Pixel Format & Dynamic Range Settings Within Catalyst Control Center - AVS Forum
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Old 07-30-2012, 08:36 AM - Thread Starter
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Hey everyone, quick question in regards to Pixel Format and Dynamic Range settings...

Running HTPC into a Samsung 50" plasma via HDMI.

Should I set my Dynamic Range to Full (0-255) or Limited (16-235)?

Should I set my Pixel Format to:

  1. YcbCr 4:4:4 Pixel Format
  2. YCbCr 4:2:2 Pixel Format
  3. RGB 4:4:4 Pixel Format Studio (Limited RGB)
  4. RGB 4:4:4 Pixel Format PC Standard (Full RGB)

Thanks!

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Old 08-02-2012, 06:14 AM
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+1
interested too.
Is the limited or full range setting to be done on both the video driver and the player, and is it dependent on the display and the connection? never quite understood this whole thing.

note: the post above is my opinion. as such, when reading any recommendations from me, please do you research and seek out other recommendations and make up your own mind on your next course of action. i mean, most reasonable adults should know that, but it seems this should be stated anyways.
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Old 08-02-2012, 06:35 AM
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I've never really found a straight answer, and I think it depends on your TV and the HTPC software you're running. I think your best bet is trying each and see what works. Choosing the wrong pixel format settings usually leads to picture looking washed out, black crush, or colors looking slightly off.
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Old 08-02-2012, 08:47 AM
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It depends on what your TV supports. I have a Sony XBR flat screen which supports fulls RGB so I go into the HDMI settings on my TV and se dynamic range to full and then I change the setting to full RGB in Catalyst. This allows for full RGB when watching any material through my media center.

I also have my TV professionally calibrated and all color and brightness were perfect, not washed out or anything else abnormal due to using this configuration.

I think its a matter of preference, some people say not to use RGB because Blu Ray content was not designed for it etc... I think it looks better in full RGB...
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Old 08-02-2012, 09:12 AM
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Never was able to find if the Sony KDL40EX523 is capable of full or limited. Lower end tv so wouldnt expect to find much info.
I will try full anyways and see what happens.
Oh how i miss my Kuro Elite 111.

note: the post above is my opinion. as such, when reading any recommendations from me, please do you research and seek out other recommendations and make up your own mind on your next course of action. i mean, most reasonable adults should know that, but it seems this should be stated anyways.
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Old 08-02-2012, 11:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lockdown571 View Post

I've never really found a straight answer, and I think it depends on your TV and the HTPC software you're running. I think your best bet is trying each and see what works. Choosing the wrong pixel format settings usually leads to picture looking washed out, black crush, or colors looking slightly off.

Thanks lockdown!

I did some experimentation last night and found that setting Full RGB within Vision made an immediate difference in relation to stuff on the Windows desktop - text was much more clear and I was able to undo all of the overscanning stuff I had initially setup.

For good measure, I also configured FFDSHOW to output Full RGB.

I didn't have time to watch any content though - that'll be tonight's project.

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Old 08-02-2012, 11:13 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moshster View Post

It depends on what your TV supports. I have a Sony XBR flat screen which supports fulls RGB so I go into the HDMI settings on my TV and se dynamic range to full and then I change the setting to full RGB in Catalyst. This allows for full RGB when watching any material through my media center.
I also have my TV professionally calibrated and all color and brightness were perfect, not washed out or anything else abnormal due to using this configuration.
I think its a matter of preference, some people say not to use RGB because Blu Ray content was not designed for it etc... I think it looks better in full RGB...

No doubt, just finding what the TV supports can be tough.

As far as calibration goes, I calibrated via the AVS calibration DVD MP4 file last year, just the basic stuff, took about an hour or so.

I turned off all of the extraneous stuff in Vision and FFDSHOW (dynamic contrast, brightness, flesh tone correct, etc) and calibrated right at the source (HDMI 1 for my HTPC)...unreal at the difference in picture quality that it made.

I'll probably recalibrate tonight now that I set Vision and FFDSHOW to output Full RGB.

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Old 08-02-2012, 12:36 PM
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I'm hardly an expert but here's what I've found.

