Fatal error problem with Crucial M4 SSDs being reported - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 2Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 12:41 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
Vlad Theimpaler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 804
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 33
Hey all,

Just today, I read that Crucial M4 SSD users are reporting that the drive is failing at around 5200 power on hours (POH). The failure causes the host system (running Windows) to blue screen. The BSOD shows error code 0x000000f4. From what I've been reading, this problem is not firmware dependent (updating the firmware does not provide recovery from this error, nor does having the latest firmware prevent the error from occuring), and it probably affects all M4 products since 64GB, 128GB, and 256GB users have been reporting it.

The main source of the information above is from this thread on Crucial's web forum (started on 12/13/11 with 142 posts to date):
http://forums.crucial.com/t5/Solid-S...4GB/td-p/76392

I thought I'd start a thread in this forum, as I'm sure some folks here are using the Crucial M4 in their HTPCs, and they may be affected by this issue. Maybe those folks should check their POH status, and maybe start getting their data backed up before the failure crops up.

Not trying to spread FUD, this seems legit.

Vlad Theimpaler is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 12:51 PM
Senior Member
 
wiggindude's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Houston
Posts: 307
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vlad Theimpaler View Post

Hey all,

Just today, I read that Crucial M4 SSD users are reporting that the drive is failing at around 5200 power on hours (POH). The failure causes the host system (running Windows) to blue screen. The BSOD shows error code 0x00000f4. From what I've been reading, this problem is not firmware dependent (updating the firmware does not provide recovery from this error, nor does having the latest firmware prevent the error from occuring), and it probably affects all M4 products since 64GB, 128GB, and 256GB users are reporting it.

The main source of the information above is from this thread on Crucial's web forum (started on 12/13/11 with 142 posts to date):
http://forums.crucial.com/t5/Solid-S...4GB/td-p/76392

I thought I'd start a thread in this forum, as I'm sure some folks here are using the Crucial M4 in their HTPCs, and they may be affected by this issue. Maybe those folks should check their POH status, and maybe start getting their data backed up before the failure crops up.

Not trying to spread FUD, this seems legit.

I got this as a Christmas gift and it's running in my pc. My coworker kept asking me how my drive is doing and if it has any BSOD and I thougth it was kinda weird that he kept asking me about it, maybe this is why.

Since I got this as a gift, any idea on how the warranty works?
wiggindude is offline  
post #3 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 12:57 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
Vlad Theimpaler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 804
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiggindude View Post

I got this as a Christmas gift and it's running in my pc. My coworker kept asking me how my drive is doing and if it has any BSOD and I thougth it was kinda weird that he kept asking me about it, maybe this is why.

Since I got this as a gift, any idea on how the warranty works?

The drive has a 3 year warranty. You can probably return to the retailer if you are within their return window (Christmas being not that long ago). But beyond that, you'll have to RMA your defective product with Crucial (which folks seem to be doing, according to the posts in the link I posted earlier).

*Edit* @wiggindude: If possible, you may want to request the purchase receipt from the person who gave you the M4 for Christmas to eliminate any return or RMA hassle.

Vlad Theimpaler is offline  
post #4 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 01:04 PM
Advanced Member
 
AVTechMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: The State of Michigan
Posts: 633
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 36
This is not good as i had planned to get the 64GB version of the ssd.
AVTechMan is offline  
post #5 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 01:07 PM
Member
 
jbilliel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 99
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I just bought one today! Doh!
jbilliel is offline  
post #6 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 01:10 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
Vlad Theimpaler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 804
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVTechMan View Post

This is not good as i had planned to get the 64GB version of the ssd.

I built a system for a friend using the 64GB M4 back in September, so I'll need to disclose the problem to him.

Then I bought one from Newegg earlier this week, and it's currently being shipped... thinking of refusing the delivery.

Vlad Theimpaler is offline  
post #7 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 01:17 PM
AVS Special Member
 
digital desire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Syracuse
Posts: 1,082
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Shoot. 216 days. I have about 150 more to go.

