HTPC over the air DVR help - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 37 Old 03-09-2013, 12:07 AM - Thread Starter
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Hi all. I've been browsing the site but haven't posted until now. This is the situation. I'm trying to cut ties with cable/sat tv but my wife can't live without dvr. Trying to spend as little as possible. My goal is to stay under $400.


I want decent speed to prevent lag time for rewind/fast forward, and browsing the guide. My current directv dvr frequently lags.

My minimum needs........

1. Dual tuner capable of pulling in over the air hd.
2. Some sort of channel guide
3. DVR capability
4. HDMI and Optical output
5. ir remote
6. Ability to download and watch 1080hd movies off netflix/etc.
7. Ability to keep the unit powered on without worry of hard drive or hardware failure.
8. Decent case that blends in with my home theater receiver and current blue ray(which I would eventually like to replace with the HTPC)
9. Expandability options for future (bluray, more storage, etc)

What's the best option for reliability and keeping cost as low as possible.

I've never built a pc from start to finish and this would be the perfect 1st build for me.

Thanks for the help!
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post #2 of 37 Old 03-09-2013, 12:13 AM
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For a start take a look at this thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1404685/cheapest-ever-htpc-thats-decent-proud-of-myself
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post #3 of 37 Old 03-09-2013, 05:46 AM
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What you are asking is exactly what I did several months ago and I have been loving it. My budget for the HTPC itself was $300, not including Windows or storage HDDs. See here:

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1426890/crazy-cheap-but-good-build-thread

Adding 2TB would take you to your $400 budget before you've added a Silicon Dust HDHomeRun Dual (network OTA tuner) and a Harmony remote of some kind. Also, I chose a cheap, ugly case because my HTPC is in the basement. I think you'll probably end up blowing your budget but hopefully not by too much.

Do you live near a microcenter by any chance? You might be able to get a good deal on CPU/mobo combo there. For reliability (read low heat), you'll want to go the APU/integrated GPU route with either an AMD or Intel Celeron.
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post #4 of 37 Old 03-09-2013, 07:25 AM
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I did this for $278. This did not include the OS but I did have a legit copy of Windows 7.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1404685/cheapest-ever-htpc-thats-decent-proud-of-myself/630#post_22281833

Later I added a 2nd dual tuner card, a cheap video card, & a $15 WMC7 remote. That's about $400 plus Windows. It can record 4 HD OTA programs at the same time while playing back a different 5th program. It also works great with Hulu, CBS, etc. I have not tried Netflix.

I use WMC7 which also supplies the EPG. The HTPC stays in sleep mode, wakes up to record, then goes back to sleep.
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post #5 of 37 Old 03-09-2013, 06:15 PM
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things that can save you money now (to come in under $400) could make upgrades cost more later.

a major variance for htpc is the cost of a case - basically from $30-$500. a larger case will cost more money, but will hold more hard drives and/or full size cards. say you bought a smaller case that cant hold many drives to start - you could buy a 2 or 4 bay external enclosure later on. that would cost more than to buy the enclosure later on but will save you know.

you dont need an optical drive at first even to install windows. that could be another place to save money upfront. you might also save money on a case without a 5.25 inch external drive bay, but later on you will be forced into buying an external drive solution.

it is pretty common practice now to have at least two hard drives - a solid state drive to hold the operating system and some main program files, and one (or more) drives to act as the dvr and archived media storage. after you get your pc set up in a manner youre happy with create an iso of the system drive as a backup. that way if something were to happen to the drive (failure, virus, other unfixable issue) you can quickly load your backup and not lose any media.

another major cost variance is on software. you will need a copy of windows 7 with media center. im not sure what that sells for anymore. since youre not planning on doing bluray at first you will save around $200 not buying bluray software and decryption software. a plugin called recorded tv hd might interest you and the author offers it pretty inexpensively.

for a tuner are you comfortable buying from ebay? you could probably find a deal there. the hauppauge 2250 is probably the most popular atsc/qam card. the silicon dust home run dual is also very popular. it isnt a card, its a network device that will plug into your router.

