTPC I would stick with 32bit for now and 3GB of mem or less, unless you have a particular reason you need/want 64bit and more mem...

NOTE: As one wise professional something once stated, I am ignorant & childish, with a mindset comparable to 9/11 troofers and wackjob conspiracy theorists. so don't take anything I say as advice...
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post #12 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 09:39 AM
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Go with 64 bit. Once everyone switches the world will be a better place.

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post #13 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 09:53 AM
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I've used both in an HTPC with equal results. Go with whatever one you want.
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post #14 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 10:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Servicetech571 View Post

64 bit requires TWO sets of codec packs for MKV playback.

Only if you use two sets of apps, one 32-bit and one 64-bit.

That is, you have to install 32-bit codecs for 32-bit apps and 64-bit codecs for 64-bit apps. The don't co-mingle, lol. If you only use one or the other, you only need one set of codecs.

The "problem" isn't Windows it's all the dumb software manufacturers that continue to make programs for x86 because they like to live in 2003

Like TMT (even the "new" 5), PDVD, etc., they are all x86 programs. Don't even get me started on Adobe and how they still don't have a release version of 64-bit Flash Those losers have been saying it's "coming soon" since Vista was released like 4+ years ago. In the meantime they've gone up like 3 versions. Like HELLO you losers stop developing x86 already!

There's no reason to use 32-bit in this day and age unless your CPU is old and doesn't support x64. What new PC in 2010+ has less than 4GB of RAM anyway? As bryansj said, it will be better when everything is x64 or at least has a version in x64.
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post #15 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 11:39 AM
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Today 64bit works the same or better. In the future 64bit will work better as new apps start being developed for 64bit first/only.

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post #16 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 11:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovemyram4x4 View Post

In the future 64bit will work better as new apps start being developed for 64bit first/only.

They not hurry since WinXP x64 was out.

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post #17 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 12:26 PM
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I find x64 to be pretty much free of issues at this point. In addition to 7MC I use MediaBrowser with MPC-HC x64 as an external player and FFDShow x64 for codecs and all works fine. I also use TMT for Bluray playback and that was the biggest hassle but only because ATI and Arcsoft have a tough time not breaking HDMI audio in TMT (fixed with the 10.11 hotfix from Arcsoft). That was the biggest problem for me though which obviously isn't x86/x64 related.
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post #18 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by convexion View Post
I find x64 to be pretty much free of issues at this point. In addition to 7MC I use MediaBrowser with MPC-HC x64 as an external player and FFDShow x64 for codecs and all works fine. I also use TMT for Bluray playback and that was the biggest hassle but only because ATI and Arcsoft have a tough time not breaking HDMI audio in TMT (fixed with the 10.11 hotfix from Arcsoft). That was the biggest problem for me though which obviously isn't x86/x64 related.
are you able to play .mov files in wmc? i have basically your same setup (7MCx64, Media browser with mpc-hcx64 as an external player) but i cannot play .mov files in wmc. they play fine in wmp and mpc-hc, but not wmc. is there a setting in ffdshow x64 that i'm missing that would allow .mov in wmc?
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post #19 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 01:07 PM
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No, I only use 7MC for recorded TV playback, everything else I prefer using MPC-HC.
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post #20 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 01:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ES_Revenge View Post
Only if you use two sets of apps, one 32-bit and one 64-bit.

That is, you have to install 32-bit codecs for 32-bit apps and 64-bit codecs for 64-bit apps. The don't co-mingle, lol. If you only use one or the other, you only need one set of codecs.

The "problem" isn't Windows it's all the dumb software manufacturers that continue to make programs for x86 because they like to live in 2003

Like TMT (even the "new" 5), PDVD, etc., they are all x86 programs. Don't even get me started on Adobe and how they still don't have a release version of 64-bit Flash Those losers have been saying it's "coming soon" since Vista was released like 4+ years ago. In the meantime they've gone up like 3 versions. Like HELLO you losers stop developing x86 already!

There's no reason to use 32-bit in this day and age unless your CPU is old and doesn't support x64. What new PC in 2010+ has less than 4GB of RAM anyway? As bryansj said, it will be better when everything is x64 or at least has a version in x64.
He's referring to the Shark007 Win7 codec packs. If you have 64-bit Windows 7 installed you need to install both the 32-bit version of Shark007 and the X64 add-on.

I've used both the 32 and 64-bit versions of Windows 7 Media Center and can't really see any difference between them. The only real advantage to going with the 64-bit version is if you are running multiple extenders with Media Center. I believe you need at least 500MB available for each extender you have tied to the MC PC.
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post #21 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 02:02 PM
 
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While both 32 and 64 bit systems work well and are able to give you an error free experience, why risk it?