If you're running multiple inputs (e.g. cable box, roku, BD or DVD player) through your AVR as well as your HTPC then set the TV to 16-235 (usually the standard) and set your HTPC to 3.RGB 4:4:4 Pixel Format Studio (Limited RGB). All the other boxes will expect 16-235 (limited) so putting your TV to 0-255 will throw all your other components off even though it is best for the HTPC.

RGB 4:4:4 Pixel Format PC Standard (Full RGB) is best for an HTPC so if you can avoid the problem above then go for it. Just make sure your TV (and AVR if necessary) can accept 0-255 Full RGB.

On my particular setup I cannot see any difference between YcbCr 4:4:4 Pixel Format and RGB 4:4:4 Pixel Format Studio (Limited RGB). YCbCr 4:2:2 Pixel Format looks bad to me for some reason but I can't quite put my finger on what exactly is wrong with the picture.

I've also found that the commerical BD/DVD players (PDVD and TMT) deal with the color format differently and it's practically impossible to get BD and DVD .iso or disk right and files played back via another player with the same settings. The closest I could come with with YcbCr 4:4:4 Pixel Format.

I do know that when playing a video the color space used internally in the PC is RGB. It doesn't really make sense to have your graphics card change the color space back to YCbCr if your TV accepts RGB. It's an unnecessary conversion best avoided if possible.

All in all it depends on your TV, your AVR if being used for pass-through, what other components you have hooked to the TV/AVR and what playback software you're using. But, IMO limited 16-235 is pretty much the video standard so keeping your HTPC output at that may be for the best.
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Old 08-02-2012, 04:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JMGNYC View Post

I'm hardly an expert but here's what I've found.
If you're running multiple inputs (e.g. cable box, roku, BD or DVD player) through your AVR as well as your HTPC then set the TV to 16-235 (usually the standard) and set your HTPC to 3.RGB 4:4:4 Pixel Format Studio (Limited RGB). All the other boxes will expect 16-235 (limited) so putting your TV to 0-255 will throw all your other components off even though it is best for the HTPC.
RGB 4:4:4 Pixel Format PC Standard (Full RGB) is best for an HTPC so if you can avoid the problem above then go for it. Just make sure your TV (and AVR if necessary) can accept 0-255 Full RGB.
On my particular setup I cannot see any difference between YcbCr 4:4:4 Pixel Format and RGB 4:4:4 Pixel Format Studio (Limited RGB). YCbCr 4:2:2 Pixel Format looks bad to me for some reason but I can't quite put my finger on what exactly is wrong with the picture.
I've also found that the commerical BD/DVD players (PDVD and TMT) deal with the color format differently and it's practically impossible to get BD and DVD .iso or disk right and files played back via another player with the same settings. The closest I could come with with YcbCr 4:4:4 Pixel Format.
I do know that when playing a video the color space used internally in the PC is RGB. It doesn't really make sense to have your graphics card change the color space back to YCbCr if your TV accepts RGB. It's an unnecessary conversion best avoided if possible.
All in all it depends on your TV, your AVR if being used for pass-through, what other components you have hooked to the TV/AVR and what playback software you're using. But, IMO limited 16-235 is pretty much the video standard so keeping your HTPC output at that may be for the best.

Seriously, that is an excellent explanation, thx much!

RGB 4:4:4 Pixel Format PC Standard (Full RGB) is best for an HTPC so if you can avoid the problem above then go for it. Just make sure your TV (and AVR if necessary) can accept 0-255 Full RGB. <-- Yeah, I've been searching for a week now every day to see if the TV can accept native RGB Full. I've seen some posts out there that say things like "If the input your

I guess what I'm really going to have to do is calibrate the AVS 709 MP4 file against Full RGB, YcbCr 4:4:4 and YCbCr 4:2:2 to see what get's clipped, crushed etc.

Luckily I'm not using an AVR, just straight into the TV.

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Old 08-13-2012, 01:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Update

The official word from Samsung Technical Support IRT to their TVs:

"Yes, our units support Full RGB, and you must use HDMI port 1, label HDMI port 1 as "PC" and use an HDMI cable, not a DVI to HDMI cable".

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