My HTPC front end set up
Integration for whole home ATSC, CableCARD, FM radio, Blu-Ray, HD-DVD, DVD, VHS control & capture, video games, and archived & streaming media playback
Mironto's Panasonic plasma black level restoration guide
Restore the initial MLL on a 2009 Panasonic plasma
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post #6 of 37 Old 03-10-2013, 08:08 PM
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I agree with the above posts.

My question, do you have a spare PC desktop or laptop around? If so, what kind of outputs does it have? My thinking, why go out a buy something new when you can recycle something you already have. It'll really keep your costs down. Plus, if you wife gets use to the idea of using a PC instead of those outdated, and crappy, cable/satellite boxes, you may be able to approve for a high budget limit and can keep something that may fits your needs and wants better, rather than just the bare minimum. I know this may not meet your "blend in" requirement, but it may be a good idea to test. Basically, what I'm eluding to, why not test the function first, before worrying about form.

Plus, what shows are the wife's must haves. Are they available with the OTA offerings or other means such as Hulu or Netflix? She's not going to be happy if he her must see shows are no longer available. At the same time, you'll both adjust your viewing habits to your available content. It'll just take some time.

The rest is just more about personal preferences, space, and ports available. I personally use and like the Silicondust's HDHomerun network attached tV tuners. It may be worth keeping on out for upcoming, HDHR4, which will have four tuners and have build in transcoding and DNLA. May be more forgiving for network lack of bandwidth. It looks like they're working on an app(s) for live TV on mobile devices as well. May include some integration into media center for setting DVR functions such as show recordings.

Probably the biggest thing you need to have or get is Windows 7 home or better. It includes Media Center. I would suggest getting the upgrade version. Just look up the registry hack for clean installs. It's not hard, but you do need to edit one setting in the registry and do the rearm. Should only take about five minutes or less to complete. This is if you have to buy a copy. Windows 8 doesn't come with Media Center, but it's only $10 addon. The registry hack may work for Windows 8. There are other DVR suites, but Media Center is most popular and well established. There are plenty of mods for it such as short cuts for Netflix. You may want to check out XMBC. Their lastest release has DVR functionality build into. I don't know how well it works or what kind of EPG may be available. I believe MythTV has a windows version too.

Hardware failure will happen at some point. This is just a fact of all hardware. Just buy equipment from manufactures you're comfortable with and are known to build better quality. This should give you a few years of worry free operation. I find that I usually can go a good five years before I have major hardware issues with my machines that basically run 24/7.
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post #7 of 37 Old 03-10-2013, 09:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovekeiiy View Post


Probably the biggest thing you need to have or get is Windows 7 home or better. It includes Media Center. I would suggest getting the upgrade version. Just look up the registry hack for clean installs. It's not hard, but you do need to edit one setting in the registry and do the rearm. Should only take about five minutes or less to complete. .

Can you please explain or give a link to the "registry hack for clean installs"? I did a clean W7 install for my HTPC but I don't think I changed any registry files, so I'd just like to know what you're talking about. Thanks!
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post #8 of 37 Old 03-11-2013, 07:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks everyone for the info and help so far. I might have to up my budget just a little.

I do have some more questions.

1. Hard Drives
It's my understanding that it's best to have a large hard drive for storage and a separate ssd for the operating system for best performance. I'm thinking I will get a 64gb ssd for the os. Is that large enough? How should the 2 be setup? I'd like to use the storage drive as a nas if possible as well.

2. Power supply and cases
what size power supply should i be getting. I saw some cases that come with 275w or 300w power supplies. Are those a waste of money?

3. OS. Seems like windows will be the easiest for me to setup. whats the difference of 32 bit and 64 bit. Also windows 7 and 8 seems to be prices from $90-$140. Any pros/cons of each. What version do i need?
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post #9 of 37 Old 03-11-2013, 09:32 AM
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When I first dropped satallite we used windows media center on an old windows vista laptop connected to the tv with a VGA cable. The laptop was free to me because it had a broken screen. I picked up a $15 generic remote from Amazon, $40 antenna from Amazon, $60 on an HD Homerun off eBay, and $30 for a Logitech K400 keyboard at WalMart. It didn't have the greatest storage capacity, but we were able to save up for an external hard drive to counteract that. After that was up and running I saved up money by selling off items on Craigslist to build my HTPC. I only spent an additional $200 net on my HTPC after selling stuff and watching sales like a hawk. Also, inform your family that computer parts make great gifts (got a birthday coming up?).

