Latest Ceton InfiniTV 4 Info Thread - Page 13 - AVS Forum
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Home Theater Computers > Latest Ceton InfiniTV 4 Info Thread
crkpot's Avatar crkpot 01:22 PM 07-10-2011
Has anyone heard of an option to share the ceton tuner across the network to a smart tv like the new LG's or Samsung? I suppose someone might have to make an app on the tv to access the ceton or something, but I'm interested in getting a cc tuner for my living room htpc and it would be great if I could get the encrypted digital channels on the bedroom tv.

Babbitt 1080P's Avatar Babbitt 1080P 08:08 AM 07-11-2011
How stable are these tuners? I want to get rid of the cable box but dont need to constantly update and mess with these. My HTPC is about as stable as its going to get and the family can use ti without too much trouble. Is that going to change if I lose the cable box and replace with this?
hlkc's Avatar hlkc 09:05 AM 07-11-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Babbitt 1080P View Post

How stable are these tuners? I want to get rid of the cable box but dont need to constantly update and mess with these. My HTPC is about as stable as its going to get and the family can use ti without too much trouble. Is that going to change if I lose the cable box and replace with this?

It depends on who you ask or reply

I'm a one of the happy Ceton daily users here and no major trouble at all. Great guide, search, record all I want in my own HDD... The down side I can think of is unless I keep this box configuration forever, otherwise I will lose my recordings since all the Protected recording are lock and can't play/watch from any other HTPCs. Also, just like another piece of hardware, it will take a bit time to configure and get used to it.
cybrsage's Avatar cybrsage 11:58 AM 07-11-2011
When it first came out, there were driver and bios updates routinely. The last update was in March. I have had no problems at all, after I installed the Low Pass Filter since I am on FiOS.
eugeneflim's Avatar eugeneflim 12:04 PM 07-11-2011
Need some help please - got Ceton card installed (had some issues but 3rd M-Card worked), and all is working. However, I am getting HDCP error. I am connected HDMI-out on HTPC to DVI-in on my TV, ATI 4200 onboard card. It is weird - regular channels work fine, but HBO does not - gives this error message. Any ideas please?
MarcSparks's Avatar MarcSparks 01:05 PM 07-11-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by hlkc View Post

It depends on who you ask or reply

I'm a one of the happy Ceton daily users here and no major trouble at all. Great guide, search, record all I want in my own HDD... The down side I can think of is unless I keep this box configuration forever, otherwise I will lose my recordings since all the Protected recording are lock and can't play/watch from any other HTPCs. Also, just like another piece of hardware, it will take a bit time to configure and get used to it.


Well the bolded part of your response sums it for me. Varying experiences for lots of user feedback on here = unstable to me.

I can't call the InfiniTV 4 stable at all in the 4 weeks I've had it up and running. First 7-10 days for me were plagued by having to re-run the WMC TV signal setup every other day for no reason. After that it ran solid for almost 3 weeks until this weekend...

One of my network PC's, WMC basically lost sight of the tuner again for no reason, so oh well went to re-run the Network Tuner Wizard should be back up and running in 5-10 mins. Well, won't let me run it because I don't have the LATEST firmware. Are you kidding me, I can't use the product if I'm one rev behind on firmware? So I do the latest firmware update which reboots the box with the InfiniTV 4 in it of course. Upon coming back up the Ceton card is no longer recognized at all by my PC. After a couple driver re-installs/reboots still nothing. Also I noted that the blue LED on the card remains in the blinking state when I'm into Windows, so it's like the card wasn't even initializing. At this point I'm thinking the firmware update might have hosed my card.

Last obvious step before having to engage Ceton support was to power down the PC, open it up and reseat the card. Did that and did the factory reset in the Network Tuner Wizard, and mercifully my TV service was restored. After 2 hours of messing around.

Before we get into the I must have an unstable system or be a noob in the HTPC world, that is not the case. I've built all 4 of my HTPCs and the one it is in has been issue free (with a QAM tuner card) for almost a year prior to the Ceton. I've never had anywhere near the troubles with any PC or AV component in my life than what I've had with the Ceton so far.

