Advanced MPC-HC Setup Guide - Page 106 - AVS Forum
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post #3151 of 3204 Old 08-17-2014, 06:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by renji1337 View Post
How would I setup MPC HC for using headphones?
the same way you set it up for stereo speaker.

so the same way just set the lavaudio filter mixer to stereo.
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post #3152 of 3204 Old 08-18-2014, 08:43 AM
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Hi all there

After trying for some days both Cyberlink PowerDVD and Arcsoft Total Media Theatre (TMT) and then coming back to MPC-HC+madvr made me think about some things.

As for 2D high-definition movies reproduction (bluray, mkv, etc) MPC is superior to "competitiors", but for 3D bluray (stereoscopic with active shutter glasses and 3d tv panasonic tv) it seems to me that TMT and PowerDVD are far better players; am I doing something wrong myself with any settings or do I need some more specific filters to add in mpc-hc?

The main concern to me is that both software give me a nice 3d-effect feeling, with objects popping out from my tv (how much and how many times depending pretty much from the movie) and coming to my face and a very good depth imaging while mpc-hc doesn't give to me the same feedback, expecially the 3d-pop out effect.

What do you think about that?

Thank you for the help and as always for all the informations and guides found there
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post #3153 of 3204 Old 08-18-2014, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by z3d View Post
Hi all there

After trying for some days both Cyberlink PowerDVD and Arcsoft Total Media Theatre (TMT) and then coming back to MPC-HC+madvr made me think about some things.

As for 2D high-definition movies reproduction (bluray, mkv, etc) MPC is superior to "competitiors", but for 3D bluray (stereoscopic with active shutter glasses and 3d tv panasonic tv) it seems to me that TMT and PowerDVD are far better players; am I doing something wrong myself with any settings or do I need some more specific filters to add in mpc-hc?

The main concern to me is that both software give me a nice 3d-effect feeling, with objects popping out from my tv (how much and how many times depending pretty much from the movie) and coming to my face and a very good depth imaging while mpc-hc doesn't give to me the same feedback, expecially the 3d-pop out effect.

What do you think about that?

Thank you for the help and as always for all the informations and guides found there
MPC does not do 3D; it plays the BD3D in 2D. You see a 2D-to-3D conversion by the TV.
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post #3154 of 3204 Old 08-18-2014, 02:09 PM
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Oh okay, now I see!

So for the reproduction of 3D bluray which software do you advise to use, which will not cause any troubles and conflicts with my current MPC-HC setup?
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post #3155 of 3204 Old 08-18-2014, 09:01 PM
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Originally Posted by z3d View Post
Oh okay, now I see!

So for the reproduction of 3D bluray which software do you advise to use, which will not cause any troubles and conflicts with my current MPC-HC setup?
As for 3D MVC MKV, Stereoscopic Player by 3dtv.at is the only player that can decode MVC and output 3D (in various formats, Frame Packing, SBS, etc.). If your graphics card is NVIDIA, you will have to buy NVIDIA's 3DTV Play, $40, to get Frame Packing 3D. AMD graphics cards are reported to have a problem. Intel is good.

You can play BR 3D ISO with any of PowerDVD, TMT, Stereoscopic Player (but with the same problems as above).
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post #3156 of 3204 Old 08-18-2014, 11:41 PM
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Thank you renethx for your advices

I have a NVIDIA graphic card (gtx 680), it will be the same for me to install Stereoscopic Player (3dtv.at) instead of Nvidia 3dPlay (I gave it a try some weeks ago with the trial version but I had problems with it and uninstalled asap) or the other mentioned softwares?

My main concern is the correct reproduction of 3D Bluray (original); honestly, online 3d contents, mkv mvc 3d video, youtube 3d and other stuff is way less important to me.
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post #3157 of 3204 Old 08-19-2014, 12:00 AM
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Stereoscopic Player (3dtv.at) is independent of 3DTV Play. You will need the latter to enable Frame Packing 3D output with Stereoscopic Player + NVIDIA GPU (you don't need it with PowerDVD/TMT + NVIDIA GPU, however). 3DTV Play is included in NVIDIA GPU driver, you will need a $40 license to use it beyond the trial period.