We were very nervous about dropping the satallite. My wife and I were both concerned about missing our shows. We wanted to have the cheapest up front cost possible just in case. Honestly, this has been the best financial decision we have ever made. We have talked about it, but we simply can not justify another monthly payment to the cable or satallie company.

Initial up and running with the laptop costs: $145

HTPC Costs: $200

My HTPC:
Mohterboard: Asrock H77M
Processor: Intel 3225 Core i3
Ram: Kingston 2x4 gb 1600 DDR3
Case: Silverstone GD06 (awesome case, has a lock to keep the kids out)
Storage Drive: Seagate 1.5 tb
OS Drive: Intel 330 Series 60 gb SSD
OS: Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit
Power supply: Thermaltake TR2-500
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post #10 of 37 Old 03-11-2013, 11:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pd veeps View Post

I do have some more questions.

1. Hard Drives
It's my understanding that it's best to have a large hard drive for storage and a separate ssd for the operating system for best performance. I'm thinking I will get a 64gb ssd for the os. Is that large enough? How should the 2 be setup? I'd like to use the storage drive as a nas if possible as well.

2. Power supply and cases
what size power supply should i be getting. I saw some cases that come with 275w or 300w power supplies. Are those a waste of money?

3. OS. Seems like windows will be the easiest for me to setup. whats the difference of 32 bit and 64 bit. Also windows 7 and 8 seems to be prices from $90-$140. Any pros/cons of each. What version do i need?

1. Definitely get the SSD for the OS and progs. This is the single best upgrade you can do as far as real world performance is concerned. Boot times are way less (my HTPC boots in 10secs), progs load faster etc. 64GB should be enough depending on what you are installing. If you put a bunch of games on the SSD, you'll run out of room quickly. For me, with Win7 Ultimate, standard home and office progs I'm using around 30GB. If you are using the machine for general purpose as well as HTPC, you can free up space by storing bigger files on your HDD then adding the folders to the Win7 library for that media type (music for example).

2. Often the PSU that comes with some of the cases is essentially free when you compare the case to one without a PSU. However, you often get what you pay for. I would consider buying one separately (400w max) for four main reasons: noise, reliability, efficiency and possibly getting a modular one. If modular is not an issue (like with a large case), then get the Antec Earthwatts 380. If you want to have an easier install and better airflow, get the PC Power and Cooling MKIII Silencer 400w.

3. You can google the differences between 32bit and 64bit computing. For HTPC purposes, everything you do will work as well or better under 64bit windows and its backwards compatible with 32bit only programs. Also, you may want to get 8GB RAM for which you will need 64bit windows to fully use. I use Win7 and have been very happy with it. It includes WMC and is very stable. I have not found a compelling reason to upgrade but maybe others could chime in with more info.
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post #11 of 37 Old 03-11-2013, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pd veeps View Post

My minimum needs........

6. Ability to download and watch 1080hd movies off netflix/etc.
7. Ability to keep the unit powered on without worry of hard drive or hardware failure.
8. Decent case that blends in with my home theater receiver and current blue ray(which I would eventually like to replace with the HTPC)
9. Expandability options for future (bluray, more storage, etc)

What's the best option for reliability and keeping cost as low as possible.
Be aware that #6 is currently impossible on Win 7. I highly recommend a roku or streaming blu-ray player for something like that.

#7: I think that running an HTPC 24x7 is a monumental waste of energy (money).

To save money on hardware costs, buy your tuner used.

My HTPC is an old mini tower sitting completely out of sight, so no money wasted on a slick looking case (#8). I paid $25 for my whole PC, added more RAM, a cheap video card, a big hard drive, a cheap MCE IR dongle and a used tuner for a total of about $250. While I can watch Netflix on it, I have no desire to settle for 720p, so I use my blu-ray player instead.