Also worth noting I had zero troubles getting the Cablecard setup with Comcast and that aspect of it. Strictly hardware/software issues with the Ceton and WMC.

And all of this is magnified by the fact that it is the sole provider of TV service into my house, and it is replacing equipment (Comcast STBs) that while they sucked, generally worked 99.999% of the time.

Could barely recommend this card to the most patient and technical savvy colleagues I have. No way I could recommend it to family or friends with beginner to intermediate PC knowledge.
ngsm13's Avatar ngsm13 01:25 PM 07-11-2011
I too have spent in excess of 20hours just trying to get the card setup, with NO avail. I can see the card fine in my network connections, I can even navigate to the IP to see it. But when I try to get it setup in WMC, it's enough to make me want to punch a baby.

It would be one thing if the thing just plain didn't work. The thing is, everytime I go to "setup TV signal" it's a different problem. It seems to take 2 minutes for WMC to register whats going on when I press the "setup TV signal button", and when it finally does it's a grab bag at what I'll get. Sometimes it will say "tuner not available/found", others it will ask to confirm my region (US) and when I select it a message will say that my tuner is not compatible in the US, on the rare occasion that I even get passed that message? It will not detect all of the tuners, it will only detect 2 of them usually (oddly enough Tuner 2 and Tuner 3), and other times only tuners 1 or 3. The one time I was able to get it to detect all 4 tuners? There was a problem with it not being able to "determine my signal", or not able to "detect cablecard"... ????

What is even more frustrating is, it was a fluke that I had it working ONCE, but unfortunately I had to reformat my computer because I purchased a Windows 7 license that did not match the version I originally installed (30 days). So, at one point in time it "worked" but this was only for a period of about 48hours. It just blows my mind as to what the problem is, since I get a different result each time and have not got it working since. I've literally restarted my computer 50times, along with uninstalling/reinstalling drivers, updating firmware and hardware, etc, etc, etc...

Ceton has been responsive, and has sent me out a replacement card, which I will receive today. So, I will report back on my experiences. With any luck, it will work? If not, I'm up **** creek with a $650 investment that doesn't work correctly (HTPC + Tunercard, I only built the PC to use as a DVR HTPC)...

Whew.
hlkc's Avatar hlkc 02:35 PM 07-11-2011
MarcSparks and ngsm13,

Just for any future users... it sounds like your problems are related to network tuners sharing, right? If you are not using network tuners sharing, it is fine, right?

Make no mistake, they should fix it and have a perfect solution for us. All I am saying is - it is a problem today and any potential customer should be alert of such problem.

I am not doing network tuners sharing with other HTPC today, therefore it is okay to me.

I also agree with MarcSparks comment and I can't recommend this tuner to any less than technical savvy friends unless you don't want to be his/her friends any more
MarcSparks's Avatar MarcSparks 03:13 PM 07-11-2011
While yes I am running this with the Network Tuners, and that may have something to do with my issues, I don't feel like it is. I think I would have the same issues if I was not doing tuner sharing.

The main HTPC with the Ceton in it is the one that basically loses sight of the card from time to time. The 2 other PCs I have setup for network sharing seem to work fine and I haven't had to do anything with their config since the 1st week.

So even when I had issues with the firmware update, had to reseat the card and did the supposed factory reset in the Network Tuner Wizard, I didnt have to do anything on the 2 networked PCs. They still had their tuner assignment and picked up the signal just fine once the main PC/Ceton was back online.

Don't get me wrong, I still think the juice is worth the squeeze to go the WMC with cablecard route. Just in response to the earlier question about whether this card was stable enough to compare to any cable co's STB experience is a flat out NO. Fortunately, every other aspect of WMC trumps what you get with the average cable co STB. But you've got to be willing to put up with the crap from time to time, and just hope you get things working for say months at a time without any major issues.

I still get the comments from the wife all the time. "This thing never works." and "Why can't we just have a normal TV setup?". The truth is it does work about 95% of the time. But in this industry the customers (our families and ourselves) have come to expect that service to be available 100% of the time. So they do not take outages well!
hlkc's Avatar hlkc 03:23 PM 07-11-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarcSparks View Post

While yes I am running this with the Network Tuners, and that may have something to do with my issues, I don't feel like it is. I think I would have the same issues if I was not doing tuner sharing.

