Official Ceton Echo Extender Info Thread - Page 58 - AVS Forum
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post #1711 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 03:17 PM
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To me, Ceton is trying a beta - they probably want to get some outside results prior to actually saying it officially supports anything hence the vaugeness; makes sense to me, anyways.

On the whole MKV "support" - does it have to truly support MKV from the stanpoint that it plays MKVs natively vs. split at the PC end? I don't remember if the xbox really "supports" MKVs, but it plays them just fine (high bit rates is a different matter altogether), but I think semantics are coming into play regarding what it "supports" vs. what it will play. The specs do say h.264...
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post #1712 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 04:12 PM
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The problem with "It supports h.264" is that they don't list the bit rate. The xbox can handle ~20 mb/sec but much higher and forget it. We'll see soon enough. I am Sammy is going to test that for us real well. I plan to when I get mine.

BTW Sammy I asked the folder question many times with Stanger as well. He filled me in on HBR MKV's. Somewhere back ~pg 30 or so IIRC.

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post #1713 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 04:26 PM
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True MKV support or not, i'm going to get at least 3 of these Echo "at Sale price". Dealing with Ceton support at first hand i'm confident that they tried to support every format on the market existing today. But probably they didn't see MS and "friends" coming and asking unreasonable license fee to get that support.
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post #1714 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 04:31 PM
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Sky- Right, which makes testing a max bit rate a great use case for beta which is probably the exact reason they don't state it smile.gif. But yes here's hoping it works on really high ones!

Gabriel - agreed, I'll definately be purchasing 4 or 5...
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post #1715 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 04:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skybolt View Post

The problem with "It supports h.264" is that they don't list the bit rate. The xbox can handle ~20 mb/sec but much higher and forget it. We'll see soon enough. I am Sammy is going to test that for us real well. I plan to when I get mine.
BTW Sammy I asked the folder question many times with Stanger as well. He filled me in on HBR MKV's. Somewhere back ~pg 30 or so IIRC.

Is the xBox you were usingig LAN? That may have something to do with it?

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post #1716 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 04:51 PM
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gigabit ethernet has nothing to do with it. the hd300 has fast ethernet and plays bds perfectly.

you only need about 50 mbps max for bd streams.
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post #1717 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 05:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gabrielcab View Post

True MKV support or not, i'm going to get at least 3 of these Echo "at Sale price". Dealing with Ceton support at first hand i'm confident that they tried to support every format on the market existing today. But probably they didn't see MS and "friends" coming and asking unreasonable license fee to get that support.

Probably the only place where license fees are getting in the way is DTS support, and I bet the hold up there is Ceton is trying to negotiate a deal on the license. As far I know, there are no license issues with supporting any of the container formats, including VOB/folder structures, MKV, mp4, etc., or subtitles. I'm not sure how Microsoft does licensing for WMV9, but I wouldn't expect much, if any, difference in licensing fees to support VC-1.

By the way, I just noticed the Echo doesn't seem to support AAC audio... That's not good...
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post #1718 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 05:30 PM
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Yes, Lan. I would not waste my time on expecting wireless to support 30 mb/sec. As I posted earlier, the xbox networking basically sucks. So there is a good chance that the Echo will do better.

BTW, I plan on getting at least 4 myself.

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post #1719 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 05:43 PM
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That is true. Optimized switches and routing can help too.

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post #1720 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 06:21 PM
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At this point I really don't see any benefits for SageTV users to switch or am I missing something?
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post #1721 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 06:27 PM
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Probably so long as the h/w holds out and they're not dealing with copy-protected CableTV.

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post #1722 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 06:40 PM
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Originally Posted by nebulink View Post

At this point I really don't see any benefits for SageTV users to switch or am I missing something?
SageTV can't do any sort of CableCARD-protected content, so there's that. That's essentially why I want an Echo, though I'd like it to have a DVD drive. I suppose that's what the USB port is for! I don't need any fancy audio on the extender; even my main viewing area uses the speakers on the ~9-year-old TV, and none of my TVs are higher than 720p.