#9: Watching blu-ray itself on an HTPC is another can of worms and not worth the effort or expense IMO. Standalone players do a far better job for far less money especially since you already own one.
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post #12 of 37 Old 03-11-2013, 01:31 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ljo000 View Post

1. Definitely get the SSD for the OS and progs. This is the single best upgrade you can do as far as real world performance is concerned. Boot times are way less (my HTPC boots in 10secs), progs load faster etc. 64GB should be enough depending on what you are installing. If you put a bunch of games on the SSD, you'll run out of room quickly. For me, with Win7 Ultimate, standard home and office progs I'm using around 30GB. If you are using the machine for general purpose as well as HTPC, you can free up space by storing bigger files on your HDD then adding the folders to the Win7 library for that media type (music for example).

2. Often the PSU that comes with some of the cases is essentially free when you compare the case to one without a PSU. However, you often get what you pay for. I would consider buying one separately (400w max) for four main reasons: noise, reliability, efficiency and possibly getting a modular one. If modular is not an issue (like with a large case), then get the Antec Earthwatts 380. If you want to have an easier install and better airflow, get the PC Power and Cooling MKIII Silencer 400w.

3. You can google the differences between 32bit and 64bit computing. For HTPC purposes, everything you do will work as well or better under 64bit windows and its backwards compatible with 32bit only programs. Also, you may want to get 8GB RAM for which you will need 64bit windows to fully use. I use Win7 and have been very happy with it. It includes WMC and is very stable. I have not found a compelling reason to upgrade but maybe others could chime in with more info.

ok I will def. get an ssd for my os and a separate power supply
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Be aware that #6 is currently impossible on Win 7. I highly recommend a roku or streaming blu-ray player for something like that.

#7: I think that running an HTPC 24x7 is a monumental waste of energy (money).

To save money on hardware costs, buy your tuner used.

My HTPC is an old mini tower sitting completely out of sight, so no money wasted on a slick looking case (#8). I paid $25 for my whole PC, added more RAM, a cheap video card, a big hard drive, a cheap MCE IR dongle and a used tuner for a total of about $250. While I can watch Netflix on it, I have no desire to settle for 720p, so I use my blu-ray player instead.

#9: Watching blu-ray itself on an HTPC is another can of worms and not worth the effort or expense IMO. Standalone players do a far better job for far less money especially since you already own one.


thanks for the info. I have a basic dvd/cd-rw drive i found that I can probably use. I'll stick with my stand alone blue ray for now as well .
Maybe I'll pick up ased case on ebay or something to save a few bucks.

I didn't realize the boot times can be pretty fast with an ssd so I won't have to keep it on 24/7.
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post #13 of 37 Old 03-11-2013, 02:21 PM
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I highly recommend a PS3 for BluRay and Netflix rather than an HTPC. I can't stand Netflix on my HTPCs, but it's great on the PS3s. And, you get a gaming system at the same time.
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post #14 of 37 Old 03-11-2013, 03:16 PM - Thread Starter
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I highly recommend a PS3 for BluRay and Netflix rather than an HTPC. I can't stand Netflix on my HTPCs, but it's great on the PS3s. And, you get a gaming system at the same time.

The main reason I'm building an htpc is to dvr over the air channels . Do you stream anything other than Netflix on your htpc?
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post #15 of 37 Old 03-11-2013, 05:02 PM
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For streaming content, the Amazon Prime plugin for XBMC works really well. Basically I use WMC for DVR and Live TV, with the XBMC integration plugin for the media library and Amazon Prime. I find XBMC much faster for browsing the media library and is just easier to set up the way I want it.

Also I second the comments about using a stand-alone BluRay player for playing physical disks. One of the main attractions of HTPC is having an on-demand library of rips of your collection that's more user friendly (e.g. no intros or ads, browse by genre etc) and avoids handling the disk and the damage that can result. HDD space is so cheap that you can rip your disks and add more drive capacity as you need it.
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post #16 of 37 Old 03-11-2013, 05:15 PM
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Can you please explain or give a link to the "registry hack for clean installs"? I did a clean W7 install for my HTPC but I don't think I changed any registry files, so I'd just like to know what you're talking about. Thanks!

