Windows 8 and my HTPC - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 24 Old 02-01-2013, 11:19 AM - Thread Starter
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FIRST AND FOREMOST: THIS IS NOT A WINDOWS 8 BASHING THREAD, IF YOU DON'T LIKE WINDOWS 8 DON'T COMMENT!

System setup:
HTPC:
Windows 8 Pro all latest updates and drivers (exccept vid card)
Silverstone GD04 case
Coolermaster 550W Power supply
MSI H77-G43
i5 3570k H60 cooler
8GB DDR3
AMD Radeon 7950 HDMI out 12.10 drivers
120GB Vertex 2 SSD for OS
1TB for program files and recorded TV
2TB for Hyperspin setup in progress
LG Blu-ray reader / writer

HDMI from HTPC goes to Denon 3808CI receiver, then out to Philips 52" 120Hz 1080p 7403 HDTV


There was one registry fix I had to do because audio kept dropping out constantly and was incredibly annoying, other than that most everything should be stock in the way of software and setup

LAV Filters being used to bitstream DTS-HD and True-HD to receiver.


The Problem:

So, after testing windows 8 for quite some time on my main rig I decided to put it on my HTPC before my Media Center Keys expired. I got everything setup nicely but am running in to one odd issue that is starting to tick me off. On playback of some movies through the My Movies application when I start the movie sometimes it will play other times it pops up with the stupid little blue spinning wheel of death and eventually says the path could not be found. Sure enough if I go to the desktop I cant hit the server by name, but I can hit it by IP, but even then I can access the shares. If I wait about 1 minute the connection is restored. Then sometimes (obviously) the movies play back just fine. It is mostly blu-ray mkvs I am having this trouble with, and did notice it on some .wma audio files (these might be higher bit rate or possibly loss-less I haven't investigated the audio much).

The next issues is Arcsoft TMT, when I go to play a Blu-ray Disc it comes back and tells me that I do not have a HDCP compliant display...

Then Add to that everytime you go to play audio even when something is working lets say for example I am watching a movie and pause it, then play it takes a second for the audio connection to get re-established and start. (same even with testing the speakers form the control panel, it takes a second for each speaker to even get the signal to play the audio)


So, I thought this might be an issue with the AMD HDMI drivers or some combo.... well I decided to switch out my receiver on my main rig (seperate from the HTPC) from a Denon 588 receiver to a Denon 2808CI. This system is using a Nvidia GTX 690...and it is having the same problems (MSI MPower z77 board, i7 3770k @ 4.5GHz, 16GB mem, etc etc).


Files / Movies are served up from a WHS 2011 box with mymovies installed on it. Switch is a D-Link 8 port gigabit switch

Did not have any of these problems on Windows 7 frown.gif



Is anyone else running in to these issues? Any suggestions for this?
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post #2 of 24 Old 02-01-2013, 11:39 AM
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I also have had HDCP issues with Win8. Turns out that uninstalling Hyper-V solves the problem.
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post #3 of 24 Old 02-01-2013, 02:50 PM
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both ATI and Nvidia drivers are having an issue with HDCP, DRM problems, especially the Windows Store apps which are heavily reliant on them.

you just have to play with various driver versions to see which works until ATI and Nvidia smooth things out with newer drivers. I had to go back to the ATI drivers that came with Windows 8 just to get the streaming apps to work.
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post #4 of 24 Old 02-04-2013, 01:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks smile.gif

forgot to subscribe to this and thought hmmm.. surely someone replied to it biggrin.gif

I'll try the hyperV thing tonight, and more than likely will try the newest vid drivers for both tonight, hopefully I can remember the reg hack I used to solve the constant HDMI drop out issues on the AMD card.
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post #5 of 24 Old 02-04-2013, 01:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nintari View Post

Thanks smile.gif

forgot to subscribe to this and thought hmmm.. surely someone replied to it biggrin.gif

I'll try the hyperV thing tonight, and more than likely will try the newest vid drivers for both tonight, hopefully I can remember the reg hack I used to solve the constant HDMI drop out issues on the AMD card.