Also, does anybody know if the Echo can be VESA mounted to the back of the TV?
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post #1723 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 07:40 PM
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I have 5 XBOX 360 units in my house. The new slim models are much quieter. I just saw the start of the shopping season price drop rumors. Best Buy XBOX 360 4GB for $199 and get a $100 Gift card, making it $99.00. Gamestop is lowering the 250GB model by $50 and expected to do the same on the 4GB version. I am am sure we will see someone do $99.00 on Black Friday.

Yes, I am hoping like the rest that the Echo would have been an all in one solution instead of a 360 & Popcorn Hour that streams Blu-Ray .iso in my bedroom...................... I have a 40TB server that currently has over 700 Blu-Ray iso files. I am not converting them to anything else. My theater has a HTPC and that will stay. I need the best picture quality I can get on my screen size.

I still want to get the Echo and see what she can do. It may be able to do more than we think at the moment or in the future. I would assume it is a touchy area for a U.S. company to announce that a product openly streams Blu-Ray iso files or certain other files.

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post #1724 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 08:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nebulink View Post

At this point I really don't see any benefits for SageTV users to switch or am I missing something?

Not missing anything. I never got HD working with satellite before I switched to cable. And them Cable co. turned flags on with my CableCard. So my only option at that point was/is 7MC. So now I use 7MC for recording/Live Tv, and Sage for Ripped content. I am really looking for an HD300 replacement for 7MC.

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post #1725 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 10:12 PM
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So the main reason to get an Xbox is to stream Blu Ray ISOs? Assuming you want to get it only for an extender?

Actually I've heard rumors that the next ten Xbox may come in two different SKUs, including a real low-end cheaper one which is more designed as set top box for media. May play games but for optimal gaming, you'd go with the high-end SKU.
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post #1726 of 7721 Old 10-13-2012, 10:35 PM
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Originally Posted by Venomnusss View Post

I would assume it is a touchy area for a U.S. company to announce that a product openly streams Blu-Ray iso files or certain other files.

Doesn't Western Digital do that with their media streamers?
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post #1727 of 7721 Old 10-14-2012, 04:22 AM
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Originally Posted by reggie14 View Post

Doesn't Western Digital do that with their media streamers?


I don't think that Western Digital would come out in a print advertisement and make the statement that they can play a Blu-ray .iso, They have everything listed in the specs and we know what we are looking for. I think by openly acknowledging that you can stream a Blu-Ray iso is kind of saying F**K You to the Blu-Ray format and all it's DRM. Sometimes it's not in the best interest for a company that will do business with the companies associated with Blu-Ray to say something like that. Licensing audio & video formats is one thing, but............

Now here comes the Echo... The big difference.... a Microsoft Media Center extender not just a streamer. If I am not mistaken Microsoft owns some of the video codecs as well as some of the DRM for Blu-ray. Something tells me that if Microsoft licensed a product that allowed you to circumvent putting an actual Blu-Ray disc in a player utilizing Media Center... that might be an issue. Does Blu-Ray want to be paying lots of royalties to a company ( Microsoft ) that is helping the consumer somewhat circumvent it's DRM and business plan.
The intent of the Ceton Q was probably to allow putting a Blu-ray disc in and streaming it to the Echo extenders and possibly allowing for Blu-ray .iso playback through the Echo as well. Now the Q seems to be cancelled at this time due to issues with Microsoft if I am not mistaken.

I am sure someone on this site knows much more than me on this and can chime in. Maybe I am completely wrong.

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post #1728 of 7721 Old 10-14-2012, 05:16 AM
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The Q is delayed due to issues with Microsoft not supporting WMC in the long term. I wondered why this isn't also an issue with the Echo.