Lot's of low rent stuff stacked up into a medium rent pile.
digital desire is offline  
post #8 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 01:21 PM
AVS Special Member
 
digital desire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Syracuse
Posts: 1,082
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
What is POH? Power on? How to check?

Lot's of low rent stuff stacked up into a medium rent pile.
digital desire is offline  
post #9 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 01:23 PM
AVS Special Member
 
chad473's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Comcast-Lancaster, PA
Posts: 2,269
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
was just about to purchase one of these for my build. Will probably go with something else just to be safe.

xbox live/PSN: Chad473
chad473 is offline  
post #10 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 01:24 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Zon2020's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,716
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 28
Is there any notion that this is a Crucial-specific problem? Or is it perhaps endemic to all ssds using either the Micron NAND chips or the Marvell 9174 controller or both? I think the Intel 510 series use both, and several others including the Plextor M2 and M3 series use a slightly different version of the Marvell 9174 (although Plextor uses Toshiba NAND chips).

Is there any more info regarding the actual source of the problem?

Let's see. The Marvell based Crucials have problems, the Sandforce based OCZ have problems. I guess that leaves Samsungs.

If you need a 64gb, Newegg has the Samsung 830 series right now for $99.
Zon2020 is offline  
post #11 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 01:35 PM
Advanced Member
 
AVTechMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: The State of Michigan
Posts: 633
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zon2020 View Post

Is there any notion that this is a Crucial-specific problem? Or is it perhaps endemic to all ssds using either the Micron NAND chips or the Marvell 9174 controller or both? I think the Intel 510 series use both, and several others including the Plextor M2 and M3 series use a slightly different version of the Marvell 9174 (although Plextor uses Toshiba NAND chips).

Is there any more info regarding the actual source of the problem?

Let's see. The Marvell based Crucials have problems, the Sandforce based OCZ have problems. I guess that leaves Samsungs.

If you need a 64gb, Newegg has the Samsung 830 series right now for $99.

Is that with an additional coupon? Says $109 currently on Newegg. Otherwise ill get a laptop drive..less chances of sudden failure down the line.
AVTechMan is offline  
post #12 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 01:50 PM
AVS Special Member
 
digital desire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Syracuse
Posts: 1,082
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by digital desire View Post

What is POH? Power on? How to check?

Downloaded:
http://crystalmark.info/software/Cry...o/index-e.html
I am at 1642 hours.

Without reading that entire thread, is *everyone* seeing a failure at 5200 hours, i.e., a ticking timebomb with the fuse lit? Damn. Feel like I just bought a late model TDI! (Oh wait. btdt.)

Lot's of low rent stuff stacked up into a medium rent pile.
digital desire is offline  
post #13 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 01:50 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Zon2020's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,716
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVTechMan View Post

Is that with an additional coupon? Says $109 currently on Newegg. Otherwise ill get a laptop drive..less chances of sudden failure down the line.

Are you signed up for their emails? There was a promo code in their Storage Sale email this morning, which I already deleted, sorry.
Zon2020 is offline  
post #14 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 01:54 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Zon2020's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,716
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by digital desire View Post

Downloaded:
http://crystalmark.info/software/Cry...o/index-e.html
I am at 1642 hours.

Without reading that entire thread, is *everyone* seeing a failure at 5200 hours, i.e., a ticking timebomb with the fuse lit? Damn. Feel like I just bought a late model TDI! (Oh wait. btdt.)

