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post #1441 of 2108 Old 05-09-2013, 03:22 PM
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Originally Posted by olyteddy View Post

The one that does OTA isn't the Prime. It only has 2 tuners: http://www.silicondust.com/products/hdhomerun/atsc/
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Originally Posted by pkscout View Post

I believe the Prime comes in 2 versions, one for QAM/cablecard stuff and one for OTA ATSC. So you probably can't hook your current one up to an antenna. Often however, you can still tune the QAM channels for the broadcast networks if you have internet (totally dependent on your local provider). So it might be worth a try to plug the Prime in and scan for QAM channels
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Originally Posted by hanly2 View Post

Comcast sucks so bad, my price went up to 170 for the triple play so I cancelled tv now I pay 103 for just internet and phone after I cancel the phone the internet will still be $65, still saving money though. So I was wondering if the prime is worthless now or can I just hook a antenna up to it and get 3 tuners that way?

Technically, the one that's easiest (possible?) to use with OTA is the HD Homerun Dual, but the Prime does have the ATSC tuners.

What pkscout said is also worthwhile, since it's common for Comcast to have local broadcast stations on unencrypted QAM. I assume if you removed the cablecard, you could go reconnect the prime (sans cablecard) and scan just to check what (if any) channels are available with your internet connection.

For the antenna, I don't know how you'd ever get Silicondust's Prime software to recognize and allow the ATSC tuners to function, but just for proof here is a screenshot of my Prime's tuner status page in NPVR http://cdn.avsforum.com/e/ed/ed139e36_2NPVR.png
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post #1442 of 2108 Old 05-09-2013, 07:58 PM
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Technically, the one that's easiest (possible?) to use with OTA is the HD Homerun Dual, but the Prime does have the ATSC tuners.
Uh, no it doesn't, unless there's some convoluted way to access them. The Prime is strictly a cable TV tuner. Please link me a document that proves me wrong.

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post #1443 of 2108 Old 05-09-2013, 10:24 PM
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Earlier this year some people were reporting on the SD forum that the prime "lost" the digital antenna tab... but this was by design as people actually thought it could do ATSC when it could not.so now it only shows what it can tune, The prime's tuner is qam only, older drivers reported ATSC since they could also work with the dual but the prime itself would not tune atsc. I believe the chip used was the MxL241SF.

http://www.silicondust.com/forum2/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=14930
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post #1444 of 2108 Old 05-10-2013, 02:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark_Slayer View Post

Technically, the one that's easiest (possible?) to use with OTA is the HD Homerun Dual, but the Prime does have the ATSC tuners.

What pkscout said is also worthwhile, since it's common for Comcast to have local broadcast stations on unencrypted QAM. I assume if you removed the cablecard, you could go reconnect the prime (sans cablecard) and scan just to check what (if any) channels are available with your internet connection.

For the antenna, I don't know how you'd ever get Silicondust's Prime software to recognize and allow the ATSC tuners to function, but just for proof here is a screenshot of my Prime's tuner status page in NPVR http://cdn.avsforum.com/e/ed/ed139e36_2NPVR.png
Comcast has virtually no clear QAM in our market for over a year now. Even the locals are encrypted.. Essentially they are all digital and that is likely the trend going forward. If they have not got to your local market, look for it. You need decoders of one sort or another for virtually everything.

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post #1445 of 2108 Old 05-10-2013, 04:50 AM
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Yes, they are slowly rolling out the HD DTAs which they will give out for free for a couple of years and allow them to encrypt the locals. I would not rely on getting clear QAM locals on Comcast for very long.
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post #1446 of 2108 Old 05-10-2013, 10:49 AM
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Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post

I would not rely on getting clear QAM locals on Comcast for very long.

Has anyone heard anything about Charters plans? I'm more interested in the HD versions of the broadcast channels.

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post #1447 of 2108 Old 05-10-2013, 10:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leebo View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post

I would not rely on getting clear QAM locals on Comcast for very long.

Has anyone heard anything about Charters plans? I'm more interested in the HD versions of the broadcast channels.

Sent from my Nexus 7

There's a bit of information here but I am not sure if this completely answers your question.

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post #1448 of 2108 Old 05-12-2013, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post

Yes, you can share any tuners to any PC on your network as they are "pooled" for use by any PC requesting a tuner. They have a new 4 tuner model coming out this year. It is supposed to be in the Spring but I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't show up until the Summer but who knows.