A google search can find almost anything: look under registry hack
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post #17 of 37 Old 03-11-2013, 05:26 PM
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you don't need an SSD, but it will help with computer boot faster. The applications will load a bit faster. Given the speeds of decent CPUs and ram, I don't think it's more over rated considering you're use to crappy cable/satellite boxes.

if it's you're only using the machine for home theater tasks, you only need the OS, media center and other media applications. You do not need an office suite, email, and so forth. it's not like you're going to write a memo on your large TV. Later if you do, just use something like OpenOffice or LibreOffice for that occasional use.

Windows 7 versus Windows 8, there's not much difference. I personally prefer Windows 7, but only because I don't think the Windows 8 Metro is friendly in a desktop, non touch screen environment. Beyond that, they both good. Windows 8 probably runs slightly more efficient.

Running an HTPC 24/7 is more dependent on the tasks you're doing. My actual HTPC, doesn't run 24/7. It's just for consuming media. My office PC does run 24/7. This is because I have Plex Media Server running, and I do all my DVR recordings on it, and it doesn't wake probably when I need to use the PMS for a client or DVR scheduled recording when in standby. Plus, since it's a Mac Mini, the energy use is minimal.

I also agree about the stand alone blu ray player as well. I also like the PS3 since Sony is good about updating it, a lot, so you'll can new features and DRM updates. It's also one fix costs, where as the PC BR suites can require pay updates to keep using. In the long run, it's cheaper. Netflix is much better experience on a set top box compared to the PC.
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post #18 of 37 Old 03-12-2013, 11:01 AM - Thread Starter
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This is what i have pickup out so far.

ASRock B75 PRO3-M LGA 1155 Intel B75 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard - $69.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157329

ntel Pentium G2130 Ivy Bridge 3.2GHz LGA 1155 55W Dual-Core Desktop Processor BX80637G2130 - $99.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819116887

G.SKILL 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model F3-12800CL9D-4GBNQ -$34.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231193

Antec EarthWatts Green EA-380D Green 380W Continuous power ATX12V v2.3 / EPS12V 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC Power Supply - $49.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371033

Western Digital WD Green WD10EZRX 1TB IntelliPower SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive - OEM -74.99
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=22-236-070&ParentOnly=1&IsVirtualParent=1

windows 7 from assasin for $50

I have a power cord and an older dvd/cdrw drive i can use.

$380 shipped so far. Need my case and tv tuner/remote. hopefully can get both for $100 on ebay.

how slow will boot time be if i use a a regular sata 64gb hard drive for my operating system versus an ssd.?

Can I go cheaper on the motherboard and cpu without losing a lot of performance?

There goes my budget. lol

Thanks all
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post #19 of 37 Old 03-12-2013, 11:51 AM
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You can usually find a sale for 2x4 gb 1600 RAM for about $40, not much more than you are spending now and twice the RAM. Newegg shell shockers come up with this deal on RAM at least once a week.

You could choose another power supply and cut some money out. Newegg has a 460w cooler master on sale right now for $20 after mail in rebate. It is not as nice as the Antec unit, but still a decent unit and functional. At half the price, it will take a long time for you to save money on electricity to match the price you are paying upfront for the Antec. You can always upgrade later when funds are a bit more available.

Newegg also has a 1tb Seagate drive for 64.99 right now. Sale prices on this stuff change day to day, so stay on top of all the sites not just Newegg. If you really want to get your cost down, you will have to be a bit flexible and know what you really want vs need. It never hurts to have cash in hand and be ready to purchase something when it is a good deal, knowing you don't have all the parts to put it together yet.

Regarding a tuner, I would buck up for an HD Homerun.
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post #20 of 37 Old 03-12-2013, 12:39 PM - Thread Starter
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are reconditioned or refurbished hard drives from Western Digital reliable or should I stay away from them?
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post #21 of 37 Old 03-12-2013, 12:54 PM
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are reconditioned or refurbished hard drives from Western Digital reliable or should I stay away from them?

As a general rule, most stay away from recondition/refurbished. doesn't matter the brand. You just never know exactly what you're getting.

That said, I have gotten a refurbished external hard drive. It works fine. But it's a mix bag. It's noisy, kind of slow. But it has been going for at least a year and half.