Just from scanning the posts, it looks like the answer is "no" and that some people are having the problem much earlier. It looks like Crucial wants people to RMA their drives that have failed so they can get some that have failed to test. Looks like they have no idea what's wrong.
Zon2020 is offline  
post #15 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 01:59 PM
AVS Special Member
 
chad473's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Comcast-Lancaster, PA
Posts: 2,269
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zon2020 View Post

Are you signed up for their emails? There was a promo code in their Storage Sale email this morning, which I already deleted, sorry.

thanks for the tip. I dug mine out of the trash. I'm not sure if it's kosher to post those codes in here or not, but if anyone is interested just pm. I assume they aren't personalized, correct? I definitely plan on using it.

xbox live/PSN: Chad473
chad473 is offline  
post #16 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 02:15 PM
Advanced Member
 
AVTechMan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: The State of Michigan
Posts: 633
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 36
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zon2020 View Post


Are you signed up for their emails? There was a promo code in their Storage Sale email this morning, which I already deleted, sorry.

I did get an email from them earlier this week but only had the code for the crucial, not the samsung model.
AVTechMan is offline  
post #17 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 02:21 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Zon2020's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,716
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by chad473 View Post

thanks for the tip. I dug mine out of the trash. I'm not sure if it's kosher to post those codes in here or not, but if anyone is interested just pm. I assume they aren't personalized, correct? I definitely plan on using it.

BTW, in the 60-64gb range, Amazon has several OCZ, and an AData for under $100, and several more for between $100-105. They also have a Corsair Nova Series 2 60 GB SATA II for $85.

I don't know anything about any of these models, but for people looking for under $100 ssds, there are lots of choices.

Then again, the Samsung gets good reviews, is SATA III, and uses both Samsung memory and a Samsung controller and the 830 is a new generation model. I have a couple of Samsung 470 models that have been fine. But of course, the M4 also has good reviews and has been fine for lots of people, so I guess we never know.

EDIT: That Corsair Nova actually also has a $10 rebate, taking the price down to $75.
Zon2020 is offline  
post #18 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 02:24 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Zon2020's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,716
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by AVTechMan View Post

I did get an email from them earlier this week but only had the code for the crucial, not the samsung model.

I usually get two emails each day, one with the Shell Shocker deals, and one with the other daily promotions. Didn't you get a storage sale email today? I think it had three or four SSDs of various makes and sizes.
Zon2020 is offline  
post #19 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 02:26 PM
AVS Special Member
 
chad473's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Comcast-Lancaster, PA
Posts: 2,269
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zon2020 View Post

BTW, in the 60-64gb range, Amazon has several OCZ, and an AData for under $100, and several more for between $100-105. They also have a Corsair Nova Series 2 60 GB SATA II for $85.

I don't know anything about any of these models, but for people looking for under $100 ssds, there are lots of choices.

Then again, the Samsung gets good reviews, is SATA III, and uses both Samsung memory and a Samsung controller and the 830 is a new generation model. I have a couple of Samsung 470 models that have been fine. But of course, the M4 also has good reviews and has been fine for lots of people, so I guess we never know.

true, thanks for all the advice. I think I'm just going to go with the samsung. hopefully it's not a major issue with the m4's, but it would always be on my mind if I purchased one now.

xbox live/PSN: Chad473
chad473 is offline  
post #20 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 02:45 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
Vlad Theimpaler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 804
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 33
Just thought I'd post this update. A Crucial employee has posted "the official word" from Crucial regarding this problem. It appears as post #147 in the Crucial forum thread. Here's a direct link to that post:

http://forum.crucial.com/t5/Solid-St...p/79094#M24083

The post says this:


Quote:
We are aware of an issue that is currently affecting a small number of users whereby their m4 causes their system to require a restart. This issue occurs after approximately 5,000 hours of actual “on time” use. Following the initial reboot, the system then requires subsequent restarts after each additional hour of use. However, the data on the SSD is unaffected and will not be lost due to this condition.

Through our investigation, we have determined the root cause of the problem and will be releasing a firmware update that rectifies the situation. We are currently running through our validation and compatibility process. Once this process is complete, the firmware will be made available to our customers. Although we understand the desire of some people to start using unreleased firmware now, we want to ensure that our solution works across multiple chipsets, systems, and operating systems before publishing the release code. We are currently targeting the week of January 16th, 2012 to publicly release the new firmware update.