Last edited by renethx; 08-19-2014 at 12:03 AM.
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post #3158 of 3204 Old 08-19-2014, 04:23 AM
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Ok, now I understand; so it's either Stereoscopic Player (3dtv.at) + Nvidia 3DTV Play or full players like Arcsoft TMT / PowerDVD Ultra.

Quality wise, are there any differences between both setups? Which one is recommended?

As for Stereo player (3dtv.at), do you advise using 2.1.4 stable version or 2.2.9 Beta version instead?

Thank you for all these informations
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post #3159 of 3204 Old 08-19-2014, 04:35 AM
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There is no quality difference. Stereoscopic Player + 3DTV Play is pretty expensive. If you already have PowerDVD, stick to it (with ISO). Otherwise whichever. With Stereoscopic Player for 3D and MPC-BE/HC for 2D, you can have all your video files in MKV format, that's a kind of advantage (?). Stereoscopic Player 2.2.9 is a lot better than the official release.

Last edited by renethx; 08-19-2014 at 04:40 AM.
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post #3160 of 3204 Old 08-30-2014, 09:04 PM
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Perhaps this is a corner case for many but I am running it with it a lot using stock Intel iGPU. When watching 1080i30/29 or 1080i50 music video movies, MadVR does not seem to know how to select correct colorspace. I have my system setup to 0-255 everywhere but with interlaced content blacks are washed out in this setup. I have tried to reach Madshi on Doom9 but I did not get much in terms of answers. Has anyone figured out how to setup madVR correctly with Intel iGPU 4600 to avoid washed out blacks with Interlaced content.

Thanks.
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post #3161 of 3204 Old 08-30-2014, 10:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dvzzz View Post
Perhaps this is a corner case for many but I am running it with it a lot using stock Intel iGPU. When watching 1080i30/29 or 1080i50 music video movies, MadVR does not seem to know how to select correct colorspace. I have my system setup to 0-255 everywhere but with interlaced content blacks are washed out in this setup. I have tried to reach Madshi on Doom9 but I did not get much in terms of answers. Has anyone figured out how to setup madVR correctly with Intel iGPU 4600 to avoid washed out blacks with Interlaced content.

Thanks.
should be a problem with dxva deinterlacing try software deinterlacing from lav.

and most important think about a bug report
http://bugs.madshi.net/

madshi will be back soon and there is no way he will not see this bug report.
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post #3162 of 3204 Old 09-08-2014, 05:25 PM
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I switched to MPC-BE for the WASAPI support.
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post #3163 of 3204 Old 09-09-2014, 07:09 PM
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I hope I am not asking a question which has already been answered

I am using integrated graphics and it struggles with using Jinc to go from DVD>768p with Bicubic75/Jinc3 without AR for 25p
I tried some of the trade quality for performance options such as buffer chroma/image in 10bit instead of 16bit which shaves 5ms off my render time which is now 35ms but the maximum render time jumps to 80ms and I am still dropping frames fairly frequently

I notice that when I use Catmull-Rom to downscale a Blu-ray rip or Apple Trailer that is 1920x800 I get a render time of 34ms and no dropped frames, but with 1920x1080 render times are > 41ms and even 24fps content drops frames.

On DVD and Blu-ray and youtube letterboxed or window boxed content is often encoded with black bars meaning the scaler has to scale that portion of the image too.

On MPC I tried using a pre-resize shader to crop the image but madvr still seems to be rendering the entire frame, and this doesn't reduce my render times.