Any "update" on the NEW 4 tuner model ... it's now May 12, 2013 and "summer" is not too far off?
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post #1449 of 2108 Old 05-12-2013, 05:35 PM
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I've been Google searching every week to see if anything would come up about an announcement, rumors, or any sort of timeframe for a release date but have come up empty every time.
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post #1450 of 2108 Old 05-13-2013, 07:29 AM
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I picked up one of those obi things a while ago, just waiting till summer because my wife just sent her resume out to a few places and doesn't want me porting the number right now. As for qam is garbage, the signal is crap, with my $6 antenna from meritline I get all the locals in HD and they look amazing. I just didn't want to have to buy one for all the tv's in the house, and I doubt the signal will split, but I will test it out.
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post #1451 of 2108 Old 05-13-2013, 02:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anywhereanytime View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post

Yes, you can share any tuners to any PC on your network as they are "pooled" for use by any PC requesting a tuner. They have a new 4 tuner model coming out this year. It is supposed to be in the Spring but I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't show up until the Summer but who knows.

Any "update" on the NEW 4 tuner model ... it's now May 12, 2013 and "summer" is not too far off?

Yes, but summer doesn't end until September 21, so it could also come out on September 20 and still qualify as "summer."
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post #1452 of 2108 Old 05-13-2013, 02:55 PM
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You'd think they might feel some competitive pressure from Ceton, which just released a 6-tuner network Cable Card box.
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post #1453 of 2108 Old 05-13-2013, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by wco81 View Post

You'd think they might feel some competitive pressure from Ceton, which just released a 6-tuner network Cable Card box.

Yeah, noticed that they don't offer a PCI and USB version but instead a PCI and Network version. Couple of things . . .
  • Pooled tuners for the new Ceton is beta, it's a staple for SD
  • DLNA is not roadmapped at this point for Ceton (might not matter to anyone)
  • Several XBMC backends support the Dual/Prime, but iTV support is much more hacked-in
  • Network tuner might change that if they can use the sagedct approach that works for SD support

They still have a ways to go before I'd say they feel competitive pressure, though Ceton appears to have a much larger fan base in these forums
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post #1454 of 2108 Old 05-13-2013, 04:34 PM
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The thing I have to ask myself utlimately... which is the better performing tuner. My Ceton at least has its good days and its bad days. I know the cabling I provide to it is vastly better than what was split over and over again back in my Tivo HD days. Still the Tivo was by far a more robust tune with its cobbled together cable drop. This was also true in the bad old days before all the OTA went digital and the stations were allowed to crank up the wattage. In those days my Silicon Dust ATSC tuners were pretty useless and my Tivo was rock solid. Of course the SD Homeruns have worked like a champ since the switchover and wattage boost and now the HDHRs are applainces and I never even thnk about themHaven't physically touched one of them in several years and I always watched my networked stuff directly OTA for the cleaner less compressed signal..

So for those who post on this thread who have both devices would you give a strong nod to either SD or Ceton for tuner performance over the other...


JRiver provides support for the Ceton but it seems to be even more sensitive to signal and timing issues in JRiver. JRiver does allow madVR with the Ceton and if capture is clean the picture is amazing. Just trying to see which future path to head down. I really like networed devices... If you main HTPC goes down fire up that laptop, you know!

I am hoping the newest devices as they hit the market have even more robust tuners in them. In my area a Comcast market I consider the current 4 tuner PCIe Ceton to be barely adequate with the cleanest short signal path possible in my house. The only way I can improve on what I have is to consider using a trap instead of a splitter so that my Cable Modem gets less of the signal on its side that does the Ceton. I only have the one splitter outside and all the cabling is short, sweet, nearly new and directly to the point.

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post #1455 of 2108 Old 05-14-2013, 06:28 AM
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Yes that's an important point when considering a network-based tuner - SD has had a couple of years now to iron out issues with the Prime and workaround all sorts of hinkiness over many FW releases. Ceton has also done that to some extent with bridging for the InfiniTV but not solely for a network tuner like this new one. We'll see how many issues will be reported with it and how long it takes to get them fixed. Certainly with the Echo you can say that Ceton's track record is mixed at the very least.

I also think DLNA w/DTCP-IP could be a compelling feature for SD with the right partners and it looks like Ceton has no interest in that feature at this time.
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post #1456 of 2108 Old 05-15-2013, 12:20 PM
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I currently have two Primes in our network, with two WMC PC's and one Xbox sharing the 6 tuners (4 tuners each as I have not installed Remote Potato). I'm starting to think about adding an HDHR Dual I bought a year ago and never used. I would use it as the primary tuner for the HD broadcast channels, freeing up the Primes for CC channels.