The main HTPC with the Ceton in it is the one that basically loses sight of the card from time to time. The 2 other PCs I have setup for network sharing seem to work fine and I haven't had to do anything with their config since the 1st week.

So even when I had issues with the firmware update, had to reseat the card and did the supposed factory reset in the Network Tuner Wizard, I didnt have to do anything on the 2 networked PCs. They still had their tuner assignment and picked up the signal just fine once the main PC/Ceton was back online.

Don't get me wrong, I still think the juice is worth the squeeze to go the WMC with cablecard route. Just in response to the earlier question about whether this card was stable enough to compare to any cable co's STB experience is a flat out NO. Fortunately, every other aspect of WMC trumps what you get with the average cable co STB. But you've got to be willing to put up with the crap from time to time, and just hope you get things working for say months at a time without any major issues.

I still get the comments from the wife all the time. "This thing never works." and "Why can't we just have a normal TV setup?". The truth is it does work about 95% of the time. But in this industry the customers (our families and ourselves) have come to expect that service to be available 100% of the time. So they do not take outages well!

It sounds like you have another problem there somewhere. I've a OCZ Revodrive X2, a PCI E type of SSD occupying one of the PCI E slot in my MB. With that in mind, since I've that, it will disable few PCI E slot and have only 2 slots enable, (it is related to which PCI E slot share the ICQ assignments...) In my case since then, it is 99% rock solid stable in my set up.

I can't agree with you more and if it is for our wifes and kids since they expect nothing less and just an one touch button operation or anyone less than tech savvy, I will not recommend this route to them. We both have a very demand group of 24X7 customers in our home to please
gsr's Avatar gsr 04:29 PM 07-11-2011
Another totally satisfied user here. I've got 2 InfiniTV 4 cards in the PC in my basement which serves a few rooms via XBOX 360 extenders. I'm not using the network tuner sharing feature. This has been up and running pretty much problem free for about a year now (I got 1 of my cards in the very first batch and got the other a short time later from someone who decided the Ceton card & WMC solution wouldn't work for him).

I recently recommended Ceton to a guy at work who's not overly tech savvy and he's been operating trouble free for about a month now.
al210's Avatar al210 07:07 PM 07-11-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by cybrsage View Post

When it first came out, there were driver and bios updates routinely. The last update was in March. I have had no problems at all, after I installed the Low Pass Filter since I am on FiOS.

What low pass filter did you need? I am putting my HTPC together now and will be setting it up with FIOS.
lovemyram4x4's Avatar lovemyram4x4 07:16 PM 07-11-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by al210 View Post

What low pass filter did you need? I am putting my HTPC together now and will be setting it up with FIOS.

Just ask the FiOS tech for one, it's free that way.
lifespeed's Avatar lifespeed 07:57 PM 07-11-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Babbitt 1080P View Post

How stable are these tuners? I want to get rid of the cable box but dont need to constantly update and mess with these. My HTPC is about as stable as its going to get and the family can use ti without too much trouble. Is that going to change if I lose the cable box and replace with this?

As you can see by the responses, they can be finicky to set up. I really think Ceton needs to provide more thorough documentation especially with regard to static IP configuration (this is especially not intuitive).

That said, mine has been working perfectly for two months once I got through the initial setup, and I do use it over the network.

It blows away the comcast DVR.
NewOrlnsDukie's Avatar NewOrlnsDukie 12:46 AM 07-12-2011
Ugh. What a painful 2 days it's been.

Ever since last night, I've had 2 huge problems.

1) Unable to watch Live TV on my Ceton (says 'tuner not available), and, much more annoyingly:

2) My ethernet port isn't recognizing that it's connected to anything. It's the ethernet port on my Gigabyte mobo. In Device manager, it says everything is just fine. But it isn't registering that my ethernet port is connected to anything. I've gone into BIOS to check that everything is set as it should be, I tried reinstalling the driver from the Gigabyte installation CD, I'vr tried different ethernet cables, different ethernet switches, etc, and have come up with a big zero every time.