Does anyone have any recommendations? If there was a feature, this would come in handy as it could make the difference from being able to use luma doubling on blu-ray for a 2.4:1 film for those with borderline GPUS.
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post #3164 of 3204 Old 09-10-2014, 07:44 AM - Thread Starter
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there are some situations where jinc doesn't work, and it falls back to lanczos. That might be what is happening.
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post #3165 of 3204 Old 09-10-2014, 12:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leonccyiu View Post
I hope I am not asking a question which has already been answered

I am using integrated graphics and it struggles with using Jinc to go from DVD>768p with Bicubic75/Jinc3 without AR for 25p
I tried some of the trade quality for performance options such as buffer chroma/image in 10bit instead of 16bit which shaves 5ms off my render time which is now 35ms but the maximum render time jumps to 80ms and I am still dropping frames fairly frequently

I notice that when I use Catmull-Rom to downscale a Blu-ray rip or Apple Trailer that is 1920x800 I get a render time of 34ms and no dropped frames, but with 1920x1080 render times are > 41ms and even 24fps content drops frames.

On DVD and Blu-ray and youtube letterboxed or window boxed content is often encoded with black bars meaning the scaler has to scale that portion of the image too.

On MPC I tried using a pre-resize shader to crop the image but madvr still seems to be rendering the entire frame, and this doesn't reduce my render times.

Does anyone have any recommendations? If there was a feature, this would come in handy as it could make the difference from being able to use luma doubling on blu-ray for a 2.4:1 film for those with borderline GPUS.
Open a MKV file with mkvmerge GUI > File > Header Editor. Then add the value to 'video crop top' and 'video crop bottom'. For example, add '140' and '140'. Then you will get 1920x800 and some players recognize the video as 1920x800 (VLC, MPC-BE etc.; you can't use madVR with VLC of course).

Or use ffdshow raw video filter > Crop, that should work with any DirectShow player.
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post #3166 of 3204 Old 09-13-2014, 08:24 AM
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I'm hoping someone will be able to help me. I'm having a new problem with madVR where videos stutter during slow panning scenes. The stutter occurs at around 1 sec intervals and I'm not dropping any frames, have zero repeat frames, and have no glitches. Render times are mid to upper 20ms. CPU shows little utilization at around 15-20%. I've attempted resetting madVR settings to default and even at default settings the stutter occurs (both exclusive mode as well as windowed).

Specs for my HTPC
Win 8.1 64bit, 16GB RAM
Resolution - 3840x2160 @60hz
Video Content - All 1080P
madVR - Current build
ReClock - Current build
MPC-HC - Current build
LAV Filters - Current build
GTX 770 - Drivers attempted with no difference in stutter -340.43 beta and 340.52

MPC-HC settings are pretty standard and where appropriate (LAV Filters) I've ensured NVIDIA CUVID settings are enabled - including HW/GPU Deinterlacing (set for 50/60p Video).

madVR - Again, reset settings to default and left scaling options default. I have attempted to play some with render settings and disabling desktop composition, use separate device for presentation as well as frames to present in advance w/o any change or impact to stutter. CPU/GPU queues also seem to make no difference. Queues all show full when stutter occurs.

If I disable madVR in MPC-HC, the stutter completely goes away. Last, I've uninstalled and reinstalled all the above components thinking something may have gotten messed up including reinstalling video drivers (ensuring perform fresh install was checked) and I still get stutter if madVR is enabled. There are times where the stutter does not exist at all on the same video file but I'd say normally there is stutter. Sometimes I can get the stutter to go away by pausing the video or ffw or rew but this does not always work.

Does anyone have any thoughts on what I can do to correct this behavior?
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post #3167 of 3204 Old 09-13-2014, 08:32 AM
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what type of file are you playing'?
make a screen of your madVr osd when or after the issue please (control+j)
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post #3168 of 3204 Old 09-13-2014, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by renethx View Post
Open a MKV file with mkvmerge GUI > File > Header Editor. Then add the value to 'video crop top' and 'video crop bottom'. For example, add '140' and '140'. Then you will get 1920x800 and some players recognize the video as 1920x800 (VLC, MPC-BE etc.; you can't use madVR with VLC of course).