I run 32 bit mostly because there is ONE LESS thing I have to troubleshoot if I have a problem. HTPC does not need more than 3.5 GB of system RAM (unless you game on it too, or do other things), and remove one potential trouble point is a good thing.
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post #22 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 02:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captain_video View Post
He's referring to the Shark007 Win7 codec packs. If you have 64-bit Windows 7 installed you need to install both the 32-bit version of Shark007 and the X64 add-on.
Who in their right mind installs codec packs?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cybrsage View Post
While both 32 and 64 bit systems work well and are able to give you an error free experience, why risk it?
Why risk what? Living in 2011? :P
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post #23 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 02:08 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ES_Revenge View Post
Why risk what? Living in 2011? :P
The risk that not every software developer is as good at creating a 64 bit version of their software as they are the much more common 32 bit version.

You may trust that every software developer is perfect, but I do not. Especially for something the wife says "should just work"
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post #24 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cybrsage View Post
While both 32 and 64 bit systems work well and are able to give you an error free experience, why risk it?

I run 32 bit mostly because there is ONE LESS thing I have to troubleshoot if I have a problem. HTPC does not need more than 3.5 GB of system RAM (unless you game on it too, or do other things), and remove one potential trouble point is a good thing.

I just see it as essentially a non-issue at this point considering that any relevant modern media players support x64 now. So long as your system isn't ancient I think you won't have any problems with 32 extra bits.
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post #25 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 02:11 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hirent

2e32 = 4,294,967,296
The 2 comes from Binary Code (machine language of 0s & 1s).
32 is for the 32 bits of addressing lines....
....which equals 4GB.
No matter how much memory you put in; the system has no way of accessing more than 4GB. Furthermore, Windows x86 (or 32-bit OS) has a limitation which restricts that 4GB to only 3.5GB.
Thus, 3.5 GB is the maximum memory that a 32-bit Windows OS can see and use.

Now, for a 64 bit system, this number becomes:
2e64 = 18,446,744,073,709,551,616
That is 18 Exabytes (10e18), which I don't believe we will see in our lifetime.

And that is the end of class for today!

=====================
Edit:
Btw, I used to have 32-bit in my HTPC and when I rebuilt it with a new CPU, I installed Win 7, 64-bit (just for kicks & experimentation). It works fine without a problem but I don't see a need for it in HTPCs. I have never seen my memory usage go above 1.2 GB.
So even 2 is fine, 4 is overkill and anything above that is just a waste of money (unless you do gaming or heavy photo/video editing on the machine).
I'm going to be gaming and probably some video encoding/transcoding so I probably want to use my 6gb RAM so that means I will need to use 64 bit I see.

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post #26 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cybrsage View Post
The risk that not every software developer is as good at creating a 64 bit version of their software as they are the much more common 32 bit version.

You may trust that every software developer is perfect, but I do not. Especially for something the wife says "should just work"
I see what you're saying but I'm more of the thought that if everyone started using x64, more people would demand these software publishers start making proper x64 programs.

The way it is now, the whole reason x64 hasn't gone anywhere is because people are still running x86 and content to use x86 programs. If that's the case, the software makers see no need to give x64 (and the future) any priority.

Same reason it's been like 5 years since x64 CPUs and OSes have been common and Flash player still doesn't have an x64 version. No one can really use an x64 Internet browser because of this foolery.
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post #27 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 02:15 PM - Thread Starter
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By the way like I ask said I have 4gb in my win7x64 and sometimes use 95%+ of my RAM.

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post #28 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 02:18 PM
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64bit eos.
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post #29 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 02:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joeydrunk
By the way like I ask said I have 4gb in my win7x64 and sometimes use 95%+ of my RAM.
I noticed I said I had 32bit in my post above, but I meant 64, also everything is fine, its just it has pushed the limits before and jumping from 4 to 6 is very little money, so why not.

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post #30 of 147 Old 02-03-2011, 02:27 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by captain_video
He's referring to the Shark007 Win7 codec packs. If you have 64-bit Windows 7 installed you need to install both the 32-bit version of Shark007 and the X64 add-on.

I've used both the 32 and 64-bit versions of Windows 7 Media Center and can't really see any difference between them. The only real advantage to going with the 64-bit version is if you are running multiple extenders with Media Center. I believe you need at least 500MB available for each extender you have tied to the MC PC.
Yes, I also have 3 extenders

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