Granted, I generally don't use Windows much, but I've spent like 8 hours trying to fix these 2 issues to no avail. It is quite a coincidence that both the Ceton tuner and the LAN port are 'network devices' and both don't work at the same time, but, for the life of me, I can't fix either.

Is this one of those points where folks do that whole 'clean install' rigamarole?

UUUGGHH
gtgray's Avatar gtgray 01:22 AM 07-12-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewOrlnsDukie View Post

Ugh. What a painful 2 days it's been.

Ever since last night, I've had 2 huge problems.

1) Unable to watch Live TV on my Ceton (says 'tuner not available), and, much more annoyingly:

2) My ethernet port isn't recognizing that it's connected to anything. It's the ethernet port on my Gigabyte mobo. In Device manager, it says everything is just fine. But it isn't registering that my ethernet port is connected to anything. I've gone into BIOS to check that everything is set as it should be, I tried reinstalling the driver from the Gigabyte installation CD, I'vr tried different ethernet cables, different ethernet switches, etc, and have come up with a big zero every time.

Granted, I generally don't use Windows much, but I've spent like 8 hours trying to fix these 2 issues to no avail. It is quite a coincidence that both the Ceton tuner and the LAN port are 'network devices' and both don't work at the same time, but, for the life of me, I can't fix either.

Is this one of those points where folks do that whole 'clean install' rigamarole?

UUUGGHH

I would remove the ceton and any other cards you don't need to post. I would clear cmos and restart the pc and see if you have network functionality. I would also if you can make sure the net driver is the latest. Once you get networking running then I would reinstall the Ceton and see what you have.

I don't have any major issues with the Ceton other than it needs a first class signal and I think the firmware needs a touch up... we have been waiting a long time for new production firmware. There is no question the Ceton does not hook to channels and reliably as a Tivo or Cable Company Cable box. Since this is my first Cable Card tuner I don't know if there are timing issues in the OS that cause problems. I have seen the subsription needed screen a hundred times, almost always fixed by one or more channel change.

Static IPs might help... but I think that the tuner sensitity with current firmware is not where it needs to be.
AVTechMan's Avatar AVTechMan 02:20 AM 07-12-2011
I will be ordering the Ceton card later this week. And I have no family nor kids so its just me in getting it all setup. I think with any kind of new hardware such as this will present some kind of challenge to get it running the way it should be. I read a little bit about the network sharing but I don't plan to use that feature of the card. Besides, I want to use the Ceton with WHS once i get that built....I haven't seen many posts of users using it with WHS.

I ran the Cable Advisor on my i3 system and its ready for the Ceton. Just have to order the card and then obtain the CableCard from Comcast (they offer the self install kit in my area). I'm pretty technically minded so I look forward to installing and putting this to use. I have the Hauppauge 1250 installed currently so I plan to install the Ceton alongside it to where I can have 4 tuners for the encrypted HD channels and the Clear QAM for the 1250.
ngsm13's Avatar ngsm13 05:42 AM 07-12-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by hlkc View Post

MarcSparks and ngsm13,

Just for any future users... it sounds like your problems are related to network tuners sharing, right? If you are not using network tuners sharing, it is fine, right?

Make no mistake, they should fix it and have a perfect solution for us. All I am saying is - it is a problem today and any potential customer should be alert of such problem.

I am not doing network tuners sharing with other HTPC today, therefore it is okay to me.

I also agree with MarcSparks comment and I can't recommend this tuner to any less than technical savvy friends unless you don't want to be his/her friends any more

Incorrect. I am not using the Ceton for network tuners at all. It will not even complete an initial setup on my sole HTPC, no networked tuners period.

Just an fyi.
mhetman's Avatar mhetman 06:52 AM 07-12-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by al210 View Post

What low pass filter did you need? I am putting my HTPC together now and will be setting it up with FIOS.

If you check the information that comes with the Ceton it suggests getting a filter for FIOs. The installer does have it on his truck so its shouldn't be an issue. My Ceton has been working great using FIOS with no issues whatsoever..
hlkc's Avatar hlkc 07:28 AM 07-12-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by NewOrlnsDukie View Post

Ugh. What a painful 2 days it's been.