Or use ffdshow raw video filter > Crop, that should work with any DirectShow player.
Thanks @renethx
I still haven't quite gotten it to work but using ffdshow is on the right track.
I installed ffdshow the video decoder and the raw video filter, and enabled them as an external filter in MPC-HC. I set the crop in ffdshow to autocrop. Nothing happened at first, then suddenly once when I was trying to watch a 720p video where the screen fades to black, it caused all kinds of problems, and I noticed the pre-scaled resolution in the madvr statistics was smaller. I noticed the ffdshow icon in my system tray. The autocrop works, but I tried to get it to crop 140 from the top and bottom that didn't work.


I uninstalled ffdshow and reinstalled it, now I can't even get it back in my system tray or use it as my video decoder.


The crop settings are also no where as easy as VLC where you can choose from a variety of aspect ratios to crop or stretch to. Playlists in VLC are also much nicer along with how opening a file automatically gets added to the playlist, I still keep VLC open for testing and playing around, but I realise MADVR is almost never going to work in VLC.
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post #3169 of 3204 Old 09-13-2014, 12:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leonccyiu View Post
Thanks @renethx
I still haven't quite gotten it to work but using ffdshow is on the right track.
I installed ffdshow the video decoder and the raw video filter, and enabled them as an external filter in MPC-HC. I set the crop in ffdshow to autocrop. Nothing happened at first, then suddenly once when I was trying to watch a 720p video where the screen fades to black, it caused all kinds of problems, and I noticed the pre-scaled resolution in the madvr statistics was smaller. I noticed the ffdshow icon in my system tray. The autocrop works, but I tried to get it to crop 140 from the top and bottom that didn't work.


I uninstalled ffdshow and reinstalled it, now I can't even get it back in my system tray or use it as my video decoder.


The crop settings are also no where as easy as VLC where you can choose from a variety of aspect ratios to crop or stretch to. Playlists in VLC are also much nicer along with how opening a file automatically gets added to the playlist, I still keep VLC open for testing and playing around, but I realise MADVR is almost never going to work in VLC.
You don't have to use ffdshow Video Decoder. ffdshow raw video filter is enough to crop the video. Just add ffdshow raw video filter in External filters and set it to preferred. Then the filter chain will be

LAV Source/Splitter -> LAV Video Decoder -> ffdshow raw video filter -> madVR

The only role of ffdshow raw video filter is cropping the (decoded) video. You can see what filters are used by right-clicking the screen and click 'Filters'.
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post #3170 of 3204 Old 09-13-2014, 12:13 PM
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Originally Posted by mightyhuhn View Post
what type of file are you playing'?
make a screen of your madVr osd when or after the issue please (control+j)
Thanks for your help. Stuttering occurs with both MKV's as well as full BR rips.
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post #3171 of 3204 Old 09-13-2014, 12:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cfendya View Post
Thanks for your help. Stuttering occurs with both MKV's as well as full BR rips.
you play 23hz with 60 hz back this judders like crazy
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post #3172 of 3204 Old 09-13-2014, 12:43 PM
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you play 23hz with 60 hz back this judders like crazy
That said, are my only options to change my TV res or use SVP?

In the past when I've used smooth motion in madVR it's caused all kinds of image quality issues.
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post #3173 of 3204 Old 09-13-2014, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by cfendya View Post
That said, are my only options to change my TV res or use SVP?

In the past when I've used smooth motion in madVR it's caused all kinds of image quality issues.
so your TV doesn't support 23p 24p 25p 29p 30p 50 59p ?

you can use madVR smooth motion.

and SVP creates artefacts that's normal it is an interpolation
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post #3174 of 3204 Old 09-13-2014, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by mightyhuhn View Post
so your TV doesn't support 23p 24p 25p 29p 30p 50 59p ?

you can use madVR smooth motion.

and SVP creates artefacts that's normal it is an interpolation
My TV does support all those refresh rates and I just changed it to 24hz and the judder still occurs although at a much faster rate.

Why does the judder stop if I disable madVR (whether I'm at 60z or 24hz)?
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post #3175 of 3204 Old 09-13-2014, 01:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cfendya View Post
My TV does support all those refresh rates and I just changed it to 24hz and the judder still occurs although at a much faster rate.