I ran into a slightly similar issue where windows was installing a driver instead of the included amd hdmi audio driver. I manually uninstalled the other driver and installed the amd driver with the amd install package and set windows update to notify but do not download updates and my problems went away.

The exact problem I had is that Windows Audio would randomly force me down to 2-channel audio. Not the same problem but the same solution could work.

In Win7 I had to use a reghack to fix HDMI audio dropping out if I didn't turn the HTPC off(standby) before switching the receiver. This is not a problem in Win8 for me.

Another thing is make sure you do the first round of Windows Updates, they fixed some problems for me.
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post #6 of 24 Old 02-06-2013, 08:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Problem persists tonight frown.gif My son wanted to watch Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy (DVD Folder structure) so we put it on with my movies.... sure enough went to play it back and same network error. Waited about 2 minutes and tried again, payed back a few seconds but once it seemed like sound was supposed to play it dumped out back to the my movies screen.

I ran upstairs to the system setup with an Nvidia card and same issue

I played around for a while and went to the properties for the audio device and unchecked Allow applications to take exclusive control of this device and the movie crapped out again and then on another attempt played back fine (not showing dolby digital just multi channel from both PCs)

I'm wondering if this is a LAV Filters issue but haven't had much success with bitstreaming audio such as DTS-HD and True HD with other methods.
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post #7 of 24 Old 02-07-2013, 04:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nintari View Post

Problem persists tonight frown.gif My son wanted to watch Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy (DVD Folder structure) so we put it on with my movies.... sure enough went to play it back and same network error. Waited about 2 minutes and tried again, payed back a few seconds but once it seemed like sound was supposed to play it dumped out back to the my movies screen.

I ran upstairs to the system setup with an Nvidia card and same issue

I played around for a while and went to the properties for the audio device and unchecked Allow applications to take exclusive control of this device and the movie crapped out again and then on another attempt played back fine (not showing dolby digital just multi channel from both PCs)

I'm wondering if this is a LAV Filters issue but haven't had much success with bitstreaming audio such as DTS-HD and True HD with other methods.

XBMC can play back DTS-HD and TrueHD like you want without the problems that WMC is giving you. Just switch back to WMC when you want to watch TV. It sounds like something is wrong with your setup of the LAV filters.
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post #8 of 24 Old 02-07-2013, 09:39 AM
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I'm running the latest MPC-HC and Lav filters with no issues with .mkv's. I just got around to setting up W8 today on my main rig using a second HDD for 8 Pro. Stereo 3D is also working with TMT 5 and PDVD 11 with no issues either. So far without any front ends everything seems to working quit well.
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post #9 of 24 Old 02-07-2013, 12:19 PM
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This is the best I've seen so far as far as fps is concerned, using latest Lav and MPC-HC W8 Pro ATi HD 6850. Stupid simple no tweaking no Reclock.
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post #10 of 24 Old 02-07-2013, 12:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nimo View Post



This is the best I've seen so far as far as fps is concerned, using latest Lav and MPC-HC W8 Pro ATi HD 6850. Stupid simple no tweaking no Reclock.

The OP is using LAV with WMC so I don't know how valid this is...
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post #11 of 24 Old 02-07-2013, 03:42 PM
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My new ATI 7700 locks in around 23.97609 which gives a frame drop in the days, not hours or minutes. I've been watching things nightly with it for over a week now and have had not 1 single frame drop or repeat. Getting a card with a good clock really helps IMO.
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post #12 of 24 Old 02-08-2013, 02:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JMGNYC View Post

My new ATI 7700 locks in around 23.97609 which gives a frame drop in the days, not hours or minutes. I've been watching things nightly with it for over a week now and have had not 1 single frame drop or repeat. Getting a card with a good clock really helps IMO.

Slight threadjack:

Would my ASUS 5850 Direct CU provide similar frame rates? Or is this exclusive to the 7xxxx line?




Thanks.
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post #13 of 24 Old 02-08-2013, 05:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Quickstrike View Post

Slight threadjack:

Would my ASUS 5850 Direct CU provide similar frame rates? Or is this exclusive to the 7xxxx line?




Thanks.