We understand the impact that this is having on some users right now and apologize for this inconvenience. We appreciate your continued support, feedback, and patience as we finalize code and resolve this issue.

Dude, Crucial Employee, US


Personally, this helps to restore confidence in my previous purchases. I think this incident will be resolved before long.

Vlad Theimpaler is offline  
post #21 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 02:53 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
assassin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 12,961
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 50 Post(s)
Liked: 241
Eh. No different than any other drive. Remember the horrible Deskstars? Or even my beloved Samsung F4 2tb firmware update from 2010 models?

I still like Crucial. The fact that they a)admitted there was actually a problem and b)are offering a fix makes me like them even more.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

assassin is offline  
post #22 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 03:00 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
Vlad Theimpaler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 804
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by assassin View Post

I still like Crucial. The fact that they a)admitted there was actually a problem and b)are offering a fix makes me like them even more.

Me too... they surely appreciate the value of their good reputation in the SSD market, and are striving to maintain it

Vlad Theimpaler is offline  
post #23 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 06:27 PM
AVS Special Member
 
bryansj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 6,288
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 47 Post(s)
Liked: 177
So is it possible to update the firmware on these drives without having to reinstall everything?

bryansj is offline  
post #24 of 67 Old 01-05-2012, 06:36 PM - Thread Starter
Advanced Member
 
Vlad Theimpaler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 804
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by bryansj View Post

So is it possible to update the firmware on these drives without having to reinstall everything?

From the Firmware Update Guide issued by Crucial for their last update of the M4 series firmware (Rev. 0009):

Quote:


WARNING: As with all firmware updates, it is strongly recommended that you backup or make copies of all important files (and passwords) before performing this update. This firmware update process is done entirely at your own risk. If performed correctly, there will be no loss of system or user data on the drive. However, if the firmware process is interrupted for any reason, your solid state drive may not function properly.

Source:
http://edge.crucial.com/firmware/m4/...0009_08-11.pdf

*Edit* The guide lists a few requirements. One of them is that the SATA controller of the mobo must be set to IDE, not AHCI, for the update program to work.

Vlad Theimpaler is offline  
post #25 of 67 Old 01-06-2012, 05:59 AM
AVS Special Member
 
bryansj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 6,288
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 47 Post(s)
Liked: 177
Well, looks like I've got to lose all my data to prevent losing all my data since I'm in AHCI mode.

bryansj is offline  
post #26 of 67 Old 01-06-2012, 07:39 AM
Member
 
headcase151's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: K.C.MO.
Posts: 162
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Just change to IDE,in bios.Update and,change back to AHCI.I did 3 drives when firmware 0009 came out.No data loss.
headcase151 is online now  
post #27 of 67 Old 01-13-2012, 09:24 PM
Advanced Member
 
tomandbeth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 723
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 15
Came across this thread while I await my new drive:

This problem is reported to be fixed by Firmware 0309, released 13 Jan 2012. Your choice of using a USB or optical formatted as a boot disk.

Hope this helps.

http://www.storagereview.com/crucial...r_bug_released
tomandbeth is offline  
post #28 of 67 Old 01-14-2012, 08:07 AM
AVS Special Member
 
bryansj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 6,288
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 47 Post(s)
Liked: 177
Updated with no issues. Switched to IDE mode, booted from CD, updated, switched back from IDE mode. Windows needed to restart due to finding "new" hardware.

bryansj is offline  
post #29 of 67 Old 01-14-2012, 09:21 AM
Member
 
lwong180's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: SF
Posts: 25
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
why would you switch to IDE mode first?
lwong180 is offline  
post #30 of 67 Old 01-14-2012, 09:25 AM
Member
 
ckensto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 148
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
See above. Update only works in IDE mode.
ckensto is offline  
Reply Home Theater Computers

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off