Why does the judder stop if I disable madVR (whether I'm at 60z or 24hz)?
it's impossible to get a judder free image with a 23p source with 60 hz refreshrate.
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post #3176 of 3204 Old 09-13-2014, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mightyhuhn View Post
it's impossible to get a judder free image with a 23p source with 60 hz refreshrate.
I get it minus madVR. It's only when I use madVR that I get judder.

I've installed SVP and the judder is completely gone now.
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post #3177 of 3204 Old 09-13-2014, 04:00 PM
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After a many hours of playing with various settings I believe I have resolved my issues. I wanted to comment in case someone else was having similar issues.

Everything software/hardware remains the same with the exception of moving to Nvidia 340.52 drivers. I'm not sure if things would work on 340.43 beta as it's working now and I don't want to make any further changes and risk breaking something.

What corrected my stutter/judder issue ended up pertaining to CPU/GPU queueing and number of frames to present in advance. It took a long time watching the output to find what specifically worked for my setup. Below are the settings that worked for me. I'm not using any SVP or madVR smooth motion at this point and get extremely smooth playback at 3840x2160@60hz.

Rendering
CPU queue - Set to 128
GPU queue - Set to 19
Exclusive Mode frames to present in advance - 4

Scaling Algorithms
Chroma Upscale - BC75 AR
Image Doubling - NNEDI3 16
Image Upscaling - Lan3 AR
Image Downscaling - Cat AR LL

With the above set my render times are low to mid 20ms with no dropped/delayed frames or presentation glitches and my frame repeat rate is in the 2 days time frames

Quote:
Originally Posted by cfendya View Post
I'm hoping someone will be able to help me. I'm having a new problem with madVR where videos stutter during slow panning scenes. The stutter occurs at around 1 sec intervals and I'm not dropping any frames, have zero repeat frames, and have no glitches. Render times are mid to upper 20ms. CPU shows little utilization at around 15-20%. I've attempted resetting madVR settings to default and even at default settings the stutter occurs (both exclusive mode as well as windowed).

Specs for my HTPC
Win 8.1 64bit, 16GB RAM
Resolution - 3840x2160 @60hz
Video Content - All 1080P
madVR - Current build
ReClock - Current build
MPC-HC - Current build
LAV Filters - Current build
GTX 770 - Drivers attempted with no difference in stutter -340.43 beta and 340.52

MPC-HC settings are pretty standard and where appropriate (LAV Filters) I've ensured NVIDIA CUVID settings are enabled - including HW/GPU Deinterlacing (set for 50/60p Video).

madVR - Again, reset settings to default and left scaling options default. I have attempted to play some with render settings and disabling desktop composition, use separate device for presentation as well as frames to present in advance w/o any change or impact to stutter. CPU/GPU queues also seem to make no difference. Queues all show full when stutter occurs.

If I disable madVR in MPC-HC, the stutter completely goes away. Last, I've uninstalled and reinstalled all the above components thinking something may have gotten messed up including reinstalling video drivers (ensuring perform fresh install was checked) and I still get stutter if madVR is enabled. There are times where the stutter does not exist at all on the same video file but I'd say normally there is stutter. Sometimes I can get the stutter to go away by pausing the video or ffw or rew but this does not always work.

Does anyone have any thoughts on what I can do to correct this behavior?
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post #3178 of 3204 Old 09-13-2014, 04:28 PM
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there is nothing smooth you now have a straight forward 3:2 judder.
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post #3179 of 3204 Old 09-15-2014, 10:48 PM
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7.1 on 5.1 system with software decoding in LAV

Hi folks, I apologize in advance if this was asked before. I tried searching through this thread but couldn't find anything similar.

