z77 vs h77 - seems to be lack of knowledge within some recommendations - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 11 Old 09-28-2012, 09:25 AM - Thread Starter
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For the current intel chipset (panther point), there seems to plenty of baseless recommendations being thrown around.

Example recommendation thread
  • OP - Planning on an i3 build
  • Rec - Microcenter can't be beat, current i3 3225 and z77 combo for $185
  • Next - Don't use z77, go with this $70-$90 H77 for HTPC biggrin.gif

Why is this? Since z77 is associated with it's increased overclocking potential, many think that's all it can be used for. Why go with an h77 over a z77 at the same price or pay more for an h77?

A little background on the Platform Controller Hub
  • Microchip included in all intel compatible motherboard since 5 series
  • Controls memory allocation, pci instructions, etc
  • Think of it as the assembly block between the CPU and the other components
See wiki for more info.

For those interested, a decent comparison table between intel chipsets can be found here. Notice Cougar Point has a TDP of 6.1W while Panther Point uses 6.7W, but that cannot account for the potential savings by bringing memory and pci into the chipset.

Now for the part that makes more sense . . . The uk.hardware.info site did a couple of different motherboard comparison tests for power usage. Here are some H77 and Z77 results, I'll just link right to the power consumption. Here is the Z77, but the more interesting chart is within the h77 roundup.

Here is the H77, and it includes the z77 results (H series are red bars, Z is blue)

Notice the lowest power consumption at idle actually comes from a Gigabyte Z77MX-D3H at 24W

The H77 version of that board uses more power at idle, consuming 26.4W


It would also be worth noting, that as z77 is typically the higher end board it would usually come with higher quality capacitors (longer life span).This is my reasoning for why I'd never pick H over Z unless there was a reasonable price advantage, and I'd definitely never pay more to avoid the Z boards
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post #2 of 11 Old 09-28-2012, 10:03 AM
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Thanks for the info, but it looks like H77 and Z77 are both Panther Point and have the same TDP. Furthermore, your links show many benchmarks where the H77 version of a board consumes less power than the Z77 version. Your example was just one case. In any case the difference is small, and there doesn't seem to be any general advantage for Z77 in power consumption. As for capacitors, I was under the impression that most all motherboards are solid capacitors now and that Z77 wouldn't be different from H77 in that regard.

I don't see any reason to pay more for Z77 if you are not overclocking. If they are the same price then there is no harm in it, but it seems that H77 are generally 20 to 30 dollars cheaper.
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post #3 of 11 Old 09-28-2012, 10:16 AM
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I recently got a z77 board for a server type build, but only because it was a good deal with RAM combo. I think with various sale prices these days, z77 can be had for similar prices as the h77. So the idea of going h77 to save money is less an issue, and either board can probably work fine. Although my HTPCs all have H61 boards which have worked great - my last H61 was purchased for $15 after rebate. smile.gif
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post #4 of 11 Old 09-28-2012, 12:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beetlesnack View Post

Thanks for the info, but it looks like H77 and Z77 are both Panther Point and have the same TDP. Furthermore, your links show many benchmarks where the H77 version of a board consumes less power than the Z77 version. Your example was just one case. In any case the difference is small, and there doesn't seem to be any general advantage for Z77 in power consumption. As for capacitors, I was under the impression that most all motherboards are solid capacitors now and that Z77 wouldn't be different from H77 in that regard.
I don't see any reason to pay more for Z77 if you are not overclocking. If they are the same price then there is no harm in it, but it seems that H77 are generally 20 to 30 dollars cheaper.

Any intel compatible board with the seven following the letter (X7X) is Panther Point. That's the point I was making

The links do not show a single example of an H77 consuming less power at idle, but there are several that are the same power draw

I do not intend to suggest the z77 is more advantageous when used without a k-processor, but I did intend to demonstrate that it should never be avoided due to the misconception that it uses too much power when compared to its H brethren

The one board that seems to be all over the place power wise is the Asus P8 (where lowest is the itx z77 at 26.4 W while the itx h77 draws 37.2 W) The highest on the chart was the P8 Premium at 54 W, so depending on what Asus includes along with intels chipset can change your thermals quite a bit for those of us who leave their stuff on all the time


Beetlesnack, I feel pretty confident that we are saying the same thing, because I don't see a reason to pay more for the z77. I'm trying to get the point across that currently it seems like right now a z77 could actually be had for less with combo options, and I wouldn't want anyone to avoid it for some myth that a low power system cannot use a z77
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post #5 of 11 Old 09-28-2012, 05:22 PM
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I got the GigaByte GA-Z77MX-D3H because I wanted an MATX board and because NewEgg threw in $60 worth of RAM with it. $60 for the board and $60 for the RAM as I see it...
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post #6 of 11 Old 09-28-2012, 06:57 PM
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Q77 should be just as good too. I would say for HTPC it really doesn't matter. Buy what has the needed features for the best price. I went Z77 asI was thinking a few thoughts beyond HTPC use and could do some mild overclocking.
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post #7 of 11 Old 09-28-2012, 07:15 PM
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Well, I wanted to build it RIGHT NOW, so I went w/H77 AsRock for $86 shipped. I ordered my parts on Friday, on Monday i had my new machine up and running.