Ever since last night, I've had 2 huge problems.

1) Unable to watch Live TV on my Ceton (says 'tuner not available), and, much more annoyingly:

2) My ethernet port isn't recognizing that it's connected to anything. It's the ethernet port on my Gigabyte mobo. In Device manager, it says everything is just fine. But it isn't registering that my ethernet port is connected to anything. I've gone into BIOS to check that everything is set as it should be, I tried reinstalling the driver from the Gigabyte installation CD, I'vr tried different ethernet cables, different ethernet switches, etc, and have come up with a big zero every time.

Granted, I generally don't use Windows much, but I've spent like 8 hours trying to fix these 2 issues to no avail. It is quite a coincidence that both the Ceton tuner and the LAN port are 'network devices' and both don't work at the same time, but, for the life of me, I can't fix either.

Is this one of those points where folks do that whole 'clean install' rigamarole?

UUUGGHH

Sorry to hear that.

Please follow what gtgray suggested.

Did Centon ever work before or just starting to have the problem?

FYI, I did have some "tuner not available" problems before with my ex GB H67 MB and it was related to some ICQ assignments/conflicts. Please try to switch it to other PCI slots and based on my experiences, your current Centon installed PCI-E might fighting the ICQ resources such as ethernet therefore you are having so much troubles.
hlkc's Avatar hlkc 07:32 AM 07-12-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVTechMan View Post

I will be ordering the Ceton card later this week. And I have no family nor kids so its just me in getting it all setup. I think with any kind of new hardware such as this will present some kind of challenge to get it running the way it should be. I read a little bit about the network sharing but I don't plan to use that feature of the card. Besides, I want to use the Ceton with WHS once i get that built....I haven't seen many posts of users using it with WHS.

I ran the Cable Advisor on my i3 system and its ready for the Ceton. Just have to order the card and then obtain the CableCard from Comcast (they offer the self install kit in my area). I'm pretty technically minded so I look forward to installing and putting this to use. I have the Hauppauge 1250 installed currently so I plan to install the Ceton alongside it to where I can have 4 tuners for the encrypted HD channels and the Clear QAM for the 1250.

Good luck and please post results.
cybrsage's Avatar cybrsage 07:47 AM 07-12-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by al210 View Post

What low pass filter did you need? I am putting my HTPC together now and will be setting it up with FIOS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lovemyram4x4 View Post

Just ask the FiOS tech for one, it's free that way.

Yep, the FiOS tech will install it. I had to put it on the input of the Ceton Tuner...on the line running into the mini adapter for the Ceton. If I put it anywhere else it killed my Internet service. Also, be aware that FiOS runs hot...the tech added in an additional, unneeded splitter to reduce the power level. I am still at +0.3 when I have all 4 channels tuned in with the extra splitter added in.

I do not use the network sharing feature, so I did not install any of the software, etc., needed for it. I have never had a problem with firmware updates or losing my tuner. It has been rock solid and 100% dependable...which is MUCH more than I could say for the tuners I used previous to this one.
Babbitt 1080P's Avatar Babbitt 1080P 08:40 AM 07-12-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by hlkc View Post

It depends on who you ask or reply
The down side I can think of is unless I keep this box configuration forever, otherwise I will lose my recordings since all the Protected recording are lock and can't play/watch from any other HTPCs.

Im confused by the protected content comment. Does this mean if I record on one HTPC I cant watch it on another networked HTPC?
gsr's Avatar gsr 09:11 AM 07-12-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Babbitt 1080P View Post

Im confused by the protected content comment. Does this mean if I record on one HTPC I cant watch it on another networked HTPC?

That's correct - anything marked with the "copy once" flag can only be watched on the PC that originally recorded it. Reinstalling the OS (or possibly certain hardware changes like a new motherboard or CPU) will result in those recordings being unplayable. It is what it is, as it's a restriction from the content providers and cable companies and is no worse than if your old cable company DVR died.