Should I enquire about set up info in this thread, or go to the Dual thread? I assume set up is similar to the Prime, but I have no idea how to make channels display seamlessly in WMC. My understanding is without the CC, channels display without call letters but I may be wrong.

Sent from my Nexus 7
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post #1457 of 2108 Old 05-15-2013, 09:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leebo View Post

I currently have two Primes in our network, with two WMC PC's and one Xbox sharing the 6 tuners (4 tuners each as I have not installed Remote Potato). I'm starting to think about adding an HDHR Dual I bought a year ago and never used. I would use it as the primary tuner for the HD broadcast channels, freeing up the Primes for CC channels.

Should I enquire about set up info in this thread, or go to the Dual thread? I assume set up is similar to the Prime, but I have no idea how to make channels display seamlessly in WMC. My understanding is without the CC, channels display without call letters but I may be wrong.

Sent from my Nexus 7
I have 2 primes but scanned 1 tuner of one of the primes as QAM (there are a couple of OTA stations that aren't in our lineup). This is what the guide says:


PS: The CableCard HD version of channel 7 is listed as 107 KIRODT.
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post #1458 of 2108 Old 05-15-2013, 11:43 PM
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Wait, I'm confused. You wrote 107, but your screen shot shows KIRODT as 7.1.

Sent from my Nexus 7
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post #1459 of 2108 Old 05-16-2013, 05:16 AM
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Originally Posted by leebo View Post

I currently have two Primes in our network, with two WMC PC's and one Xbox sharing the 6 tuners (4 tuners each as I have not installed Remote Potato). I'm starting to think about adding an HDHR Dual I bought a year ago and never used. I would use it as the primary tuner for the HD broadcast channels, freeing up the Primes for CC channels.

Should I enquire about set up info in this thread, or go to the Dual thread? I assume set up is similar to the Prime, but I have no idea how to make channels display seamlessly in WMC. My understanding is without the CC, channels display without call letters but I may be wrong.

Sent from my Nexus 7

I am a big fan of the Silicondust network tuners; we use a pair of HDHR3-CC’s and a single HDHR3-US dual tuner for ATSC/OTA. I am on FiOS and rent a single cable-card for one of the HDHR3-CC, the other is set for Clear-QAM. Statistically, encrypted cable viewing is in the order of about 10%; Clear-QAM and ATSC/OTA provides for the majority of our viewing. This configuration provides a pool of eight tuners. (3 CC, 3 QAM and 2 ATSC/OTA). I really like having the large pool of tuners, it allows for smooth transitions between shows when you have overlapping recordings. WMC really does a great job on managing tuners, I have had a few minor errors in my channel line-up; nothing hard to correct.

You are mistaken with the “Remote Potato”, this application is used to remotely access WMC. “Tuner Salad” allows you to configure more than 4 of each type of tuner; in my world I don’t need it.
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post #1460 of 2108 Old 05-16-2013, 07:25 AM
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Originally Posted by leebo View Post

Wait, I'm confused. You wrote 107, but your screen shot shows KIRODT as 7.1.

Sent from my Nexus 7
The screen shot shows just one page of the guide. It also shows up in the guide as 107. The 107 is the channel number in the ComCast lineup (as read by the CableCard), the 7 is the SD version and 7.1 is the HD Clear Qam channel number. All 3 peacefully co-exist.
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post #1461 of 2108 Old 05-16-2013, 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by billdacat View Post

I am a big fan of the Silicondust network tuners; we use a pair of HDHR3-CC’s and a single HDHR3-US dual tuner for ATSC/OTA. I am on FiOS and rent a single cable-card for one of the HDHR3-CC, the other is set for Clear-QAM. Statistically, encrypted cable viewing is in the order of about 10%; Clear-QAM and ATSC/OTA provides for the majority of our viewing. This configuration provides a pool of eight tuners. (3 CC, 3 QAM and 2 ATSC/OTA). I really like having the large pool of tuners, it allows for smooth transitions between shows when you have overlapping recordings. WMC really does a great job on managing tuners, I have had a few minor errors in my channel line-up; nothing hard to correct.

You are mistaken with the “Remote Potato”, this application is used to remotely access WMC. “Tuner Salad” allows you to configure more than 4 of each type of tuner; in my world I don’t need it.

Yes, I did confuse them. And with our set-up, I'm thinking we won't need it either. So we'll have 6 CC tuners, and two clear QAM tuners. I'll set up my sister's pc to use three cc tuners, mine to use 3 cc tuner plus one Clear QAM, and the living room to use one of each tuner (we use a ROKU more than cable in the LR).