So I have an HTPC (Intel HD4000 GPU) that is connected via HDMI to my Yamaha RX-V375 receiver (5.1 output only). Up until now, I have been bitstreaming lossless audio (DTS-HD-MA and TrueHD) to my receiver and things have been working great. However, I recently purchased the PB12-NSD subwoofer from SVS and in the process of using REW to optimize sub placement, I came across the wonderful Equalizer APO software that lets you EQ your sub/speakers at the Windows audio driver level. This works wonderfully, but in order to leverage the EQing advantage with my sub, I need to decode the audio in software to PCM prior to sending it out to my receiver.

So I got my TMT dll (dtsdecoderdll.dll) into LAVfilters folder and all is working well. HOWEVER, I am unclear on whether I am getting the same audio now when I play 7.1 lossless tracks.

When bitstreaming, I'd assume that the receiver would realize it was getting a 7.1 track and would figure out how to downmix the missing 7.1 channels into 5.1 thus allowing for some of the audio to the extra 2 channels being accounted for in my 5.1 surrounds.

However, when decoding in software, it appears that the 7.1 track just gets decoded into 7.1 PCM. What is not clear to me is whether the receiver still detects the PCM audio track it receives as being 7.1 and performs the same downmixing to incorporate audio from the missing channels or whether it simply discards the extra channel audio info. Would I need LAV Audio to perform this downmixing in software prior to outputting the PCM track to my receiver? If so, what setting would I need to use within LAV audio to achieve this?

I'd really appreciate any advice/suggestions on this matter!
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post #3180 of 3204 Old 09-16-2014, 07:12 AM
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Originally Posted by orion2001 View Post
Hi folks, I apologize in advance if this was asked before. I tried searching through this thread but couldn't find anything similar.

So I have an HTPC (Intel HD4000 GPU) that is connected via HDMI to my Yamaha RX-V375 receiver (5.1 output only). Up until now, I have been bitstreaming lossless audio (DTS-HD-MA and TrueHD) to my receiver and things have been working great. However, I recently purchased the PB12-NSD subwoofer from SVS and in the process of using REW to optimize sub placement, I came across the wonderful Equalizer APO software that lets you EQ your sub/speakers at the Windows audio driver level. This works wonderfully, but in order to leverage the EQing advantage with my sub, I need to decode the audio in software to PCM prior to sending it out to my receiver.

So I got my TMT dll (dtsdecoderdll.dll) into LAVfilters folder and all is working well. HOWEVER, I am unclear on whether I am getting the same audio now when I play 7.1 lossless tracks.

When bitstreaming, I'd assume that the receiver would realize it was getting a 7.1 track and would figure out how to downmix the missing 7.1 channels into 5.1 thus allowing for some of the audio to the extra 2 channels being accounted for in my 5.1 surrounds.

However, when decoding in software, it appears that the 7.1 track just gets decoded into 7.1 PCM. What is not clear to me is whether the receiver still detects the PCM audio track it receives as being 7.1 and performs the same downmixing to incorporate audio from the missing channels or whether it simply discards the extra channel audio info. Would I need LAV Audio to perform this downmixing in software prior to outputting the PCM track to my receiver? If so, what setting would I need to use within LAV audio to achieve this?

I'd really appreciate any advice/suggestions on this matter!
If you are using a 7.1 capable receiver, but only happen to have a 5.1 speaker setup then it should be able to downmix 7.1 PCM to 5.1 speakers. However the EQ might be screwy as your software is preforming its EQ under the assumption that there are 8 channels when there are really only 6 being output. You would likely get better results by telling the software to downmix to 5.1 before EQ is applied.

If your receiver is only 5.1 capable and you are feeding it 7.1 then it will just discard the extra 2 channels worth of audio information. So, again, you would be better off having the software downmix to 5.1 before EQ is applied and certainly before the audio is output.

Both scenarios assume that you are passing the audio from the PC to the receiver over HDMI. Normally, the PC and receiver should be able to sort this out on their own during the HDMI handshake, at which point the receiver will tell the PC that it can only handle 5.1 audio. Obviously, if you are using analog connections then you would also want to do the downmixing in the software as you could then keep the signal in the analog domain after the initial DAC, so as to avoid multiple conversions.
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