Sorry, but I really couldn't say for sure. I do know my new 7770 has closer refresh rates to the ideal than my old 5570 did. I have no idea what the means for the 5860. I suggest installing MPC-HC/madVR/LAV and trying it. It certainly might be good enough.
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post #14 of 24 Old 02-09-2013, 01:42 PM - Thread Starter
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As of right now XBMC is not an option for me. Once a DVR solution gets robust and stable enough I may look at it again, but for right now the lack of that and the lower WAF (or really fiancee / kids acceptance factor / ease of use) prevents me from using it.

Out of curiosity, is there another way to bit stream from windows media center or send the DTS-HD and TrueHD to my receiver from within Media Center? Regular DTS and Dolby Digital should be taken care of by the WMC codecs that are installed and pass through.

I'm going to try a Blu-Ray again tonight since I updated the Catalyst drivers to the more recent version that is up, see if I get the HDCP error again.

Sad that everything worked fine on Windows 7, but 8 is throwing fits... don;t know if it is a Win 8 issue, LAV Filter issue, or Driver / display detection issue. I went with 8 because I like the idea of the modern UI for a HTPC, updated plugins / apps like netflix and etc that could be navigated with a Gyration remote so on and so forth... plus many other features of 8 I liked.

Worst case I make a full image of the system, wipe it all out, go back to 7 for a few months and wait for the dust to settle / issues to get worked out. Hate to do that though since I really only have 1 issue that might be something easily fixed by using other filters / decoders.
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post #15 of 24 Old 02-09-2013, 07:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Ok, so some testing tonight

Catalyst 13.1 resolved my HDCP issue on TMT 5


The following testing was done on both my HTPC (7950 hooked to 3808CI out to Philips 7403 LCD) and my desktop (GTX 690, DP to Samsung 23". HDMI to Denon 2808CI, DVI to 55" Westignhouse)

DVD Folder Playback through my movies:

If I leave Allow applications to take exclusive control of this device and give exclusive mode applications priority checked, DVD movies through WMC and DVD Folders from home server WILL NOT play back. If I uncheck both boxes mentioned, DVDs playback fine but receiver only lists Multi Channel... will not switch / show DTS or Dolby Digital on receiver... sounds like it is surround but I don't know how it is being processed. This is with Lav Filters set to bitstream, with lav filters everything unchecked, and LAV Filters completely uninstalled. Doesn't Matter LAV doesn't seem to help or break any of it.


HD MKV Playback in windows media center

Lav Filters set to bitsteam every format:

Every now and then for some reason when I select a movie form my server through my movies the spinning circle comes up like it normally does when you load a movie... it gets hung up and eventually says it can not find the path. Give it a few minutes and the connection is restored and sometimes it plays.

If I uncheck Allow applications to take exclusive control of this device and give exclusive mode applications priority to allow DVD movies to playback, I get no audio what so ever in MKVs. So at that point DVDs work but MKVs wont.... If I check those boxes MKVs have audio and work fine (if they play back and not suffer the network drop issue), but DVDs do not playback.

Tests to try for MKV failures (will update these as I try them):

Try playback over and over from WMP from network to see if it does the same, if it doesn't fail.....

Copy a MKV to local video folder and add to library in videos in WMC, test playback over and over see if it fails, if it doesn't fail.....

Setup stand alone My Movies point to video directory with MKV local on the machine, test playback see if it fails.






Please feel free to give me some suggestions to try out for testing... I'm starting to get really frustrated here lol
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post #16 of 24 Old 02-09-2013, 07:28 PM
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post #17 of 24 Old 02-10-2013, 01:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Another Oddity... my antenna had been ripped down for quite some time due to high winds. Just got up on my roof today to re-mount it and got it hooked in.

If I start live TV on a OTA HD Channel The audio repeats over and over the picture keeps going then it craps out and gives an error on can not play video files are missing. If I go in to the control panel and uncheck the Allow applications to take exclusive control of this device and give exclusive mode applications priority, it works fine but then I can't playback MKVs ....