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The screen shot shows just one page of the guide. It also shows up in the guide as 107. The 107 is the channel number in the ComCast lineup (as read by the CableCard), the 7 is the SD version and 7.1 is the HD Clear Qam channel number. All 3 peacefully co-exist.

OK. So if I understand, 107 and 7.1 are showing the same channel. Now, does WMC know to try to use the Clear QAM tuner for all un-encrypted stuff, or do you have to specifically set that?
Also, I assume I just need to hook up the Dual and re-run both the SD tuner scan and WMC tuner scan, without having to download any other software from SD?
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post #1462 of 2108 Old 05-16-2013, 06:44 PM
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OK. So if I understand, 107 and 7.1 are showing the same channel. Now, does WMC know to try to use the Clear QAM tuner for all un-encrypted stuff, or do you have to specifically set that?
Also, I assume I just need to hook up the Dual and re-run both the SD tuner scan and WMC tuner scan, without having to download any other software from SD?
I believe it does use the Clear Qam when it can, if not you can force it by selecting 7.1 as the channel. It is correct that it doesn't take anything special software wise.
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post #1463 of 2108 Old 05-16-2013, 07:34 PM
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Thanks. I guess I'll figure it out by trial and error. My sister watches Disney, Nick, and ABC Family almost exclusively, so if she misses recordings, it's likely the living room used a cc tuner rather than Clear.

Sent from my Nexus 7
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post #1464 of 2108 Old 05-17-2013, 05:09 AM
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Originally Posted by leebo View Post

Thanks. I guess I'll figure it out by trial and error. My sister watches Disney, Nick, and ABC Family almost exclusively, so if she misses recordings, it's likely the living room used a cc tuner rather than Clear.

Sent from my Nexus 7

I was experiencing some annoying pixilation issues with the HDHR3-Dual on QAM. This is the reason why I bought a second HDHR-Prime –CC tuner. So I basically have two HDHR3-CC tuners, one with a “cable-card”, and the other without a cable-card. WMC considers that as two different types of tuners; 3-CC and 3-QAM.
Getting back to the HDR3-Dual; I connected this to my roof-top antenna for ATSC/OTA. I was expecting pixilation, but to my surprise none was present. I have no explanation as to why my pixilation issues disappeared. Silicondust suspected a network issue, but I was in no mood to start mucking around with my NIC’s that have been solid for the past three years. I then said what the heck and configured my main HTPC with all three types of HDHR tuners. (CC,QAM,ATSC/OTA)
Not knowing if your cable provider encrypts all the channels, I would pull a CC out of one tuner and rescan. You have nothing to lose but a rented cable-card. Isn't this fun????
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post #1465 of 2108 Old 05-17-2013, 02:11 PM
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Not knowing if your cable provider encrypts all the channels, I would pull a CC out of one tuner and rescan. You have nothing to lose but a rented cable-card. Isn't this fun????

Well, everything seems to be working still. I have not installed the Dual yet though. I was planning on doing that today, but I decided to let it ride and see if we even need it. If somebody starts getting missed recordings due to tuners not being available, I'll go ahead and install it. The only issue I've noticed so far is the E channel is coming in either pixelated or not at all (no signal). But I'm getting this on both Primes, which are on different feeds, so I'm suspecting its an issue with the cable co.

Btw, I don't think Charter goes crazy encrypting everything like TW, at least not yet!
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post #1466 of 2108 Old 05-19-2013, 08:23 AM
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anyone have any idea when the 4 tuner model is supposed to be released?
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post #1467 of 2108 Old 05-19-2013, 10:20 AM
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anyone have any idea when the 4 tuner model is supposed to be released?

Haven't heard anything new, so still "Summer 2013." My money is on a cable labs hold up somewhere. It'll probably just be released like the iTV6 was, no heads up before (at least I don't remember seeing any heads up)
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post #1468 of 2108 Old 05-21-2013, 03:33 PM
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So as expected it looks like the Xbox One won't be a media extender. Is watching encrypted cable via an HTPC dead? I'm kind of starting to regret my HD Homerun Prime purchase.
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post #1469 of 2108 Old 05-21-2013, 03:35 PM
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So as expected it looks like the Xbox One won't be a media extender. Is watching encrypted cable via an HTPC dead? I'm kind of starting to regret my HD Homerun Prime purchase.

What?

I do this every single day and don't regret my Prime one bit. It already paid for itself six months ago and it is all gravy now.

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post #1470 of 2108 Old 05-21-2013, 03:36 PM
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Yes, it's dead. I'll give you $50 for your HDHomeRun Prime. wink.gif
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