In my case (Verizon FIOS), pretty much none of my recordings are marked with the "copy once" flag - only premium channels like HBO have it. For some people, just about every channel is marked with the flag - it's pretty much luck of the draw and varies a lot by cable provider.
1992lee's Avatar 1992lee 10:05 AM 07-12-2011
gsr, I would like to do a similiar setup to the one that you described earlier with the two Cetons and Xbox extenders. Would you be willing to share your HTPC specs?
I am most interested in the Motherboard,OS, and video card. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Babbitt 1080P's Avatar Babbitt 1080P 02:02 PM 07-12-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsr View Post

That's correct - anything marked with the "copy once" flag can only be watched on the PC that originally recorded it. Reinstalling the OS (or possibly certain hardware changes like a new motherboard or CPU) will result in those recordings being unplayable. It is what it is, as it's a restriction from the content providers and cable companies and is no worse than if your old cable company DVR died.

In my case (Verizon FIOS), pretty much none of my recordings are marked with the "copy once" flag - only premium channels like HBO have it. For some people, just about every channel is marked with the flag - it's pretty much luck of the draw and varies a lot by cable provider.

Thats different than some of the DVR's that are out now. They claim to be able to pause the show and switch rooms. Why is it different for a cable box?

So the network sharing part of the tuner is only to watch live tv or record to a different box. No sharing recorded shows?
hlkc's Avatar hlkc 02:25 PM 07-12-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsr View Post

Reinstalling the OS (or possibly certain hardware changes like a new motherboard or CPU) will result in those recordings being unplayable.

In additional of what you mentioned, I think if we reset the MB BIOS we might lose all the recordings too.
gsr's Avatar gsr 04:00 PM 07-12-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1992lee View Post
gsr, I would like to do a similiar setup to the one that you described earlier with the two Cetons and Xbox extenders. Would you be willing to share your HTPC specs?
I am most interested in the Motherboard,OS, and video card. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Motherboard = Asus P6T7 WS Supercomputer
OS = Windows 7 Ultimate 64bit

The video card is largely irrelevant in my case as long as it satisfies the HDCP requirements as I'm not actually watching anything on that PC - I use XBOX extenders. But I'm currently using an ATI 5670, I believe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Babbitt 1080P View Post
Thats different than some of the DVR's that are out now. They claim to be able to pause the show and switch rooms. Why is it different for a cable box?

So the network sharing part of the tuner is only to watch live tv or record to a different box. No sharing recorded shows?
That's really no different than going to another room and using an XBOX 360 as an extender to continue watching the show. You just can't use another PC to watch protected content. Before worrying about it, see if you can find out if your cable system uses the copy once flag on anything other than premium channels - if they don't then there's nothing to really worry about.

Network sharing allows you to farm out tuners to other PC's so you can either watch live TV or record shows on the other PC's. But protected shows recorded on those other PC's would have the same restrictions - you would only be able to watch a show that was recorded by PC #X on PC #X regardless of where the tuner card is physically installed. I'm not using this feature of the Ceton, but rather have XBOX's in locations where I want to watch TV. This allows me to have all my recordings centralized and can watch them where ever I want to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hlkc View Post
In additional of what you mentioned, I think if we reset the MB BIOS we might lose all the recordings too.
That may be - my intent wasn't really to cover all cases, but to point out to people that certain actions will result in the inability to watch protected content.
hlkc's Avatar hlkc 04:16 PM 07-12-2011
gsr,

I hear you. On the other hand, I really wish we can keep the recordings somehow and it should be easily enough to proof that such as Win7 activation key...

Let's count on it, about a year from now when W8 released, I bet we will most likely lose all the recordings at that time unless there are some developments between now and then
jojoxl's Avatar jojoxl 05:51 PM 07-12-2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by hlkc View Post
gsr,

I hear you. On the other hand, I really wish we can keep the recordings somehow and it should be easily enough to proof that such as Win7 activation key...

Let's count on it, about a year from now when W8 released, I bet we will most likely lose all the recordings at that time unless there are some developments between now and then
If you do an in-place upgrade from Win 7 to Win 8, you shouldn't lose anything. I believe that's the way it worked from Vista to 7. I agree the whole DRM thing is stupid.
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