So something funky is going on with MPEG 2 audio decoding / pass through apparently on my system.... PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD help me track it down and figure out what is going on!!
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post #18 of 24 Old 02-10-2013, 01:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nintari View Post

Please feel free to give me some suggestions to try out for testing... I'm starting to get really frustrated here lol

Since you're going crazy anyway, TMT 6 is out.

wink.gif

 

Though I will mention that any TMT > 5.3.1.146 will have Cinavia issues.


Downloadable FREE demo discs:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1475769/de...ently-authored 

Did you really need to quote that entire post in your reply?
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post #19 of 24 Old 02-10-2013, 01:41 PM - Thread Starter
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yeah I seen that, I have 5.???? installed now, was goign to get the upgrade for 6 but not install it till the boot issues are resolved that I keep hearing about.

any way to set the TMT decoders as the default for WMC? maybe that will get rid of the issue or help diagnose.

Originally I didnt have TMT installed on my PC upstairs (the GTX 690 system) it suffered all the same problems as my HTPC, so I installed the trial of 6 to see if it would take over the decoders but it didn't either still same probs on both systems.
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post #20 of 24 Old 02-10-2013, 02:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nintari View Post

any way to set the TMT decoders as the default for WMC? maybe that will get rid of the issue or help diagnose.
 

 

Easy:

 


Downloadable FREE demo discs:
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1475769/de...ently-authored 

Did you really need to quote that entire post in your reply?
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post #21 of 24 Old 02-10-2013, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nintari View Post

keeps going then it craps out and gives an error on can not play video files are missing. If I go in to the control panel and uncheck the Allow applications to take exclusive control of this device and give exclusive mode applications priority, it works fine but then I can't playback MKVs ....

I have seen this issue in Windows 7 with an ATI gpu. I can't remember exactly what the issue was, since it was quite some time ago. I remember two things, and I think I only needed one of them to solve the issue. One was to set the speaker configuration to 7.1, even though I have 5.1, and uncheck the unused speaker channels. If I set it to 5.1 it gave me issues. The other was a WMC setting. The other was to uncheck the "play sounds when navigating windows media center" option under settings\general\visual and sound effects. If I remember correct, either fixed the problem, but the former made it so that I didn't have to uncheck the latter.
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post #22 of 24 Old 02-11-2013, 01:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LastButNotLeast View Post

Easy:



That only takes care of Using an external player for Media Browser

My Movies I can do the same thing if I purchase points lol

I thought there was another way....

I tried this with no luck so far: http://www.hack7mc.com/2009/04/media-center-decoder-utility-mcdu-finally-comes-to-windows-7.html
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post #23 of 24 Old 02-11-2013, 01:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nintari View Post

That only takes care of Using an external player for Media Browser

My Movies I can do the same thing if I purchase points lol

I thought there was another way....

I tried this with no luck so far: http://www.hack7mc.com/2009/04/media-center-decoder-utility-mcdu-finally-comes-to-windows-7.html

MyMovies doesn't require points for using an external player for Blu-ray playback.

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post #24 of 24 Old 02-11-2013, 04:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Key words there... Blu-ray playback, not DVD playback (or DVD folders for that matter) which is the problem I am having, then MKV playback.


But I am left stupified....
Quote:
Originally Posted by brianjb View Post

I have seen this issue in Windows 7 with an ATI gpu. I can't remember exactly what the issue was, since it was quite some time ago. I remember two things, and I think I only needed one of them to solve the issue. One was to set the speaker configuration to 7.1, even though I have 5.1, and uncheck the unused speaker channels. If I set it to 5.1 it gave me issues. The other was a WMC setting. The other was to uncheck the "play sounds when navigating windows media center" option under settings\general\visual and sound effects. If I remember correct, either fixed the problem, but the former made it so that I didn't have to uncheck the latter.


I'll be damned.... that worked! Set speakers to 7.1 unchecked the rear surrounds and VIOLA! it worked as it should! Not only on the 7950 system but the GTX 690 system as well!! I am so excited, even with this miserable cold lol

now to get my hyperspin setup completed on my HTPC! (have to configure every emulator and controls for the Xbox 360 controller using x-padder for keyboard commands) and my HTPC will be complete!!

oh...and have to pull my server out and upgrade the 4x 2TB drives to 4x 3TB drives.....I ran out of room lol
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