I would definitely read the small print so see what the warranty and exactly what it covers. After than, if you're comfortable with it, than give it try.
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post #22 of 37 Old 03-12-2013, 01:01 PM
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are reconditioned or refurbished hard drives from Western Digital reliable or should I stay away from them?

In my experience, refurb = an underpaid employee of some reseller, put down the broom, hooked up the returned product and stated. 'this one works OK'. Reputable companies such as Western Digital do not refurbish anything. You send them an RMA, they test it. Then they decide to return the product to you because nothing is wrong with it or they send you a new product to replace the one that they tested and subsequently tossed in the trash.

Use Shark007 Codecs and retain your sanity.
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post #23 of 37 Old 03-13-2013, 05:38 AM
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The main reason I'm building an htpc is to dvr over the air channels . Do you stream anything other than Netflix on your htpc?

Nope. Amazon doesn't have a direct plug-in for WMC. So my HTPC in my main living room is used ONLY for recording and playback of OTA and cable programming. I have an HDHR Dual for OTA, I recommend the same for you.

My PS3 is used for streaming Netflix, Amazon, and for BluRay. In my bedroom and office, I use my PCs to do all the DVR functions, plus stream Netflix. The difference in quality between Netflix on HTPC and Netflix on PS3 is huge, the PS3 is a far better streamer.
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post #24 of 37 Old 03-13-2013, 05:43 AM
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Also I second the comments about using a stand-alone BluRay player for playing physical disks. One of the main attractions of HTPC is having an on-demand library of rips of your collection that's more user friendly (e.g. no intros or ads, browse by genre etc) and avoids handling the disk and the damage that can result. HDD space is so cheap that you can rip your disks and add more drive capacity as you need it.

That's exactly what I've done. All my BD and DVD discs have been ripped to my server and the physical media stored away. I really only watch BDs directly when I rent them or when I want the full audio. I store my BDs on the server with only DTS, so if I want DTS-MA I will have to pull the physical media. That's pretty rare though, honestly.
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post #25 of 37 Old 08-16-2013, 08:46 AM
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Did you finish your OTA DVR HTPC? I cut the cord 3 months ago and have been almost 100% satisfied. Now like you, wife is starting to wish for the old DVR. Almost called DirecTV or Comcast last night. My house has a wi-fi, and is also wired with CAT 5. Was hoping to build something that could be used by 2 TVs, but that would only be a nice to have feature.
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post #26 of 37 Old 08-16-2013, 08:57 AM
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Before doing that, get a CableCARD tuner and use WMC as your PVR. It is nicer than any CableCo DVR and you don't have to pay monthly rent on the STB or DVR fees. For charter, this adds up to $30/month for just two TV's. With a CableCARD tuner it is $2/month for the CableCARD.

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post #27 of 37 Old 08-16-2013, 12:16 PM
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Did you finish your OTA DVR HTPC? I cut the cord 3 months ago and have been almost 100% satisfied. Now like you, wife is starting to wish for the old DVR. Almost called DirecTV or Comcast last night. My house has a wi-fi, and is also wired with CAT 5. Was hoping to build something that could be used by 2 TVs, but that would only be a nice to have feature.
Forget Cable Card. Build a PC with Windows 7 then buy a couple of these which will give you the ability to record up to 4 shows at the same time. Then run WMC's setup. It's way better then any Cable Co. DVR. For the 2nd TV you can just buy a new or used XBOX 360 and use that to access all the recordings + live tv from the main pc.
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post #28 of 37 Old 08-16-2013, 02:16 PM
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Those may work for you but for me, Charter pretty much requires a CableCARD tuner because except for the locals everything else is encrypted. So YMMV OP.

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post #29 of 37 Old 08-16-2013, 02:25 PM
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MA/NH folks have been getting letters from Comcast saying soon the locals will all be encrypted. Bye-bye ClearQAM tuners. There will no longer be ClearQAM.

 

 

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post #30 of 37 Old 08-17-2013, 12:37 PM
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Those may work for you but for me, Charter pretty much requires a CableCARD tuner because except for the locals everything else is encrypted. So YMMV OP.
He stated he was happy with OTA. That's the reason I recommended that setup.
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