One common way to get around codec licensing or related distribution issues is to give the user the ability to load codecs/plugins and provide them separately.
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post #1729 of 7721 Old 10-14-2012, 05:26 AM
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Originally Posted by pittsoccer33 View Post

So are we to assume DTS's press release was premature?
http://www.engadget.com/2012/04/16/cetons-echo-extender-for-media-center-will-be-the-first-to-supp/

Ceton has integrated DTS audio technology into the upcoming Ceton Echo, a next-generation Windows Media Center Extender, to offer consumers an immersive, high-definition sound experience.

It's hard to see DTS support not coming by release after this official announcement. Otherwise, talk about an embarrassing 'oops'...
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post #1730 of 7721 Old 10-14-2012, 07:34 AM
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Originally Posted by DanPackMan View Post

The Q is delayed due to issues with Microsoft not supporting WMC in the long term. I wondered why this isn't also an issue with the Echo.
One common way to get around codec licensing or related distribution issues is to give the user the ability to load codecs/plugins and provide them separately.

The Q was shelved due to WMC support in Windows Embedded being unknown going into the future. The Echo, however, works with any WMC installation, so it should have a pretty solid run.
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post #1731 of 7721 Old 10-14-2012, 08:22 AM
 
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Anyone receive their hardware yet? I am honestly getting tired of mere speculation and want real world info...
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post #1732 of 7721 Old 10-14-2012, 08:37 AM
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Mine shipped on Friday so I don't think I'll see it until Tuesday at the very earliest.

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post #1733 of 7721 Old 10-14-2012, 08:48 AM
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You know what would be great? Having something like a USB authenticator to allow you to use your own computer with WMC, but access all your content from a server as if your PC is an extender.

Off-topic again, sorry.
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post #1734 of 7721 Old 10-14-2012, 08:56 AM
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^^ You mean boot the Echo from a USB stick as if it were another computer but use it as an extender? I'm not clear what you mean here.

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post #1735 of 7721 Old 10-14-2012, 09:09 AM
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Originally Posted by Sammy2 View Post

^^ You mean boot the Echo from a USB stick as if it were another computer but use it as an extender? I'm not clear what you mean here.
Nah, not even related to the Echo at all.

Just like an authenticator that would allow you to access everything, including CableCARD protected content, on your home server, so you don't need to have locally saved recordings (and dedicated tuners) or buy a separate extender just to watch TV in, say, your home office.
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post #1736 of 7721 Old 10-14-2012, 09:23 AM
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You can do that now with the Prime... well except for network saved copy-protected recordings.

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post #1737 of 7721 Old 10-14-2012, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ImThat1Guy View Post

Nah, not even related to the Echo at all.
Just like an authenticator that would allow you to access everything, including CableCARD protected content, on your home server, so you don't need to have locally saved recordings (and dedicated tuners) or buy a separate extender just to watch TV in, say, your home office.

You're asking for Softsled.

See what an anamorphoscopic lens can do,
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post #1738 of 7721 Old 10-14-2012, 12:00 PM
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http://softsled.codeplex.com/

Which hasn't really gone anywhere ...

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post #1739 of 7721 Old 10-14-2012, 12:13 PM
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That's not exactly what I was getting at. The "rumor" is that Microsoft has an internal version of their Media Center Extender that runs on a normal PC/windows, essentially a PC Windows Media Center client/extender, which they use for testing extender functionality. However this software has never been released to the public. This is exactly what ImThat1Guy is describing.

See what an anamorphoscopic lens can do,
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post #1740 of 7721 Old 10-14-2012, 01:12 PM
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Originally Posted by stanger89 View Post

That's not exactly what I was getting at. The "rumor" is that Microsoft has an internal version of their Media Center Extender that runs on a normal PC/windows, essentially a PC Windows Media Center client/extender, which they use for testing extender functionality. However this software has never been released to the public. This is exactly what ImThat1Guy is describing.

Which is internally known as SoftSled. The linked SoftSled project is the same idea, but an attempt to create it from scratch.
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