Had I been little more patient, I probably would go w/z77 and overclockable CPU.

I can't stand the fact that I cannot actually overclock this Intel. biggrin.gif

Good time to buy computers and computer parts: NEVER
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post #8 of 11 Old 09-30-2012, 03:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark_Slayer View Post

For the current intel chipset (panther point), there seems to plenty of baseless recommendations being thrown around.
Example recommendation thread
  • OP - Planning on an i3 build
  • Rec - Microcenter can't be beat, current i3 3225 and z77 combo for $185
  • Next - Don't use z77, go with this $70-$90 H77 for HTPC biggrin.gif
Why is this? Since z77 is associated with it's increased overclocking potential, many think that's all it can be used for. Why go with an h77 over a z77 at the same price or pay more for an h77?
A little background on the Platform Controller Hub
  • Microchip included in all intel compatible motherboard since 5 series
  • Controls memory allocation, pci instructions, etc
  • Think of it as the assembly block between the CPU and the other components
See wiki for more info.
For those interested, a decent comparison table between intel chipsets can be found here. Notice Cougar Point has a TDP of 6.1W while Panther Point uses 6.7W, but that cannot account for the potential savings by bringing memory and pci into the chipset.
Now for the part that makes more sense . . . The uk.hardware.info site did a couple of different motherboard comparison tests for power usage. Here are some H77 and Z77 results, I'll just link right to the power consumption. Here is the Z77, but the more interesting chart is within the h77 roundup.
Here is the H77, and it includes the z77 results (H series are red bars, Z is blue)
Notice the lowest power consumption at idle actually comes from a Gigabyte Z77MX-D3H at 24W
The H77 version of that board uses more power at idle, consuming 26.4W
It would also be worth noting, that as z77 is typically the higher end board it would usually come with higher quality capacitors (longer life span).This is my reasoning for why I'd never pick H over Z unless there was a reasonable price advantage, and I'd definitely never pay more to avoid the Z boards

AMEN BROTHER!

Z77 for the win. Only an extreme budget should consider less.

Say a G620+ sub $79 motherboard might make sense.

Above this- I think Z77 begins to show a better value for a simple $10 or $20.

I did recently get a i5 3570 Ivy + Asrock Z77 at microcenter for about the same price as NewEgg had the i3 and h77. For $10 more it was a no brainer.


I replaced my G630 + Z68 HTPC with this and gave the old board, ram and CPU to my mother in a cheap case for a basic home PC.

I was going to just buy her a new PC from scratch but when I realized that the difference in cost was so small I opted to upgrade myself. I basically was trying to buy her the same thing I had for my HTPC, which is a nice value ordinary Sandy build. But I could not resist the upgrade to the Z77 and i5 for the same cost.

The Asrock Z77 was $89 at mircocenter and I got the $50 off making it $39. I would have got this board probably from new egg anyway with a G630 or i3- so when I realize the $189 i5 is really $50 off making it $139 then it's worth $15 more than an i3 I was looking at. No brainer.


Z77 boards can be found under $100 all day long on new egg. Hard to not spend $5 on the Z77 instead of the H77.

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"Too much is almost enough. Anything in life worth doing is worth overdoing. Moderation is for cowards."
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post #9 of 11 Old 09-30-2012, 03:25 PM
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I think most buy the h77 over the Z77 because they think it's a better value because it's supposed to be. I see no great priced h77 boards right now that are cheaper than Z77's enough to get the nod and decision to purchase. h77 should be $60 and it would sell all day long and be recommended.

But when h77 is $79 and Z77 is $89 hard to decide.

After all the Z77 is better.

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"Too much is almost enough. Anything in life worth doing is worth overdoing. Moderation is for cowards."
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post #10 of 11 Old 09-30-2012, 06:34 PM
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$5, $10, $20 more. What difference does it make if you're not going to use any of the additional features? "Z77 is better" is not a good enough reason. I got a G630 from microcenter for $50 and an Asrock H77M for $70 from the egg. $120 for a very capable HTPC combo.
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post #11 of 11 Old 09-30-2012, 10:45 PM
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I agree with ljo000. I buy what I will use. I think some people forget that a dollar is a dollar, 5 or 10 less is 5 or 10 saved where you didn't have to spend more.
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